#soylent | Logs for 2020-04-30

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[00:47:04] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Hardkernel Launches ODROID-C4 Single-Board Computer - https://sylnt.us - alternatives++
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[02:00:18] <chromas> I'm beginning to think the Phabricator guys like to make jokes
[02:00:44] <chromas> "Port Multiplexing: If you have hardware access, you can power down the host and find the network I/O pins on the motherboard (for onboard networking) or network card. Carefully strip and solder a short piece of copper wire between the pins for the external interface 22 and internal 2222, so the external interface can receive traffic for both services.
[02:00:44] <chromas> (Make sure not to desolder the existing connection between external 22 and internal 22 or you won't be able to connect normally to administrate the host.) The obvious downside to this approach is that it requires physical access to the machine, so it won't work if you're hosted on a cloud provider."
[02:26:41] <Bytram> ROFL!!!!
[02:27:07] <Bytram> Telepresence? Send in the droid!
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[02:57:04] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - The Pentagon Releases Official Footage of UFOs. No, Seriously! - https://sylnt.us - I-want-to-believe-marsh-gasses-are-out-there
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[05:07:04] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Avoid the Trash Heap: 15 Great Uses for an Old PC - https://sylnt.us - new-life
[07:17:44] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Memory Misfires Help Selfish Maintain their Self-Image - https://sylnt.us - self-justification
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[09:15:13] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Ubuntu "mini.iso" Minimal Install .ISO for 20.04 LTS - https://sylnt.us - how-to-make-use-of-52-3.5-inch-floppy-disks?
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[09:49:32] <GrandFireWizard> =gday Runaway1956
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[09:55:26] <FatPhil> https://www.youtube.com
[09:55:27] <systemd> ^ 03The Quiz Broadcast S04E01
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[11:25:50] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - HP Injecting Sneaky DRM Update Into Printers That Rejected Non-HP Ink? - https://sylnt.us
[11:52:40] <Bytram> coffee++
[11:52:40] <Bender> karma - coffee: 5193
[11:55:27] <Ingar> Again ??
[11:55:40] <Ingar> good thing I banned HP after my last HP inkjet
[11:55:53] <Ingar> Epson makes fine printers too !
[11:56:35] <AndyTheAbsurd> I've just banned inkjets from my life.
[11:56:43] <AndyTheAbsurd> Laser printer master race.
[11:58:18] <Ingar> I considered laser, but for what I needed it, it was too expensive
[11:58:38] <Ingar> (it was my mom's printer actually ;)
[12:02:10] * Bytram has had excellent luck with Brother laser printers
[12:02:56] <Bytram> Bought current one a couple (three?) years ago for $50; replaced the introductory toner cartridge once.
[12:03:48] <Bytram> B&W, but that's good enought for me & prints about 25 pages/minute
[12:04:53] <Ingar> Bytram: if I had to buy one for myself, It would probabely be a brother laser
[12:05:18] <Ingar> ofc, these days I work for a scanning company and try to avoid printing :)
[12:05:34] <AndyTheAbsurd> Yeah, one of the reasons I'm able to go with laser is that I need to print color about once every five years.
[12:05:55] <AndyTheAbsurd> Which is so close to "never" that if I really need color, I'll just pay somewhere to do it.
[12:06:14] <Ingar> AndyTheAbsurd: yeah totally the other way aroudn here: it mostly prints pictures and images
[12:08:00] <Bytram> FWIW HL-L2360DW & from the tag looks like it was made Dec 2015
[12:08:47] <Bytram> allergies--
[12:08:47] <Bender> karma - allergies: -46
[12:08:52] <Bytram> coffee++
[12:08:52] <Bender> karma - coffee: 5194
[12:08:58] <Bytram> afk biab
[12:15:53] <AndyTheAbsurd> coffee--
[12:15:53] <Bender> karma - tea: 619
[12:25:42] <janrinok> I am still using a HP4050 laser printer which I bought 2nd hand in 2001!
[12:28:11] <janrinok> I also have a brother laser printer which I found at the local dump - it had had the USB cable cut off to 'disable' it to deter it being scavenged and re-used. I simply unpluged the cut usb cable and replaced it with a new one and it has been working ever since. Slow compared with modern laser printers - but it was free and has required no maintenance over the last 18 months since I 'rescued' it.
[12:29:20] * janrinok must look for a colour laser when the dump re-opens after the current restrictions are lifted (May 11)
[12:41:43] <FatPhil> we've not had a printer for 20 years now
[12:42:59] <FatPhil> about 2 or 3 times a year we need one, and we go to either a highstreet printers (costing almost nothing) or the local pub (costing nothing).
[12:44:48] <FatPhil> When i travel to new cities, I print out our planned pubcrawl maps, that's the major use. So I won't need a printer in 2020 :|
[12:51:48] <gozar> janrinok, those printers are beasts. I bought a bunch when I started my job in 2000, I plan on making sure one is still there when I retire in 5-10 years.
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[12:54:33] <janrinok> gozar, they certainly are, and I wouldn't like to have to carry the Hp4050 any long distance either
[13:06:12] <FatPhil> If you can fit more than one in a room, it's not a "monster".
[13:06:45] <Bytram> beast < monster ??
[13:07:11] <FatPhil> that's true
[13:07:51] <Bytram> also, might depend less on the size of the room and more on the size of you. =O
[13:08:13] <FatPhil> I used to work with professional A0 printers. They were sexy beasts. And monsters.
[13:08:24] <Bytram> nod nod
[13:09:18] <Bytram> OMG, what *was* that called... IBM laser printer to replace their old band-printers. Very first printer which could output text faster than I could read it!
[13:10:16] <Bytram> this was for printing from the continuous green-bar stock.
[13:12:10] <Bytram> About comparable to printing speed of a band-printer with a carbon copy (i.e. two-copies from each page), but for single copy printing... and it only got faster over time. Yee hah!
[13:13:17] <FatPhil> I do remember those line printers, dunno if chain or band, you couldn't get close enough to them to find out and leave with your eardrums in tact.
[13:15:33] <FatPhil> didn't pay much attention to printer tech until my first job, which was working on early dye-subs (and another realated tech that I can't remember the name of now, even waxier)
[13:15:58] <carny> FatPhil: those okilasers?
[13:16:04] <Bytram> those chain/band printers were an improvement over drum printers =)
[13:16:10] <FatPhil> carny: the big ones, yup
[13:16:42] <FatPhil> nope, not oki, oce, a dutch company
[13:17:35] <carny> oh ok not familiar with oce
[13:17:41] <carny> what i wouldn't give for an old school color laserjet from before they added all the drm garbage and jacked up the consumable and maintenance costs
[13:19:41] <FatPhil> at one point oce were the 2nd biggest reprographics cmopany in teh world. before japan and consumer tech took over.
[13:21:42] <FatPhil> I can't complain, my job was writing algorithms for postscript interpreter boards that would be bought by japanese companies and shoved in there prosumer range. (PS was a bit "pro", billy numnuts at home didn't need it)
[13:21:55] <FatPhil> their, sheesh
[13:22:04] <FatPhil> need more booze in my coffee
[13:23:19] <Bytram> had a coworker at IBM who took an assembly language course when he started there. Learning about device drivers. Assignment: write a device driver for a chain printer. Took a bit, but got it working. By then it was late at night. Had a bright idea. Print heads would fire when the desired letter came around to the desired position. When all desired chars were printed, then would advance the paper to the next line. Hmmm. What would
[13:23:20] <Bytram> happen if all the print heads fired at once? Create a file, full page print width, where each line contained the exact order of the text on the print chain. Fired it off. His job ran for a bit and then was forcefully halted. Confusion. And *then* a computer operator tracked him down and gave him an ear full. Told him that was a good way to break the print chain and at the speeds it was going at, there'd be significant damage to the
[13:23:25] <Bytram> printer when it broke. Think like cracking a whip.
[13:24:28] <Bytram> apparently, the sound of all those print heads going off at once, in the wee hours of the night, sounded like a machine gun going off!
[13:24:36] <Bytram> Oooops!
[13:25:24] <Bytram> break time
[13:25:44] <FatPhil> it's basically an unsolvable problem, alas
[13:26:12] <FatPhil> you have to slow down to the slowest speed to handle that corner case.
[13:26:30] <FatPhil> "normal" text will be quicker than "optimally fast, but needs to be choked" text.
[13:27:58] <FatPhil> I guess he should consider himself luck he didn't blow fuses by firing all the actuators at once!
[13:30:49] <FatPhil> I was just wondering whether adversarial text such as that could be considered the same problem as an adversarial attack on a hash table.
[13:31:15] <FatPhil> I persuaded myself that no, it isn't really, that's too much of a stretch.
[13:32:08] <FatPhil> But the way to mitigate against it is to have a *random* ribbon, letter order known only to the driver. That way, there's no predictable adversarial text.
[13:32:26] <FatPhil> Which is exactly the mitigation against adversarial hash table attacks.
[13:34:11] <FatPhil> For efficiency, a ribbon should have entropically-guided letter distribution - more etaoinshrldu than the other letters. I wonder if anyone ever did that? You'd need a longer band, but bands are a small part of the system, that's a minor drawback.
[13:34:26] <FatPhil> Damn, why am I solving 1970s tech problems in the 2020s?
[13:35:28] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Three Things in Life are Certain: Death, Taxes, and Cloud-Based IoT Gear Bricked by Vendors - https://sylnt.us - S-in-IoT-stands-for-security
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[13:55:09] <Bytram> FatPhil: Was a Loooong time ago, but ISTR that one of the optimizations was to have some letters repeated on the print chain ETNR or whatever were most-commonly used, so that a single letter did not become the gating factor on print speed. =)
[13:58:15] <FatPhil> that would make sense. One of my first entries into tech was from an information theoretical background (compression was my thang), and I detect bottlenecks like that without even thinking about them - I see things in terms of how they could be optimised.
[13:59:19] <Bytram> great minds think alike. Some would call it being lazy. For me, it
[13:59:37] <FatPhil> The problem is that it only takes one rare letter per line to mean that you need one full sweep per line, and mediocrity is resumed.
[13:59:40] <Bytram> is a matter of why should I work any harder than absolutely necessary?
[14:00:08] <Bytram> Hmmm
[14:00:09] <FatPhil> it's impossible to know what would work without modeling it.
[14:01:14] <FatPhil> Similar to the least effort keyboard configurations, and for similar reasons. Sure, qwerty's crap, but the AEIOU on Dvorak is not optimal either, they fucked up on that one.
[14:05:17] <Bytram> Now I'm thinking that they may have had two copies of the charset on the chain. 132-column printer. A-Z, 0-9, (!@#$%^&*[]<>.,;:'"/?) and the EBCDIC not symbol. Assuming my recollection is correct, that would be: 26 + 10 + 22 + 1 = 59. 2*59 = 118. 132 - 118 = 14. So, could duplicate 7 chars and still have two copies of all chars over the page at the same time?
[14:05:58] <Bytram> (Back then it was uppercase-only)
[14:07:00] <FatPhil> what, no space character?
[14:07:11] <Bytram> just don't print anything there.
[14:07:20] <FatPhil> YHBT!
[14:07:41] <Bytram> =g YHBT
[14:07:41] <systemd> https://en.wiktionary.org - YHBT - Wiktionary
[14:08:03] <Bytram> Oh, not ure if there was a vertical bar, too. "|"
[14:08:21] <Bytram> http://ascii-table.com
[14:12:20] * FatPhil shows the class his glue-gun drippy sculpture.
[14:14:47] <Bytram> I forgot the cent-sign character. From that page, there seems to be 94 printable EBCDIC characters, *including lowercase*, 94 - 26 = 68 characters.
[14:15:45] <Bytram> 68 * 2 = 136 which is really close to 132-column green bar capacity.
[14:15:57] <chromas> And with two copies of the charset, you can always give your 2¢
[14:17:07] <Bytram> So, toss in a few very frequent letters to slightly lengthen the print chain (until benefit of extra availability of freq letters causes a net slowdown because of increased delay for less frequently appearing letters)
[14:19:36] <Bytram> Ever notice the non-reciprocity of people's assessment of the value of opinions? Unsolicited, its "Here's my two cents' worth!" But if someone else were to ask me for my opinion, it would be: "A penny for your thoughts?" =)
[14:23:11] <janrinok> it's a buyers' market
[14:23:36] <chromas> Just split the difference and call it a fractional reserve
[14:29:07] <FatPhil> fractionally reversed
[14:31:27] <FatPhil> !grab Bytram
[14:31:27] <Bender> Added quote 956
[14:38:24] <FatPhil> And if you don't mind, I'll add that (attributed and detypoed) to my sig list for use in mails/usenet.
[14:40:01] <chromas> Who edits the editors?
[14:46:35] <Bytram> FatPhil: Appreciate the complement! But, what typo?
[14:47:00] <Bytram> oh, "its" --> "it's"
[14:47:09] <Bytram> good catch!
[14:47:26] <Bytram> chromas: editor'
[14:47:33] <Bytram> ~last chopchop1
[14:47:34] <exec> 03<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//IETF//DTD HTML 2.0//EN"> <html><head> <title>301 Moved Permanently</title> </head><body> <h1>Moved Permanently</h1> <p>The document has moved <a href="https://chromas.0x.no/s/soylent_log.php">here</a>.</p> </body></html>
[14:47:35] <exec> http://chromas.0x.no
[14:47:41] <Bytram> lol
[14:47:46] <Bytram> ~seen
[14:47:59] <chromas> editor prime?
[14:48:07] <Bytram> yep!
[14:50:03] <GrandFireWizard> Grandson of Optimus. Integrated with society, he now runs a newspaper.
[15:00:49] <Bytram> ~last nick=chopchop1
[15:00:50] <exec> 03<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//IETF//DTD HTML 2.0//EN">
[15:00:51] <exec> 03<html><head>
[15:00:51] <exec> 03<title>301 Moved Permanently</title>
[15:00:52] <exec> 03</head><body>
[15:00:53] <exec> 03<h1>Moved Permanently</h1>
[15:00:54] <exec> 032 records not shown - refer to http://chromas.0x.no
[15:01:00] <Bytram> lol
[15:02:22] <pinchy> never go chop to chop
[15:02:37] <Bytram> or cheek to jowl
[15:04:13] * Bytram keeps typing ch<tab> to get chromas' nick and it almost always works... except when chopchop1 is in the channel. =( Seems s/he is only in #Soylent and #shitlords, and last I saw anything from them here was 2020-03-28 or over a month ago.
[15:04:30] * Bytram ponders
[15:04:39] <Bytram> .kick chopchop1
[15:04:39] -!- chopchop1 was kicked from #soylent by Aphrodite!Aphrodite@dodekatheon.olympus.gr [(Bytram (martyb)) No reason given]
[15:05:39] <chromas> Poor choppy
[15:05:57] <chromas> /nick chopchop2
[15:07:54] <Bytram> Sorry about that... It's only to keep my sanity. char char <tab> almost always work in what ever channel I am in. Also, the ONLY reason I'm "Bytram", on IRC was that way-back-when came the edict that nobody could have a nick that started with "m". Two many nicks with that same first letter. As one or another M* joined/left a channel, tab completion would dynamically change.
[15:08:29] <Bytram> so I reversed the letters and "martyb" became "Bytram"
[15:11:17] <chromas> But now there are only two Ms so you can change back
[15:12:35] <Bytram> Looks like I last used that nick in 2017-06
[15:47:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - There's Finally a Supreme Court Battle Coming Over the Nation's Main Hacking Law - https://sylnt.us - is-"view-source"-a-crime?
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[16:58:29] <Bytram> =g perchlorate
[16:58:30] <systemd> https://en.wikipedia.org - Perchlorate - Wikipedia
[16:59:57] <Bytram> =g "10.1038/s41467-020-15931-4"
[16:59:58] <systemd> https://www.nature.com - In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian ...
[17:00:10] <Bytram> =g "10.1038/s41467-020-15931-4" science
[17:00:11] <systemd> https://www.nature.com - In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian ...
[17:00:17] <Bytram> =g "10.1038/s41467-020-15931-4" daily
[17:00:17] <systemd> https://www.nature.com - In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian ...
[17:00:30] <Bytram> =g "10.1038/s41467-020-15931-4" science daily
[17:00:31] <systemd> https://www.eurekalert.org - 4-billion-year-old nitrogen-containing organic molecules discovered ...
[17:00:37] <Bytram> =g "10.1038/s41467-020-15931-4" "science daily "
[17:00:38] <systemd> [0 results]
[17:01:12] <Bytram> =g "In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian Martian carbonates"
[17:01:13] <systemd> https://www.nature.com - In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian ...
[17:01:28] <Bytram> =g "In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian Martian carbonates" -site:nature.com
[17:01:28] <systemd> https://www.eurekalert.org - 4-billion-year-old nitrogen-containing organic molecules discovered ...
[17:01:53] <Bytram> =g "In-situ preservation of nitrogen-bearing organics in Noachian Martian carbonates" -site:nature.com -site:eurekalert.org
[17:01:54] <systemd> http://astrobiology.com - 4-billion-year-old Nitrogen-containing Organic Molecules ...
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[17:56:51] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Offspring May Inherit Legacy of their Father's Toxoplasma Infection - https://sylnt.us - don't-poo-poo-cat-poo-warnings
[18:07:28] <Bytram> w2? http://feedproxy.google.com
[18:07:29] <systemd> ^ 03This gigantic, volleyball-size hail may be the largest on record ( https://www.cnet.com )
[18:23:28] <Bytram> =g Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society
[18:23:29] <systemd> https://journals.ametsoc.org - Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society Vol. 101, No. 4 (2020)
[18:30:56] <Bytram> https://doi.org
[18:30:58] <systemd> ^ 03Gargantuan Hail in Argentina ( https://journals.ametsoc.org )
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[20:07:50] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - 4-Billion-Year-Old Nitrogen-Containing Organic Molecules Discovered in Martian Meteorites - https://sylnt.us - in-situ-production-of-TNT-on-Mars
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[21:22:31] <pinchy> maybe if tim pool would shave his head he could start showing himself without that beanie
[22:17:16] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Renewable Power Surges as Pandemic Scrambles Global Energy Outlook, New Report Finds - https://sylnt.us - power-surges-are-not-good-though