#soylent | Logs for 2023-06-14

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[00:41:23] -!- mrpg [mrpg!~Thunderbi@Soylent/Staff/Editor/mrpg] has joined #soylent
[00:41:23] -!- mode/#soylent [+v mrpg] by Imogen
[01:02:00] <janrinok> I was communicating with NCommander. Sometime after the threat to close down he stopped answering my emails. I tried text but that was ignored too.
[01:03:21] <janrinok> From mid-December to the shut down threat I was trying to find out when he was going to return to complete the work he started. There was always an excuse and another delayed date. Each came and went with the same pattern.
[01:03:59] <janrinok> But he would still write in Metas blaming others for something he should have done himself.
[01:05:58] <janrinok> The problem I have now is with both NCommander and kolie - who will NOT say what they plan to do to me or the community because of 'excuses'. NCommander is telling nobody anything, and kolie has an NDA which appears to cover everything he thinks for several more weeks yet.
[01:07:11] <janrinok> One of them needs to speak to the community. The community want kolie to speak to the community. Because a wall of silence is not building trust.
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[01:10:24] <janrinok> It is not helped by Management suddenly appearing in what have been closed chat channels on here for specific teams. We want to be able to talk to each other in privacy. I, as Editor-in-Chief, have to interface between the Management Group and my team. That is written in our terms of Reference.
[01:11:37] <kolie> No silence here.
[01:11:41] <kolie> I will answer anything I can.
[01:11:52] <kolie> I've told you the extent of my plans.
[01:11:55] <janrinok> I have no issue with kolie as a person. But at present he is still a contractor and should not, IMO, be advertising himself as Management.
[01:12:38] <janrinok> Only after we have been through so much to get you to speak. We are several weeks into this now and you finally explained some background last week.
[01:12:51] <kolie> I have said as much from the beginning.
[01:12:57] <kolie> I'm an open book my man.
[01:12:59] <janrinok> Even then, there are still gaps. Where are you moving the servers to?
[01:13:03] <kolie> I told you.
[01:13:08] <kolie> Cogent la mirada.
[01:13:31] <janrinok> No, you haven't told me or the community. You might have told somebody, but it wasn't me.
[01:13:38] <kolie> You where in the channel.
[01:13:54] <kolie> And again I'm an open book. If you have questions I'll answer.
[01:14:49] <kolie> No one asked that ever - if they did they got the exact answer - which was cogent la mirada.
[01:14:54] <janrinok> That is the first time I have ever heard of Cogent la mirada. I haven't a clue where that is. But I cannot search the logs for some channels because there aren't any.
[01:15:10] <kolie> lol.
[01:15:14] <janrinok> We are not supposed to discuss the contents of those channels outside of those channels
[01:15:27] <janrinok> It says so at the top of your irc page.
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[01:15:43] <kolie> Nothing if being discussed other than to remind you I've said it to you.
[01:15:50] <janrinok> So even if I had heard, I should not, technically speaking, tell the community.
[01:16:29] <janrinok> The community want to know - I am trying to get the information for them.
[01:16:44] <kolie> You just said I hadn't told you it was quite confusing.
[01:17:01] <kolie> In any case I am freely answering questions.
[01:17:15] <janrinok> I said "even if I had heard" not that I had heard.
[01:17:16] <kolie> No one has asked me that - other wise again I would've said as much.
[01:17:33] <kolie> Ok well it's there I mentioend it, I talked about owning racks there and who owns the building.
[01:17:46] <janrinok> It was in the list of questions that were posed in a comment that you replied to. It was not answered.
[01:18:38] <janrinok> That is in Freemont, that you have told me. We discussed it yesterday (my time) it is now 03:18
[01:18:58] <kolie> https://pasteboard.co
[01:19:00] <systemd> ^ 03Pasteboard - Uploaded Image
[01:19:20] <kolie> ennwise has a large amount of equipment in freemont.
[01:19:25] <kolie> Which you are correct to recall.
[01:19:29] <janrinok> That was about where the racks are now!
[01:19:36] <kolie> No that isnt now.
[01:19:38] <kolie> that is future.
[01:20:17] <janrinok> Then you did not answer the question I asked. I asked who owned the racks where it is stored now.
[01:20:23] <kolie> linode.
[01:21:05] <kolie> which anyone can tell by doing basic ip info on the server addresses.
[01:21:08] <janrinok> Well that is not Cogent either. You have a rack of servers, which you have said you are moving towards the end of this month.
[01:21:21] <kolie> Linode runs all the sn stuff currently.
[01:21:33] <kolie> I have a rack going up which I want to fully test staging on
[01:21:35] <kolie> and then run prod from.
[01:21:55] <janrinok> Why do we have to do IP searches when somebody asks you a question. I know about Linode. You are simply not giving straight answers.
[01:22:02] <kolie> That's pretty straight my man.
[01:22:59] <kolie> Anything else I can clarify?
[01:23:57] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Where is it stored?
[01:23:57] <janrinok> <kolie2> dont know what we are doing for secrets yet.
[01:23:57] <janrinok> <kolie2> Right now there is a backup script, it copies /opt
[01:23:57] <janrinok> <kolie2> and /opt on the docker host is where all config/db/ stuff is right now.
[01:23:58] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Where does it copy it to?
[01:23:59] <janrinok> <kolie2> Offsite storage.
[01:24:00] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Where is that offsite storage? On what platform?
[01:24:02] <janrinok> <kolie2> Freemont, CA, FMT2 facility. Linux OS on a iSCSI array.
[01:24:04] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Owned and controlled by what organisation or individual?
[01:24:06] <janrinok> <kolie2> Ennwise, on behalf of myself.
[01:24:08] <janrinok> <Deucalion> As in the actual the hardware, not the VM running atop
[01:24:10] <janrinok> <kolie2> I have a full rack of equipment there.
[01:24:12] <janrinok> <kolie2> It's being moved in two/three weeks.
[01:24:14] <kolie> Yea so I am backing up staging.
[01:24:16] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Ennwise is a small VPS Hosting provider
[01:24:24] <kolie> Linode has staging
[01:24:26] <kolie> and staging has data
[01:24:28] <kolie> which I backup
[01:24:30] <kolie> in freemont.
[01:25:12] <janrinok> so stop saying different things. You have a rack which is in freemont. Nowhere in that discussion can I see cogent la mirada
[01:25:27] <kolie> That discussion - was about current thing.
[01:25:40] <kolie> We discussed where the racks WOULD be, and that answer is freemont.
[01:25:44] <kolie> sorry
[01:25:47] <kolie> cogent.
[01:25:53] <janrinok> which is today. and you are moving it in a few weeks.
[01:25:56] <kolie> Current is linode, I keep data backups in freemont.
[01:26:09] <kolie> Nothings been moved yet.
[01:26:27] <janrinok> <Deucalion> Where is it stored? is today, it is not future tense.
[01:26:32] <kolie> yes
[01:26:38] <kolie> hes asking about the backups
[01:26:42] <kolie> And I answered properly then.
[01:26:51] <janrinok> I know what he is asking about.
[01:26:58] <kolie> Ok so it's clear.
[01:27:03] <kolie> And I wasn't talking about cogent then.
[01:27:42] <janrinok> That is the rack that you are moving. That is the one that you now say will be in cogent la mirada. You did NOT say that in that conversation. I have a copy of it too#
[01:28:00] <kolie> I know so when you asked me about ennwise facility under servers i control
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[01:28:09] <janrinok> We wanted to know how secure the data is now
[01:28:12] <kolie> That's when I figured you were talking about where everything is going to be.
[01:28:51] <janrinok> well you made an assumption - or you answered the question that you thought we should be asking. And that is something you have done more than once.
[01:28:55] <kolie> I will answer also that, freemont or cogent - the setup is the same.
[01:29:07] <kolie> Well based on how you asked it it seemed appropriate.
[01:29:12] <janrinok> to you
[01:29:29] <kolie> Well words are interpreted, im not in your head, based on how it was asked i read it that way
[01:29:33] <janrinok> We know why we were asking the question
[01:29:40] <kolie> If you said "the backups you just mentioned storing from opt, where are they"
[01:29:44] <kolie> That's more clear.
[01:30:28] <janrinok> Read the bit that I quoted. You know exactly what we were asking. Or you were not paying attention.
[01:30:53] <kolie> I didn't and the reason I didn't is because we were also discussing staging
[01:30:56] <kolie> And how staging could work
[01:31:01] <kolie> And future work would be done.
[01:31:09] <kolie> I thought the conversations where tied and I answered as such.
[01:31:31] <kolie> But - either way, cogent la mirada, he freemont, is the only difference it makes.
[01:31:38] <kolie> Both are tied to ennwise.
[01:32:00] <janrinok> it is OUR personal data - we wanted to know how it was being protected.
[01:32:17] <kolie> Ofcourse.
[01:32:43] <kolie> My data is in there as well.
[01:33:30] <janrinok> It has taken 2 pages for you to tell me what I wanted to know. A simple answer would stop all this confusion.
[01:33:53] <kolie> I've answered it repeatedly - it didn't take two pages. we are discussing how I answered earlier.
[01:34:40] <janrinok> listen to our concerns and please address them. We can work together but everything take so long to achieve. Just give plain answers please.
[01:34:48] <kolie> I did.
[01:34:56] <kolie> And I will.
[01:35:02] <janrinok> now - after a discussion that we had last week
[01:35:36] <kolie> Well I had no idea that the answer I was giving was wrong based on the context.
[01:35:53] <kolie> So I'm not sure what to say other than the context was murky and we misunderstood each other.
[01:36:08] <kolie> I'm not withholding anything and I'm trying to answer what your asking.
[01:36:22] <kolie> I did so then and I was able to clarify now. Not a rubix cube here.
[01:37:02] <janrinok> it seems to have happened a lot though - the misunderstanding, interspersed with the 'I must get NC's approval to say that' etc He doesn't control what you do on your hardware or will do in the future.
[01:37:48] <kolie> I have an nda in place - a very generic one - which is very broad and covers that anything disclosed not know by the public is trade secret. I've asked for generic exemptions on a broad range of things. I must keep the NDA in mind lest I breached it.
[01:38:04] <kolie> The intent isn't to hide anything - I can't think of anything we've discussed that hasn't been disclosed.
[01:38:18] <kolie> It's mostly to protect data and intellectual property.
[01:38:21] <janrinok> our software is GPL2 - it is not a trade secret
[01:38:38] <kolie> The work I am doing as a contractor is my work until fully executed under the agreement.
[01:38:49] <kolie> And I agree rehash is licensed however it is.
[01:39:13] <kolie> But the NDA is general, and covers the entire arrangement, and again I've clarified some excemptions already broadly.
[01:39:30] <kolie> Otherwise I could spill the beans on everything and have no repurcussion.
[01:39:58] <kolie> Pretty standard work agreement.
[01:40:33] <kolie> He doesn't control what I do on my hardware. Things we've talked about may be protected and I don't have mutual exclusion to say them. Just making sure I don't breach it and acting in good faith under the agreement.
[01:40:43] <janrinok> NCommander has also stated the at the last Board meeting you discussed a '2nd money stream' for the site. Earlier you said you don't know anyone who has said that. Look at the Meta that NC wrote after that Board meeting
[01:40:55] <kolie> No what we spoke about was commercialization.
[01:41:03] <kolie> Which has a very specific meaning to me.
[01:41:07] <janrinok> He used the term that I did.
[01:41:17] <kolie> He did bring up very generally that he wanted to raise capital to fund various things on the site.
[01:41:48] <janrinok> What were those things?
[01:41:52] <kolie> It was a distant plan, no specifics were brought up, and we specifically discussed that nothing would be done without community approval and we walk a very fine line to not sell out.
[01:42:09] <janrinok> and how would he/you raise the capital?
[01:42:09] <kolie> Which leaves limited options without community buyin.
[01:42:43] <kolie> There was no specific on what could be done - more of what wouldnt work. I also don't think that raising money is necessary at this time.
[01:42:45] <janrinok> we have saying for 9 years that we also want to buy shares - we have been rebuffed each time
[01:43:08] <janrinok> Shares would give us a vote
[01:43:13] <kolie> I'm fairly certain he's open to share buying - but not in the terms of recurring revenue.
[01:43:51] <janrinok> we don't care about recurring revenue - we do not like 2 people have total control over our site
[01:44:03] <kolie> You brought it up not me.
[01:44:17] <kolie> I'm all for empowering a committee of community governance.
[01:44:32] <janrinok> You are saying join the board - we can have the same voting rights by having shares
[01:45:05] <janrinok> Some of us just want to do the jobs we volunteered to do. I do not want to be on a Board.
[01:45:07] <kolie> There's many ways to skin a cat.
[01:45:33] <kolie> Join the board is an option today that has a low path of entry. It's not the only way for community governance.
[01:46:12] <janrinok> Buying shares - which we can do if permitted - gives us exactly the same level of voting power as 'joining the Board'
[01:46:22] <kolie> You are free to discuss those with the PBC and try and get them hammered out if you don't like it. I'm just suggesting one way and if I'm on the board then we can discuss community governance withouti t.
[01:46:28] <kolie> Ok. That's certainly one way.
[01:47:11] <janrinok> So the Board will not sell us shares but they will allow us to join the Board where we can buy shares anyway
[01:47:25] <kolie> I think they are open to selling shares.
[01:47:25] <janrinok> I am not convinced by that argument yet
[01:47:38] <kolie> I didn't say otherwise.
[01:47:45] <janrinok> They obviously want their seed money back
[01:47:52] <kolie> I offered all of it in full.
[01:48:06] <kolie> It's not about the money.
[01:48:09] <janrinok> And they refused?
[01:48:24] <janrinok> No, it is about control - and you haven't got any either yet
[01:48:26] <kolie> I didn't push much but I made an honest offer for it in full yes and it was declined.
[01:48:49] <kolie> The difference is having control is in my hands.
[01:49:03] <kolie> The only person that decides that is now me.
[01:49:07] <kolie> My actions.
[01:49:32] <janrinok> but, despite that, you are now calling yourself 'Management'. Can you perhaps see why we are getting confused with what is actually happening?
[01:49:58] <kolie> I'm acting on behalf of the current management.
[01:50:06] <kolie> Not that confusing.
[01:50:15] <janrinok> you are either a Board member or you are a contractor. The community decide who represents them
[01:50:29] <kolie> Contractor now, and board is in the cards.
[01:50:41] <kolie> I've never claimed otherwise.
[01:50:47] <janrinok> And when you get it you are Management - until then you are NOT
[01:51:04] <kolie> Ok well - you can give it whatever title you like - I don't know what management means to you.
[01:51:19] <kolie> But right now - I am acting under the authority of management, and delegated management duties.
[01:51:28] <janrinok> The Management Group is the Board. Read the term of Reference for people
[01:51:47] <janrinok> They are amongst the wiki data somewhere
[01:52:10] <kolie> Ok well the way I see it is 1099 or employee, im not an employee, im 1099 management.
[01:52:20] <kolie> Pick the nits as you want.
[01:52:24] <janrinok> That isn't here
[01:52:31] <kolie> I've explained the reality of what is occuring.
[01:52:54] <janrinok> I know, but you are having problems understanding how it applies to you
[01:53:01] <kolie> No.
[01:53:23] <kolie> I've clarified my role with the PBC.
[01:53:30] <janrinok> I appreciate the work that you are doing, but you are still a contractor. You do not speak for the community.
[01:53:38] <kolie> I never said I spoke for the community.
[01:54:40] <janrinok> They do not choose who the community want to represent them. You are simply not part of the management group yet. NC can say what he wants, it doesn't change reality
[01:54:58] <kolie> I think management as management can delgate the roles of management.
[01:55:19] <kolie> Even if they cant - ok. Forget management.
[01:55:20] <janrinok> But the community see that you are now 'Management' on here and they want to know what is happening
[01:55:21] <kolie> I'm kolie.
[01:55:56] <kolie> No one here is confused about what I am doing - certainly not because of a label that no one else has had on this IRC
[01:56:18] <kolie> And its not like I'm going around saying "Hi I'm management"
[01:56:19] <janrinok> What is your address displayed on the RHS of the screen here
[01:56:22] <kolie> This is a complete strawman.
[01:56:40] <janrinok> Soylent/Staff/Management/kolie
[01:56:48] <kolie> Staff/Management/Kolie I just mentioned that.
[01:57:02] <kolie> It doesnt say PBC board member.
[01:57:37] <janrinok> it is not a strawman, if you are not a Board member then you are NOT part of the management group. Read the Term of Reference
[01:58:04] <kolie> I've been delegated management duties as an outside contracted party.
[01:58:13] <kolie> I am not a board member.
[01:58:55] <kolie> I haven't claimed to - no one thinks I am a current board member - and there isn't confusion on this at large.
[01:59:09] <janrinok> in your mind. But you are not Management. It should say perhaps contractor. This is another cause for confusion. They think that you have some control function - you have none. You have to have NCs permission.
[01:59:30] <kolie> I have control with regards to the terms of my agreements.
[01:59:36] <kolie> It doesn't stem from being a board member.
[01:59:44] <janrinok> salesman speak again.
[01:59:46] <kolie> It stems from contractual obligations on both parties.
[01:59:50] <kolie> No - reality speak.
[01:59:56] <kolie> Because that's the reality.
[02:00:10] <kolie> What does it mean to be a board member?
[02:00:25] <kolie> It means you follow the corporate bylaws and regulations. It's a contractual obligation.
[02:00:38] <kolie> The set of laws enforcing those obligations are the same as my contractors agreements.
[02:00:41] <kolie> Just different.
[02:00:43] <janrinok> here you go again....
[02:01:09] <kolie> I don't directly control the PBC - I have agreements with the PBC - clear?
[02:01:20] <janrinok> yes - as a contractor
[02:01:46] <janrinok> you are behaving more like NC than you realise
[02:02:00] <kolie> "They think that you have some control function - you have none."
[02:02:12] <janrinok> But I am going back to bed
[02:02:15] <kolie> Agreements can force hands can they not?
[02:02:31] <kolie> that is some level of control. atleast as much as any one can have in a situation.
[02:02:54] <kolie> I'm sorry - when you were mistaken earlier you wanted correct information.
[02:02:55] <janrinok> goodnight
[02:03:01] <kolie> I answer in good faith now and "here I go again."
[02:03:06] <kolie> If you don't like the answer - don't ask.
[02:03:16] <kolie> I am not under 0 control. I also am not a board member.
[02:03:20] <kolie> they are not mutually exclusive.
[02:11:08] <kolie> It's funny man - I'll show you every card I have - be transparent as possible - answer every detail as best as I can - and I get accused of not being a team player. Not good enough for you.
[02:11:22] <kolie> I wont stop by the way - but most people aren't going to shoot as straight as I am.
[02:11:41] <kolie> I have NO skin in this game - I have NO agenda - I just like my site and want it around.
[02:12:09] <kolie> I've been more than forth coming in every thing you have asked - to the point of being explicit and as correct as possible with the answers so I don't say it wrong.
[02:12:27] <kolie> I'm not going to say something that's not - and I will correct you if I feel that it's different than it is.
[02:13:33] <kolie> I just say things exactly as if someone asked me on the street and I wanted to know myself. That's how transparent I'm trying to be.
[02:13:51] <kolie> I'm sorry that doesn't sit well with you. I'm not sure why giving it to you straight is an issue.
[02:25:31] <mrpg> CAPCOM games https://captown.capcom.com
[02:25:31] <systemd> ^ 03ファイナルファイト English version
[02:29:40] <mrpg> The barrapunto article said one problem was the signal to noise ratio
[02:30:24] <mrpg> And that a better model is to let users decide or vote on which article goes live, not just the editors.
[02:33:44] <mrpg> The article is from 2017
[02:33:58] <mrpg> The site doesn't exist anymore
[02:37:06] <mrpg> And they tried to make money but no
[02:37:30] <mrpg> They had increasing costs for the increasing visits.
[02:37:58] <mrpg> And when the site stopped having stories daily, users began to drift to another site.
[02:38:51] <mrpg> And there was also a barrapunto (slashdot) effect for small websites.
[02:40:13] -!- AzumaHazuki [AzumaHazuki!~hazuki@the.end.of.time] has joined #soylent
[03:07:16] <kolie2> Also funny enough https://wiki.staging.soylentnews.org - Management exists below the board level. So management is even necessarily board....
[03:07:18] <systemd> ^ 03StaffPolicy - SoylentNews
[03:07:28] <kolie2> According to prior notes.
[03:08:29] <kolie2> Not that my title even says "management group" but sayign that management == board is contrary to this. Not that anyone was confused or has any illusion to the contrary.
[03:09:06] <kolie2> mrpg, interesting - I wonder what recipe would work for that in practice.
[03:10:28] <Bytram> kolie: "I have said as much from the beginning." "I'm an open book my man." I know you are very busy *doing* things for the site; thanks! What I see as missing, though, is *regular* and *frequent* posting to the site. Things like: Timeline. Milestones. Progress reports. Invite the community to participate and communicate! The only thing that grows in the dark are mushrooms! Earn our trust!
[03:11:54] <Bytram> Whew! I'm exhausted, and I see 6 pages of backscroll!
[03:12:36] <kolie2> Nothings really changed. I am still working towards replicating all the infrastructure in staging.
[03:13:44] <kolie2> I guess we got varnish and sphinx in staging now.
[03:13:53] <kolie2> Rehash remains unfinished.
[03:13:58] <kolie2> Workingish.
[03:20:48] <Bytram> Nice! But don't tell just me; tell the while community! Tell them/us in *official* updates! Not (just) posts on IRC; keep the *community* informed!!!
[03:21:34] <Bytram> Post stories keeping us informed!
[03:23:26] <Bytram> BTW, "I have been bust and working hard" does not cut it, either.
[03:23:41] <kolie2> halfway through a journal.
[03:24:17] <Bytram> BTW, "I have been busy and working hard" does not cut it, either. (LOL! what a typo!)
[03:26:06] <Bytram> Nice!!! But if I could ask, why not a real front page story?
[03:26:28] <AzumaHazuki> Kolie, what is your endgame? What do you benefit by doing this?
[03:26:45] <kolie2> Already said - my site I like very much stays operational and consistent.
[03:26:59] <Bytram> If you have trouble, I would be happy to help!
[03:27:04] <AzumaHazuki> right, and I'm Sailor Mercury, right down to the cute little blue miniskirt
[03:27:36] <AzumaHazuki> "VC" is a big, big red flag to me, Kolie. There is a reason people half-jokingly say it stands for "vulture capitalism."
[03:27:43] <kolie2> Cool. Well I happen to read soylentnews religiously. I will read the full site, open a tab, type in my next destination and realize i just auto typed soylent news . org again.
[03:28:14] <kolie2> VC used me to evaluate tech and make purchases, I consulted in VC, I am not VC.
[03:28:18] <AzumaHazuki> Why do we need an NDA? What is going to be done with the site data and content we as users produce?
[03:28:32] <kolie2> Who needs an NDA?
[03:29:02] <AzumaHazuki> I am seeing several comments on the site that there is an NDA involved
[03:29:14] <kolie2> I signed an NDA to get access to the SN servers.
[03:29:35] <kolie2> Why is that required? Because no legal entity in the world is going to let someone touch their systems without a standard nda of some sort.
[03:29:55] <kolie2> I'd do the work without an NDA
[03:29:55] <AzumaHazuki> is the text of said NDA available anywhere?
[03:30:15] <kolie2> it's a legal zoom bog standard NDA. I can access nc if I can show it.
[03:31:01] <AzumaHazuki> i just wish i knew what's going on here...my best guess is NC and Matthew Angel want some kind of RoI on the seed money they spent to get SN going in the first place but this is giving me the ick
[03:31:02] <kolie2> I asked for blanket exceptions to disclose a few things - otherwise everything I do would be subject to it.
[03:31:27] <kolie2> NC wants SN to stick around and not be a shitshow crashing pile of neglect.
[03:31:42] <kolie2> No one is under the illusion that SN will be profitable or return money.
[03:32:11] <kolie2> I wouldn't be involved at all if SN didn't announce a shutdown.
[03:32:40] <AzumaHazuki> it may be better for it to die in a recognizable form then live on as some sort of advertising/monetization engine...
[03:33:15] <kolie2> No one is monetizing it or wants to put advertising on it. That's not what NC wants and it's not what I would do if I was in a position to do somethinga bout it.
[03:33:31] <kolie2> The only talks about money came from - SN needs to be self sufficient in and of itself.
[03:33:35] <kolie2> I think it can do so today.
[03:33:53] <AzumaHazuki> okay, then the next question is: where does the operational funding come from? i kind of doubt subscriptions are enough to keep this going
[03:34:18] <kolie2> The subscription amount's I'm aware of today completely pay for hosting and incorporation fees etc.
[03:34:34] <kolie2> Theres minimal cost in the current form.
[03:34:49] <kolie2> How much comes in in subs?
[03:35:02] <AzumaHazuki> i'm not privy to that information
[03:35:21] <kolie2> I think its public or has been
[03:36:03] <AzumaHazuki> some has been but i don't know that that's all the information
[03:36:09] <kolie2> I've offered and would be comfortable to fund any cost for hosting or operation as I understand them today going forward out of my own pocket.
[03:36:17] <kolie2> And expect nothing to do so.
[03:37:50] <kolie2> so the p&l for 2019 says...
[03:38:26] <kolie2> EOY '20 7.4 gross sub income
[03:38:42] <kolie2> Total expense 6k
[03:38:57] <kolie2> I'm not sure why seems high to me.
[03:39:02] <kolie2> website was 3.2k
[03:39:13] <kolie2> 270$/mo
[03:39:25] <kolie2> It's my understanding the hosting is significantly less than that currently.
[03:39:57] <kolie2> I could cover the entire 6k and not blink.
[03:40:16] <kolie2> Not that it is necessary or what I think it takes going forward.
[03:41:00] <AzumaHazuki> i still don't get why. just to keep a site you like afloat?
[03:41:01] <kolie2> 1139$ in professional fees, not sure what that entails, seems reasonable if they had legal/accounting involvement for the year.
[03:41:27] <kolie2> You know how business pay to have little league teams with shirts and shit?
[03:41:40] <kolie2> And all they get is a plaque in their office.
[03:41:56] <kolie2> I get something out of this - the site is around.
[03:42:00] <kolie2> That's why.
[03:42:35] <Bytram> SN Self supporting? It was, for several YEARS. How do I know? Because I did the fundraising! At first, I worked from a rough estimate of what we seeded. When I learned better, I increased the target. And me it! Right up until Covid-19 hit and I had my strokes.
[03:42:35] <kolie2> I'm not paying anything currently - and nothing is being suggested that I do so in the future.
[03:42:38] <kolie2> Just saying I would.
[03:43:17] <kolie2> So my involvement is solely because of the instability of management threatening something I like.
[03:43:28] <kolie2> And I can do something about that - so I am - or atleast trying.
[03:43:31] <AzumaHazuki> well...like my namesake, i'm a lost girl, a wanderer. so in the long run what happens to SN is no real concern of mine. this just seems too good to be true
[03:43:41] <Bytram> Subscriptions covered expenses.
[03:44:10] <kolie2> idk about too good to be true.
[03:44:50] <kolie2> maybe for you - for me it involves doing shit - perhaps too good because we mutually benefit if I reach my stated goals.
[03:45:47] <kolie2> for me it's a simple proposition - atleast the beginning step - the community aspect needs to be fixed but I'm not addressing that rn because rn I'm not in a place to. manuevering there.
[03:46:03] <kolie2> the beginning is - remove roadblock to shutdown- thats nc, I'm addressing his perceived concerns.
[03:46:12] <Bytram> My fundraising efforts weke posed oas stories on the front page; it would be hard to miss them.
[03:46:35] <kolie2> after that - I see a roadblock in community being alienated from operations over long periods of time. that needs to be addressed.
[03:47:00] <kolie2> So I'll do what I can to resolve that in a manner that benefits the continuation and growth of the site because thats all I want to see.
[03:48:03] <Bytram> And, I wrote a summary of what we tool in vs expenses, too.
[03:48:04] <kolie2> Theres no money in this kind of thing - especially as it stands now. Anyone trying to make money would be far better off starting in a green field new domain and site.
[03:48:29] <kolie2> @Bytram, I read your post of the P&L and stuff right now in the wiki thats where I got it all so thanks for curating that.
[03:51:20] <kolie2> I posted my uhh journal update as well.
[03:52:54] <Bytram> Why not A story on the front page? or on both?+
[03:53:18] <kolie2> I'm not an editor and I don't write news for the site?
[03:53:23] <Bytram> BTW, thank you!
[03:54:50] <Bytram> I thought you had editor privs along with privs for everything else!?
[03:55:08] <kolie2> I have access to pretty much everything - doesn't mean I have carte blanche or should do whatever I Want.
[03:55:30] <kolie2> I'm not going to go posting articles to the front page - doesn't seem like my place to force shit.
[03:57:06] <kolie2> If I get a board position and leadership down the line - than I might take a more active role and feel comfortable voicing things from the pbc or about stuff.
[03:57:42] <kolie2> Right now I'm just a person trying to do right by a few people, and got a lot to prove/complete before any of it matters at all.
[03:58:06] <kolie2> If someone wants to do a write up I'll answer anything and be a good interviewee.
[03:58:25] <kolie2> I don't want to control the optics on this one - people will ask what they ask and Ill document what I do in journals.
[03:58:43] <Bytram> My concern is that information gets hidden from view. Mane it fron-and-center. You're not an editor? Well, *I* am. Let me know and I will post it for you!
[03:58:46] <kolie2> AFAIK the community is here atleast the people that have a bigger understanding of the long term.
[03:59:37] <kolie2> I get that - I figured atleast coming here and journals will give some light. I'd like to feel comfortable with articles on the site that's a bit much for me rn.
[03:59:58] <Bytram> Heck, I'll ghostwrite it for you!
[04:00:19] <kolie2> Alright - my main issue is - people take the things on front page and interpret that as this is what IS happening.
[04:01:02] <Bytram> "Here's the latest update I have received on the progress on SN." ...
[04:01:03] <kolie2> And what I want to communicate more than anything is - there are many paths here - I see one and am pursuing that. It's not to the exclusion of anyone or the community - and I'm very open to anything at this point.
[04:01:57] <kolie2> And I'd very much like for things to go back to boring and status quo for the staff.
[04:02:25] <kolie2> I just want my news :)
[04:02:29] <kolie2> And my comments.
[04:02:43] <kolie2> comment section vastly underrated.
[04:05:30] <Bytram> Sorry. I think your sudden appearance and announcements made it no longer possible for the site to suddeny go back to "boring"
[04:06:03] <kolie2> I mean that's not what caused this - the PBC disolving and shutting operations is.
[04:06:03] <Bytram> it is very late for me.
[04:06:50] <kolie2> But I intend very much to be business as usual after this is avoided and hashed out.
[04:06:55] <kolie2> Good night Bytram take care.
[04:07:33] <Bytram> And, I've got a good friend in the hospital. Very sick. And they don't know wy. :(
[04:09:16] <Bytram> I really wish to continue this conversation, but I just not up to iiit right now.
[04:09:32] <kolie2> Sorry to hear that - get good rest.
[04:12:15] <Bytram> kolie: I really do appreciate that. Thanh you very much!!
[04:12:59] <Bytram> have a good night!
[04:13:06] <kolie2> Thanks. o/
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[04:55:10] <Bytram> kolie2: "<kolie2> I posted my uhh journal update as well." I just went looking, and came up empty. Could you please the full URL link to this journal?
[04:56:50] <Bytram> Thank you very much!
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[07:58:07] <Ingar> in the meanwhile, Ingar has coffee
[07:58:12] <Ingar> *cheers*
[07:58:49] <chromas> Remember þe olden dayes of coffee increments?
[07:58:54] <chromas> coffee++
[07:58:57] <chromas> :'(
[08:00:37] <Ingar> we so need a new coffeebot
[08:01:31] * chromas puts on a new bot of coffee
[08:01:49] <Ingar> freshly grinded java
[08:02:08] <chromas> I wonder if kolie has access to the Bender files
[08:02:27] <chromas> Or we could just start over with new stats. The coffee value was inflated anyhow
[08:02:58] <Ingar> with current inflation, odl stats would be irrelevant anyway
[08:03:03] <Ingar> *old
[08:03:30] <chromas> True. We need to replace it with a float so each increment only gives like half a cup
[08:03:50] <chromas> or even a quarter cup
[08:04:06] <chromas> maybe a ⅗ compromise
[08:15:03] <Ingar> I count coffee in mugs
[08:15:07] <Ingar> cups are for amateurs :p
[08:15:21] <chromas> metric cups, of course
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[08:16:34] <Ingar> lol https://en.wikipedia.org I had no idea
[08:16:35] <systemd> ^ 03Cup (unit) - Wikipedia
[08:19:09] <chromas> Units are the timezones of…units
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[09:38:10] <sylvest> Is Kolie for real?
[09:40:44] <sylvest> He doesn't know who aristarchus was? Major blind spot.
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[09:47:25] <sylvest> janrinok's slurs upon my username did not go unnoticed.
[09:50:03] <sylvest> And I ask again, why isn't NCommander here?
[09:50:41] <chromas> Probably should ask NCommander
[09:52:36] <sylvest> More apropos, why is chromas here? One might ask.
[09:54:21] <chromas> Actually, nobody asked that
[09:54:50] * janrinok because we all know, and you have every right to be here
[09:55:13] <sylvest> Why is that? Just asking.
[09:55:47] <chromas> Why is someone who totally isn't ari obsessed with bringing up ari every day?
[09:56:05] * chromas deletes sylvest's hosts file
[09:56:47] <sylvest> I am quite upset about being accused of being aristarchus, and I will say bad things about anyone who insinuates that.
[09:57:43] <chromas> Well keep at it
[09:58:11] <chromas> In fact, you should be even more upset. Time to go stomp around the house
[09:58:22] * chromas burps sylvest
[09:58:45] <sylvest> Until SN comes to terms with its history of censorship, kolie will be buying nothing.
[09:59:01] <chromas> So you're pro-TMB then
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[10:04:50] <ted-ious> I keep hearing about this aristarchus person but I don't know much about him.
[10:05:10] <chromas> ted-ious = ari: confirmed
[10:05:22] <ted-ious> I'd like to hear his side of the story but apparently he won't come say it himself?
[10:06:14] <ted-ious> chromas: I don't think I'm important enough to inspire such strong feelings but I'll take the compliment anyway. :)
[10:06:38] <sylvest> TMB iniated the censorship, when he suggested that aristarchus was painting him with a broad brush. After today's indictment, turns out that was correct.
[10:06:40] <chromas> sorta the opposite of a compliment but ok
[10:09:26] <sylvest> ari used to submit a lot of submissions on the alt-right, not complimentary, but TMB in IRC objected (circa 2017) and all of ari's submissions were rejected after that.
[10:10:27] <janrinok> another lie - aristarchus had submission accepted up until 2022
[10:11:11] <janrinok> He had over 30 submissions accepted and published in 2021
[10:13:27] <sylvest> He had over Seven thousand submissions, with a single digit acceptance rate, because of a right wing bias by the editorial staff. This is the real problem with SoylentNews. This is what drove NCommander to the point of pulling the plug.
[10:14:19] <chromas> odd that non-ari would be so interested though
[10:15:08] <chromas> "This guy who's totally not myself spammed the site with irrelevant off-topic tripe and it got rejected!"
[10:15:26] <sylvest> all and any soylentils are interested, especially the ACs that have lost the ability to comment.
[10:15:55] <sylvest> I am not aristarchus, I am a soylentil. STFU, chromas.
[10:17:06] <janrinok> don't like being called out do you sylvest ?
[10:18:16] <sylvest> As many have said before, after being falsely accused by you of being aristarchus, go fuck yourself, janrinok! You are the death of SN.
[10:18:27] <janrinok> if a submission does not comply with the guidelines it is often binned. Or he would be told to put it in his journal, which still exists and you can read for yourself. Not much fun though reading what you wrote yourself.
[10:19:17] <janrinok> You got my email? I told of 5 other accounts all from your email address. That is why you are not accepted. You are a sock puppet.
[10:19:29] <chromas> "I'm not ari but I act exactly like him and say all the same things"
[10:19:42] <janrinok> chromas, yep, sure had me fooled
[10:19:59] <sylvest> Oh, just like how c0lo being mod banned is a bug, that affects only one person. But a predominately rational and lefty person? Your excuses do not stand.
[10:20:09] <chromas> He would have gotten away with it if it weren't for those meddling adults
[10:20:16] <janrinok> and ari could magically pull up the emails that I sent to sylvest. He even signed one of his comments when he did so.
[10:20:40] <sylvest> Meddling alt-right kids, as in intellectual children.
[10:20:44] <janrinok> still, I can't tell who it is, it's got me stumped
[10:20:56] <chromas> alt-right is just s shortcut for moving forward
[10:21:07] <janrinok> and your latest submission are all gone too
[10:21:22] <janrinok> ... for precisely the same reason.
[10:21:45] <sylvest> This is where your "soft skills" come in, janrinok. Pay attention to the content, not the person. Too late for you, I take it?
[10:22:23] <chromas> the content is retarded and off-topic
[10:22:40] <sylvest> I can submit more, and if not me, other true soylentils, until NCommander and kolie shut this place down.
[10:23:01] <janrinok> don't hold your breath. Have you seen the front page?
[10:23:16] <chromas> If you ever get around to submitting something of value, it might even be posted
[10:25:38] <janrinok> lunchtime!
[10:26:47] <sylvest> Die, SoylentNews, racist fucks! Die! Oh, kolie, this is what you are trying to buy. Look to Elon Musk's profitabiltiy with that, or the purchasers of Parler.
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[10:38:48] <inz> !bots--
[10:38:49] <inz> oops
[10:39:06] <karmabot> inz, !bots: -1
[10:39:13] <inz> bots--
[10:39:13] <karmabot> inz, bots: -88
[10:40:33] <chromas> coffee++
[10:40:33] <karmabot> chromas, coffee: 5613
[10:40:36] <chromas> noice
[10:40:40] <chromas> inz++
[10:40:40] <karmabot> chromas, inz: 22
[10:40:45] <chromas> coffee++
[10:40:46] <karmabot> chromas, coffee: 5614
[10:41:00] <chromas> What's the karma source?
[10:41:06] <inz> IRC logs :)
[10:41:12] <chromas> excellent
[10:41:15] <chromas> inz++
[10:41:16] <karmabot> chromas, inz: 23
[10:41:19] <chromas> poutine--
[10:41:19] <karmabot> chromas, poutine: -445
[10:41:22] <chromas> systemd--
[10:41:23] <karmabot> chromas, systemd: -38
[10:41:31] <inz> That's way too high
[10:41:42] <sylvest> sylvest is not a soylent account. janrinok has sent no emails to me.
[10:42:03] <chromas> , he says, three and a half hours later
[10:42:14] <sylvest> I begin to worry about his mental health.
[10:42:27] <inz> chromas, you'd think there'd be a better comeback after that long.
[10:42:58] <sylvest> Chromas is obviously not chronos.
[10:43:03] <chromas> "Kim Kardashian? I thin kshe got cum on her back"
[10:43:58] <sylvest> What's chromas got on his back?
[10:45:10] <chromas> a mentally disabled fellow, apparently
[10:46:51] <chromas> Because of how slow he types, I always got the impression ari was typing one-handed. Probably stroking himself as he types. Maybe he's in a wheelchair, typing with his mouth.
[10:47:58] <chromas> Or the department of instigation didn't give him the budget to replace his keyboard after he spilled his pony jar on it
[10:49:27] <sylvest> Well, here is a part of the problem, as I see it. We have a certain group of soylentils, and many of the staff, that have a hankering for the USENET of the past, and like to think of IRC as somehow more real and important than what happens on the public facing parts of SoylentNews. They are upset that the actual owner of the site does not share their enthusiasm, and ability to make decisons off site. Runaway, curiously,
[10:49:27] <sylvest> was among them. Well, that will all come to naught, as the actual Board makes decisons, now.
[10:50:46] <chromas> IRC and email are the official and main channels of communication between staff
[10:53:49] <sylvest> Yeh, so you say. Not verified by any public policy statements. Illegal tyranny!
[10:54:49] <chromas> of course, as a staff, I would be a little more in the know than some truncated rando
[10:54:56] <sylvest> Any one else have a bad vibe about sylvest? Any one else that should?
[10:55:19] <chromas> https://www.youtube.com
[10:55:22] <systemd> ^ 03The Karate Kid
[10:55:27] <chromas> Took them long enough to make this a free movie on here
[10:56:11] <chromas> Cobra Kai was originally a YouTube series so they shoulda dunnit then
[10:56:56] <janrinok> oh, he is angry, he has started his bot again....
[10:57:15] <chromas> Sounds like a fun time
[10:57:17] <janrinok> chromas, this is serious now, he has restarted his bot.
[10:57:33] <chromas> I wonder if he's paid by China or Russia
[10:57:42] <janrinok> at least it isn't stuck doing .ru email addresses this time
[10:57:43] <chromas> Maybe even the Fed
[10:59:11] <sylvest> Fantasy, janrinok. I have no bots. Or, I have thousands of bots, and the .ru addresses are Runaway's not mine.
[11:00:07] <janrinok> sylvest, actually, if you scroll back up this channel you will see that kolie has spent a lot of time on here.
[11:00:09] <sylvest> Your support for Hungarian fascists does not go unnoticed.
[11:00:41] <ted-ious> Video unavailable. The uploader has not made this video available in your country
[11:00:45] <janrinok> lol - which Hungarian fascist in particular?
[11:00:50] <ted-ious> Oh well no nostalgia for me.
[11:00:55] <sylvest> Yes, I have read all of kolie's posts. You are not very nice to him.
[11:01:38] <janrinok> I am not trying to be. I am trying to get answers. I take it then you still haven't read the front page?
[11:04:37] <janrinok> Well, you can't have read all of them, but you have probably read the ones in this channel.
[11:06:46] <sylvest> No, it makes no difference. I expect that the site will be shut down, and I have even less confidence in kolie than you have. BuckFeta has evoloved into WuckMeta. Just let it die.
[11:07:18] <chromas> If you go somewhere else, then from your perspective, it's already dead
[11:07:56] <chromas> For some reason though, everyone who wants it dead (ari and zumi), just can't leave. They're addicted I guess
[11:08:37] <janrinok> sylvest, before you make yourself look even more stupid that you already have, read the front page.
[11:10:06] <sylvest> Read it, and before you make yourself look even more stupid than you are (if that is even possible), shut the fuck up now. Mon Dieu, janrinok, how dense are you?
[11:12:18] <sylvest> And you wonder why the left on this site has to resort to personal insults, against invincible ignorance.
[11:12:39] <chromas> because they don't have an argument
[11:12:43] <janrinok> and your terminology reveals who you are again.....
[11:12:49] <chromas> that's the usual reason for pulling out insults
[11:14:33] <sylvest> Have an argument, the idiot right does not comprehend the argument. Ignorant morons need to be punched in the face, to get their attention. Or have the website shut down to prove to them that they were right wing cesspools.
[11:15:59] <sylvest> My terminology? They are words, you arsehole, the words of those with more education than you, ones who did not go into the military, and engage in "military intelligence", one of the great oxymorons.
[11:16:45] * chromas puts another quarter into ari's slot to keep him buzzing
[11:16:59] <janrinok> And also, in a document published on the wiki since 2014:
[11:17:04] <janrinok> Privacy Policy
[11:17:04] <janrinok> It is the policy of SoylentNews, in as much as is reasonably possible, to retain the least amount of personally identifiable information about the community's members. Certain items are necessary in the conduction of the site's operation. These include, but are not necessarily restricted to: e-mail address and IP address [what else?]. Reasonable and customary steps are taken to protect that information.
[11:17:47] <sylvest> ari is banned. There is no ari here. Ari posts are not allowed. No leftist positions can be posted on SN, under penalty of banishment.
[11:18:05] <janrinok> So your accusations that I am running software to 'track' people is simply rubbish.
[11:18:24] <janrinok> I don't look anywhere outside of this site.
[11:18:44] <sylvest> Not my accusation, another soylentils accusation, and given the facts, plausible
[11:19:54] -!- justin_ [justin_!~justin@47.180.mlm.kw] has joined #soylent
[11:19:55] <janrinok> and from the same documentation
[11:19:58] <janrinok> Abusive Behaviour
[11:19:59] <janrinok> SoylentNews aims to be tolerant of any individual's personal views and will allow them to express their views in the comments of published stories. However, occasionally, individuals will not express their views relating to a story but will employ offensive and/or abusive behaviour towards an individual. This is not in the spirit of the site and a graduated response will be adopted to anyone who employs such behaviour in their comments.
[11:19:59] <janrinok> [...]
[11:19:59] <janrinok> The MG can agree to ban the offender for a specific period or permanently and take action to do so. There are, of course, technical difficulties associated with effectively banning an individual but a block of his personal IPs for each computer system as and when they are identified might be considered as a reasonable action.
[11:20:02] <sylvest> What makes you think I am aristarchus, as you have claimed earlier in this IRC? Stupid gut feeling? Do I stress you so?
[11:21:05] <janrinok> aristarchus is receiving all the emails that are sent to your email address. He has quoted them in comments. He has even signed one of those comments.
[11:21:06] <chromas> "Hey guys! Out of nowhere, I have to be sure you know that I'm not Ari!"
[11:22:06] <sylvest> I am not so sure that chromas is not "deep-cover" aristarchus.
[11:22:15] <janrinok> I am sure he is not
[11:22:22] -!- AlwaysNever has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
[11:22:37] <sylvest> How do you know that , janrinok? How do you know anything?
[11:22:50] <chromas> This aristarchus must be some elite haxxer, getting access to other people's emails. Probably a false flag by the salt-right
[11:22:55] <janrinok> because it is there for all to see in the comments.
[11:23:38] <janrinok> lol - against somebody who claims he is not ari. They still get your emails but then pretend to be ari. How do they do that?
[11:23:40] <sylvest> What emails, janrinok? I have not gotten any emails, since I have no account, and no associated email.
[11:23:42] -!- kolie2 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
[11:24:17] <janrinok> You have used the sylvest name in other accounts from the same email address that you tried to create your latest account.
[11:25:34] <sylvest> Really? Go ahead, you asshole Brit! Breach confidentiality and post them here! I dare you, you vomitous pile of parrot droppings!
[11:26:13] <janrinok> you are losing again, aren't you? You don't like it when somebody can do to you what you have often done to them.
[11:27:02] <janrinok> isn't time for you nap yet?
[11:27:32] * chromas burps sylvest again
[11:28:01] <chromas> This is like when you see a Karen in the store ranting and raving about how right she is while everyone else just stands agape as she confirms her high Karenosity index
[11:29:30] <janrinok> oh, temper tantrum submissions now....
[11:29:43] <sylvest> This is why SoylentNews is finished. The staff is biased, and can be easily provoked to demonstrate that fact.
[11:30:28] * chromas refills the ba-ba and grabs a fresh diaper
[11:30:30] <janrinok> but we have got rid of all the crap from the front pages..... That sounds like a win to me
[11:31:02] <chromas> Bias isn't inherently bad. Remember hi-bias audio tapes?
[11:31:11] <janrinok> I do!
[11:31:49] <janrinok> But we simply apply a set of guidelines which have be published and are easy to comply with.
[11:32:01] <chromas> We're biased against off-topic submissions
[11:32:30] <sylvest> Right! Of course!
[11:32:38] <janrinok> oh, damn, you've seen through the plot
[11:33:18] <sylvest> Yes, nearly everyone has. Say "goodbye", janrinok.
[11:33:31] <janrinok> are you leaving again?
[11:33:49] <janrinok> Departure # 73 I think
[11:34:17] <chromas> Goodbye, janrinok
[11:34:27] -!- mode/#soylent [+o chromas] by Imogen
[11:34:29] <sylvest> I will be here after you, and chromas, are gone. Get used to it.
[11:34:29] -!- sylvest was kicked from #Soylent by chromas!~chromas@Soylent/Staph/Infector/chromas [sylvest]
[11:34:41] <janrinok> lol
[11:37:04] <chromas> it would be kind of amusing if we all left for Soylnet 2: the Rehashening and ari was still here throwing tantrums at 50% of the board
[12:38:39] <Ingar> coffee++
[12:38:40] <karmabot> Ingar, coffee: 5615
[12:38:42] <Ingar> yes!
[12:38:45] <Ingar> aristarchus--
[12:38:45] <karmabot> Ingar, aristarchus: -77
[12:39:01] <Ingar> keeping taht score
[12:42:12] <Bytram> poutine--
[12:42:12] <karmabot> Bytram, poutine: -446
[12:42:28] <Bytram> lol
[12:43:10] <Bytram> plus++
[12:43:10] <karmabot> Bytram, plus: 3
[12:43:19] <Ingar> Bytram: poutine, the dish ?
[12:46:24] <Bytram> No. We had had a user on IRC many tears ago who like to "stir the pot" and try to get folk agitated.
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[12:52:31] <Ingar> oh that does ring a bell
[12:53:04] <Bytram> It became a "meme" to do "touting--" as a result. I was reminded of this as I read all the crap posted by sylvenus
[12:54:32] <Bytram> (or however it is spelled)
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[13:10:59] <Bytram> Ugh. I am still tired and am going back to bed.
[13:13:32] <Bytram> Pls let me know if kolie returns; I'm still looking for his journal post; the full URL.
[13:18:29] <janrinok> Bytram, will do!
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[14:49:58] <inz> Sorry to say that karmabot is now just a shell script; I would've used Java, as by name it would be the most appropriate, but unfortunately I deeply despise it.
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[15:00:10] <Ingar> inz: kudos for deeply despising java
[15:14:54] <Bytram> gtg; laters!
[15:15:21] <janrinok> laters!
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[15:58:06] <justin_> o/
[15:58:11] <justin_> fun stuff eh
[15:58:20] justin_ is now known as kolie2
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[16:01:19] <kolie2> ahh man I missed sylvest
[16:03:45] <janrinok> he has just emailed me quoting one the emails that he claimed he was not receiving. He wanted me to give him an account. I declined (politely) of course.
[17:33:01] <kolie> I must've fucked up my journal entry.
[17:33:06] <kolie> Cause I totally wrote one.
[17:33:27] <kolie> I need some notes from my other desk to repost it.
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[18:43:15] <AlwaysNever> I remember Barrapunto.com had no ads, except for a cuple of fixed banner for the hosting where they were hosted, which was providing said hosting for "free"
[18:44:02] <AlwaysNever> In my opinion something like that would be not a bad option in SN, to lower even more its costs
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[20:18:46] * mechanicjay dd's his way to a new hard drive
[21:23:15] <mechanicjay> AlwaysNever: I think as we're running on a single smaller Db node now, costs are quite minimal.
[21:24:13] <mechanicjay> We needed a couple unfortunately large VMs to run the DB cluster because NDB really realy really really likes RAM, and if it doesn't have enough it won't run -- and you need enough ram to run two ndb nodes for the cluster to work.
[21:54:32] <AlwaysNever> mechanicjay: so SN is running lean now, that's good
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[23:23:32] <kolie> Super lean AlwaysNever
[23:52:21] <chromas> Needs moar fat. It's where the flavor is