#Soylent | Logs for 2017-04-06
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[00:09:49] <paulej72> smegma
[00:18:25] -!- xuser [xuser!~xachet@108.61.vlo.skz] has joined #Soylent
[00:36:39] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Gigabyte Firmware Flaws Allow the Installation of UEFI Ransomware - http://sylnt.us - now-you-tell-me
[01:21:08] <TheMightyBuzzard> blerg. i am gonna hafta spin off a thread, damnit.
[01:31:09] <chromas> If I put my firmware in eufi mode will it go faster?
[01:31:24] <chromas> Does it work like a racing stripe for cars? And Type-R stickers?
[01:31:32] <charon_> paint it red
[01:33:32] <nick> TURBO
[01:34:00] * chromas sets it to 12MHz
[01:36:30] <Bytram> rofl
[01:36:38] <SirFinkus> fuck, nier is awesome
[01:37:40] * Bytram once had a PC/AT Clone where there were times when 12MHz was fine, but others where I had to knock it back down to 10MHz because (IIRC) an addon card went flakey.
[01:38:25] <chromas> Don't forget to save
[01:38:29] <Bytram> hmm, skip Windows, Linux, *BSD... just write your whole app to run under UEFI
[01:38:50] <Bytram> like voting, save early and often?
[01:39:10] <chromas> With all the virtualization, yeah, skip the os and just run everything as a VM
[01:39:32] <chromas> oh yeah, didn't obama steal that from the internet?
[01:39:38] <chromas> commit early; commit often
[01:39:48] <chromas> or release
[01:39:59] <chromas> Thanks, Obama. Thobama.
[01:40:00] <Bytram> or maybe get committed?
[01:40:06] <chromas> That's crazy
[01:40:51] <Bytram> like a faux?
[01:41:27] <chromas> fo' sho'
[01:42:01] <charon_> heh
[01:42:46] <Bytram> faux show?
[01:43:47] <charon_> i like steve carrell
[01:44:35] * chromas remembers when the daily show 'correspondents' were funny
[01:45:10] <chromas> ~imdb steve carrell
[01:45:15] * chromas wonders if he still does things
[01:45:21] <chromas> #imdb steve carrell
[01:45:26] <chromas> bots--
[01:45:26] <Bender> karma - bots: -2
[01:47:23] <Bytram> hmm, this is interesting... Coup d etat? https://bitcoinmagazine.com
[01:48:28] <chromas> not a new bitcoin fork!
[01:48:33] * chromas tries to count 'em all
[01:48:43] <charon_> fork bitcoin
[01:50:11] <Bytram> bork fitcoin?
[01:50:34] <Bytram> http://feedproxy.google.com
[01:50:36] <exec> └─ 13Google Patches 31 Critical Flaws in Android | SecurityWeek.Com
[01:51:01] <chromas> They should bring back the "tablet mode"
[01:51:09] <Bytram> http://www.securityweek.com
[01:51:11] <exec> └─ 13Google Patches 31 Critical Flaws in Android | SecurityWeek.Com
[01:51:31] <Bytram> same destination, w/o redirection
[01:53:24] <charon_> so... eventually they'll fix all the bugs and it will be secure?
[01:53:37] <chromas> hah
[01:53:51] <Bytram> not likely, usually fixes contain their own bugs
[01:54:08] <Bytram> "Little fleas have lesser fleas upon their backs to bite them..."
[01:54:16] <Bytram> OgdenNash++
[01:54:16] <Bender> karma - ogdennash: 1
[01:54:40] <chromas> Plus they'd toss it out and start over before they get near bugfree
[01:54:54] <chromas> "It's aging code and not modern no' mo'"
[01:55:11] <charon_> a brand new codebase written from scratch (with the same old bugs)
[01:55:20] <Bytram> newed is not necessarily better
[01:55:25] <Bytram> s/d/r/
[01:55:25] <sedctl> <Bytram> newer is not necessarily better
[01:55:29] * Bytram is tired
[01:55:35] <charon_> nude is definitely better
[01:56:13] <Bytram> ~weather nome, ak
[01:56:14] <exec> 10Nome, AK, USA - currently 34°F, mostly cloudy, wind N at 17 mph, humidity 69% - Wednesday mostly cloudy (24°F:33°F), Thursday snow showers (23°F:35°F), Friday mostly cloudy (19°F:39°F), Saturday partly cloudy (17°F:30°F)
[01:56:23] <chromas> depends on the aspect ratio
[01:56:33] <Bytram> charon_: after you, of course!
[01:57:20] <charon_> ~weather mcmurdo
[01:57:22] <exec> 10McMurdo Station, Antarctica - currently 1°F / -17°C, mostly sunny, wind NE at 13 mph, humidity 47% - Thursday mostly sunny (-30°F:1°F / -34°C:-17°C), Friday sunny (-16°F:-5°F / -27°C:-21°C), Saturday partly cloudy (-31°F:-6°F / -35°C:-21°C), Sunday cloudy (-19°F:-7°F / -28°C:-22°C)
[01:57:39] <chromas> that's pretty warm
[01:57:46] <charon_> balmy
[01:57:51] * Bytram was thinking the same thing
[02:03:59] <charon_> leaving work. cheers
[02:04:12] -!- charon_ has quit [Quit: driving nude]
[02:06:36] <paulej72> ~weather
[02:06:37] <exec> 10Princeton, NJ, USA - currently 50°F / 10°C, partly cloudy, wind SE at 10 mph, humidity 73% - Wednesday rain (46°F:66°F / 8°C:19°C), Thursday thunderstorm (43°F:62°F / 6°C:17°C), Friday showers (36°F:49°F / 2°C:9°C), Saturday partly cloudy (34°F:57°F / 1°C:14°C)
[02:08:31] <Bytram> ~weather presque isle
[02:08:31] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[02:08:33] <Bytram> ~weather boston
[02:08:33] <exec> 10Presque Isle, ME, USA - currently 33°F, cloudy, wind S at 5 mph, humidity 94% - Wednesday cloudy (30°F:36°F), Thursday showers (37°F:40°F), Friday scattered showers (33°F:52°F), Saturday showers (30°F:44°F)
[02:09:26] <paulej72> Bytram: did you just kill exec
[02:09:44] <Bytram> not on purpose
[02:09:44] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[02:09:46] <exec> 10Portland, ME, USA - currently 40°F, cloudy, wind NE at 5 mph, humidity 81% - Wednesday cloudy (34°F:41°F), Thursday rain (38°F:41°F), Friday mostly cloudy (37°F:49°F), Saturday cloudy (34°F:50°F)
[02:09:49] <Bytram> ~weather boston
[02:09:51] <exec> 10Boston, MA, USA - currently 40°F, cloudy, wind NE at 8 mph, humidity 84% - Wednesday cloudy (38°F:42°F), Thursday rain (44°F:45°F), Friday cloudy (40°F:53°F), Saturday mostly cloudy (36°F:50°F)
[02:10:22] * Bytram justinvoked the bring-out-your-not-dead-yet-parrot-mode
[02:11:21] <paulej72> you may have had it hit against the EFknoker shit we did but never worked on it
[02:15:56] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - ATMs Under Attack by Malware and... Drills - http://sylnt.us - i'll-take-two
[02:21:00] <Bytram> paulej72: ahhh, that would 'splain it! thanks!
[02:32:49] <Runaway1956> opinion here: An editor or six should consolidate all the submissions, and maybe add some links to the Obama White House spying on Trump
[02:33:30] <Runaway1956> That damned clock - just finished reading Soylent, and it's time to get out of here . . . :^(
[02:33:54] <Bytram> Runaway1956: I don't see what stories you think should be merged?
[02:34:31] <Runaway1956> https://soylentnews.org
[02:34:33] <exec> └─ 13DiGenova: Rice Ordered 'Spreadsheets' on Calls Involving Trump, Aides | The Daily Caller: SoylentNews Submission
[02:34:50] <Runaway1956> https://soylentnews.org
[02:34:52] <exec> └─ 13President Obama’s Own Defense Deputy Admits Obama White House Spied on Candidate/President-Elect: SoylentNews Submission
[02:34:59] <Runaway1956> The stories just keep coming
[02:35:46] <Runaway1956> The daily caller story puts some light and/or spin on the story that REALLY makes the Obama administration look bad
[02:35:46] <Bytram> oh, I thought you meant to merge ALL the stories in the submission queue... so, just htose two?
[02:36:11] <Runaway1956> LMAO - that would be interesting wouldn't it? Just merge them all!
[02:36:28] <Runaway1956> gotta run - have a good one!
[02:36:31] <Bytram> may do it tomorrow, I'm utterly exhausted.
[02:36:39] <Bytram> allergies--
[02:36:39] <Bender> karma - allergies: -3
[02:51:33] <Bytram> and... that's all I gots... time for bed.
[02:51:44] <Bytram> ~gnight #Soylent
[02:51:46] * exec casually pilfers a spoon of cowbell from #Soylent
[02:51:59] <charon> gnight bytram
[02:52:09] <Bytram> ~gnight charon
[02:52:10] * exec historically writes a fanfic featuring a sole datagram of humor about charon
[02:52:44] <Bytram> ~weather presque isle
[02:52:45] <exec> 10Presque Isle, ME, USA - currently 34°F, cloudy, wind SE at 5 mph, humidity 94% - Wednesday cloudy (30°F:36°F), Thursday scattered showers (37°F:40°F), Friday scattered showers (33°F:53°F), Saturday showers (30°F:44°F)
[02:52:47] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[02:52:48] <Bytram> ~weather Boston
[02:52:48] <exec> 10Portland, ME, USA - currently 39°F, cloudy, wind NE at 6 mph, humidity 84% - Wednesday cloudy (34°F:41°F), Thursday rain (38°F:41°F), Friday mostly cloudy (37°F:49°F), Saturday cloudy (34°F:50°F)
[02:54:31] <Bytram> ~weather presque isle
[02:54:31] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[02:54:31] <Bytram> ~weather boston
[02:54:31] <Bytram> ~weather baltimore
[02:54:31] <Bytram> ~weather miami
[02:54:33] <exec> 10Presque Isle, ME, USA - currently 34°F, cloudy, wind SE at 5 mph, humidity 94% - Wednesday cloudy (30°F:36°F), Thursday scattered showers (37°F:40°F), Friday scattered showers (33°F:53°F), Saturday showers (30°F:44°F)
[02:54:39] <Bytram> ~weather presque isle
[02:54:41] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[02:54:41] <Bytram> ~weather boston
[02:54:41] <Bytram> ~weather baltimore
[02:54:41] <Bytram> ~weather miami
[03:41:54] <cmn32480> finally at the damn hotel
[03:42:07] <cmn32480> ~weather
[03:42:08] <exec> 10Baltimore, MD, USA - currently 57°F / 14°C, mostly cloudy, wind E at 13 mph, humidity 61% - Wednesday thunderstorm (53°F:70°F / 12°C:21°C), Thursday thunderstorm (44°F:62°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday cloudy (39°F:51°F / 4°C:11°C), Saturday sunny (40°F:62°F / 4°C:17°C)
[03:42:13] <cmn32480> #smake exec
[03:42:13] * MrPlow smakes exec upside the head with a tag cloud
[03:55:16] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Malware Attack on GitHub Developers - http://sylnt.us - professional-sniping
[04:14:34] * cmn32480 wanders off to study thee inside of his eyelids
[04:44:30] -!- n1 [n1!~nick@Soylent/Staff/Editor/n1] has joined #Soylent
[04:44:30] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v n1] by Aphrodite
[04:44:32] <exec> welcome n1: Montevideo, Montevideo Department, Uruguay, 19°C/66°F, 1:44 am GMT-3, Thursday, 6 April 2017
[04:44:58] -!- nick has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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[05:35:34] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Ubuntu Dropping Unity; Will Return to Gnome for Release 18.04 - http://sylnt.us - translation:-we-aren't-making-money-from-the-ads-anymore
[05:38:07] <chromas> Yuck
[05:38:28] <chromas> Leaving mediocre for terrible
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[07:16:20] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Rising Incomes Make People Less Likely to Attend Religious Services - http://sylnt.us - almighty-mammon
[08:16:46] -!- snary [snary!~mike@72-581-601-514.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has joined #Soylent
[08:56:14] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - LGBT Workers in Illinois, Indiana, and Wisconsin Gain Protection - http://sylnt.us - about-time
[09:59:16] <soy673> Protection against Law +2
[10:03:19] <FatPhil> breaking_the_law++
[10:03:19] <Bender> karma - breaking_the_law: 1
[10:12:00] <TheMightyBuzzard> #yt beavis and butthead breaking the law
[10:12:00] <MrPlow> https://www.youtube.com
[10:12:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[10:12:31] <Bender> karma - coffee: 3334
[10:32:14] <FatPhil> stale_coffee++
[10:32:14] <Bender> karma - stale_coffee: 0
[10:32:39] <FatPhil> I'm the only one in the office who likes it. So when the other guys want a fresh pot, my job is clear...
[10:37:34] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Amazon Scoops NFL Streaming Deal Away From Twitter for $50 Million - http://sylnt.us - fumble-recovery
[10:38:16] <TheMightyBuzzard> s'what god created creamer for
[10:39:58] <FatPhil> creamer--
[10:39:58] <Bender> karma - creamer: -1
[10:44:03] <TheMightyBuzzard> tastes better than burnt coffee or coffee made with soft water
[10:44:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> hard water's fine. i grew up needing a hammer and chisel to dry off after a shower.
[10:50:14] -!- Popeidol [Popeidol!~dopeypoll@145-164-144-216.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #Soylent
[10:53:09] <paulej72> #fit Aphrodite
[10:53:14] <paulej72> #fite Aphrodite
[10:53:14] <MrPlow> #fite temporarily restricted to the channel #fite
[10:57:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> smoke break
[10:57:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> nicotine++
[10:57:02] <Bender> karma - nicotine: 348
[11:53:10] <cmn32480> ~gday TheMightyBuzzard
[11:53:12] * exec abnormally postulates my butt of pascal towards TheMightyBuzzard
[11:55:34] <TheMightyBuzzard> ~gday cmn32480
[11:55:36] * exec casually offers a hollowed out iMac of windows 3.11 for workgroups to cmn32480
[11:57:09] * cmn32480 looks at the clock and notes he is late
[11:58:16] * cmn32480 runs out to the customer site with a stop for Dunkin' on the way
[11:58:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> fun fun
[11:59:12] <cmn32480> fucking Texas... again
[12:05:37] <FatPhil> problems always bigger in texas?
[12:06:13] <TheMightyBuzzard> only problem with texas is it's full of texans
[12:06:42] * TheMightyBuzzard says authoritatively as an Okie
[12:16:53] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - 21 Years Later, Experts Connect the Dots on One of the First Cyber-Espionage Groups - http://sylnt.us - acid-burn-and-crash-override
[13:04:44] <FatPhil> cold_pizza++
[13:04:44] <Bender> karma - cold_pizza: 1
[13:09:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> cold_pizza++
[13:09:17] <Bender> karma - cold_pizza: 2
[13:18:55] <Bytram> coffee++
[13:18:55] <Bender> karma - coffee: 3335
[13:19:01] <Bytram> !uid
[13:19:01] <Bender> The current maximum UID is 6556, owned by dm
[13:19:33] <Bytram> Why isn't the word palindrome an actual palindrome?
[13:19:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> ~gday Bytram
[13:19:56] * exec hurriedly drops a buttload of totally legit parameters on Bytram
[13:20:02] <Bytram> Probably for the same reason that one cannot say a word has one syllable using only one syllable... monosyllabic
[13:20:10] <Bytram> ~gday TheMightyBuzzard
[13:20:11] * exec illegitimately mixes a hollowed out iMac of nerf darts with TheMightyBuzzard
[13:20:27] <Bytram> tie
[13:21:15] <Bytram> could you please restart your bot in #fite? So we can at least battle the nicks that are currently there?
[13:22:18] -!- MrPlow has quit [Quit: Powered by Rust.]
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[13:53:13] <Bytram> http://www.eurogamer.net
[13:57:13] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Apple Fans, Android World Scramble to Patch Broadcom's Nasty Drive-by Wi-Fi Security Hole - http://sylnt.us - so-many-patches-today
[14:31:12] -!- snary has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
[15:26:24] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - IoT Garage Door Opener Maker Bricks Customer's Product After Bad Review - http://sylnt.us - device-went-doormant
[15:37:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> woot! foss victory over SJW bullshit: http://fossforce.com
[15:37:25] <exec> └─ 13Libreboot Reorganizes: Seeks to Make Amends | FOSS Force
[15:44:31] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:33] <exec> 10London, UK - currently 64°F / 18°C, mostly sunny, wind W at 5 mph, humidity 43% - Thursday partly cloudy (44°F:63°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday partly cloudy (43°F:63°F / 6°C:17°C), Saturday mostly sunny (45°F:66°F / 7°C:19°C), Sunday sunny (48°F:70°F / 9°C:21°C)
[15:44:34] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:37] <exec> 10London, UK - currently 64°F / 18°C, mostly sunny, wind W at 5 mph, humidity 43% - Thursday partly cloudy (44°F:63°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday partly cloudy (43°F:63°F / 6°C:17°C), Saturday mostly sunny (45°F:66°F / 7°C:19°C), Sunday sunny (48°F:70°F / 9°C:21°C)
[15:44:38] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:39] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:39] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:40] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:40] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:44:40] <exec> 10London, UK - currently 64°F / 18°C, mostly sunny, wind W at 5 mph, humidity 43% - Thursday partly cloudy (44°F:63°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday partly cloudy (43°F:63°F / 6°C:17°C), Saturday mostly sunny (45°F:66°F / 7°C:19°C), Sunday sunny (48°F:70°F / 9°C:21°C)
[15:44:52] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:45:38] <TheMightyBuzzard> ~gday Deucalion
[15:45:39] * exec cantankerously embiggens a sweaty armpit of beef stock with Deucalion
[15:46:04] <Deucalion> o/ hola TheMightyBuzzard
[15:47:58] <TheMightyBuzzard> bot's coming along nicely. got raw commands working (library i use don't have hooks for DLINE/RESV) and think i'm nearly done with user info storage.
[15:49:43] <Bytram> TheMightyBuzzard++
[15:49:43] <Bender> karma - themightybuzzard: 292
[15:51:09] <Deucalion> TheMightyBuzzard++ going beyond what I would have managed to hack up over a weekend :)
[15:51:09] <Bender> karma - themightybuzzard: 293
[15:51:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> smoke break
[15:51:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> nicotine++
[15:51:55] <Bender> karma - nicotine: 349
[15:52:29] <Deucalion> good thinking
[15:52:43] <Deucalion> ~weather
[15:52:44] <exec> 10London, UK - currently 64°F / 18°C, mostly sunny, wind W at 5 mph, humidity 43% - Thursday partly cloudy (44°F:63°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday partly cloudy (43°F:63°F / 6°C:17°C), Saturday mostly sunny (45°F:66°F / 7°C:19°C), Sunday sunny (48°F:70°F / 9°C:21°C)
[15:53:07] <Deucalion> hmm... ok, definitely just rate limiting at the moment
[16:26:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> smoke break
[16:26:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> nicotine++
[16:26:17] <Bender> karma - nicotine: 350
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[16:57:37] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Powerful Solar Flares Found at TRAPPIST-1 Could Dim Chances for Life - http://sylnt.us - auroras++
[17:02:34] <Bytram> ~weather presque isle
[17:02:34] <Bytram> ~weather portland, me
[17:02:34] <Bytram> ~weather boston
[17:02:34] <Bytram> ~weather baltimore
[17:02:34] <Bytram> ~weather miami
[17:02:36] <exec> 10Presque Isle, ME, USA - currently 40°F, cloudy, wind SE at 9 mph, humidity 80% - Thursday showers (37°F:40°F), Friday showers (32°F:51°F), Saturday showers (30°F:44°F), Sunday partly cloudy (29°F:49°F)
[17:11:12] <Bytram> http://feeds.nature.com
[17:11:35] <Bytram> http://www.nature.com
[17:11:37] <exec> └─ 13Initiative aims to break science's citation paywall : Nature News & Comment
[17:29:36] <Deucalion> Viridi++ for those on Steam...
[17:29:36] <Bender> karma - viridi: 1
[17:31:06] <chromas> A little spendy
[17:31:13] <chromas> :D
[17:36:21] <Deucalion> ha - yeh.... umm, wait it's free to play and keeps dropping random seeds once a week forever.... you only pay if you want to get certain plants pronto.... given you only need to interact with it for a few minutes a day to keep the things alive I see no reason to splash out on such things. Probably buy a few as gratitude to the dev as a courteousy. It's not like it's a competitive play to win - it's just pot plants :D
[17:37:38] <n1_> Deucalion, thats kind of cool
[17:38:12] <Deucalion> I left my pot for ~5months - came back to it today and as expected all my plants were brown and limp - fully expected them to be dead and have to start again.... spritz spritz.... all back to life again :D It's just a soothing little waste of time for the end of a nasty day :D
[17:38:33] <n1_> it
[17:38:44] <n1_> it's not something i follow, but i expect there to be a lot more demand for games like that
[17:39:39] <n1_> something relaxing to play and enjoy, rather than the more intense or competition focused games
[17:40:11] <Deucalion> lol - with new apartment sizes going the way they are in the UK - absolutely there will. The expression used to be "not enough room to swing a cat", now it is becoming "not enough room for a pot plant" - we'll all be in those Japanese tube hotel rooms soon enough.
[17:40:52] <n1_> yup
[17:41:13] <n1_> before i left the uk i got to experience how small a one bedroom (not studio) can be
[17:41:33] <n1_> in the kitchen/lounge area going "ok, i guess if you put it there, you could fit a chair in here..."
[17:44:27] <n1_> but in fairness they were only asking £350,000 for it
[17:49:25] <Deucalion> There is a massive development going up just across the A4 from me - right by the river on the Taplow side of the Maidenhead bridge - "Taplow Riverside" they are calling it - mimicing the rather exclusive "Maidenhead Riverside" on the opposite bank (which is mostly huge Georgian detached and semis) - yup 2 bed apartments STARTING at £650,000 up to £960,000.
[17:50:16] <Deucalion> Usual thing - a bedroom is a builtin double wardrobe and just enough room for a double bed and a couple bedside tables....
[17:50:23] <chromas> You buy apartments there?
[17:50:32] * Bytram wonders how much of a rental could be asked for a slightly-used Tardis?
[17:50:34] <chromas> Or is it like an annual lease or something?
[17:51:21] <n1_> chromas, it depends
[17:51:52] <Deucalion> chromas, aging baby boomers looking for somewhere to park their piles of dosh buy them as property is about the only thing to invest in in the UK that shows a return - they then rent them out :)
[17:52:50] <n1_> chromas, leasehold is common, you own the apartment, but not the land that it occupies
[17:53:12] <chromas> Ah. I guess we have a similar thing with condominiums
[17:53:18] <n1_> often they're like 100 year leases#
[17:53:19] <Deucalion> Well - I say "buy" - apartments are usually Leasehold in this part of the UK. So you actually buy a 100 or 1000 year lease. But thanks to statutes Freehold and Leasehold change hands for pretty much the same kind of money per sq.m
[17:53:55] <chromas> That's a long lease. Can you reverse mortgage it to get your money back? :D
[17:55:14] <Deucalion> I'm in a 1930s apartment in the same neighbourhood - bought many moons ago before property went bonkers - rooms are much bigger - but everyone seems to want the little rabbit hutches because they come with shiny new appliances or something :D
[17:56:41] <chromas> You could probably sell it for a fortune
[17:56:54] <Deucalion> n1_ with leasehold you do NOT own the apartment - you lease it and pay ground rent on the land to boot. If you fail to renew the lease before expiry it reverts to the freeholder and you are S.O.L.
[17:57:10] <n1_> being in south america, im renting a 2 bedroom house that is costing me about the same as it would to share a flat in london :D
[17:57:41] <n1_> Deucalion, i wasn't sure on that but .gov says you 'own' it for a fixed period
[17:57:47] <Deucalion> It is basically very long term rent with statutory protections around cost to renew the lease (as long as sufficient years remain) etc.
[17:58:48] <Deucalion> n1_, if it's a fixed period it's not fucking owned is it? It's smoke and mirrors - it's called leasehold for a reason - it's a fucking lease - much like you would lease a commercial property.
[17:58:55] <n1_> Deucalion, i agree
[17:59:52] <n1_> the world we live in now, 'owning' something has a different meaning it would appear
[18:00:08] <n1_> entirely responsible for the costs of
[18:00:14] <n1_> would be more appropriate
[18:00:16] * chromas requisitions another box of scare quotes.
[18:01:26] <n1_> https://www.gov.uk
[18:01:28] <exec> └─ 13Leasehold property - GOV.UK
[18:01:36] <n1_> 'Ownership of the property returns to the landlord when the lease comes to an end.'
[18:02:18] <Deucalion> chromas, my much larger 2 bed 1930s apartment on the same river bank, with river views just 2 minutes walk away is market value ~£280,000 - yet people will pay £600K up for a new rabbit hutch with no storage and no garage. Whatever... I paid nowhere near that much for it - I'm just baffled by the differential :D I guess it's the "look at my fabulous apartment" tax effect coming into play or somesuch :D
[18:03:52] <chromas> You just need to find some hipsters. Call it "vintage" and "retro".
[18:04:14] <Deucalion> n1_, that is true that ownership reverts when the lease ends. But by statute the freeholder has to renew the lease at a capped value on request IIRC >30 years remains on the lease. So it's infinitely renewable unlike commercial property leases. It's still shady as they get sold as "own" this apartment.
[18:04:21] * TheMightyBuzzard chuckles at the silly brits from his ~$70K three bedroom house on a double lot
[18:04:51] <n1_> TheMightyBuzzard, not this silly brit.
[18:04:52] <Deucalion> TheMightyBuzzard, can you find me a job in those parts?
[18:05:03] <Deucalion> ohh.... and a pesky visa!
[18:05:17] <chromas> Just come in illegally. It's all the rage.
[18:06:01] <TheMightyBuzzard> Deucalion, jobs are shit around here in TN but it's possible i could get ya one in TX
[18:06:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> mind you, it'd be working with a buncha texans
[18:07:33] <Deucalion> n1_, you are bang on about the costs - leaseholders of apartments get hit with all maintenance and upgrade costs incurred on the overall apartment block. It needs a new roof.... leaseholders pay for it while the freeholder... who owns the damn building just chuckles.
[18:08:06] <Deucalion> I have family in TX :)
[18:09:00] <TheMightyBuzzard> texans are annoying as hell in the same way that californians are. they think they know everything and their way of doing things is the only sensible way.
[18:09:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> granted they are more correct in those assumptions than californians but still
[18:10:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> blerg, gotta run the neighbor to the grocery store n back. see yall after while.
[18:14:32] <Deucalion> And having painted with his broad stereotyping brush TMB is gone :D
[18:16:37] <Deucalion> Just by way of example... floorplan for a £950,000 2 bed apartment with a view over a concrete lined man made culvert of a river... https://www.berkeleygroup.co.uk
[18:16:42] <exec> └─ 13Property 128, Jubilee Mill, Taplow Riverside
[18:18:10] <n1_> ah the good ol' berkeley group
[18:19:51] <Deucalion> That "Master Bedroom" - pray tell.... where does one swing the proverbial cat or have the wall space for any decent S&M amongst consenting adults?? Even assuming the walls are made of anything but recycled digestive biscuits as opposed to such earthly materials as baked clay :D
[18:20:57] <Deucalion> Utter madness.... but still they sell at the price - so I am clearly the oddity here, it's what the market wants so I shall shush :D
[18:21:12] * Deucalion still does not get it though
[18:21:38] <chromas> You shouldn't be doing that kind of stuff in your home. There are places for that where you can be part of a group. You're not…antisocial are you?
[18:21:51] <chromas> [agents move in]
[18:22:09] <n1_> Deucalion, there's a new generation of people who just don't know any different
[18:22:36] <Deucalion> Only illegal here if you take a photo chromas - that would fall under "extreme porn" laws....
[18:22:48] <n1_> and everyone's still happily drinking the kool-aid that property prices will rise forever, so that £600k mortgage becomes a £1m investment
[18:23:51] <n1_> http://www.bbc.com
[18:23:53] <exec> └─ 13Better-off cashing in on Help to Buy scheme, research finds - BBC News
[18:24:08] <n1_> "Just over half of the people who have received taxpayers' money to help them buy a home under a government scheme did not need it, according to research.
[18:24:08] <n1_> About 4,000 households in England earning more than £100,000 annually are in the Help to Buy Equity Loan scheme."
[18:24:18] <paulej72> blarg
[18:24:21] <chromas> Sounds like you guys are old and standing in the way of 'progress'. smdh you guys just think being alive longer and having more experience makes you know more but we young'ns, we know everything because we just went to our first college class
[18:24:35] <Deucalion> Still hearing it on the radio ads... "ISA not performing for you? Fed up your money is not giving you the returns it should? Invest with cufflink" - 5 - 7% returns - they're a property investment co as far as I can work out.
[18:24:57] <paulej72> start a loan sharking program
[18:25:04] <paulej72> good ROI
[18:25:05] <n1_> Deucalion, are the radio ads still running for the car finance shenanigans?
[18:25:13] <Deucalion> yup
[18:25:21] <n1_> not the typical ones
[18:25:24] <n1_> the investment ones
[18:25:31] <chromas> Do you guys have paylay loan places?
[18:25:31] <n1_> you buy a car, and the company you bought it from leases it out
[18:25:33] * chromas schemes
[18:25:33] <Deucalion> car investments?
[18:25:41] <Deucalion> not heard of that one
[18:25:45] <chromas> payday
[18:25:48] <n1_> and you get that 5-10% RoI
[18:25:59] <n1_> it was a pretty common ad i used to hear on classicfm
[18:26:02] <paulej72> $1 down, $5/month, $40K balloon
[18:26:16] <chromas> sounds legit
[18:26:33] <n1_> chromas, there's plenty of payday loans
[18:26:38] <n1_> although less than there was
[18:27:03] <n1_> they got in trouble for the 8000% interest rates, creating toxic debt etc
[18:27:13] <Deucalion> It's the last vestiges of the money begats money, infinite growth mirage that never really existed. Can't imagine why the new build rate in the SE is so low compared to the population expansion ;)
[18:27:39] <chromas> Well shit, I'll have to go deeper. Only 6,000% interest and you can get a whole year's worth of paychecks in one lump! Buy now!
[18:29:15] <n1_> 'However, it appears the new regime will not spell the end of the huge annualised interest rates quoted on payday loan websites. Despite the changes, Wonga is still able to charge a representative APR of 1,509%, while QuickQuid’s site was promoting an APR of 1,212%.'
[18:30:35] <n1_> from 2013: "Wage Day Advance, which was bought by US-owned Speedy Cash Holdings in February, has increased its profits 32 times in five years to £20m on turnover of £39.5m. This represents a very healthy 50% profit margin. The company offers payday loans to borrowers at an APR of 7069%."
[18:31:42] <n1_> interestingly from this article, all these payday loan companies seem to be owned by US firms
[18:33:00] <n1_> " It also showed that US companies, some banned by law from issuing payday loans in the American states where they are based, are now investing heavily in the UK’s less regulated market."
[18:33:14] <Deucalion> Didn;t they rationalise that by limiting the loan length to a max 30 or 60 days? So obviously no-one is ever going to end owing loads because the loan gets paid back pronto. Oh wait.... or defaults a whole lot sooner! Fuck 'em - unsecured loans - they're buggered come collection time as the only unsecured debt that carries any statutory right of entry for bailiffs or jail time is the council tax. If only people would tell the door knockers
[18:33:14] <Deucalion> to do one along with the Capita TVL drones :D
[18:34:46] <Deucalion> Not that I would encourage anyone to borrow beyond their means - better to sleep on the street than take up a pay day loan. Easier to say when you don;t have toddlers in the house I guess :/
[18:35:01] <n1_> Deucalion, from a quick skim it seems to be that now you wont ever have to pay back more than 100% in interest and fees
[18:35:24] <Deucalion> 100% of what?
[18:35:32] <n1_> the borrowed amount
[18:35:54] <n1_> so if you borrow £500, the most you'll end up owing is £1000 if you don't pay back within the agreed time
[18:35:59] <chromas> That's not too bad. Get your paycheck early for only the cost of two paychecks
[18:36:02] <Deucalion> the principal or principal + fees - which will mount by £50 every time they call or send you a letter
[18:36:27] <n1_> "Interest and fees on all high-cost short-term credit loans are now capped at 0.8% per day of the amount borrowed. If borrowers do not repay their loans on time, default charges must not exceed £15.
[18:36:28] <n1_> In addition, the total cost (fees, interest etc) is capped at 100% of the original sum, which means no borrower will ever pay back more than twice what they borrowed"
[18:36:57] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Boffin Builds, Flies Jet Suit - http://sylnt.us - beware-of-icing
[18:37:24] <chromas> ~define boffin
[18:37:24] <exec> [urbandictionary] 03Boffin: (Computer geek) Science boffin Origin: Boffin was a common colloquial term used in Britain during WW2 for the technical experts, the backroom boys, who were helping to win the war An affectionate term...
[18:37:26] <n1_> not sure what happens if they call in the debt collectors though
[18:37:45] <Deucalion> I's a fucked up system - default and pay just 200% principal - or pay as per terms and be stitched with 1,000% APR - but keep your precious credit rating.
[18:39:44] * Deucalion has a very low opinion of usury - let's just leave it there or I'll be overturning tables with wrath and emerging from behind rocks after 3 days presumed dead :D
[18:40:12] <Deucalion> Wait - is it Easter soon?
[18:40:50] <n1_> it's very troubling, but i know very few people who are not saddled with onerous debt
[18:41:18] <Deucalion> surely not you though - galavanting around the world :D
[18:41:43] <n1_> not yet... although my dad half jokes when he introduces me to people that i'm the man who will inherit his debts
[18:49:36] <Deucalion> be thankful you are no a German citizen - unsecured debt inheritance is a thing there
[18:51:30] <n1_> my parents are pretty responsible but there's likely to be some outstanding mortgage stuff to deal with
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[18:52:58] <exec> welcome FatPhil: Tallinn, Estonia, 3°C/37°F, 9:52 pm GMT+3, Thursday, 6 April 2017
[18:53:43] <n1_> now i must go and buy a mattress, since i woke up on an empty inflatable mattress this morning
[18:53:55] FatPhil is now known as SoyGuest93511
[19:05:33] <Deucalion> n1_, sure but that will hit the estate before it is ever allowed to be distributed to inheritees - if the estate is insufficient that's end of, the mortgage co gets the property, the debt does not follow the will "beneficiaries".
[19:08:34] <Deucalion> ~weather
[19:08:35] <exec> 10London, UK - currently 59°F / 15°C, clear, wind W at 6 mph, humidity 58% - Thursday partly cloudy (44°F:63°F / 7°C:17°C), Friday partly cloudy (43°F:63°F / 6°C:17°C), Saturday mostly sunny (45°F:66°F / 7°C:19°C), Sunday sunny (48°F:70°F / 9°C:21°C)
[20:27:26] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Microbial "Gatling Guns" Observed - http://sylnt.us - gone-fishin'
[21:26:12] <chromas> https://i1.wp.com
[21:58:04] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - To Preserve Natural Resources, El Salvador Becomes First Country to Ban All Metal Mining - http://sylnt.us - poor-countries-showing-grit
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[23:17:42] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Trump Signs Bill Allowing ISPs to Share or Sell Customers' Browsing History - http://sylnt.us - are-you-getting-what-you-voted-for-yet?
[23:30:00] <chromas> Again?
[23:53:01] <n1_> the previous story was about the senate vote
[23:53:48] <chromas> oh yeah
[23:53:53] <chromas> same result tho
[23:54:41] * chromas prepares for all his datas to be sold off by his ISP just like they weren't already