#soylent | Logs for 2021-10-25
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[23:29:02] <kyonko`> what would schopenhauer do?
[23:28:49] <kyonko`> wow, look at the CYBRQUAD
[22:41:17] <kyonko`> super spreader event -2340
[22:41:09] <kyonko`> gathering of the juggalos
[22:41:00] <kyonko`> around 2009 or 2010 the juggalos came to tucson in a carnival and the police shot pepper paintballs at them
[22:38:56] <chromas> drinking too much from the Faygo tree
[22:38:22] <requerdanos> it's their fan club that was a terror group. icp is a musical ensemble.
[22:37:51] <kyonko`> remember when insane clown posse was a terror group?
[22:24:30] <Runaway1956> don't forget phat balls
[22:24:19] <kyonko`> body balls
[22:24:14] <kyonko`> inner balls
[22:24:12] <kyonko`> lower balls
[22:24:11] <kyonko`> upper balls
[22:23:43] <Runaway1956> they have no balls to scratch
[22:23:24] <Runaway1956> which reminds me - you know why women rub their eyes when they wake up?
[22:22:43] <Runaway1956> only two?
[22:22:31] <chromas> I've got two iBalls
[22:21:27] <Runaway1956> I finally have an iThing, sort of
[22:20:50] <Runaway1956> but i386? Didn't Jobs copyright little i
[22:20:26] <kyonko`> as jobs was a motorola man
[22:20:20] <kyonko`> it came from microsoft
[22:20:08] <Runaway1956> Did it come from Steve Jobs laboratory?
[22:19:44] <kyonko`> needed i387
[22:19:41] <Runaway1956> Actually, I've only been to Target 1/2 dozen times in my life
[22:19:38] <kyonko`> DIP ram, 16-bit only
[22:19:27] <kyonko`> the 1985 release of the i386 was a bomb
[22:19:14] <kyonko`> defective computers
[22:18:54] <Runaway1956> Most everything was from Vietnam
[22:18:40] <kyonko`> exactly
[22:18:35] <kyonko`> they send you a weekly/monthly clothing packet
[22:18:30] <Runaway1956> Finally found the best of the pick, with one arm shorter than the other
[22:18:28] <kyonko`> just get the plan from amazon
[22:18:20] <kyonko`> an hour????
[22:18:13] <Runaway1956> Needed a dress short with little notice, went in and searched for an hour for a decent shirt
[22:18:07] <kyonko`> defective shoes are the bees knees
[22:17:55] <kyonko`> Target isn't defective clothes
[22:17:43] <Runaway1956> What about Target?
[22:17:40] <kyonko`> VF made/makes wrangler
[22:17:27] <kyonko`> reminds me of the shit from VF factory outlet in the mid 90's
[22:17:26] * Runaway1956 ponders the strangeness factor
[22:17:13] <kyonko`> the ross clothes have certain defects that make them uncomfortable to wear
[22:16:51] <kyonko`> why launder when you can toss?
[22:16:43] <kyonko`> throw away clothes
[22:16:37] <Runaway1956> cross dress for less?
[22:16:28] <kyonko`> (before covid19)
[22:16:25] <kyonko`> ross dress for less was always full of mexican nationals untill they closed at around 1 am
[22:16:22] * Runaway1956 has had to pay Canadians hundreds of dollars to cross the border
[22:15:50] <kyonko`> sky's the limit
[22:15:42] <kyonko`> no money at all, credit only
[22:15:37] <kyonko`> most of the border shoppers were mexican nationals
[22:15:29] <Runaway1956> Mmmmm - how much money?
[22:15:24] <kyonko`> because why would you ever dare leave home WITHOUT MONEY?
[22:15:15] <kyonko`> if you have THE MONEY
[22:15:12] <kyonko`> dual citizens can
[22:15:07] <kyonko`> mexican nationals can't cross the border post covid19
[22:14:58] <kyonko`> some borderlands bullshit
[22:14:54] <Runaway1956> cross post covid rules?
[22:14:42] <Runaway1956> ????? what does that even mean kyonko?
[22:14:34] <kyonko`> very expensive and ironic
[22:14:28] <kyonko`> they sell all the japanese stuff
[22:14:01] <kyonko`> i don't think hobby lobby is selling much to dual us-mexico citizens who are the only ones who can cross post covid19 rules
[22:13:31] <Bender> karma - runaway1956: 38
[22:13:31] <FatPhil> Runaway1956++ OK, that works
[22:13:26] <kyonko`> we have a hobby lobby in my town that some how hasn't closed
[22:13:11] <Runaway1956> they have fun being mental?
[22:12:57] <kyonko`> look at hobby lobby
[22:12:57] <FatPhil> well, you know why they're called fundamentalists, don't you?
[22:12:39] <Runaway1956> fundamentalists say so
[22:12:21] <Runaway1956> there was no 'before gilgamesh'
[22:12:18] <chromas> being green wasn't an issue when evolution did most of its work
[22:12:06] <kyonko`> before gilgamesh
[22:12:03] <kyonko`> FatPhil: this is pre-history, before babylon
[22:11:51] <kyonko`> all homo in what era? greece, rome?
[22:11:44] <kyonko`> no homo
[22:11:42] <FatPhil> looking at it from a green perspective - he who breeds 3 or 4 times is fucking toxic to the planet. Other opinions are available.
[22:11:35] <Runaway1956> What if his kids are all homo, and never breed?
[22:11:32] <kyonko`> usually it means inheriting a face
[22:11:23] <chromas> come again?
[22:11:16] <kyonko`> or both
[22:11:15] <kyonko`> unless war or genocide
[22:11:11] <kyonko`> yeah, his genese are assured
[22:11:02] <kyonko`> premature ejaculation is just evolution at work
[22:11:02] <Runaway1956> So, if a guy breeds 3 or 4 times, he's above average?
[22:10:52] <kyonko`> he who cums fast wins
[22:10:35] <kyonko`> line
[22:10:34] <FatPhil> medichlorians are good, they give you super powers
[22:10:30] <kyonko`> thin blu of pre historic pre crime and pre cum
[22:10:21] * chromas gives Runaway1956 How to Pun 99 Vol 1
[22:10:12] <kyonko`> otherwise, we wouldn't be here today
[22:10:06] <kyonko`> most humans are lucky to breed once after reachng reproductive age
[22:09:49] <kyonko`> YMMV
[22:09:49] <kyonko`> only 1 in 100 people can reach age 100 without meds
[22:09:46] <Runaway1956> and I didn't explain any jokes FatPhil - you're just being an arse again
[22:09:39] <chromas> depends on the meds
[22:09:33] <FatPhil> Orbital Reef = err... lifeboat
[22:09:24] <kyonko`> so are meds good or are meds bad?
[22:09:20] <Runaway1956> kid goes to the beach, and snorkels in the shallows - he doesn't have an air tight submarine, lol
[22:08:48] <Bender> karma - runaway1956: 37
[22:08:48] <FatPhil> Runaway1956-- never attempt to explain jokes
[22:08:40] * Runaway1956 sighs
[22:08:33] <Bender> karma - chromas: 400
[22:08:33] <FatPhil> chromas++
[22:08:29] <chromas> Did Bezos die?
[22:08:06] <Runaway1956> They haven't even demonstrated that they can make an air tight can to keep their cans of people in
[22:07:47] <chromas> you're no pun
[22:07:39] <Runaway1956> the waste, more likely
[22:07:22] <FatPhil> it's going to orbit at the narrowest part of space - the waist of space
[22:07:09] <Runaway1956> Are they gonna hire SpaceX?
[22:06:58] <Runaway1956> They'll have to get a ship into space before they can get a space station into space.
[22:06:45] <chromas> Will it harbor spacefish?
[22:06:25] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03Blue Origin Reveals Plans for Future Commercial Space Station Called Orbital Reef" (1p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[22:06:23] <FatPhil> =submit https://www.theverge.com
[22:06:20] <Runaway1956> Wonder how many other forums he haunts?
[22:05:59] <Runaway1956> The very next thought was, he probably doesn't have meds, or a medical plan, or much of anything else
[22:05:37] <Runaway1956> The thought passed through my mind that APK was off his meds
[21:44:03] <chromas> whew
[21:43:53] <kyonko`> don't worry, i'll only provide you with adult dogs
[21:43:39] <chromas> so now I need to hate puppies
[21:43:34] <kyonko`> and he had that woman as a prop
[21:43:23] <kyonko`> hitler liked puppies
[21:43:17] <kyonko`> Opera was nice while it lasted
[21:43:16] <chromas> It's like finding out Hitler like puppies :(
[21:43:02] <chromas> He was also pro-Delphi and Opera
[21:42:29] <kyonko`> APK he logs into forums with pass phrase email addies and pass phrase passwords
[21:42:06] <kyonko`> keeps the facebook away
[21:41:59] <chromas> ...APK
[21:41:57] <chromas> APK...a toast to the ghost who can boast the most hosts
[21:41:57] <kyonko`> and mbr-bios
[21:41:53] <kyonko`> with dvd-rw and hdd of course
[21:41:48] <kyonko`> I remember when the first win 7 home updates were sent out, I had to go out and buy a win 10 laptop
[21:41:18] <kyonko`> will the APK hosts file prevent me from the update that bricks my computer?
[21:41:03] <kyonko`> APK SAVE ME
[21:40:58] <kyonko`> and they are still sneaking updates in even tho you turn them off
[21:40:46] <kyonko`> kvirc crashed, but win 7 pro didn't die
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[21:35:29] <chromas> 10 was also the last Windows
[21:35:16] <chromas> WinFS
[21:33:34] -!- kyonko` has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
[21:33:16] <progo> I didn't read back, but wasn't Microsoft going for "the filesystem is the database" in the 2000s?
[21:32:41] <kyonko`> around for a long time, and no one cares
[21:32:30] <systemd> ^ 03GoboLinux Rethinks The Linux Filesystems - Slashdot
[21:32:29] <kyonko`> https://linux.slashdot.org
[21:30:26] <kyonko`> and who needs 16 bit linux when you got minix 8/16
[21:30:09] <kyonko`> its brazilian distro, so its kinda like lua
[21:30:02] <kyonko`> yes
[21:29:49] <chromas> Gobosexual?
[21:29:28] <kyonko`> if you keep pushing the homosexual edge eventually you should turn the dial back into straight
[21:28:58] <kyonko`> it's so gay, it's straight
[21:28:46] <kyonko`> According to its creators, in GoboLinux we don’t need a package database because “the file system IS that database”. By dedicating its own directory to each program, GoboLinux also allows the user to keep installed (and run) different versions of it simultaneously.
[21:28:18] <systemd> ^ 03The six most peculiar Linux distributions of 2020 - SamaGame
[21:28:17] <kyonko`> https://samagame.com
[21:25:00] <kyonko`> that whole money and travel and shelter and dangerous of the road thing is an unsolvable problem
[21:24:32] <kyonko`> if you could somehow get a ride
[21:24:25] <kyonko`> in 2009 people were still going to big city libraries to connect their laptops to the ethernet
[21:20:58] <kyonko`> unlimited local calling, unlimited dial up
[21:20:55] <chromas> took years for firefox to get zoom, session saving and resumable file transfers
[21:20:41] <kyonko`> I was on dial up untill 2008, made for a strange life
[21:20:11] <kyonko`> so you had a fuckton of firefox install folders
[21:20:02] <kyonko`> always downloading a new version.... to a new folder
[21:19:48] <kyonko`> i remember firefox in my amd 3d now windows 98 era
[21:19:22] <chromas> I remember they put the header bar at the bottom for awhile
[21:19:15] <kyonko`> visiting facebook always makes chrome or firefox pop
[21:18:57] * kyonko` remembers what facebook was like before linux had OOM protection
[21:18:47] <chromas> yeah. ads in the new tab view
[21:18:30] <kyonko`> firefox now has spam
[21:18:26] <chromas> used to. not sure about now
[21:18:20] <kyonko`> it does that?
[21:18:13] <chromas> Especially if Firefox is still saving its session every 5 seconds
[21:17:28] <kyonko`> and one day its soldered ssd wll die
[21:17:14] <kyonko`> and a keyboard
[21:17:05] <kyonko`> that i7 had to get a fan obviously
[21:15:35] <kyonko`> i never got that with extreme heat on a fanless i7
[21:15:35] <FatPhil> no, your computer is a file under your control panel in your explorer
[21:15:33] <chromas> everything's a double-ended computer if you're brave enough
[21:15:12] <kyonko`> thats when it all clicked, IT'S A COMPUTER
[21:15:01] <kyonko`> i never started getting big problems with corrupt but still visible data untill my moto razr v3t got hot
[21:14:28] <FatPhil> exactly, was double ended joke - lots of chunks, some missing
[21:14:27] <kyonko`> thats around the time amd breaks the gigahertz barrier with x86
[21:14:01] <kyonko`> i regret getting rid of that computer
[21:12:51] <kyonko`> and the infamous radium codec
[21:12:33] <kyonko`> but .mp4 on a 166 pentium mmx was slick
[21:12:04] <kyonko`> i had a binaries server on my isp in 1999, but dial up was kinda pissing me off
[21:11:16] <kyonko`> never got a bad .iso so far
[21:11:12] <chromas> I never posted to usenet. how do I resolve?
[21:11:08] <kyonko`> that happens all the time in slow internet links such as mine
[21:10:56] <kyonko`> was it missing on purpose?
[21:10:43] <chromas> yeah, missing block dangit
[21:10:30] <FatPhil> you get the joke
[21:10:27] <FatPhil> big data [005/149] was usenet
[21:10:24] <FatPhil> big data [004/149] was usenet
[21:10:20] <FatPhil> big data [003/149] was usenet
[21:10:17] <FatPhil> big data [001/149] was usenet
[21:09:40] <chromas> you got there just in time for the boomer invasion
[21:09:07] <kyonko`> i'm 6 years into facebook
[21:08:48] <chromas> perhaps youtube would be long forgotten like alltheweb and goatse
[21:08:38] <kyonko`> around 2009 you still needed special computers with special interfaces to upload a video to youtube
[21:08:07] <chromas> maybe it wouldn't've gotten big then though
[21:07:39] <kyonko`> too bad youtube sold out early to google
[21:07:30] <kyonko`> YMMV
[21:07:26] <kyonko`> before youtube, big data was usenet
[21:07:12] <kyonko`> data so big, it needs to broken down in chunks
[21:07:10] <chromas> that's why they have the 8" floppies
[21:06:59] <kyonko`> they are
[21:06:51] <chromas> I thought chads were all about big data
[21:06:34] <kyonko`> "for very small data"
[21:06:17] <kyonko`> look at the whole becky with chad thing, its anatomical mismatch
[21:06:17] <chromas> just put two slices of data on two different disks. it doesn't always need to be the same two
[21:06:00] <kyonko`> mismatched everything
[21:05:45] <chromas> mismatched size
[21:05:35] <kyonko`> mismatched hdd's as in garbage hdd's from the flea market?
[21:05:17] <chromas> one thing btrfs has that (as far as I know) zfs doesn't, is raid0/1 with mismatched HDDs
[21:04:20] <chromas> that's worded awkwardly, and a good thing it is, too
[21:04:19] <kyonko`> so i'm not a de-dupe guy
[21:04:11] <kyonko`> he who dupes the most wins
[21:04:05] <kyonko`> i live in the universe where duplication is god
[21:03:36] <chromas> zfs is the btrfs of good design
[21:03:26] <kyonko`> now i need to get a feel for the chugs on btrfs
[21:03:03] <kyonko`> i7
[21:02:57] <kyonko`> on 6gb ram
[21:02:53] <kyonko`> i'm chugging on zfs
[21:02:44] <chromas> wow. even ext4 is ancient by now
[21:02:39] <kyonko`> which out to be just about enough for anybody
[21:02:28] <kyonko`> ext2 isn't experiment in the bsd's
[21:02:18] <kyonko`> and its for ever experimental
[21:02:15] <chromas> but it also had a registry
[21:02:15] <kyonko`> yeah they got it late
[21:02:08] <kyonko`> and was 16 bit
[21:02:08] <chromas> are they only just now getting ext4?
[21:02:06] <kyonko`> win 3.1 used ini files
[21:01:56] <kyonko`> I wonder if the ext4 in freebsd 12.2 is worth it
[21:01:46] <chromas> seems like the registry was just for file associations in Win 3
[21:00:42] <kyonko`> xorg/wayland
[21:00:34] <chromas> should've gone to X12
[21:00:33] <kyonko`> as long as its got ext2 you should make it
[21:00:21] <kyonko`> its better to do linux with x11r5
[21:00:17] <FatPhil> chromas; it can be used as one, so maybe it is?
[21:00:07] <kyonko`> the windows registry is a good reason not to use windows ,ever
[20:59:55] <kyonko`> FatPhil: I am at the age now where I just get a result/answer in my 3rd eye
[20:59:40] <chromas> is the Windows registry a filesystem?
[20:59:34] <FatPhil> the calculation of the probability of it being your mind making shit up just gave a complex number as an answer!
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[20:59:07] <chromas> once he realized it, he ceased to exist
[20:58:47] -!- kyonko` has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
[20:58:41] <kyonko`> or was my mind just making shit up again?
[20:58:39] <FatPhil> a fielsystem is just a heirarchical DB
[20:58:34] <kyonko`> I was trying to remember if there was a linux distro with everything in a db
[20:58:20] <chromas> a DB is just a filesystem with extra credentials
[20:58:11] <kyonko`> but why do samba when ftp is good?
[20:58:01] <kyonko`> such as a samba file sharing volume within its slices
[20:57:50] <kyonko`> you could make dumb mistakes with the way the bsd's do things
[20:57:37] <kyonko`> ext2 for the win
[20:57:23] <kyonko`> yeah I get it
[20:57:17] <FatPhil> A DB that's slower than a filesystem is an insufficiently fast DB
[20:57:13] <kyonko`> I'm not a db person
[20:57:00] <kyonko`> it begins to chug once its not, such as html 5
[20:56:59] <FatPhil> A filesystem that's slower than a DB is an insufficiently fast filesystem.
[20:56:42] <kyonko`> its kinda uncanny how fast android is with plain text....
[20:56:19] <kyonko`> so if you don't, who does?
[20:56:13] <kyonko`> the only problem with android is you don't have root
[20:53:38] <systemd> ^ 03185 Employees Leave Los Alamos Nuclear Weapons Lab Due to Vaccine Mandate
[20:53:36] <kyonko`> https://www.cryptogon.com
[20:50:05] <kyonko`> and android is very fast with plain text
[20:49:46] <kyonko`> android is funny, its bugs are almost non-existant compared to chromeos (which is becoming more chrome and less os by the update)
[20:47:10] <systemd> ^ 03GoboLinux - Wikipedia
[20:47:09] <kyonko`> https://en.wikipedia.org
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[20:34:42] <kyonko`> the db file... or the db file CHUNKS?
[20:34:17] <kyonko`> lol thats a great headline, if you don't know what radio is
[20:33:18] <kyonko`> databases are faster than file systems, but it breaks the tradition of the "internet"
[20:16:57] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - International Team of Astronomers Reports on Immense Mysterious Fast Radio Bursts - https://sylnt.us - having-a-blast,-galactic-style
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[19:09:52] <FatPhil> the phonebook app is so crap on the n900, sometimes i just query the db file manually
[19:09:28] <FatPhil> the nokia webtablets that evolved into the n900 phone were using sqlite right from the beginning
[18:59:52] <chromas> oh I didn't scroll down enough
[18:59:42] <chromas> android's heavy on the sqlite
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[18:20:55] <boru> Ah, if I wasn't so tired and a lazy sod, I should have made the sub myself. I haven't subbed in a while now. I should really try to make more time for that.
[18:20:21] <Bender> karma - boru: 65
[18:20:21] <FatPhil> boru++ it's thanks to you at the end of the day, when all is said and done
[18:19:58] <boru> Excellent. Thanks.
[18:19:43] <FatPhil> Yup, just added your 2 URLs to the story submission's editor's notes
[18:19:31] <boru> Comets and supernovae are amongst the few remaining fields where amateurs can still contribute these days.
[18:18:53] <boru> Please link directly to that BAA URL, also, since it might encourage other amateurs.
[18:18:34] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03Spaceweather.com Time Machine" (142p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[18:18:30] <FatPhil> =submit https://spaceweather.com
[18:18:29] <boru> Good on you.
[18:18:19] <FatPhil> I just pushed an astro story, but don't mind having another one in the queue, i don't remember there being one about this in recent days
[18:17:58] <boru> But it's like most other comets, in terms of composition.
[18:17:33] <boru> Well, you can get absorption spectra from sunlight.
[18:17:05] <boru> Yeah, I mean, comas usually look like this on Sol approach, but 29P is a bit special.
[18:16:58] <FatPhil> can't they take a spectrum of known stars in the background, and see precisely which lines are absorbed and dissipated by the cloud?
[18:16:39] <progo> "cryomagma" is a human-centric term :^)
[18:16:18] <boru> Good time of year for observing it, though. I'm not sure about there, but the seeing here was incredible last weekend. I even pulled out my visual scope whilst I was imaging; good show from the planets and some SNs.
[18:15:16] <FatPhil> I love the concept of "cryomagma".
[18:14:35] <FatPhil> that's quite a funky one: https://spaceweather.com
[18:14:18] <FatPhil> ah, just reading your second link - 13s is more visible now.
[18:13:45] <boru> The coma, or rather cloud of cryomagma it's spewing out, would likely have a far lower surface brightness. Apparent magnitude is sometimes not very helpful in astronomy...
[18:12:35] <boru> Well, if you were imaging it, you'd probably managed mag +15 with some reduction.
[18:12:02] <FatPhil> yikes, magnitude 15, that's not for the lame-arse amateurs(tm).
[18:11:04] <FatPhil> prkl
[18:08:11] <AzumaHazuki> so, a Finn after sauna and a meal of beans?
[18:07:11] <progo> book of knowledge: a comet is a small icy (astronomical ice) thing that orbits with a close approach to the Sun, and has outgassing
[18:04:48] <FatPhil> waiting for the cometinos...
[18:04:39] <boru> I tend to ignore that bellend as much as I can with putting effort into it.
[18:04:14] <progo> and has Neil deGrasse Tyson recently rewritten the defintion for "comet"? :^)
[18:03:58] <boru> As comets go, it's _big_ at 60km wide.
[18:03:48] <boru> Size, for one, plus it seems to be locked in a planet-like orbit.
[18:03:23] <FatPhil> Koblitz is incredibly dry, but is pretty much the classic text. I think i still have it somehwere, but I may have given it away when I moved country.
[18:02:52] <progo> what are the criteria for the classification "comet", besides highly eccentric orbit?
[18:01:47] <boru> Heh, yeah, the city might limit your visible magnitude...
[18:01:18] <boru> It seems like 29P is covered with cryovolcanoes and more observations are required, since it's a bit special for its "comet" classification.
[18:01:04] <progo> I don't have a telescope. I have New York City across the river
[18:00:56] <progo> fun
[18:00:05] <systemd> ^ 03MISSION 29P | British Astronomical Association
[18:00:03] <systemd> ^ 03Comet 29P/Schwassmann-Wachmann 1
[18:00:02] <boru> On an unrelated note, for those of you with telescopes, there's some work to be done by amateur astronomers at the moment with comet 29P: https://theskylive.com https://britastro.org
[17:54:27] <boru> I'll leave that stuff to the real mathematicians.
[17:54:06] <boru> I had a stab at reading Koblitz's book, but I'm missing some of the background.
[17:53:27] <boru> Heh, indeed.
[17:53:18] <FatPhil> and that's true no matter which of the 2 ECCs you're talking about1
[17:52:56] <FatPhil> ECC's just pure maths
[17:52:31] <boru> I'd go so far as to say that, in some cases, for example ECC, there are only a handful of people who _really_ understand the mathematics behind it.
[17:52:19] <FatPhil> SQLite has some crankiness that really ought not be there, such as the implicit primary keys.
[17:51:55] <boru> Aye, I've heard it's a neat little implementation.
[17:51:53] <progo> it's like they say about crypto: if you are coding base crypto functions you're probably doing it wrong and you will cock it up
[17:51:35] <progo> the author of SQLite is probably the kind of wizard that only comes around a few times per generation
[17:51:15] <progo> yes!
[17:51:10] <boru> I'd say the same about databases!
[17:51:03] <progo> filesystems are a dark art
[17:51:00] <boru> Seems reasonable, though, for low bandwidth.
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[17:50:51] <boru> I'll take your word for it. The closest I've come to databases is writing a filesystem.
[17:50:49] <progo> *stuck in the weeds
[17:50:08] <progo> think of a notebook/diary app where at most a small handful of people own it, and every user account is a completely separate database. SQLite is a good fit
[17:49:31] <systemd> ^ 03Appropriate Uses For SQLite
[17:49:30] <progo> https://sqlite.org btw, speaking of bike shedding and stuck in the weeks. SQLite. "Checklist for choosing the right database engine" -- if you don't have lots of people waiting to write at the same time, and you don't have "big data", SQL is perfect for the job
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[17:47:09] <progo> **moving functions from server to client
[17:46:16] * progo sets up an easel and grabs the sharpies
[17:46:03] <progo> that was the vibe I got
[17:45:55] <boru> I'm mostly bikeshedding, not meaning to sound disparaging.
[17:45:54] <progo> and I'll be careful not to go off in directions that will absolutely kill the future "zero knowledge" idea
[17:45:43] * boru nods.
[17:45:36] <progo> one set of features at a time, around a single structure I understand and control
[17:45:11] <progo> a public web site that is unreadable without a javascript program is the worse kind of publishing sin
[17:44:53] <progo> and public web site versus zero knowledge will absolutely involve rewriting and moving functions from client to server
[17:44:34] <progo> of course
[17:44:08] <boru> Well, a well known lemma of classical software engineering mistakes is that security should be considered from the start. As I've told many pointy haired managers over the years, security is not a commodity. It's not a magic box you drop in at the end of a project and everything is secure.
[17:43:04] <progo> if I worry about crypto now I'll be stuck in those weeds with no viable product for myself for months :^)
[17:42:18] * boru nods.
[17:42:07] <progo> then MAYBE I'll pivot and rewrite some of it to make it zero-knowledge service
[17:41:57] <progo> as I said: my diary app project is going to be no-privacy within the app itself to start with. I will get it working to the point where I can run it on a secure server and use it for personal work, and also use the same software to publish web sites
[17:41:37] <boru> I didn't mean to imply you weren't familiar with the field.
[17:41:08] <progo> yeah I know all about crypto methods and combinations of methods in theory. I'm actually giving some kind if "intro to cryptography" talk to the NY Amateur Computer Club next month
[17:40:54] <boru> Shutup, SedBot. Vimbot is fine with it.
[17:40:34] * SedBot tosses a / to biru
[17:40:34] <boru> s/test/text
[17:40:25] <boru> e.g. I have plaintext_0, I generate ciphertest_0 and hash_0. I push the latter two to the server to post something. I send hash_0 when I want to search for ciphertext_0.
[17:38:53] <boru> Leave key management to the client.
[17:38:43] <boru> Salted hash as a key? The client can compute that locally, and push it to the server to post, or to search.
[17:37:59] <progo> and also key management is a bitch
[17:37:30] <progo> or else some crazy scheme to push a shared index to the server, which the server can't read
[17:37:11] <progo> in the simplest form, every client has to have their own complete index -- they have to read EVERY page before they can have that index.
[17:36:19] <progo> the tricky part is indexing and searching
[17:36:12] <progo> yeah
[17:36:06] <boru> Surely the way to go about it is encrypting it on the client, and pushing it to the server, no? Doesn't get much more zero knowledge than that.
[17:35:31] <progo> anyway I'm building it insecure first
[17:35:17] <progo> leave that bad business to Google and Facebook
[17:35:04] <progo> :^)
[17:35:04] <progo> but hell no I'm not selling a diary service where the server CAN read and peruse your data
[17:35:00] <boru> Good for you.
[17:34:50] <progo> and if I can figure out how to implement a zero knowledge server for my idea, maybe sell it as a service
[17:34:44] <boru> I use C in the latter mostly, these days.
[17:34:38] <progo> want to build a notebook/diary program my way with my features
[17:34:33] <boru> There are, in essence, three camps: operating systems, HPC and embedded.
[17:34:30] <progo> last night I started learning the Nette web application framework for the PHP ecosystem. I am already a PHP expert
[17:33:40] * progo doesn't know the C ecosystem at all with first-hand experience
[17:33:25] <boru> But the Tao exists there, too.
[17:33:21] <progo> you can get a lot done with C
[17:33:19] <boru> So I'm told.
[17:33:12] <progo> it's turtles all the way down
[17:32:45] <boru> I've been writing C, assembly, Verilog (and now VHDM), Forth, some bits of Fortran and pretending to know Perl for most of my career. That enterprisey stuff isn't my neck of the woods at all.
[17:31:09] <progo> CURRENT ColdFusion is quite nice. but only if you never have to deal with any other programmer's code.
[17:30:45] * boru chuckles.
[17:30:32] <progo> the ecosystem there is full of one trick ponies who know how to program, wrong.
[17:30:23] <progo> and I say it publicly all the time: do not learn coldfusion and do NOT put it on your resume
[17:30:10] <progo> my experience with Java is mostly in ColdFusion, a stacked-on-top language
[17:29:54] <progo> I should learn Java's build systems -- maven and whatever
[17:29:07] <boru> Briar's worth a look, and if you, unlike me, have any experience with java, I'm sure they'd be glad to have someone help out with these quality of life features.
[17:28:31] <boru> Indeed.
[17:28:21] <progo> I mean, GPG's user experience has always been terrible. but it's been a meme for 10 years now
[17:28:09] <boru> Well, in terms of local webs of trust, you have darknets and meshnets. PGP on a more local level.
[17:27:53] <progo> *maybe it didn't have to be a terrible UX
[17:27:37] <progo> I wonder if there's some aspect to the idea that GPG "solved" the problem once and for all, and no one learned to do crypto because the UX sucked but maybe it didn't have to
[17:27:29] <boru> But the concept is sound.
[17:27:25] <boru> It still is, to be honest.
[17:27:09] <progo> for ~10 years people have been griping that the UX for GPG and everything plugged into it is terrible
[17:27:05] <boru> e.g. we can just talk to each other via gmail with PGP.
[17:26:42] <boru> Nothing stopping you sending your own e2e data over the clearnet to any service. I don't get why that isn't more widespread.
[17:25:02] <progo> simple and stupid, and sorta secure
[17:24:47] <progo> :^)
[17:24:47] <progo> all I need for a lot of my friends is nothing but a private IRC server and Jitsi
[17:24:29] <boru> Emily sounds like a n00b. Get better friends.
[17:24:15] <progo> not gonna happen
[17:24:09] <progo> I don't want to be three profiles to my friend Emily
[17:23:55] <boru> Briar is a bit like that, but you can just create an identity for each device, and share it out of band.
[17:23:54] <progo> I don't see why my two Tox hosts can't talk to each other about my single profile and keep my contact list synced over the tox network
[17:23:19] <boru> You don't need µg for it, though.
[17:23:12] <progo> it's like people with a suitcase full of computers don't exist
[17:23:09] <boru> I've got in on LOS with µg and a few other bits to lessen leaks, so it's as good as I'm going to get for a phone messenger, imho.
[17:23:00] <progo> Tox looks really good except for it has no way to make YOUR profile portable across all of your hosts. basically you must use it on your one single preferred phone or never at all. or you must use it on your laptop and nowhere else
[17:22:00] <boru> Briar's been around for a while, and I don't have any idea why it hasn't had more traction.
[17:21:56] * progo burns Signal
[17:21:53] <progo> first thing signal did was demand my local address book
[17:21:36] <boru> Yeah, signal is compromised.
[17:21:25] <progo> I haven't heard of that one. I'm tured of stuff like Signal that beats the new users with "you must register with a phone number and you can't possibly sign up without using an Android app"
[17:21:24] <boru> That said, forums, blogs and censorship/infrastructure circumvention await all who use it. Plus, it's a mesh. The more people who use it, the better.
[17:20:46] <boru> I still don't get why more people aren't using Briar, but I guess the platform most people would use it on is fundamentally compromised.
[17:19:55] <progo> if anyone scoops me, no problem. otherwise I'll submit a soylent story some time this evening
[17:17:55] <FatPhil> I still have a Beavis & Butthead t-shirt. It's from their movie, and it has the slogan "America Sucks"
[17:17:16] <FatPhil> Fuck yeah! I remember that from the early 90s.
[17:16:59] <progo> Beavis and Butthead understand frog baseball
[17:16:45] <FatPhil> I understand frog boiling urban legends ;-)
[17:16:27] <progo> will include "skip to ___ in the youtube pitch if you already understand frog boiling mass surveillance"
[17:15:50] <FatPhil> sure - thanks!
[17:15:46] <progo> will do
[17:15:43] <progo> I wasn't even thinking of that
[17:15:37] <progo> introducing what's been posted so far
[17:15:33] <progo> I can write it as a soylent blog post for sure
[17:15:24] <progo> oh derp
[17:14:43] <FatPhil> if there's something more than just a blog, maybe submit that as a story. it's got tech and privacy, it's well on topic.
[17:12:50] <progo> they will sell you out
[17:12:24] <systemd> ^ 03How SmarterEveryDay's 4privacy can, and cannot, meet its goals
[17:12:23] <progo> https://drewdevault.com Drew also points out that they have no profit plan and yet they ARE seeking investors
[17:11:36] <progo> I feel like I wasted my time listening
[17:11:29] <progo> the Smarter Every Day video and its followup are full of "but that's not possible" comments
[17:11:05] <progo> it anymore if you need to"
[17:11:05] <progo> so Drew Devault (owner of Sourcehut) blogged about Smarter Every Day's new privacy kickstarter… first thing he linked to to introduce what the blog post is a ~15 minute pitch that's mostly "yeah wiretapping and thinking in the cloud and massive unchecked spying are a problem" and then you FINALLY at the end get to "we're building a new system that lets you send information to conversation partners and then remove that information so they don't have
[17:08:48] <progo> turned "<i></i>" into mIRC colors?
[17:08:13] <progo> and apparently so does the submission queue
[17:07:48] <progo> most channels will pass them through and most clients interpret them
[17:07:32] <progo> I think the de facto standard is mIRC color escape codes
[17:07:15] <progo> elite hacking
[17:02:47] <FatPhil> how did you get colour in that?
[16:57:22] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Facebook Sues Programmer Who Allegedly Scraped Data for 178 Million Users - https://sylnt.us - that's-2my-data-and-you're-not-abusing-it-properly!
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[15:08:41] -!- mode/#soylent [+v requerdanos] by Imogen
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[14:25:48] <FatPhil> Musk Tops $250 Billion Net Worth After TSLA Rockets Past FB As 5th Biggest US Stock
[14:17:19] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Mapping the NFT Revolution - https://sylnt.us - WTF-are-NFTs?
[11:26:50] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Tesla Switches All Standard-Range Vehicles to LiFePo Chemistry - https://sylnt.us
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[11:11:57] <inz> sl is as useful as sedbot's "terminate your substitute commands" reply
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[10:45:57] <FatPhil> I don't know sl
[10:20:15] <boru> fortune also has some good ones.
[10:19:46] <Runaway1956> Yeah, I've seen some but this one popped up entirely out of nowhere, caught me entirely by surprise
[10:19:44] <boru> And then making a system-wide alias to it for ls.
[10:19:29] <boru> Like fake rm etc.
[10:19:09] <boru> There are more fun ones.
[10:17:14] <Runaway1956> terminal is in full screen, so I got full effect
[10:16:52] <boru> For shame.
[10:16:47] <boru> ~cowsay Real Men™ use xterm
[10:16:33] <Runaway1956> No, not new, but that one kinda shocked me
[10:16:17] <boru> New to *nix?
[10:15:55] <Runaway1956> meant to type ls instead typed sl and a frigging train ran across the screen
[10:15:26] <Runaway1956> Oh shit - lxterminal just made me sit back and stare
[10:13:31] <chromas> Hm, what else can we do to impede ari's enjoyment of SN?
[09:14:29] <FatPhil> apparently americans have become an uncountable mass noun
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[08:49:21] <aristarchus> Moderation in all things, c0lo!
[08:48:04] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Stretchy, Bendy, Flexible LEDs: They’re Also Cheaper, Faster and Fabricated With an Inkjet Printer - https://sylnt.us - Print-your-own-light
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[08:47:31] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03A Record Amount of Americans are Quitting Their Jobs Due to Pandemic Burnout" (11p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[08:47:29] <SoyCow7256> =submit https://www.cbsnews.com
[08:45:41] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03As Russia Shuts Down, Putin 'Can't Understand What's Going On' With Vaccine Hesitancy" (17p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[08:45:40] <SoyCow7256> =submit stupidity-is-universal https://thehill.com
[08:45:18] <systemd> ✓* Sub-ccess! "03Young Australians Lodge Human Rights Complaints With UN Over Alleged Government Inaction on Climate" (25p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[08:45:16] <SoyCow7256> =submit https://www.theguardian.com
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[08:24:28] <aristarchus> I mean, I would downmod such spam, if I was able to downmod. But as I am not, I can only watch. Seems SN has emptied its entire mag of spam mods, to no effect?
[08:22:54] <aristarchus> Just a word to the admin, apk is seriously impeding my enjoyment of SN. Equally, the drive-by anti-semite stuff needs to go. Free speech can be ruined by exactly these tactics, and it is being ruined.
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[08:08:31] <aristarchus> I thought it was the duck-breast abs?
[07:58:32] <FatPhil> he's just jealous of my antique fish-floats
[06:28:54] <kyonko`> At least he is open about his fat
[06:27:56] <aristarchus> kyonko, sorry, but read your long exchange with the Phil of Fat earlier, and came to the conclusion that nothing is to be gained by conversing with you, or FatPhil. Again, sorry.
[06:26:21] <kyonko`> that falun gong situation in china is batshit insane and decades old
[06:25:48] <kyonko`> get it orgnDNR
[06:25:36] <kyonko`> only meds I take is for my heart, so it may be ripe for someone else to take (as in orgndnr)
[06:25:16] <kyonko`> long actin', tinactin'
[06:25:08] <kyonko`> you mean my infusions
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[06:14:41] <aristarchus> Could it be, that kyonko is apk, when he takes his meds?
[06:12:40] <kyonko`> May APK never die
[06:11:44] <aristarchus> Happy APKween, everybody!
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[05:57:31] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Audio Tape Interface Revives Microcassettes As Storage Medium - https://sylnt.us
[05:55:31] <kyonko`> a bioweapon on training wheels
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[03:50:16] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03EU Scientists Reveal Long-term Brain Damage Caused by Covid" (19p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:50:12] <SoyCow7256> =submit https://www.rfi.fr
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[03:47:54] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03A Worker in Florida Applied to 60 Entry-level Jobs in September and Got 1 Interview" (20p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:47:50] <SoyCow3038> =submit https://www.businessinsider.com.au
[03:47:30] <systemd> ✓* Sub-ccess! "08Breitbart and Other Conservative Publishers Get ‘Special Treatment’: Here’s What the ‘Facebo" (23p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:47:28] <SoyCow3038> =submit facebook-papers https://www.forbes.com
[03:47:05] <systemd> ✓ Sub-ccess! "03What Was Leaked in the Facebook Papers?" (13p) -> https://soylentnews.org
[03:47:01] <SoyCow3038> =submit facebook-papers https://nymag.com
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[03:16:43] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - American ISPs Slammed for Spying on Their Own Subscribers - https://sylnt.us - Quis-custodiet-ipsos-custodes
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[00:27:50] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - The Least Efficent Way to Charge a BEV? - https://sylnt.us - Pushmi-Pullyu