#soylent | Logs for 2022-01-28

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[00:06:35] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - US Navy Wants to Get Crashed Stealth Fighter Back -- Before China Can - https://sylnt.us - if-they-can't-find-it,-was-it-too-stealthy?
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[01:02:45] <Runaway1956> I sit here, hearing my wife's new puppy whimpering and whining - after a couple minutes go to investigate
[01:03:22] <Runaway1956> expect to find him trapped behind fridge, or his head stuck in a big jar, or leg stuck in a door, or something wildly ridiculous
[01:03:43] <Runaway1956> grandchildren in the bathroom bathing, and they've locked him out
[01:03:55] <Runaway1956> poor thing wants to romp in the water with his peers
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[01:04:50] <Runaway1956> Not sure why my bathroom is so attractive to kids this evening, don't think I want to ask - I know their water isn't frozen now that it has warmed up
[01:59:04] <tedious> Why does everything I try to install that uses x11 want to eventually pull in rust and spidermonkey?
[01:59:12] <tedious> Talk about bloat ware.
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[02:02:15] <t3> the worst part is huge dependency chains that are just for documentation
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[02:06:34] <tedious> Is that what's jamming me up?
[02:07:06] <tedious> I figured out that getting rid of elogind killed a huge amount of bloat but that's only good for x11-server.
[02:07:46] <tedious> I still end up with rust or even more bloat if I try to install any window manager.
[02:09:05] <t3> try cwm
[02:09:21] <tedious> What's that like?
[02:09:21] <AzumaHazuki> what distro is this?
[02:10:13] <AzumaHazuki> a very nice light desktop is made of openbox + picom + pcmanfm + tint2, by the way. pcmanfm can manage the root window, tint can produce a fluxbox-like panel, and picom is a wonderful light compositor
[02:10:19] <t3> it's pretty minimalistic, but has all the features I need, very light, no dependencies
[02:12:08] <tedious> AzumaHazuki: I'm still trying to get gentoo to be nice to me.
[02:12:34] <AzumaHazuki> gentoo is painful on anything but fast desktop hardware these days
[02:12:49] <AzumaHazuki> might i suggest Void or Artix?
[02:12:51] <tedious> I gave up trying to fix my old system problems so I'm building a new one in a chroot and trying to keep all the bloat out so I hopefully won't have these problems in the future.
[02:12:52] <t3> it's also part of openbsd's base, so the docs are good
[02:13:36] <tedious> t3 does cwm at least have a menu system like icewm for example?
[02:14:26] <t3> I've never used icewm, but it has exec menus, window selection menus, ssh menus
[02:15:53] <AzumaHazuki> icewm has serious potential. of the plain window managers it's the most complete, but it's also missing a lot of features
[02:16:03] <AzumaHazuki> notably, last i tried, composition still doesn't work
[02:18:16] <tedious> I don't know what composition is so I don't think I'm missing it. :)
[02:19:13] <tedious> Unfortunately icewm seems to need librsvg which needs rust.
[02:19:32] <tedious> Maybe it's because of something called vala?
[02:20:01] <AzumaHazuki> no, librsvg is now coded in rust
[02:20:04] <AzumaHazuki> because of course it is
[02:20:16] <AzumaHazuki> i know, that made me about shit a brick too
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[02:23:43] <tedious> Oh jeeze.
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[02:23:50] <tedious> Because of course it is.
[02:24:18] <tedious> What a perfect comment on the state of the world of software.
[02:29:03] <AzumaHazuki> from a coding point of view it makes sense. from a "hey not everyone has 16 GiB of memory" point of view? noooooot so much, de gesso
[02:32:35] <t3> do rust programs use more memory? I thought tedious was just trying to avoid the "somehow worse than llvm or boost" rust bbootstrap process
[02:33:54] <tedious> I want to avoid having to recompile rust every 5 days just because I want to control my system with a mouse. :)
[02:34:27] <tedious> Rust updates even more often than spidermonkey which is almost as big a pain to update.
[02:35:01] <tedious> Is there some kind of live cd I can use to try out cwm?
[02:35:30] <tedious> I don't seem to be able to get icewm to abandon its rust lust.
[02:36:56] <t3> if it's a live image with X already on it, every distro has cwm in repo and it's tiny
[02:37:09] <t3> so you could just install it from the live image
[02:37:43] <t3> I don't know of any that use it out of the box though
[02:38:03] <AzumaHazuki> there is a rust-bin package, iirc
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[02:38:40] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> WHoa mama! Sure is a lot in the news today!
[02:38:52] * Runaway1956 yawns
[02:38:52] * MrPlow flips a Skittle into Runaway1956's gaping mouth
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[02:39:06] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Lots of entertainment
[02:39:11] <Runaway1956> what is newsworthy to Ethanol_Fueled?
[02:39:17] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> for awhile it was just pandemic scaremongering
[02:39:40] <AzumaHazuki> oh, this idiot again
[02:39:42] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> I wouldn't worry about what is newsworthy
[02:40:15] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Doubt SN would want to become CNN, or Rantingly, or something
[02:40:15] <Runaway1956> not worried, I was just being sociable
[02:40:45] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> But I have a feeling that you may be getting a break from my shitposting soon.
[02:41:07] <Runaway1956> Are you going undercover to South Africa or something?
[02:41:10] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> I'm going to jail for threatening the ADL
[02:41:30] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Got drunk and sent them an e-mail
[02:41:30] <Runaway1956> Oh - well - making credible threats is never a good idea.
[02:41:57] <Bytram> plat stupid games...
[02:42:14] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Yeah. They're trying to have me committed too
[02:42:16] <Runaway1956> I knew there was some reason I gave up drunken carrousing
[02:42:57] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> They claim that I'm a 5150 so even though I made bail they might lock me up with all the Homeless, tweeked-out Mexicans
[02:43:14] <Runaway1956> What's a 5150?
[02:43:23] <Runaway1956> shorthand for psycho?
[02:43:26] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> A really awesome Van Halen album
[02:43:35] <t3> crazy
[02:43:37] <Bytram> pls change your nick
[02:43:38] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Not as good as 1984 but still decent
[02:43:55] <USA_yes_JEWS_no> Uh oh, they're here for me! I uh gotta ahskdfhakdjsfhaksdflas;fgdfl ihaksdfnk ang kasndknaskg,ansdfg
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[02:44:26] <Runaway1956> need moar drama
[02:44:29] <Bytram> that's one way to change your nick
[02:45:53] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - UK MPs to Debate Landmark IoT Security Law - https://sylnt.us - because-it-was-IoT-not-IoST
[02:49:15] <t3> lol, EF in a turtle suit for trolling too hard, that's almost like justice
[03:13:15] <tedious> Ok I'm making a minimal debian system to install cwm on it and see if I can use that.
[03:14:04] <tedious> t3 do you have any idea what else I need to install manually or will installing cwm and a few apps like xterm and lightdm pull in all the deps I need?
[03:26:43] <tedious> So far it looks like cwm + xdm + xterm is enough to pull in whatever it needs.
[03:34:16] <tedious> Nope it's not able to start xdm and launch an x server.
[03:35:17] <t3> probably an xdm issue rather than cwm
[03:35:44] <t3> I always just use startx
[03:38:53] <tedious> Installing xinit gave me startx and I might be able to login with xdm if I can ever figure out how to exit cwm.
[03:39:08] <tedious> It started with no menus and no way to quit.
[03:39:09] <t3> ctrl-shift-alt-q
[03:39:25] <t3> yeah, the defaults have too many modifier-keys
[03:40:17] <t3> they're not too bad once you learn them, but I change most of them
[03:41:26] <tedious> Does it come with any menus or buttons or anything?
[03:41:27] <t3> ctrl-alt-enter for terminal, ctrl-? for exec
[03:41:46] <t3> get a terminal and then man cwm
[03:41:54] <t3> it has all the keybinds
[03:42:08] <t3> to configure man cwmrc
[03:42:15] <tedious> No man page.
[03:43:00] <tedious> Oh ok they're called openbsd-cwm and cwmrc.
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[04:02:52] <tedious> Openbox without anything else looks like it might work.
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[05:16:23] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Australia Scientists Find 'Spooky' Spinning Object in Milky Way - https://sylnt.us
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[07:52:52] <chromas> https://i.imgur.com
[08:08:14] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Crowding, Climate Change, and the Case for Social Distancing Among Trees - https://sylnt.us - remember-Treebeard-and-the-Ents
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[08:31:43] <chromas> "I am no tree!"
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[10:40:06] <chromas> https://medicalxpress.com
[10:40:07] <systemd> ^ 03Not easy being green: China's 'health codes' define Covid-era life
[10:41:22] <chromas> "The health codes, with their colour-coded system of red, yellow and green signifying different levels of COVID risk, have been a crucial pillar of this system. Health-tracking apps are now required for entry almost everywhere, including offices, transport stations, stores, malls and taxis. Without it, normal life grinds to a halt."
[10:42:13] <chromas> "Residents in the western city of Xi'an complained in December of a systemwide crash on their local health code app after authorities suddenly ordered mass testing of millions of inhabitants over a spike in coronavirus cases. The order prompted residents to flock to COVID-19 testing centres, overwhelming the health code system. Local media reported hours-long lines of people trying to enter subway stations as well as a second system crash
[10:42:13] <chromas> in January after the city had been placed under strict lockdown. The city official in charge of the technology was swiftly fired."
[10:42:15] <chromas> hue
[10:43:17] <FatPhil> In China, "fired" probably means a firing squad.
[10:43:37] <janrinok> FatPhil is being picky again....
[10:47:40] <FatPhil> Nope, picky is Leon Trotsky
[10:49:01] <FatPhil> Unsure whether to blame Mexico or Russia for that.
[10:56:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Uncontrolled Blood Pressure is Sending More People to the Hospital - https://sylnt.us - take-it-easy
[11:12:26] <janrinok> lol
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[13:05:16] <FatPhil> Forget ThunderM1ll1m3tr3, forget ThunderAngstr0m, I finally have optimised Thunderf00t as far as it's possible to go! I hereby announce the first ThunderPl4nkL3ngth video! https://www.youtube.com
[13:05:17] <systemd> ^ 03Riding - Silent Partner
[13:47:54] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Players Needed to Solve Puzzles and Help Advance Cancer Research - https://sylnt.us - blocked
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[16:26:48] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - JEDEC Publishes HBM3 Update to High Bandwidth Memory (HBM) Standard - https://sylnt.us - I-suppose-my-DDR3-doesn't-cut-it-anymore
[17:03:32] <Runaway1956> My inertnet truly sucks - I've been disconnected from IRC 19 times since midnight - mostly automatically reconnected soon after, but not always
[17:04:12] <Runaway1956> That's 19 times in 11 hours, since we don't all live in US Central time
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[17:44:47] <Runaway1956> And, wow, connectivity issues are putting a huge dent in my F@H - 6 work units queued to send, all of them losing points while they wait!
[18:47:41] <chromas> Are you using ipv6?
[18:50:15] <janrinok> sounds like he isn't using anything at the moment.....
[18:53:55] <Runaway1956> No, everything here is IPv4 - the ISP isn't sophisticated enough for IPv5
[18:54:02] <Runaway1956> well, 5 or 6
[18:54:54] <tedious> How long does it go down for Runaway1956?
[18:55:24] <Runaway1956> Many times, it looks like only one or two minutes
[18:55:54] <Runaway1956> Long enough to make IRC disconnect, long enough to interrupt file transfers
[18:57:51] <tedious> The modem drops the connection and has to redo the whole negotiatiation process?
[18:59:05] <Runaway1956> That is what it appears to happen tedious, when I check the router login window, I have no IP, wait a minute, and I have an IP address again
[18:59:29] <tedious> Oh well that's different.
[18:59:31] <Runaway1956> Have used multiple modems, they all go through this sooner or later
[19:00:12] <tedious> That could be a failure to renew your dhcp lease so the router blocks all traffic until it finishes.
[19:00:28] <tedious> What's happening to the lights on the modem during this outage?
[19:01:13] * janrinok is obviously listening to a man who has done this before......
[19:01:14] <Runaway1956> I get pretty much the same sequence as a reboot - the power light is on, all ethernet plugs are alive, but no DSL and no internet
[19:01:44] <Runaway1956> wait a minute, I get a DSL light again, then another minute, I get internet with an IP
[19:02:11] <tedious> Ok that's a dsl line protocol retrain.
[19:02:19] <Runaway1956> sometimes, the DSL light stays on, uninterrpted, it's just the internet that goes out
[19:02:31] <tedious> Oh.
[19:02:42] <tedious> That's weird.
[19:02:54] <Runaway1956> it will vary, but usually the DSL light also goes out for a moment or 5
[19:03:42] <Runaway1956> This may continue for another day, or another week, then it stays stable for days, even weeks
[19:04:39] <Runaway1956> scrolling up through IRC log, it's 1 1/2 hours since last disconnect, maybe I'm good for awhile
[19:05:12] <tedious> Well I guess it's possible for line problems to cause the connection to drop but not trigger a full retraining.
[19:05:48] <Runaway1956> We have a years long problem with the copper - they've replaced some of it, but not all
[19:05:56] <janrinok> have your work units cleared?
[19:06:22] <Runaway1956> I guess it was 5 years ago, they took out an old junction box along the highway, replaced it
[19:06:44] <Runaway1956> things got a lot better, for over a year, but "better" is a relative thing
[19:07:25] <Runaway1956> Yeah, work units finally cleared the queue
[19:08:08] <Runaway1956> I'm being called - I think lunch or dinner or something is ready
[19:08:10] <Runaway1956> BBL
[19:10:43] <chromas> DHL? I'm so sorry
[19:10:51] <chromas> s/H/S/
[19:10:51] <SedBot> <chromas> DSL? I'm so sorry
[19:17:10] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Widespread Sound Communication Among Fish - https://sylnt.us - Dr.-Seuss-approved
[19:19:53] <tedious> Dsl isn't really any better or worse than cable honestly.
[19:20:34] <tedious> The main thin is how far away is your closest node because from that node on up the rest of the network is usually fiber and much more reliable.
[19:21:44] <tedious> So if your cable node is 5 miles away but your dsl node is at the end of the street it doesn't take a genius to figure out which one should be able to give you better service.
[19:22:46] <tedious> If I had to guess I'd say that Runaway1956 has a leaky junction box somewhere or a connector that shakes in the wind or something like that.
[19:27:18] <chromas> DSL's always been far enough away to be slow and shitty for me (and everyone I know)
[19:27:31] <chromas> oooh, 35MB/s? Slow down, the g-forces are killing me!
[19:31:46] <Deucalion> Gahhh... beware the Hexchat version upgrade if you have a case sensitive file system and value your scrollback (i.e. a linux dist not Windows).
[19:33:00] <chromas> Is your log file for #Soylent even though the channel is #soylent?
[19:34:45] <janrinok> hi Deucalion
[19:34:51] <Deucalion> Previous versions stored scrollback in ~/home/.config/hexchat/scrollback/Network-Name-As-You-See-In-Hexchat/#channel.txt
[19:35:58] <janrinok> mine still does...
[19:36:01] <Deucalion> Latest version... flattens the caps in the network-name-as-you-see-in-hexchat so decides to create a new dir and new logs
[19:36:53] <Deucalion> HexChat v2.14.3 OS: Linux 5.4.0-96-generic
[19:37:20] <janrinok> I'm using the same...
[19:38:13] <janrinok> but everything is lower case apart from the SoylentNews folder right at the top
[19:38:39] <Deucalion> no no - I'm talking about as stored on your PC
[19:38:57] <Deucalion> and o/ hi janrinok
[19:39:18] <janrinok> so am I - everything is lower case even when the #channel is uppercase on the screen
[19:39:32] <janrinok> all the files are lower case
[19:40:03] <Deucalion> Yup that's the "new" format.
[19:40:24] <janrinok> oh, didn't realise it didn't use to be like that....
[19:41:19] <Deucalion> Just stumbled on it as I'm visiting family this week, so flattened the laptop, threw the latest Mint on it and grabbed my HexChat data from my desktop as I usually do.
[19:41:32] <janrinok> understandable
[19:41:46] <Deucalion> No idea what vers my desktop is using
[19:42:33] <Deucalion> No biggie other than I'll have to upgrade the desktop so they use the same format then merge the files.
[19:43:13] <Deucalion> BIAB
[19:43:16] <janrinok> k
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[19:51:08] <Bytram> Deucalion: Hi!
[19:54:41] <Bytram> Enjoy your visit!!!
[20:11:15] <Runaway1956> A belly button is basically a scar from when you got into a knife fight with a guy in a mask after being evicted from your first place.
[20:12:11] <chromas> Your fault for not masking up
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[20:18:02] <Bytram> Deucalion: PM
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[20:24:19] <Runaway1956> https://ifunny.co
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[21:59:17] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Amazon Workers Want a Union Vote - https://sylnt.us
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[22:43:06] <SoyCow5467> Wow, for a population that gets lots of other nations' money, the International Jew sure doesn't have a sense of humor.
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[22:47:44] <SoyCow5467> https://www.adl.org
[22:47:45] <systemd> ^ 03ADL Collaborative for Change Fellowship Offers Jews of Color Opportunity to Share Their Stories
[22:48:07] <SoyCow5467> Anybody want to go scrounge up some token minorities so people forget about our insular racism and involvement in the slave trade?
[22:48:22] <SoyCow5467> I can think of one right off the bat: WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOPIII!
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[23:41:48] <Fnord666> Soylentnews coming in at #3 https://www.makeuseof.com
[23:41:49] <systemd> ^ 03The Best Dark Web Websites You Won't Find on Google
[23:42:26] <Fnord666> And by 'you won't find on google' they mean that you can totally find them on google.
[23:43:10] <Deucalion> wtf is that - secure yourself with a VPN before visiting? lol
[23:43:35] <Deucalion> "dark web" lololololol
[23:44:00] <Deucalion> Maybe they mean we don't have an iPhone app :D