#Soylent | Logs for 2014-11-11

« return
[00:00:01] <ciri> 9
[00:00:03] <ciri> 10 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[00:00:20] <nick> crutchy, i am a man with ethics and morals and i find it very hard to compete in the business world for those reasons
[00:00:33] <crutchy> nooo!
[00:00:35] <nick> i wont change my approach, but i know it costs me business.
[00:00:39] <crutchy> but you're cutting your own head off :p
[00:00:51] <crutchy> sex sells
[00:00:57] <nick> i want to be able to sleep at night
[00:01:03] <crutchy> blokes will buy anything from a nice pair of tits
[00:01:20] <crutchy> its the male condition
[00:01:28] <crutchy> its no fault of yours
[00:01:29] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Obama Presses for Tough 'Open Internet' Rules - http://sylnt.us - now-we-have-to-regulate-freedom-to-keep-it
[00:01:37] <nick> tits would be the downfall of the free market in that case
[00:01:44] <crutchy> lol true
[00:01:45] <ciri> i missed it, what are you laughing at? >.>
[00:01:56] * nick thinks he will remember that for the next time this comes up
[00:01:57] <nick> :p
[00:02:09] <crutchy> though there are a lot of tits out there
[00:02:23] <crutchy> question is, who can find the nicest/biggest?
[00:02:42] <nick> heh
[00:03:15] <crutchy> there's a reason why porn is a global mega-industry
[00:03:44] <nick> and prostitution is supposed to be the 'oldest profession'
[00:03:49] <crutchy> that too
[00:04:22] <crutchy> there's quite possibly more money in porn than even defense or finance
[00:04:49] <nick> there could have been, but there isn't now
[00:05:27] <nick> if you had to pay for porn on the internet, it probably would be up there
[00:05:45] <nick> but as the internet is an endless source of 'free' porn, it's not as valuable as it could have been
[00:10:19] <crutchy> gtg. see yas later
[00:10:23] <crutchy> thanks for the chat nick
[00:11:03] <nick> laters
[00:11:16] <paulej72> what i miss
[00:14:49] <Blackmoore> i think we (both) missed a conversation about capitalism..
[00:14:55] <Blackmoore> o.)
[00:23:38] <TheMightyBuzzard> damn, i like those
[00:24:31] <nick> something like that
[00:28:39] <Blackmoore> i'm too groggy to engage
[00:29:29] <nick> i'm too conflicted to have a real opinion aside from we're all fucked.
[00:31:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'm too busy eating dinner then doing the dishes
[00:31:34] <Blackmoore> nick - it doesnt help that i get paid to be part of the problem.
[00:32:08] <nick> Blackmoore, i know the feeling, i'm desperately trying to find a way to not be part of the problem
[00:32:10] <Blackmoore> and my company at very least wants us to look ethical'
[00:32:33] <Blackmoore> eh. I tried that and nearly starved.
[00:32:46] <nick> trying to do something meaningful, with tangible value that actually pays the bills and leaves me morals and ethics still
[00:32:47] <Blackmoore> i'm just a poorly paid prostitute.
[00:33:21] <nick> i think that applies to most people
[00:33:26] <Blackmoore> yeah
[00:33:39] <Blackmoore> they just dont like to think about it that way
[00:33:39] <nick> prostitutes at least get to pick their hours and often their working environment
[00:33:56] -!- JamesNZ [JamesNZ!~james@43-567-441-22.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #Soylent
[00:33:59] <Blackmoore> eh- that's not entirely true
[00:34:25] <nick> not entirely, but my point is in general there is a degree of flexibility with that employment that most people do not have
[00:34:30] <Blackmoore> I've seen the ones reduced to working the bad areas and roughest clients
[00:34:43] <chromas> the flexible ones charge extra
[00:35:04] <nick> employees are expected to be in the office 8 hours day minimum in the office, 5-6 days a week etc
[00:35:16] <Blackmoore> yup.
[00:35:17] <nick> going to the toilet could well be logged to make sure you're not spending too many minutes away from your desk
[00:35:28] <nick> i was amazed to find out that actually happens
[00:35:39] <Blackmoore> i used to work at a place like that
[00:35:48] <Blackmoore> had to call in the labor board
[00:36:04] <Blackmoore> and the fire inspectors..
[00:36:22] <nick> i'm sure it was on here, we ran a story about McDonalds using 'real time profit systems' or something, so the franchise owner could see how much profit/loss they were making
[00:36:25] <nick> by the minute in real time
[00:36:40] <Blackmoore> nauseating
[00:36:43] <nick> which is going to create a real nice working environment for the employees
[00:39:04] <Blackmoore> i often wonder why we dont se a return to mobs with pitchforks and torches. and then i remeber you cant pick those up at walmart
[00:41:47] -!- FunPika has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[00:42:18] <nick> i read something on that point yesterday
[00:42:43] <nick> the conclusion was 'we still have monday night football, and the commercials during that tell us it's all awesome'
[00:43:15] <nick> we still have enough bread and circuses
[00:43:36] <chromas> walmart sells both of those things ;)
[00:44:07] <nick> and so many people have their priorities screwed up: "Kim Kardashian: Hollywood, the freemium app in which you climb up to the A-list next to Kim Kardashian, made $43.4 million in Q3."
[00:44:57] <juggs> da fuq o.O there is no hope
[00:45:30] <nick> juggs, as i said, "we're all fucked"
[00:45:48] * juggs nods
[00:46:20] <swiss> crutchy: yeah (2 U for 12 drives) I can actually only fit 6 in the one i'm putting it in
[00:46:26] <swiss> the number of sata connections is insane
[00:46:40] <nick> think you missed him, swiss
[00:46:53] <swiss> all good, pretty sure he has a hilight window like i do
[00:47:30] <swiss> did he show you the board I linked? it's way too crazy
[00:47:30] <nick> ah the old days, when i actually bothered to configure my IRC client
[00:47:35] <swiss> lol
[00:47:35] <ciri> HEHEHEHE
[00:47:43] <nick> i don't think i saw it, link me?
[00:48:27] <swiss> nick: http://www.newegg.com
[00:49:06] <swiss> new modem came~
[00:49:10] <chromas> I like the battery slot
[00:49:22] <swiss> chromas: looks like a coin machine, doesn't it?
[00:49:36] <nick> oooo
[00:49:38] <nick> well i do like that
[00:49:56] <swiss> i think i'll be picking this one up
[00:50:02] <nick> even as an amd fanboi, it's tempting
[00:50:05] <chromas> would make a nice little firewall server combo with all those ethernet ports
[00:50:16] <swiss> http://www.newegg.com this is the octacore version of the same thing
[00:50:30] <swiss> chromas: i'm planning on nic-teaming them so it has a 2Gbit link
[00:50:39] <chromas> sweet
[00:51:12] <swiss> do i want to try to use time warner's automated system to hook up my new modem
[00:51:42] <chromas> do you have to speak the options to a computer?
[00:51:42] <nick> i wouldn't
[00:51:57] <swiss> the other option is talking to them on the phone
[00:52:15] <nick> well that sucks
[00:52:22] <nick> automate then
[00:52:27] <swiss> when i say automated system i mean the online one
[00:52:33] <swiss> where i supposedly can put in my new MAC
[00:54:19] <nick> how does one get online without the modem?
[00:54:19] <ciri> doing great here
[00:54:48] * nick kicks ciri
[00:55:03] <chromas> apparently ciri did it
[00:55:12] <swiss> nick: phone?
[00:56:06] <nick> i think i was overthinking it, using your old modem to register online before hooking up the new one?
[00:57:27] <Blackmoore> eh. g'night
[00:57:40] Blackmoore is now known as blackmoore|afk
[01:00:17] <swiss> ugh, i can't figure out how to do this online
[01:00:19] <swiss> time to call in
[01:00:27] <swiss> my work phone gets baller reception at my hosue at least
[01:02:49] <nick> random question, anyone connect to a vpn on their android phone regularly?
[01:15:37] <swiss> http://www.speedtest.net
[01:15:37] <NetCraft> ^ 03Speedtest.net by Ookla - My Results
[01:16:21] <chromas> that's on the new modem?
[01:16:36] <nick> thats some fast interwebs you got there
[01:16:44] <swiss> chromas: yeah
[01:16:52] <chromas> 👍
[01:16:55] <swiss> slow ass upload in comparison though
[01:17:07] <swiss> i'd take a 50% cut in download to get 50Mbps upload
[01:17:22] <chromas> I think that's pretty common for cable though
[01:17:33] <nick> i got 20Mbps down 1Mbps up, so :|
[01:18:05] <chromas> that's why god in vented multi-source downloads :)
[01:18:37] -!- pbnjoe [pbnjoe!~pbnjoe@Soylent/Users/313/pbnjoe] has joined #Soylent
[01:21:41] -!- SpallsHurgenson [SpallsHurgenson!~SpallsHur@cath-11-222-727-91.nwrknj.east.verizon.net] has joined #Soylent
[01:23:18] <SpallsHurgenson> Oct 29 2015 will be a Thursday, may need to correct the /topic :)
[01:24:11] <chromas> just need to adjust your cock back a few days
[01:25:09] <SpallsHurgenson> sadly, I do not have trans-temporal genitalia :(
[01:25:30] <chromas> then you need you some Alzheimer's
[01:25:44] <juggs> that meeting didn't happen and has not been rescheduled yet as far as I know. It's on the front page of the site too, which is not a good look really.
[01:26:05] <nick> juggs, i only just noticed that today :/
[01:26:05] * chromas notices the X-style select-to-copy doesn't work right in LibreOffice
[01:27:29] <juggs> .op
[01:27:29] -!- mode/#Soylent [+o juggs] by juggler
[01:27:36] <juggs> .topic https://SoylentNews.org | Useful links: http://sylnt.us | SN PBC Board Meeting - TBA in #staff, all are welcome
[01:27:36] juggler changed topic of #Soylent to: https://SoylentNews.org | Useful links: http://sylnt.us | SN PBC Board Meeting - TBA in #staff, all are welcome
[01:27:38] <juggs> .deop
[01:27:38] -!- mode/#Soylent [-o juggs] by juggler
[01:27:57] <SpallsHurgenson> yay, my constant and incessant moaning has had result!
[01:29:35] <juggs> it was bugging me too, just kept getting distracted and forgetting to change it :D
[01:30:35] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - GM Ordered 500,000 Replacement Ignition Switches Months Before Recall - http://sylnt.us - more-than-just-a-lucky-premonition
[01:34:48] <juggs> This really annoys me... http://www.bbc.co.uk
[01:34:49] <NetCraft> ^ 03BBC News - CBI conference: Increase free childcare, business leaders urge
[01:35:39] <nick> juggs, i had the same reaction to that this morning
[01:36:11] <nick> and "The CBI, which represents more than 190,000 businesses" is the key point to it
[01:36:13] <juggs> socialising the costs while pocketing the profits AGAIN.. they have a nerve
[01:36:15] <SpallsHurgenson> what, you want business to start offering a living wage to its low-paid employees? You communist!
[01:36:27] <nick> not just some random business group of a handful of crazy people
[01:36:30] <juggs> lol Palls
[01:36:35] <juggs> +s
[01:36:55] SpallsHurgenson is now known as PallssHurgenson
[01:37:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> Man should never be forced to devote his life to the happiness of another man nor of any number of other men.
[01:37:05] <nick> 2015 CBI conference: increase social housing, business leaders urge
[01:38:15] <nick> business doesn't attack the welfare state because it provides them with cheap labour
[01:38:41] <nick> the government picks up the tab on the housing and childcare, so you can pay people half what the living wage would be.
[01:38:59] * PallssHurgenson hires nick as his new CEO!
[01:39:02] <nick> and you then have the people relying on the government and their employers, for doing the 'right thing', going out and working hard.
[01:39:06] PallssHurgenson is now known as SpallsHurgenson
[01:39:53] <nick> juggs, might be my liberal mind but there was a statement from IDS that was something about 'it's always going to be better to work' in reference to single parent families
[01:40:14] <nick> and it lines up with this in my mind, "it's always going to be better to work, you dont need to have time with your children, you can pay people do to that for you"
[01:40:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> really it's just as well. kids are loud, smelly, and otherwise annoying.
[01:41:04] <SirFinkus> oooh, oooh, bug I think
[01:41:13] <nick> which is fine, and i would agree.
[01:41:14] <SpallsHurgenson> frankly, this whole "paying the employees" thing really needs to be looked at too. I mean, the cost of all those accountants and paystubs really add up. The government needs to help out the business-owner by removing that necessity :)
[01:41:17] <nick> but then people should not have kids.
[01:41:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> SirFinkus, SN bug?
[01:41:23] <SirFinkus> http://soylentnews.org
[01:41:23] <NetCraft> ^ 04SN comment by Sir Finkus (192)
[01:41:24] <SirFinkus> yep
[01:41:50] <nick> paying wages is a massive strain on business, without it there would be much more profit
[01:41:56] <SirFinkus> there's a chance I forgot to add a / in the tag, but it still seems like unexpected behaviour
[01:42:09] <SpallsHurgenson> not to mention that whole TAX thing
[01:42:22] <SpallsHurgenson> government should pay the taxes for business too :)
[01:42:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> SirFinkus, this is why we have the preview button =P
[01:42:51] <nick> thats what we have luxembourg for i thought
[01:42:53] <nick> and the cayman islands
[01:43:00] <TheMightyBuzzard> what was the address you tried to link?
[01:43:02] <SirFinkus> yeah, but using that's like reading the linked articles
[01:43:18] <SirFinkus> https://lists.torproject.org
[01:43:19] <NetCraft> ^ 03[tor-dev] yes hello, internet supervillain here
[01:43:31] <SirFinkus> but if I did miss the tag, the result is still gross
[01:43:49] <SirFinkus> it tries to linkify it anyway
[01:44:34] <SirFinkus> might even be dangerous
[01:45:01] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, we can handle proper links or plaintext link-ifying but malformed ones it's anyone's guess.
[01:47:27] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'd debug it but i dunno how ya put in what ya put in. looks like ya did a <ahref=blah> without quotes and without a space between the a and the href but who knows how it was mangled.
[01:48:54] * SirFinkus wishes he had previewed
[01:49:07] <SirFinkus> oh wait
[01:49:14] <SirFinkus> ok if I query you?
[01:49:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, i don mind
[01:51:37] -!- pbnjoe has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[01:58:04] -!- pbnjoe [pbnjoe!~pbnjoe@Soylent/Users/313/pbnjoe] has joined #Soylent
[02:06:00] * SpallsHurgenson watches "Yes Minister"
[02:07:59] <nick> as good as Yes Minister is, it is used to simplfy and excuse how the political system works here
[02:08:24] <SpallsHurgenson> it's realy more of a commentary on politics vs government
[02:08:38] <SirFinkus> oh, sounds interesting, I love those types of stories
[02:08:38] <SpallsHurgenson> "The Thick of It" is more a commentary on the political side
[02:08:45] <nick> indeed, but it's also 'of its time' now
[02:09:14] <SirFinkus> Wag the Dog is another good one
[02:09:22] <nick> too many people (in the UK) will call to yes minister as a reason why it doesnt matter how terrible and corrupt the politicians may be, because the civil servants are there keeping things in check where it really matters
[02:09:31] <nick> and i just dont believe that is true anymore (if it ever was)
[02:09:52] <SirFinkus> That sounds like "The Trial"
[02:10:11] <SirFinkus> maybe without the naked guys in the closet
[02:10:28] <SirFinkus> ...maybe
[02:10:35] <nick> lol
[02:11:12] <SirFinkus> I always think of that book whenever I read docs by the feds defending their illegal activities
[02:11:23] <SpallsHurgenson> apparently the british civil service was that powerful in the early 80s but its not quite the same these days
[02:11:52] <SirFinkus> "Oh, you can't sue us because you can't prove we affected you because that information is classified, in order to have that released you need to prove that it affected you"
[02:11:54] <SpallsHurgenson> (or so I've been told; not being British - I can cook! - I don't have personal experience :)
[02:12:47] <nick> SirFinkus, the law is a tool to be used when appropriate
[02:12:55] <nick> but it can also be ignored when appropriate
[02:13:29] <SpallsHurgenson> but the bureacracy is a major reason politicians have increasingly turned to corporations to assist them in getting around their own government
[02:13:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> that only leads to tyranny when you allow that same liberty to the rulers.
[02:13:59] <nick> indeed
[02:14:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> personally, i obey the laws i agree with and disobey the ones i don't.
[02:15:06] * SirFinkus notes TheMightyBuzzard on his list
[02:15:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> great characteristic for when i'm a proper tyrannical emperor so i gotta practice up
[02:15:43] <JamesNZ> Sooo... criminal when it pleases you? :P
[02:16:07] <SirFinkus> my personal moral code in that respect is "Is this hurting others?"
[02:16:37] * SpallsHurgenson obeys all the laws, especially the contradictory ones :)
[02:17:01] <nick> thing is, we don't even know if we're obeying 'all the laws' or not
[02:17:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> sure we do. we know we're not.
[02:17:17] <SirFinkus> protip: you're not
[02:17:24] <nick> yeah, obviously
[02:17:29] <nick> but from the perspective of people who think they are
[02:18:02] <nick> even if you read the law, it doesnt help due to various courts interpretations of them.
[02:18:06] <TheMightyBuzzard> i figure if they're gonna have something to arrest me for anyway, why not rack up the score a bit and enjoy myself?
[02:18:51] * SirFinkus adds an asterisk next to TheMightyBuzzard, leading to a footnote
[02:19:07] <TheMightyBuzzard> trying to watch Dracula Untold. it's not working so far.
[02:19:38] <nick> i think SirFinkus is generally on the right thought process... "is this hurting others, are other people going to be negatively affected by my actions..."
[02:19:58] <SirFinkus> well, there's another little bit there
[02:20:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> nick, only if you throw in "is this any of their business" as well.
[02:20:31] <SirFinkus> "is the harm I'm doing to others as a direct result of the illegality of my actions or the actions themselves?"
[02:20:43] <nick> TheMightyBuzzard++
[02:20:43] <Bender> karma - themightybuzzard: 107
[02:20:47] <nick> SirFinkus++
[02:20:47] <Bender> karma - sirfinkus: 8
[02:21:29] <nick> because naturally some people will be negatively affected, because for some reason certain people think that everything is their business.
[02:22:01] <SirFinkus> so things like drug use would probably fall into the moral category, even though it could hurt others as a result of its illegality
[02:22:15] <SirFinkus> as an example
[02:22:51] <SpallsHurgenson> like those poor criminals who are forced to sell it at an incredible mark-up; think of what would happen to their profits if drugs were made legal!
[02:22:56] * SpallsHurgenson shakes his head sadly
[02:23:43] <nick> "In July 2013, May decided to ban the mild stimulant khat, against the advice of the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs. The council reached the conclusion that there was "insufficient evidence" it caused health problems,[92] while May argued that the mere possibility of harming evidence existing was sufficient grounds for banning something - "we risk underestimating the actual harms of
[02:23:43] <nick> khat in our communities owing to the limitations of the evidence base available to the ACMD".[93]"
[02:23:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> newp, self destruction is an inalienable right. drugs, seatbelts, whatever.
[02:24:13] <nick> the UK is on the path to ban anything 'mind altering' with a broad brush
[02:24:22] <SirFinkus> oh, that khat bullshit
[02:24:32] <SirFinkus> they were talking about it on the local news here
[02:24:32] <nick> one assumes they will exclude alcohol and food from this.
[02:24:41] <SirFinkus> they said it was like meth
[02:24:49] <nick> and they would be lying
[02:24:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> they'd better or the scotts will riot
[02:24:55] <SirFinkus> I suppose in the sense that coffee is like meth
[02:25:18] * SpallsHurgenson wants a Britsh ban on tea, for ultimate irony
[02:26:14] <nick> the government position on alcohol is 'you cant compare an illegal drug with a legal substance'
[02:26:24] <nick> 'but maybe you should compare to see if the legal one should be illegal also'
[02:26:27] <TheMightyBuzzard> they don't do that, they just tax it. then a bunch of clowns in indian getup go and make a harbor-sized cup of tea.
[02:26:30] <nick> followed by: 'you cant compare an illegal drug with a legal substance'
[02:27:18] <TheMightyBuzzard> nick, sounds pretty similar to here.
[02:27:23] <SirFinkus> I love the alcohol doublethink
[02:27:39] * TheMightyBuzzard salutes with his bottle
[02:27:41] <SirFinkus> it's objectively less healthy than nearly all illegal drugs
[02:27:42] <nick> i have it on my sunday lunch with the family
[02:27:45] <nick> i'm drinking water
[02:27:48] <nick> they're all drinking wine
[02:27:50] <chromas> good, upstanding christian citizens drink a lot
[02:27:51] <nick> telling me how dangerous drugs are
[02:27:54] <chromas> Seen Moral Orel?
[02:28:02] <SirFinkus> good show
[02:28:32] <SirFinkus> a little dark though
[02:28:34] <juggs> they like the alcohol tax income, but flatly refuse to consider de-crim of mild narcotics which they could then of course tax. It's a weird brit puritanical mess of poor thinking.
[02:29:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> it's a "what can we get away with"
[02:29:12] <nick> because the children might get the 'wrong message'
[02:29:34] <juggs> oh gawd you're channelling May again nick
[02:29:40] <nick> lol
[02:29:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> cause, i mean, there's evidence from the US saying bad things happen when you criminalize booze.
[02:29:58] <SirFinkus> "think of the children" is one of those key phrases you hear and know the next thing out of that person's mouth is going to be bullshit
[02:30:11] <SirFinkus> another is "welcome the debate" etc
[02:30:23] <nick> i just have to disregard logic and take the opposite position than i normally would, and i have May's position.
[02:30:41] <nick> anything and everything will either be bad for the kids
[02:30:44] <nick> or will aid terrorists
[02:30:49] <nick> that is all that can ever happen
[02:31:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> fuck em. kids n terrorists both. and kid terrorists too for good measure.
[02:31:15] <SirFinkus> so apparently California decriminalized drug posession, except for a few drugs
[02:31:18] <SirFinkus> guess which ones
[02:31:18] <juggs> Unless it is controlled and overseen by May, then all will be rainbows and unicorns
[02:31:36] <SirFinkus> hint: they aren't the most dangerous ones
[02:32:08] <juggs> the ones they think they can lock the most people up for perhaps? Gotta keep the prison "industry" thriving.
[02:32:14] <chromas> put the kids back out in the onion fields; that'll keep 'em occupied and larn 'em about makin' moneys
[02:32:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> SirFinkus, honestly it doesn't matter what cali does. drugs are a federal issue.
[02:32:17] <nick> juggs, that does seem to be how it works
[02:32:18] <nick> and the same again
[02:32:27] <SirFinkus> well, it does to some extent
[02:32:38] <juggs> talk of privatising prisons here really worries me
[02:32:40] <SirFinkus> and really, no, even that would make sense juggs
[02:32:48] <nick> juggs, talk? it's too late for that
[02:32:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> only if the feds refuse to enforce like they've done with medical pot.
[02:32:53] <nick> it's here and it's here to stay.
[02:32:58] <SirFinkus> LSD and fucking Mushrooms
[02:33:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> man shrooms are fuckin dangerous. it's real easy to get the wrong kind n just die horribly.
[02:33:31] <juggs> I thought only police escort duties had gone to g4s not the whole prison setup nick? It may have passed me by :(
[02:33:50] <nick> let me double check but i'm sure there are already private prisons
[02:33:54] <nick> or at least semi-private
[02:34:05] <TheMightyBuzzard> you can borrow some of ours if not.
[02:34:10] <SirFinkus> one time I thought I got oysters, but ended up with shitake
[02:34:16] <SirFinkus> that could have turned out bad
[02:34:17] <juggs> TheMightyBuzzard, so legalise shrooms and instigate quality control measures so people can obtain psilocybes safely
[02:34:28] <nick> juggs:
[02:34:32] <nick> "In the modern era, the United Kingdom was the first country in all of Europe to use prisons run by the private sector to hold its prisoners."
[02:34:49] <TheMightyBuzzard> juggs, i always got mine out of piles of cow shit. cows aren't big on being regulatory agencies.
[02:34:50] <nick> started in 92
[02:35:05] <juggs> fuck...
[02:35:11] <SirFinkus> that's the funniest part about mushrooms, they grow in my backyard
[02:35:33] <nick> juggs ima pm you real quick
[02:35:48] <juggs> TheMightyBuzzard, horse paddocks here were always fine places to look for shrooms. No idea if that is still the case.
[02:35:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> safest way. most other kinds of shrooms that look similar won't grow in cow shit.
[02:35:58] <SirFinkus> but I guess if I pick them I'm a felon
[02:36:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> juggs, yeah, those as well.
[02:36:24] <SirFinkus> it isn't particularly dangerous if you use a key and take spore prints
[02:36:30] <SirFinkus> not that I'd know that kind of thing
[02:36:49] <SirFinkus> also check for blue bruising
[02:36:59] <SirFinkus> ...you know so you know which ones not to pick
[02:37:09] <TheMightyBuzzard> or just stay the fuck away from shrooms.
[02:37:38] <SirFinkus> mushrooms are interesting though
[02:37:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> it's not something you want to get wrong a few times before you figure it out.
[02:37:59] <SirFinkus> bizzare methods of growing and reproduction
[02:38:02] <juggs> shrooms are legal here as long as you don't dry, process or sell them. How on earth they expect to catch someone in the act of boiling up a pot of shroom juice and quaffing it I have no idea... but them's the rules lol
[02:38:41] <SirFinkus> well, most of the "fun" ones don't look very much like any toxic ones
[02:38:54] <nick> juggs, i thought they changed that
[02:38:55] <SirFinkus> or behave in the same ways
[02:39:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> i pity the poor schmucks who had to figure it out the hard way
[02:39:42] <SirFinkus> usually the people who get in trouble with misidentification either haven't done their research, or are looking for edible ones
[02:39:58] <juggs> nick, no doubt. I go check if I still bothered with the things. Haven't for years now.
[02:39:59] <SirFinkus> a lot of edible wild mushrooms look very similar to toxic ones
[02:40:17] <nick> never done shrooms, i hate mushrooms too much lol
[02:40:42] <SirFinkus> http://en.wikipedia.org
[02:40:42] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Destroying angel
[02:40:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> you're british, you should love them cause you can make tea out of them.
[02:41:03] <SirFinkus> the immature version of this mushroom looks very similar to edible puffballs
[02:41:04] <nick> way to ruin tea for me, TMB
[02:41:32] <SirFinkus> destroying angles are sexy looking, I had a 6 inch tall one in my backyard
[02:41:36] <SirFinkus> I should have taken a picture
[02:42:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> aight. getting on towards that time. round up cats n sleep.
[02:42:35] <SirFinkus> night
[02:43:01] <SirFinkus> oh, other dangerous things about mushrooms
[02:43:09] <SirFinkus> some you can eat, and they'll kill you 3 weeks later
[02:43:20] <SirFinkus> other ones are edible, but if you drink alcohol, they'll kill you
[02:44:19] <juggs> These things are pretty distinctive among the UK's range of wild fungi at least... https://en.wikipedia.org
[02:45:08] <SirFinkus> the trick is to note the habitat, the bruising characteristics, appearance, and spore print for every single one
[02:45:30] <SirFinkus> since they can be mixed in with toxic ones which look similar at a glance
[02:45:41] -!- pbnjoe has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[02:46:19] <SirFinkus> I have some that grow in my backyard that look similar to that, but if you eat them, apparently your vision will turn blue and you'll have a pretty bad night on the toilet
[02:46:36] <juggs> ha, sounds lovely
[02:47:23] <SpallsHurgenson> I think my kitty is trying to kill me; last night she was chewing on the back of my neck
[02:47:34] <SirFinkus> I idly wonder if they may be an aphrodisiac because I'm pretty sure blue vision is a side effect of viagra
[02:49:26] <SirFinkus> distinct from liberty caps because they don't bruise, they have straw like hollow stipes, and have a very dark brownish black spore print
[02:49:48] <SirFinkus> they also tend to be found on lawns with decomposing leaves in partial sunlight
[02:50:05] <SirFinkus> throughout fall
[02:51:29] <juggs> SirFinkus, you have become the pocket field guide to wild fungi
[02:52:00] <SirFinkus> heh, my dad is a teacher and I'd always go along on the field trips
[02:52:09] <SpallsHurgenson> kitty has been nibbling on me for years... I think she's ready to move up from a quick snack to the full meal
[02:52:12] <SirFinkus> identifying plants and critters in the local ponds
[02:53:01] <SirFinkus> my cat used to lie behind me when I was sleeping and lick my head
[02:53:39] * SirFinkus is listening to Korpiklaani — Tequila, from the album Ukon Wacka
[02:53:54] <SirFinkus> on a Monday?!?
[02:54:09] <SpallsHurgenson> cats kill by slipping their long fangs between the vertebrae and cutting through the spinal cord... I don't want her nibbling back there :)
[02:54:14] <SpallsHurgenson> it gives her ideas :)
[02:54:42] <SirFinkus> yeah, better sleep with a gun under your pillow
[02:55:15] <SirFinkus> I think if you die in your house, a cat will begin eating you before a dog will
[02:55:57] <SpallsHurgenson> I'm fine with that; I just don't want her knocking me off before my time :)
[02:59:52] <juggs> Seems more environmentally friendly to be eaten and shat out by your pets than burnt in a giant gas oven at the crem at least
[03:01:27] <SirFinkus> I'll be dead, what do I care?
[03:01:59] <SpallsHurgenson> plus she shredded my old will and I think I caught her practicing my signature
[03:04:10] <juggs> SirFinkus, I have some weird minor hippy vibe going on where I think it would be good to leave the world a better place than when I entered in some small way. ~shrug~
[03:04:35] <SirFinkus> best way to look at it I think
[03:04:42] <JamesNZ> SpallsHurgenson: Suspicious behaviour indeed.
[03:04:46] <SirFinkus> I'll donate my body to science
[03:05:10] <SirFinkus> probably the best contribution I can make at that point
[03:13:24] * Konomi yawns
[03:14:11] * SpallsHurgenson counts teeth
[03:14:21] * Konomi grrrrrrsss
[03:15:24] <chromas> Fee Di Foe Fum, somebody made a mess in the kitchen
[03:16:25] <SpallsHurgenson> nuke it from orbit!
[03:17:04] <chromas> small_kitchens--
[03:17:04] <Bender> karma - small_kitchens: -1
[03:17:25] <SpallsHurgenson> smaller_nukes++
[03:17:26] <Bender> karma - smaller_nukes: 1
[03:17:34] -!- Ethanol-fueled [Ethanol-fueled!~62b0cd6b@ng19-647-271-678.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #Soylent
[03:17:47] <Ethanol-fueled> 'sup doofuses.
[03:18:55] <SirFinkus> you missed the mycology ef
[03:19:15] <Ethanol-fueled> that sucks...because I love fungi
[03:19:23] <Ethanol-fueled> mushrooms are mega-delicious.
[03:19:59] <SirFinkus> also fascinating in terms of life cycle
[03:19:59] <Ethanol-fueled> what did I miss, anyway?
[03:20:13] * Ethanol-fueled checks logs
[03:22:15] <SirFinkus> good place to find mushrooms
[03:22:35] <Ethanol-fueled> I don't have the balls to pick wild shrooms
[03:24:02] <SirFinkus> I mainly enjoy trying to identify them, usually easier to buy them at a store or grow your own if you have special requirements
[03:24:03] <Konomi> I used to all the time
[03:24:14] <Konomi> my dad liked cooking them
[03:24:17] -!- pbnjoe [pbnjoe!~pbnjoe@Soylent/Users/313/pbnjoe] has joined #Soylent
[03:24:33] <SirFinkus> it's pretty safe if you know what you're doing
[03:24:43] <SirFinkus> and are diligent
[03:25:04] <Konomi> I haven't done it for awhile so I wouldn't now don't trust myself ;p
[03:25:33] <chromas> The key is to have someone else taste them
[03:25:38] <Ethanol-fueled> haha chromas.
[03:25:48] <SirFinkus> naw, that doesn't work unless you wait a month
[03:26:12] <Ethanol-fueled> Man, gettin' hungry now....some chopped mushrooms sauteed in butter and garlic, with a hint of pepper
[03:26:32] <Ethanol-fueled> ladled mountainously over a phat steak and some mashed pataters.
[03:26:44] <SirFinkus> http://en.wikipedia.org
[03:26:45] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Mushroom poisoning
[03:26:56] <SirFinkus> "Causes kidney failure within 3 weeks after ingestion. Principal toxin in genus Cortinarius."
[03:27:23] <chromas> SirFinkus: so they'll get a little cold; check your email and irc while you wait :)
[03:27:24] <Ethanol-fueled> LOL phallotoxin
[03:27:25] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[03:27:25] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Phallotoxin
[03:27:43] <Ethanol-fueled> The death cap too, that shroom will fuck your shit up.
[03:28:26] <SirFinkus> there's another one that is edible, but will kill you if you drink alcohol with it
[03:29:10] <SirFinkus> the Orellanine is the scariest one though
[03:32:05] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Darkhotel Offers Yet Another Reason Not to Use Hotel Wi-Fi - http://sylnt.us - forgot-to-put-the-key-in-the-switch
[03:32:43] <Ethanol-fueled> Wanna try some psiloscybes again
[03:33:04] <SirFinkus> tis the season
[03:33:36] <Ethanol-fueled> Yeah, just go out into the desert, get all introspective on some shrooms
[03:34:14] <Ethanol-fueled> This is the real O.G. shit here:
[03:34:14] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[03:34:15] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Ayahuasca
[03:34:49] <Ethanol-fueled> there are underground meetings where you pay like 100-200 bucks and take it with a shaman chanting and everything.
[03:34:58] <SirFinkus> one year I found a rather large flush of psilocybe cyanescens
[03:35:30] <SirFinkus> they're everywhere in the PNW
[03:36:15] <SirFinkus> it's kind of strange that they call it Ayahuasca, considering that's just the catalyst
[03:36:34] <SirFinkus> the DMT comes in the stuff they mix with it, Ayahuasca is just a MAOI
[03:38:06] <SirFinkus> DMT is fairly easy to extract using common off the shelf chemicals
[03:41:13] * Ethanol-fueled snorts a fat gagger of nutmeg
[03:42:38] <SirFinkus> nutmeg is a deliriant, different stuff, also fairly unpleasant from what I've read
[03:43:59] <Ethanol-fueled> Yeah, I wouldn't do that. It's like when you're a kid desperate to get high and willing to do things like smoke tea or the backyard mint.
[03:44:50] <SirFinkus> Benadryl is another fun one, people almost universally report seeing spiders
[03:46:44] <Ethanol-fueled> diggin' dat /gif on the front page of Drudge Report.
[03:47:18] <Ethanol-fueled> Is kinda worrisome though...why Google is gettin' into shit like that. I wonder how long it will be before they're a card-carrying member of the military-industrial complex.
[03:47:58] <Ethanol-fueled> Though humanoid robots are still clumsy and no good power-sources exist to make them a credible threat
[03:48:12] <Ethanol-fueled> just imagine being a native in the Amazon or some shit and seeing one of those.
[03:48:35] <SirFinkus> that general dynamics 4 legged one is terrifying
[03:48:52] <Ethanol-fueled> Oh yeah, that thing scares the fuck out of me.
[03:49:05] <SirFinkus> err, boston dynamics
[03:49:08] <Ethanol-fueled> now imagine THAT motherfucker charging at you
[03:49:34] <SirFinkus> it's got that sound, and weird uncanny valley animal like movement
[03:49:44] <Ethanol-fueled> That's the shit of nightmares from dystopic post-holocaust movies
[03:51:31] <Ethanol-fueled> The humanoid would probably tip over after taking a jump-kick...but not the Boston Dynamics one. They could put spikes or horns on it and you'd be fucked if it charged you
[03:52:04] <Ethanol-fueled> Especially if the designers knew that feral pics instinctively disembowel and can learn how to hamstring.
[03:52:11] <SirFinkus> it's like something out of a Beksinski painting
[03:52:35] <Ethanol-fueled> feral pigs, not pics
[03:53:20] <Ethanol-fueled> Whoa, that is some seriously awesome shit. Never seen his art before now
[03:53:52] <Ethanol-fueled> Like if Salvador Dali would have been forced to kill his own family in his childhood or something, hahah
[03:54:04] <SirFinkus> yeah, he's awesome
[03:54:13] <SirFinkus> trying to find the specific one
[03:56:33] <Ethanol-fueled> I think a lot of the art in Pink Floyd's Wall was inspired by his art
[03:59:14] <SirFinkus> he also took pictures of fat women with cords tied around them
[03:59:41] <SirFinkus> http://imgur.com
[03:59:41] <NetCraft> ^ 03imgur: the simple image sharer
[03:59:47] <SirFinkus> there are quite a few that are like that
[04:00:06] <SirFinkus> the robot I mean
[04:00:26] <Ethanol-fueled> Haha, man, that's fucked.
[04:03:07] <SirFinkus> henry darger is another fun one, he was absolutely batshit insane, wrote a 15k page book about little girls with penises fighting some kind of terrible war against child slavery
[04:03:17] <SirFinkus> titled: The Story of the Vivian Girls, in What is Known as the Realms of the Unreal, of the Glandeco-Angelinian War Storm Caused by the Child Slave Rebellion
[04:03:27] <Konomi> well that's some good nigtmare material there
[04:04:42] <SirFinkus> he cut out stuff from magazines and traced them for much of his art
[04:05:09] <Ethanol-fueled> Hahah, nice.
[04:05:54] <SirFinkus> http://www.escapeintolife.com
[04:06:42] <SirFinkus> http://www.mysteriousexhortations.com etc
[04:07:20] <Konomi> dinosaur art >.>
[04:07:22] <Ethanol-fueled> Hahah, Olde Asian-influenced, for sure.
[04:08:26] <SirFinkus> naw Konomi, he was a genius
[04:08:35] <SirFinkus> a batshit crazy one, but damn
[04:08:43] <Ethanol-fueled> What do you like, Konami? Anime shite?
[04:09:12] <SirFinkus> if an artist isn't at least a little crazy, he probably isn't any good
[04:09:28] <Ethanol-fueled> You're talking to a dude who not only had a woman paint him a pic with her menstrual blood, but framed it and took it to work explaining to everybody what it was.
[04:09:39] * Ethanol-fueled kicks self for not still having that painting :(
[04:10:03] <Konomi> I like anime I dont like shite however
[04:10:40] <Ethanol-fueled> The crazier the artist, the better.
[04:10:42] <Konomi> though I haven't really watched any for a few years
[04:10:54] <Ethanol-fueled> Especially if their art violates health laws.
[04:10:58] <Konomi> I think the last one was heavens notepad
[04:11:11] <Konomi> yeah people were crazier back then
[04:11:14] <Konomi> they are still crazy
[04:11:20] <Konomi> I'd prefer to be born 1000 years in the future
[04:11:25] <SirFinkus> my batshit crazy uncle composed tons of songs, they're just sitting in boxes in my grandmother's basement
[04:11:27] <chromas> Should do a reboot of that: heavens wordpad: now with ribbons
[04:11:27] <Konomi> people might be more tolerable then
[04:11:29] <SirFinkus> they're probably good
[04:11:40] <Ethanol-fueled> You should publish 'em, Finkus
[04:11:52] <Konomi> chromas: the show was actually extremely realistic to a degree
[04:12:01] <SirFinkus> I'm kind of working on that, but it's a lot of work to put together
[04:12:07] <Konomi> the violence was a bit unerving but the story was good
[04:12:54] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, that looks pretty light on the controversy.
[04:12:54] <chromas> violence++ # it's like xml
[04:12:55] <Bender> karma - violence: 2
[04:13:03] <SirFinkus> Darger's stuff reminds me most of the Voynich manuscript
[04:13:11] <Konomi> no one said it was controversial
[04:13:15] <Konomi> it just felt authentic
[04:13:36] <Ethanol-fueled> violence++
[04:13:38] <Bender> karma - violence: 3
[04:13:42] <Ethanol-fueled> (ultra violence)++
[04:13:42] <Bender> karma - (ultra violence): 1
[04:13:57] <Konomi> \nescape\nmonekys++
[04:14:07] <Konomi> Bender doesn't like hehe
[04:14:15] <Konomi> \000escape\000monekys++
[04:14:50] <Ethanol-fueled> Monkey violence is awesome
[04:14:59] <chromas> Bender only escapes when he feels like it
[04:15:02] <Konomi> monkey\000violence++
[04:15:06] <Konomi> monkey\\000violence++
[04:15:09] <Konomi> boo ;p
[04:15:17] <chromas> putting in a null?
[04:15:33] <Konomi> yup
[04:15:34] <SirFinkus> http://en.wikipedia.org
[04:15:34] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Gombe Chimpanzee War
[04:15:37] <Konomi> worst character to handle in C
[04:15:38] <Konomi> ;p
[04:15:46] <chromas> null_terminated_strings--
[04:15:46] <Bender> karma - null_terminated_strings: -3
[04:15:51] <Konomi> I dodn't execpt any of the bots to be using c though
[04:15:58] <SirFinkus> I guess they were probably engaged in a lot of... Gorrilla warfar
[04:15:59] <SirFinkus> e
[04:16:04] <Ethanol-fueled> doing anything internet in c minus minus
[04:16:05] <chromas> I think they just don't escape anything
[04:16:08] <Konomi> oh ho ho ho you so funnnyyy
[04:16:23] <chromas> Konomi: s/f/p/
[04:16:23] <sedctl> <chromas> <Konomi> oh ho ho ho you so punnnyyy
[04:16:30] <Konomi> works too i guess
[04:16:42] * SpallsHurgenson flings poo at SirFinkus
[04:16:59] <Ethanol-fueled> HAHAHAHAH
[04:17:00] <Konomi> I do say that's so uncivilised chap
[04:17:05] <SirFinkus> oh, someone added the war infobox
[04:17:20] <Ethanol-fueled> per the article. Strengths of the forces: 6 males, 3 females versus 8 males, 12 females
[04:17:56] <SirFinkus> someone with a stick up their ass removed the war infobox from the emu war page
[04:17:56] <Ethanol-fueled> Do ho HO!
[04:18:13] <Konomi> heh
[04:18:26] <Konomi> our military once failed to wipe out a bunch of emus
[04:18:28] <Konomi> amusing stuff
[04:18:37] <SirFinkus> emus are disgusting
[04:18:43] <Konomi> https://en.wikipedia.org
[04:18:44] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Emu War
[04:18:51] <juggs> ha - I read about the emu wars - funny stuff
[04:18:55] <SirFinkus> there's a farm near my house, it stinks to high heaven
[04:19:25] <juggs> the emus were not as daft as the military had assumed
[04:19:33] <Ethanol-fueled> SirFinkus, what do they sell, eggs?
[04:19:36] <Ethanol-fueled> Down?
[04:19:55] <juggs> emu meat I hope
[04:20:00] <SirFinkus> not sure, they may even just be pets
[04:20:08] <Ethanol-fueled> MEAT?! in the pacific northwest?!
[04:20:25] <juggs> no idea why that would be alarming
[04:20:32] * Ethanol-fueled wants me a drumstick in a tub of buffalo sauces
[04:20:47] <SirFinkus> it backs right up to a bike path I use frequently
[04:20:51] <juggs> big damn tub if it's an emu drumstick
[04:21:00] <SirFinkus> it's worse than pigs or cows
[04:21:12] <Ethanol-fueled> nothing's worse than pigs.
[04:21:18] <SirFinkus> emus are
[04:21:26] <SirFinkus> I assure you
[04:21:51] <Ethanol-fueled> Emu farms are much smaller-time operations than the big pig farms are though
[04:21:54] <SirFinkus> pigs just smell like shit, this is like a mix of shit and sulfur and vomit
[04:22:16] <SirFinkus> I'm comparing 2 pretty small operations
[04:22:25] <SirFinkus> animal to animal, emus smell worse
[04:22:35] <Konomi> #FarmingwithSoylent
[04:22:53] <SirFinkus> oh, they also have that ferret smell too
[04:24:09] <Konomi> note to self sub minion will be ferrets main minions will be howler monkeys
[04:24:18] <Ethanol-fueled> Huh. I think that's because I have my smell calibrated with North Carolina and the Imperial valley, both of which stink like pig shit.
[04:24:51] <Ethanol-fueled> I'd farm with soylent. Though I'd be the weenie who does vegatables and fish.
[04:25:19] <SirFinkus> I'll do the other plants and funguses
[04:25:25] <SirFinkus> for research purposes of course
[04:26:41] <Konomi> while I eat meat I could never kill stuff so I'd have to go veg' with a lack of third party to deligate to
[04:27:17] <SirFinkus> I personally think everyone who eats meat should be aware of and comfortable with where it comes from
[04:27:30] <SirFinkus> oh, another crazy genius, Temple Grandin
[04:27:34] <SirFinkus> she's a slaughterhouse savant
[04:28:07] <Konomi> oh I'm aware idk about comfortable
[04:28:11] <SirFinkus> has a bunch of very interesting videos on youtube about slaughterhouse design
[04:28:30] <Konomi> I figure in the future we'll just grow meat so the issue will no longer slightly tug at my morals
[04:28:45] <Ethanol-fueled> I dated a lady who had a degree in animal science and had her arms up the orifices of large animals.
[04:29:26] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com warning, has some pictures of animals being slaughtered
[04:29:27] <Konomi> how long did that dating status last ;p
[04:29:27] <ciri> how how brown cow
[04:29:27] <NetCraft> ^ 03Design of Cattle Stun Boxes and Conveyor Restrainers - YouTube
[04:29:27] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, I like how some indigenous tribes do kills. They pray to the four cardinal directions and make a little ceremony venerating the animal
[04:29:33] <SirFinkus> ciri--
[04:29:33] <Bender> karma - ciri: -14
[04:29:48] <Konomi> comendable but far too out dated for my interest
[04:29:55] <Ethanol-fueled> Aw, fug, ain't watchin' no kills.
[04:30:24] <Ethanol-fueled> Industrialized slaughterhouses are nasty.
[04:30:25] <SirFinkus> she's an expert on tricking cows into getting slaughtered
[04:30:53] <Konomi> just walk over this here spike pitt mr cow
[04:30:55] <Konomi> erm
[04:31:00] <Konomi> ms cow mr cow wouldn't make much sense
[04:31:10] <SirFinkus> pretty much
[04:31:15] <Konomi> wait really?
[04:31:18] <SirFinkus> more like "walk towards the light"
[04:31:25] <Ethanol-fueled> Hey, if they could grow steaks from stem cells, that'd be great.
[04:31:26] <Konomi> that's kinda sick
[04:31:37] <Konomi> Ethanol-fueled: they can it's just too expensive
[04:31:49] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi - and the meat looks like a baseball.
[04:32:05] <Konomi> https://en.wikipedia.org
[04:32:06] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03In vitro meat
[04:33:47] <Konomi> the irony is if we can make meat cheaply this way cheaper than say cows etc
[04:33:51] <Konomi> they'll be less of them one day
[04:33:58] <Konomi> just like how horses declined after we had cars
[04:34:18] <Konomi> so um animal rights is kinda weird in a large picture time line perspective
[04:34:25] <Ethanol-fueled> That's why we need to have habitats where wild horses and bovines can kick it
[04:34:59] <Ethanol-fueled> But how much of that is artificial? If animals were brought to land and could not survive on their own there, well, then maybe they just shouldn't be there.
[04:35:42] <Ethanol-fueled> If anything, we should breed back all those buffalo we exterminated and eat them instead. Man, buffalo burgers are delicious.
[04:35:55] <Ethanol-fueled> Not to mention healthier
[04:36:01] <Konomi> hmm not sure buffalo would do too well in australia though
[04:36:09] <Ethanol-fueled> Yank here.
[04:36:16] <Konomi> is that like a sign
[04:36:18] <Konomi> yank here
[04:36:18] <Konomi> ;p
[04:36:28] <SirFinkus> buffalo++
[04:36:28] <Bender> karma - buffalo: 1
[04:36:32] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, do you want to see an image of my peness?
[04:36:39] <SirFinkus> little healthier than beef too
[04:37:01] <chromas> context++
[04:37:01] <Bender> karma - context: 1
[04:37:10] <Ethanol-fueled> Regardless of whether you do or don't, I will not post it here. I'm not drunk enough to be banned :)
[04:37:13] <Konomi> seen one dick seen them all
[04:37:28] <Ethanol-fueled> There are bigger, better ones anyway.
[04:37:35] <Konomi> also I'm spoken for so ;p
[04:37:53] <Konomi> afk getting dishes out of the way
[04:38:18] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus, we need to bring back all those healthy indigenous animals, breeding them on small farms with no antibiotics.
[04:38:49] <Ethanol-fueled> And eat wild turkey while drinking Wild Turkey
[04:39:04] * SirFinkus prefers scotch
[04:39:17] <Ethanol-fueled> Ugh, I never understood you scotch people.
[04:39:30] <Ethanol-fueled> It's like eating chitlins and being proud of it.
[04:39:31] <juggs> then you don't understand scotch
[04:39:55] <SirFinkus> it's kind of an acquired taste
[04:40:01] <SirFinkus> and you gotta sip it slowly
[04:40:11] <SirFinkus> if you drink it too quickly, it tastes like shit
[04:40:14] <chromas> that's what makes it classy
[04:40:20] <juggs> it's also incredibly varied. What have you tried ef?
[04:40:35] <Ethanol-fueled> One of my best friends is prefers scotch and orders it ON THE ROCKS. Putting ice in liquor?
[04:40:47] <SirFinkus> I'll pour a glass and enjoy it neat over like an hour
[04:41:03] <SirFinkus> the only thing that should go in scotch is a little bit of water
[04:41:09] <SirFinkus> depending on the scotch
[04:41:10] <juggs> yah - it's a sippy drink not a gluggy drink
[04:41:11] <Ethanol-fueled> All the scotch I have tried I do not like. And I've had shit Dewar's all the way up to a 15 year-aged single-malt.
[04:41:34] <SirFinkus> I like old pultney
[04:41:49] <Ethanol-fueled> It's the drink of an old, angry, crusty man...with the "crusty" being the only cool part.
[04:42:05] <juggs> Yah, but which single malts ef? They vary massively.
[04:42:08] <SirFinkus> oh, also sipping a scotch along with a good stout is godly
[04:42:43] <Ethanol-fueled> juggs: admittedly not much.
[04:43:29] <juggs> I find some of the island malts to be way too medicinal and peaty for my tastes, but others swear by them.
[04:43:54] <SirFinkus> speyside ones can be downright sweet
[04:43:59] <Ethanol-fueled> All this talk about drink is driving me to the drink. It's time for a walk to the licka sto'
[04:44:16] <Ethanol-fueled> see y'all in fitteen or so minutes.
[04:44:28] <SirFinkus> it's so expensive though, I can't drink it very often
[04:44:50] * Ethanol-fueled -!- has left[k-lined]
[04:44:53] <juggs> My preference is lighter and dry with scotch.
[04:45:18] <juggs> But I'm a scotch lightweight :D
[04:48:09] <Konomi> iced_coffee++
[04:48:09] <Bender> karma - iced_coffee: 10
[04:48:13] <Konomi> ohh more fans
[04:49:05] <Konomi> I don't drink alcohol so ;p
[04:49:15] <juggs> nick, you were right - fresh psilocybe mushrooms are illegal to possess now in the UK - brought in with the 2005 Drugs Act. Prior to that it was only an offence to process, dry or sell processed - fresh was fine legally. Shows how long it's been since I went shroom picking :)
[04:49:17] <Konomi> with the exception of sweet cider but hardly ever see it
[04:50:31] <Konomi> in fact a lot of spirits smell/taste like bugs to me
[04:51:52] <juggs> do you sniff/taste bugs a lot? Other than shield bugs, I've not noted any odours from insects.
[04:52:54] <Konomi> nope
[04:53:00] <Konomi> it just reminds me of how a bug might smell
[04:55:05] <Konomi> some bugs make weird smells to make things go away and leave them alone and most alcohol that is spirit based reminds me of a smell similar to that ;p
[04:55:35] <Konomi> speically cheap bourbon
[04:59:33] <SirFinkus> I drink more beer than anything
[04:59:40] <SirFinkus> and mostly because it's delicious
[04:59:51] <SirFinkus> getting drunk is just a bonus
[05:00:16] <juggs> ya, shield bugs here are what the US call stink bugs. They don't smell unless you piss them off. Get them in the house during autumn, they're perfectly happy to be handled and put back outside without creating a stink as long as you don't try and squish them. Cute lil things.
[05:00:44] <Konomi> rather bug smell than beer smell :_;
[05:00:51] <Ethanol-fueled> how the hell do you get stink bugs in your pad, juggs?
[05:00:52] <ciri> how how brown cow
[05:01:01] <SirFinkus> but there are so many different types of beer
[05:01:10] <Ethanol-fueled> I live in a shit pad riddled full of holes and don't get 'em
[05:01:11] <Konomi> SirFinkus: I haven't smelt a nice one yet ;p
[05:01:31] <Ethanol-fueled> You know what comes out when you step on a stink-bug? Banannas!
[05:01:37] <SirFinkus> have you sniffed a good oatmeal stout? smells like coffee
[05:01:53] <Konomi> http://vimeo.com totally haven't watched this 100000 times
[05:01:53] <NetCraft> ^ 03DIE YOUNG- Fan Animated on Vimeo
[05:02:09] <juggs> leave the windows open EF - same with spiders this time of year... they come in looking for a nook to hibernate in. I just trap them and put them back outside.
[05:02:16] <Konomi> no fly wire?
[05:02:31] <SirFinkus> how apropos
[05:02:31] <ciri> how how brown cow
[05:02:31] * Ethanol-fueled has a big problem with Daddy longlegs spides in his pad
[05:02:35] * SirFinkus is listening to Black Sabbath — Die Young, from the album Heaven And Hell
[05:02:36] <Ethanol-fueled> even in the fucking shower
[05:02:49] * juggs approves SirFinkus choice of music
[05:02:50] <SirFinkus> those fuckers love showers for some reason
[05:03:04] <SirFinkus> along with craneflies in the summer
[05:03:13] <Konomi> I have no black sabbath in my music collection it seems
[05:03:16] <juggs> Konomi, no - no fly wires here, we simply don't have the insect density to justify it
[05:03:23] <SirFinkus> I have one in my room right now guarding a menacing looking egg sack
[05:03:23] <Konomi> http://research.google.com
[05:03:24] <NetCraft> ^ 03Music Timeline
[05:03:25] <Konomi> also this is fun
[05:03:38] <Konomi> jazz much popular so forgotten
[05:03:40] <SirFinkus> you're a terrible person konomi, rectify that
[05:03:54] <Ethanol-fueled> I bet buzzard has it pretty bad wher he lives, those fucking bugs out there are prehistoric-sized
[05:03:55] <juggs> SirFinkus, I thought daddy long legs were crane flies... do enlighten me
[05:04:05] <SirFinkus> crane flies have wings
[05:04:06] <Konomi> SirFinkus: it's okay I have tons of Kesha to make up for it \o/
[05:04:10] <SirFinkus> they look pretty similar
[05:04:10] * Konomi runs
[05:04:20] * SirFinkus chases
[05:04:25] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[05:04:26] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Opiliones
[05:04:33] <Ethanol-fueled> juggs - also known as "harvestmen"
[05:05:15] <SirFinkus> http://en.wikipedia.org
[05:05:16] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Crane fly
[05:05:20] <Konomi> they look cute
[05:05:46] <Konomi> crane fly sounds bad
[05:06:21] <SirFinkus> they look like huge mosquitos
[05:06:36] <Ethanol-fueled> ugh, fucking disgusting
[05:06:41] <Ethanol-fueled> I hate bugs with large abdomens
[05:06:54] <SirFinkus> I like the daddy long legs
[05:06:55] <juggs> SirFinkus, what we term daddy long legs here have wings... at least I presume they have wings as they manage to fly... albeit incompetently. Trapping and evicting the buggers is somewhat tricky as they have haphazard flight and their legs are far too easily accidentally detached. That makes me a sad panda when I snag a leg escorting one of them out of my abode.
[05:06:58] <SirFinkus> they don7t bothy me
[05:07:08] <Konomi> bug bigotry!
[05:07:10] <SirFinkus> don't bother me
[05:07:19] <Ethanol-fueled> No bug is uglier than this bug:
[05:07:19] <SirFinkus> hmm, must be a regional difference
[05:07:35] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[05:07:35] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Jerusalem cricket
[05:07:57] * Konomi np: Electric Six - Gay Bar (Live) - Rock - 2012.flac :: 26M :: DeaDBeef 0.6.2
[05:07:59] <Ethanol-fueled> except for maybe this one:
[05:08:00] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[05:08:00] <Konomi> thehe
[05:08:00] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Solifugae
[05:08:15] <Konomi> that one is a little creepy looking
[05:08:18] <SirFinkus> http://i.livescience.com
[05:08:25] <SirFinkus> do I win?
[05:08:30] <Konomi> okay second one definitly nightmare material
[05:08:40] <Ethanol-fueled> finkus, easily by size
[05:08:46] <Ethanol-fueled> ain't that the big birdeater or whatnot?
[05:08:59] <SirFinkus> yep
[05:09:00] <juggs> ahh yeh - looked at your wiki links... we call crane flies daddy long legs. Although the wiki for Opiliones states the opposite :/
[05:09:15] <Konomi> so hairy
[05:09:34] <SirFinkus> that thing could eat many household pets
[05:11:19] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Appeals Court Acquitted 6 Italian Scientists Convicted over 2009 Earthquake Deaths - http://sylnt.us - natural-disaster-scapegoat
[05:11:20] <exec> https://www.youtube.com
[05:11:38] <Ethanol-fueled> HAHAHAH, italians are so funny.
[05:13:37] <juggs> I don't mind hunter spiders prowling around my place, it's the web building brigade that annoy me indoors simply because I have to clean up after them. I have a couple of sprinters (as I call them for their ability to leg it across a room in a second or so) that have been knocking about the place for years. They just appear, run like hell, then vanish again under some furniture. Leggy, hairy buggers but they don't leave webs all over
[05:16:47] <Konomi> hate feeling clingy and my SO doesn't happen to be around atm >.<
[05:17:43] <chromas> juggs: their web sites are probably hidden services; check your onions
[05:17:55] -!- pbnjoe has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
[05:19:07] <Konomi> how do you convict people for a natural disaster...
[05:19:07] <ciri> doing good, and you?
[05:19:11] <Konomi> ciri--
[05:19:11] <Bender> karma - ciri: -15
[05:19:39] <chromas> that would've been a good time for ciri's "very carefully and then some"
[05:22:56] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[05:22:56] <Bender> karma - coffee: 905
[05:22:57] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[05:22:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> JamesNZ-- overzealous coffee moderation detected, enchance your calm.
[05:22:57] <Bender> karma - coffee: 904
[05:22:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[05:22:57] <Bender> karma - jamesnz: -15
[05:22:58] <Bender> karma - coffee: 905
[05:23:04] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[05:23:04] <Bender> karma - coffee: 904
[05:23:41] <Konomi> "enchance"
[05:23:46] <Ethanol-fueled> Buzzard, go easy on james. He goes to meetings for his coffee addiction, and when the new guys are all gone, he admits to sucking dick for it.
[05:23:47] <Konomi> TheMightyBuzzard: it's enhance ;p
[05:27:06] <SirFinkus> beer++
[05:27:06] <Bender> karma - beer: 21
[05:28:33] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[05:28:33] <Bender> karma - coffee: 903
[05:28:50] <Konomi> you're never going to win rebel scum give it up \o/
[05:29:10] <JamesNZ> I shall never surrender!
[05:29:24] <SirFinkus> lets find common ground (har har)
[05:29:33] <SirFinkus> caffeine++
[05:29:33] <Bender> karma - caffeine: 39
[05:29:37] <chromas> beverage++
[05:29:38] <Bender> karma - beverage: 3
[05:29:52] <Konomi> already been voiting up caffeine ;_;
[05:29:57] <Konomi> voting*
[05:32:22] <Konomi> https://securelist.com
[05:32:23] <NetCraft> ^ 03The Darkhotel APT - Securelist
[05:32:32] <Konomi> securelist has convinced me
[05:32:40] <SirFinkus> what's your poison tonight Ethanol-fueled?
[05:32:47] <Konomi> all hackers have tattoos
[05:33:02] * juggs cues up Black Sabbath - Heaven & Hell - I blame SirFinkus
[05:33:20] <SirFinkus> don't blame me, thank me
[05:33:37] * SirFinkus can't decide between Dio and Ozzy
[05:33:45] <SirFinkus> both are amazing, but different
[05:33:54] <juggs> just enjoying the solo in Neon Knights as I type :D
[05:34:07] <SirFinkus> Iommi++
[05:34:07] <Bender> karma - iommi: 1
[05:34:19] <SirFinkus> that's a safe bet I suppose
[05:34:35] <Konomi> apparently I need to get some tattoos to live up to the image now
[05:35:39] <SirFinkus> that kind of music is enjoying a comeback too
[05:36:01] <juggs> different eras of sabbath - I see no reason to choose between dio and ozzy phases. Likewise both their solo stuff outside has been mostly good.
[05:36:33] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com
[05:36:33] <NetCraft> ^ 03Uncle Acid & the Deadbeats "I'll Cut You Down" (OFFICIAL) - YouTube
[05:36:35] <Konomi> if I am to believe googles music timeline
[05:36:41] <Ethanol-fueled> cuz Ozzy, like Frank Zappa, knew that having stud musicians made all the difference.
[05:36:50] <Konomi> indie alternative rock and hip hop are the popular genres
[05:37:13] <SirFinkus> I saw your chart, and I consider it bullshit
[05:37:21] <Konomi> it isn't my chart it's googles chart ;p
[05:37:31] <SirFinkus> red hot chili peppers was on it under indie/alternative
[05:37:36] <SirFinkus> they have a ride at disneyland
[05:37:50] <SirFinkus> not to mention u2
[05:38:06] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus, it seems we have a fifth-columnist here.
[05:38:12] -!- pbnjoe [pbnjoe!~pbnjoe@Soylent/Users/313/pbnjoe] has joined #Soylent
[05:38:12] <Konomi> SirFinkus: be careful the first two coloumns only show popularity until you click a genre
[05:38:16] <Ethanol-fueled> point me to this chart of which you speal.
[05:38:17] <Konomi> after clickign alternative/indie
[05:38:18] <Ethanol-fueled> speak.
[05:38:41] <SirFinkus> http://research.google.com
[05:38:42] <NetCraft> ^ 03Music Timeline
[05:38:49] <SirFinkus> click indie/alternative
[05:38:58] <Konomi> https://en.wikipedia.org
[05:38:59] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Stadium Arcadium
[05:39:09] <juggs> I associate ozzy with the slower, broody early days of sabbath - the dio days were less dark and higher energy. It's all subjective of course, for some only early sabbath is "real" sabbath. I can't find the energy for such zealotry
[05:39:29] <SirFinkus> all of that is extremely mainstream among those who think they have eclectic music tastes
[05:40:02] <Ethanol-fueled> Well, shit, Finkus, that doesn't even work at all in my browser.
[05:40:19] <Ethanol-fueled> Probably some crap revisionist history by Jewgle
[05:40:21] <SirFinkus> pretty sure apple uses pearl jam and/or cold play during all of their press events
[05:40:32] <SirFinkus> or u2
[05:40:52] <Konomi> SirFinkus: it got put under alterantive cause the alternative takes precidence over the rock part
[05:41:01] <Konomi> alternative rock is more alternative than it is rock
[05:41:29] <Ethanol-fueled> alternative, like "indie," once actually had a specific meaning.
[05:41:30] <Konomi> alternative rock stylistic origins are listed as punk rock post punk new wave and hardcore punk under wikipedia
[05:41:35] <Konomi> punk is considered alternative over rock
[05:41:57] <Konomi> that is why it's in the alternative section and not the rock section
[05:41:59] <Ethanol-fueled> Now, the revisionists have coopted music history...and that's why, we must bring dangerous music to the forefront:
[05:42:10] <Ethanol-fueled> GG allin. vaginal Jesus. Johnny Rebel.
[05:42:26] <Ethanol-fueled> Hell, N.W.A. and Too $hort.
[05:42:32] <juggs> "genres" need to die in the same bucket as "monster cables" - it's fapping over nothing. Just listen to what you like how you like to hear it, music is not an identity.
[05:42:43] <Konomi> I like gernes actually
[05:42:50] <SirFinkus> wtf is "alternative" supposed to mean anyway
[05:42:56] <Konomi> I admit they're a mess but I am in certan moods and want certain types of music to listen too
[05:42:59] <Konomi> genre helps a lot with that
[05:43:22] <SirFinkus> almost as bullshit as the "indie" "genre"
[05:43:36] <Konomi> page I linked to
[05:43:40] <Konomi> first two sentences
[05:43:41] <Konomi> Alternative rock (also called alternative music, alt-rock or simply alternative) is a genre of rock music that emerged from the independent music underground of the 1980s and became widely popular by the 1990s. The 'alternative' definition refers to the genre's distinction from mainstream rock music, expressed primarily in a distorted guitar sound, subversive and/or transgressive lyrics and generally a nonchalant, defiant attitude.
[05:44:00] <Konomi> alternative rock is more pouty in other words!
[05:44:09] <Konomi> with modified guitar sound ;p
[05:44:19] <SirFinkus> well, rock is pouty anyway
[05:44:27] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus - unlike most bullshit labels, "indie" meant something. It meant that the music was signed by an independent label, which meant that it was somewhat unique and not the whiny effeminiate crypto-Christian bullshit so-called "indie" music is today.
[05:44:38] <juggs> SirFinkus, "alternative" means some bragging BS. "Indie" should refer to independent labels but is commonly misused.
[05:44:46] <Konomi> Ethanol-fueled: actually christian has it's own genre section
[05:44:53] <Konomi> and probably overrides the indie specification
[05:45:03] <SirFinkus> it's just whiny effeminate bullshit instead of whiny effeminate christian bullshit
[05:45:11] <juggs> lol
[05:45:30] <SirFinkus> and why is the whether or not they're signed to a label important to what kind of music they make?
[05:45:33] <juggs> systemd-genred we so need this :D
[05:45:50] <juggs> One genre system to bind them
[05:45:56] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, one of my good friends years ago bought into Christian rock, and told me all about the different sub-genres of it, then his fellow churchmate fucked his girlfriend he met in church and all was cast to the wayside to listen to Iron Maiden.
[05:46:16] <Konomi> I don't care about subjective examples ;p
[05:46:17] <Ethanol-fueled> Fucking sanctimonious religious idiots....and I fear Soylent News is run by them.
[05:46:26] <juggs> o.O
[05:46:26] <Konomi> lol
[05:46:27] <ciri> it's not that funny :)
[05:46:33] <Konomi> ciri--
[05:46:33] <Bender> karma - ciri: -16
[05:46:33] <SirFinkus> it reeks of "oh, they're not signed yet so I have better taste in music than you because I discovered them first" elitism
[05:46:38] <Konomi> just go home ciri
[05:46:59] <Konomi> juggs is definitly christian you can tell about his crusade against systemd!
[05:47:01] * Konomi runs for it
[05:47:02] <juggs> SirFinkus, spot on. As I said - bragging rights.
[05:47:07] <juggs> lol
[05:47:08] <ciri> hahaha
[05:47:12] <Konomi> ciri--
[05:47:12] <Bender> karma - ciri: -17
[05:47:16] <Konomi> hole shovel off you go ciri
[05:47:39] <JamesNZ> ciri++ # poor ciri
[05:47:39] <Bender> karma - ciri: -16
[05:47:51] <SirFinkus> even the label "alternative" implies something outside the mainstream, which doesn't apply to any of these bands
[05:47:52] <juggs> Konomi, I have no crusade against systemd, I was merely playing inquisitor antagonist last night.
[05:48:18] <SirFinkus> fucking nirvana? "alternative?"
[05:48:25] <Konomi> sorry I don't listen to christian sympathises Ethanol-fueled has showed me the light
[05:48:36] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus - the point I was trying to make is that many of those labels were originally were alternatives, but were coopted as a buzzword by maintreamists.
[05:48:44] <SirFinkus> heard of skillet?
[05:48:48] <Ethanol-fueled> Alternative. Grunge. Indie.
[05:48:48] <SirFinkus> their lyrics are hilarious
[05:49:05] <Konomi> SirFinkus: nirvana is definitly alternative rock...
[05:49:09] <Ethanol-fueled> All words with meaning, all co-opted and cheapened.
[05:49:16] <SirFinkus> alternative to what?
[05:49:26] <Konomi> to rock.
[05:49:28] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com
[05:49:29] <Konomi> alternative.
[05:49:29] <NetCraft> ^ 03Skillet - The Thirst Is Taking Over (Lyrics) - YouTube
[05:49:30] <Konomi> rock.
[05:49:34] <SirFinkus> the lyrics are hilarious
[05:49:40] <SirFinkus> but it really isn't
[05:49:52] <juggs> alternative to not using a shotgun inappropriately?
[05:50:17] <SirFinkus> the moment they have mainstream appeal, the label becomes meaningless
[05:50:29] <Konomi> ac dc would be classic rock
[05:50:34] <SirFinkus> GG Alin? that could be considered alternative
[05:50:35] <Konomi> nirvana would be alternative rock
[05:50:53] <Konomi> the difference in the listening base of those two should be really freaking obvious
[05:50:54] -!- SpallsHurgenson has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de]
[05:51:18] <SirFinkus> why a genres determined by the listening base rather than the style of music?
[05:51:39] <Ethanol-fueled> GG allin would be quite the alternative nowadays, but he died unceramoniously of a heroin overdose and is now safely relagated to the allusions of edgy teenagers.
[05:51:49] <Konomi> the style is different that's why they have different fan bases
[05:51:59] <Konomi> you wouldn't get nirvana past my step dad as rock any freaking day for example
[05:52:04] <juggs> da fuq? I'd say the correlation of ac/dc listeners to nirvana listeners is pretty damn high IME.
[05:52:05] <Ethanol-fueled> Which makes me sad, because one of GG's core tenets was to "make rock an roll dangerous again"
[05:52:21] <Ethanol-fueled> as Elvis had made is dangerous with his pelvic swing
[05:52:25] <SirFinkus> it really isn't, nirvana is pretty conventional rock
[05:52:41] <SirFinkus> just different effects and lyrical themes
[05:53:04] <Konomi> which earns it categorisation into a sub genre
[05:53:07] <SirFinkus> kind of brought rock back to its misanthropic roots out of the hair metal of the 80s
[05:53:20] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus, dumber, really.
[05:54:09] <Ethanol-fueled> the "soft-hard" dynamic for which Nirvana was famous for "popularizing" was a logical extension of Poison power-ballads.
[05:54:17] <SirFinkus> I'm a fan of a band started by the guy who gave Cobain the shotgun
[05:54:25] <Ethanol-fueled> Or, hell, Metallica's "fade to black"
[05:54:40] <SirFinkus> kind of my point, it wasn't revolutionary in any respect
[05:54:58] <Konomi> only has to varry it does not have to be revolutionary
[05:55:06] <juggs> hair metal was only a minor thing in its day anyway, there was plenty of other metal going on in tandem. Ach, ye gads, I'm not being drawn into this.
[05:55:35] <Ethanol-fueled> absoulutely not, Finkus. Only superficially to the degree that kids who were never exposed to good music prior to didn't know any better.
[05:55:35] <SirFinkus> but the choice of genre name betrays the motivations of those who claim to be fans of it
[05:56:01] <SirFinkus> it's a term made up by those who want to be seen as not following conventions
[05:57:38] <Ethanol-fueled> Good music must have power
[05:57:41] <Ethanol-fueled> musical power
[05:57:45] <Ethanol-fueled> lyrical power.
[05:57:51] <Ethanol-fueled> Something.
[05:58:23] <SirFinkus> I can find good things in nearly any song I hear, nirvana was pretty good at impact
[05:58:28] <Ethanol-fueled> Modern co-opting has mindless crypto-christian lyrics delivered by whiny effeminate voices.
[05:58:32] <SirFinkus> syncing the drums and guitars and vocals to hit you hard
[05:58:46] <SirFinkus> something that Sabbath were also masters of in their early days
[05:59:04] <Ethanol-fueled> There's no controversy. There's no "lets go fuck the prom queeen" or "lets get high"
[05:59:34] <Ethanol-fueled> It's all nowadays, "she's with another man" and "I'm just hanging around"
[06:00:46] <Ethanol-fueled> The fifth-columnist crypto-Christians and homosexual neo-liberals must be jettisoned out the exhaust port.
[06:01:11] <Konomi> I also have a very electic music collection
[06:01:18] <Ethanol-fueled> We don't want life to be safe. We want people who can tolerate some unsafety.
[06:01:30] <Konomi> eceletic*
[06:01:37] <SirFinkus> one more time
[06:01:54] <Konomi> thought I lean towards electronica by personal preference
[06:02:10] <Konomi> I'm not past listen to things like
[06:02:13] * Konomi np: Bob Marley - I Shot The Sheriff - Reggae - 1984.flac :: 108M :: DeaDBeef 0.6.2
[06:02:17] <juggs> music is art and some art should be challenging, exploring boundaries that make the viewer or listener question their beliefs. IMO. You the hell wants to sit in a darkened room having affirmations of their own mid played back at them? That's no way to expand the mind.
[06:02:18] * SirFinkus is listening to Uncle Acid and the Deadbeats — I'll Cut You Down, from the album Blood Lust
[06:03:30] <SirFinkus> my song is about cutting up women
[06:03:46] <juggs> If a piece of art disgusts, the converation should not be about banning it, the conversation should be around ~why~ it is found to be disgusting.
[06:04:24] <SirFinkus> I don't respect any artist that tries to be inoffensive
[06:04:28] <Ethanol-fueled> Hell yeah, Juggs/.
[06:04:49] <SirFinkus> I respect nirvana, since they seemed less concerned with that kind of stuff
[06:04:55] <Konomi> juggs tend to agree in general with that
[06:04:56] <SirFinkus> still don't like their music though
[06:05:08] <crutchy> coffee++
[06:05:08] <Bender> karma - coffee: 904
[06:05:09] <Konomi> I have three nirvana songs
[06:05:12] <Ethanol-fueled> that's what I like about Soylent News...
[06:05:24] <SirFinkus> its disgusting?
[06:05:31] <Konomi> it's ran by christians?
[06:05:32] <Konomi> ;p
[06:06:10] <crutchy> it smells like poo?
[06:06:15] <Ethanol-fueled> They at least understand that the good part about free speech is that you have to listen to shit you hate.
[06:06:28] <Konomi> actually I'd disagree with that
[06:06:44] <SirFinkus> I don't even mind christians, as long as they don't try to moderate their opinions to please an audience
[06:06:48] <Konomi> free speech is more like
[06:06:49] <Konomi> https://xkcd.com
[06:06:50] <Ethanol-fueled> I don't like the Christian part but it's better than being run by Jews like Slashdot is.
[06:06:50] <NetCraft> ^ 03xkcd: Free Speech
[06:07:32] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, I lambasted that cartoon for its mob mentality.
[06:07:43] <SirFinkus> that comic is bullshit, I think the benefits of free speech apply universally
[06:07:58] <Konomi> like the comic describes
[06:07:58] <SirFinkus> sites have the legal right to censor their users, but not the moral one
[06:08:05] <Konomi> free speech doesn't mean people have to listen to your crap
[06:08:07] <Konomi> just means you cna say it
[06:08:10] <Konomi> that is the whole point of it
[06:08:48] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, being able to speak freely is a hipster commodity. You censor users and they will leave.
[06:08:54] <SirFinkus> so that doesn't work as an argument for censorship
[06:09:07] <Konomi> it isn't an arguement for censorship
[06:09:14] <Konomi> censorship would be preventing you from talking AT ALL
[06:09:17] <SirFinkus> sure it is
[06:09:19] <Ethanol-fueled> Finkus -- unless you want a like-minded circle-jerk.
[06:09:26] <Konomi> censorship is not ignoring you or not listen to waht you say
[06:09:41] <crutchy> you can personally censor the bullshit using the score drop downy thingys
[06:09:47] <Konomi> yup
[06:09:50] <Ethanol-fueled> Yeah, really.
[06:09:52] <SirFinkus> what, couldn't parse that Konomi
[06:10:02] <Konomi> people filter out (OMG CENSOR I MEAN) what they listen to all the time
[06:10:21] <SirFinkus> that's different from a site censoring comments though
[06:10:31] <Ethanol-fueled> The point of Soylent news is that they built a better system than Slashfags did.
[06:10:36] <Konomi> sites are private platforms though they get to choose what they have on their shit
[06:10:51] <Konomi> you wouldn't expect to be able to stick a hige arse sign up on the front of someones house if they don't want it
[06:10:55] <SirFinkus> I can decide you're a jackass for example (not that I do), and ignore you on irc and on soylent
[06:11:01] <crutchy> Ethanol-fueled, its still lacking punch and pie
[06:11:07] <Konomi> I don't know why anyone would expect to be able to do the equivelent on someones web site
[06:11:11] <SirFinkus> but if the site bans you fro something you say, they are censoring my right to read it
[06:11:21] <Ethanol-fueled> why, crutchy? What improvements would you suggest?
[06:11:31] <SirFinkus> well, that's a property issue
[06:11:34] <Konomi> SirFinkus: you do not have a right to go to someones web site they put it up and allow you to
[06:11:42] <crutchy> more people will come if we have punch and pie
[06:11:53] <Ethanol-fueled> crutchy, so you want a circle-jerk.
[06:11:54] <SirFinkus> that's the distinction I'm trying to make Konomi
[06:11:59] <Ethanol-fueled> You want groupthink.
[06:12:10] <crutchy> nah. just punch and pie
[06:12:27] <SirFinkus> a site has the legal right to censor all they want, but I don't believe they have the moral right
[06:12:32] <Ethanol-fueled> Well, what are you waiting for? Refund me my 20 bucks, ban me for life, and invite a bunch of Mexicans and Indians!
[06:13:10] <Ethanol-fueled> problem solved! I'm too lazy to TOR just to troll a fledgeling startup, and I have other shit to do anyway.
[06:13:12] * crutchy isn't following the conversation very muchly
[06:13:22] <SirFinkus> and being able to censor what is posted on your own site is a form of free speech, as strange as it sounds
[06:13:23] <JamesNZ> ~gday crutchy
[06:13:24] * exec diabolically passes a bathtub of splodge to crutchy
[06:13:24] <Konomi> fortuantly you can choose if your 0s and 1s have the abstraction of a race on the internet
[06:13:30] <Ethanol-fueled> I know at least some of you are kneading your dicks to the notion.
[06:13:35] <Konomi> and you don't have to put that foward if you don't want to ;p
[06:13:43] <juggs> It's the distinction between having an open discussion forum whereby people can apply their own filters vs having a moderated echo chamber that aligns to your world view ready rolled. I prefer the former. Some people seem uncormfortable hearing views that do not align with their own for some reason.
[06:14:06] <Konomi> echo chambers have always existed though
[06:14:10] <Konomi> they're the status quo normality
[06:14:15] <Konomi> and have been forever
[06:14:16] <SirFinkus> well, that's deeply ingrained juggs
[06:14:22] <crutchy> reddit
[06:14:24] <Konomi> people just like using new words to point them out
[06:14:27] <Konomi> circlejerk for example
[06:14:36] <Konomi> is just a negative conitation for group of people
[06:14:48] <Konomi> if we could construct them into entities
[06:14:51] <SirFinkus> I really do try to read opinions from people I disagree with, but it hurts
[06:14:56] <SirFinkus> for lack of a better word
[06:15:05] <Ethanol-fueled> juggs, that was the compliment I gave, that there are two filters.
[06:15:08] <juggs> "fuck that" is all I have to say
[06:15:09] <Konomi> it would go something like "Circlejerk 1: Omg circlekjerk 2 is such a circlejerk"
[06:15:27] <Konomi> I mean once you literally group together you've become the status quo circlejerk
[06:15:29] <SirFinkus> so I understand the censor's instinct
[06:15:34] <Konomi> becoming that which you ridicule
[06:15:39] <Konomi> it's sort of like hipsters actually
[06:15:55] <crutchy> cocks add a whole new dimension
[06:15:56] <Ethanol-fueled> It's a shame that the talent here is better in an instant than the one-man-Jew-band Timothy was at Slashdot.
[06:16:14] <crutchy> or is that clocks
[06:16:32] <SirFinkus> like, I'd love to shut those anti-vaccine nutjobs up
[06:16:42] <SirFinkus> and you could argue that they've done real harm
[06:16:54] <SirFinkus> but free speech is more important
[06:16:57] <crutchy> and why didn't anyone grab konomi's circlejerk x 3 comment?
[06:17:05] <Konomi> cause
[06:17:07] <Konomi> no grab
[06:17:07] <Konomi> ;p
[06:17:13] <SirFinkus> too busy circlejerking
[06:17:17] <juggs> you could, or you could accept they are in the minority and hope that herd resistance that vaccination relies on prevails.
[06:17:23] <SirFinkus> a free speech circlejerk is fine though
[06:17:24] * crutchy was stuffing his face
[06:17:44] <SirFinkus> since that is somewhat self limiting
[06:17:49] <Konomi> what we really need is many small circlejerks interacting without circlejerks in consturctive ways
[06:17:53] <Konomi> I figure it's the best we can hope for
[06:17:53] <Konomi> ;p
[06:17:59] <Konomi> with other*
[06:18:01] <JamesNZ> XD
[06:18:02] <Konomi> not without herp
[06:18:28] <crutchy> herp is important
[06:18:32] <crutchy> herp++
[06:18:32] <Bender> karma - herp: 1
[06:18:42] <Konomi> like everything I don't care about accusations of bias and such crap
[06:18:45] <Ethanol-fueled> herpes++
[06:18:45] <Bender> karma - herpes: 1
[06:18:49] <Konomi> it comes back to education
[06:19:02] <Konomi> and people being able to figure out what is bullshit and what is not
[06:19:08] <Konomi> there will always be bullshit
[06:19:19] <Konomi> mise well teach people how to deal with it
[06:19:21] <crutchy> education about the risk of herps while circlejerking
[06:19:28] <Ethanol-fueled> Konomi, you are a Christian faggot. You are the embodiment of bullshit.
[06:19:46] <Konomi> sure sure
[06:19:49] <crutchy> lol
[06:19:50] <ciri> HAHAHAHA
[06:19:56] <juggs> educate people too well they become hard to subjugate
[06:19:58] <SirFinkus> shut up ciri
[06:20:04] <Konomi> ciri--
[06:20:04] <Bender> karma - ciri: -17
[06:20:11] <juggs> SirFinkus, /ignore is your friend
[06:20:17] <Ethanol-fueled> OOOOOHHHHHH!
[06:20:23] <SirFinkus> it's more fun to get mad
[06:20:25] <Konomi> people who are educated for example tend to be more progressive
[06:20:45] <crutchy> ciri, yo mama is so fat when she wants to ride the train the engine pushes from behind
[06:20:53] <juggs> Konomi, do you consider yourself to be in either or both of those camps?
[06:21:12] <SirFinkus> people who are more educated also are more likely to buy into the anti-vaccine bullshit, so it's a wash
[06:21:17] * Ethanol-fueled readies the k-line
[06:21:22] <JamesNZ> Plot twist: crutchy is ciri's moma O_o
[06:21:26] <Konomi> juggs: I like to devorce myself from the whole duality of it all but I'd probably be categorised into the progressive camp
[06:21:37] <crutchy> Konomi, noooooo!
[06:21:48] <Ethanol-fueled> https://www.youtube.com
[06:21:48] <NetCraft> ^ 03Kramer's Racist Comedy Show - YouTube
[06:21:59] <Konomi> even having a slight sense of logic tends to lump you into that category so it's hard to not be in it
[06:22:06] <crutchy> just so long as you're not into that keynesian economics bullshit
[06:22:25] <Konomi> crutchy: I'd prefer to abolish currency all together so not really ;p
[06:22:41] <SirFinkus> oh fuck economics, I can't begin to have an intelligent position on that
[06:22:46] <Konomi> no one can
[06:22:50] <juggs> yah - we can go back to barter.... that'll work
[06:22:53] <crutchy> dunno about abolishing currency altogether, but competition to fiat currency would be good
[06:22:53] <Konomi> it's pyramid scheme
[06:22:57] <crutchy> barter++
[06:22:57] <Bender> karma - barter: 1
[06:23:05] <Konomi> you dig down into it and it will always end in nonsense
[06:23:11] <crutchy> true that
[06:23:19] <Konomi> finite planet infinit growth outlook
[06:23:22] <Konomi> all sense lost
[06:23:39] <Konomi> people just ignore it because it would be a mess to fix
[06:23:50] <crutchy> china is developing the next generation WMD
[06:23:55] <Konomi> kinda like sysadmin never wants to touch that win2k server in the back room that does xyz thing
[06:24:07] <Konomi> sure it sucks sure it makes zero sense to have there but fixing it would freaking suck
[06:24:10] <crutchy> en financial bomb in the form of a gold backed yuan
[06:24:15] <Konomi> that's an econemy
[06:24:29] <Ethanol-fueled> https://www.youtube.com
[06:24:29] <NetCraft> ^ 03Michael Richards rap - YouTube
[06:24:35] <crutchy> its gunna blow the dollar off the face of the earth
[06:24:35] <Ethanol-fueled> Wait, there's the funny one ^^^
[06:24:41] <Konomi> it'll explode eventually
[06:24:45] <Konomi> humans are a reactive species
[06:24:45] <crutchy> *usd
[06:24:47] <Konomi> not a proactive one
[06:25:12] <SirFinkus> Russia and the US are doing some real cold war shit right now
[06:25:43] <Konomi> it's just an ego thing
[06:25:46] <Konomi> it always is
[06:25:56] <Konomi> it's just worse when it gets to a country scale vs two idiots on a bar
[06:27:00] <crutchy> putin is gunna judo obama's ass
[06:27:22] <Konomi> I'd say obama jamming a nuke up his butt would country any martial arts training
[06:27:27] <Konomi> counter*
[06:27:47] <crutchy> it would have to penetrate the wall of russian nukes
[06:28:02] <Ethanol-fueled> America has been infiltrated by fifth-columnists who have interests in carrying out its downfall.
[06:28:14] <crutchy> though i'm sure it would be some kind of superpower foreplay
[06:28:22] <crutchy> nuclear tipped dildos
[06:28:28] <crutchy> with flags painted on
[06:28:33] <Ethanol-fueled> the solution to America's pollitical problem is a resurgence in isolationism and self-reliance.
[06:28:49] <Konomi> like living in caves?>
[06:28:59] <Ethanol-fueled> Which souped us up in the post-WWII era, I may mention.
[06:29:17] <Konomi> yeah cause the biggest sign of maturity is going to war ;p
[06:29:23] <crutchy> Ethanol-fueled, whilst i agree that US focusing more on self-development would be good, your reliance on imports means that it would have to be gradual
[06:29:49] <Ethanol-fueled> crutchy, we don't RELY on imports.
[06:30:12] <crutchy> your balance of trade suggests otherwise
[06:30:13] <Ethanol-fueled> Some people do, but they can afford to suffer.
[06:30:19] <crutchy> maybe
[06:30:43] <Ethanol-fueled> they will, crutchy....at the barrel of a gun, if necessary.
[06:31:17] <SirFinkus> as long as they don't take my beer
[06:31:21] <crutchy> or as a result of US dollar value plummeting to the point where imports become too expensive
[06:31:44] <Ethanol-fueled> why do you care about the dollar, crutchy?
[06:32:03] <crutchy> i don't. but i do care about normal hardworking americans
[06:32:16] <crutchy> fellow man and all that shit
[06:32:55] <SirFinkus> the current political climate is pretty bad
[06:32:57] <Ethanol-fueled> When the dollar plummets, it will be because American politicians have failed. And, gee, trillions in folly wars and inviting in the Brown Menace free of charge had nothing to do with it?
[06:33:11] <SirFinkus> very few people in politics care about civil liberties at all
[06:33:13] <crutchy> the fed played a big role too
[06:33:35] <crutchy> it "financed" the party
[06:33:35] <SirFinkus> all of the candidates in my local elections were impossible to vote for
[06:33:57] <crutchy> financed = changed some number on a pyewta
[06:34:49] <crutchy> which will enslave future generations of americans
[06:35:44] <crutchy> you guys should just take your millions of guns and blow the crap outta all fed buildings. problem solvered. no finance, no wars
[06:36:28] <SirFinkus> that shit won't work yet
[06:36:39] <SirFinkus> everyone still has easy access to food
[06:36:51] <Ethanol-fueled> nice try, FBI.
[06:36:55] <SirFinkus> after 3 days without bread come back
[06:37:15] <juggs> lol.. civilian US armoury insurrecting on Fed US forces. That's not going to end well. Unless you get to a point where the armed forces won't fire on the populous.
[06:37:16] <crutchy> thats too late though
[06:37:55] <SirFinkus> you'd be surprised, various terrorist groups seem to have given our military plenty of trouble
[06:37:55] <Ethanol-fueled> juggs, feds don't guard guard and reserve forces well.
[06:38:09] <Ethanol-fueled> It's how you have situations like this happening:
[06:38:24] <crutchy> juggs, gov got big guns, but you should see the shit that the citizenry has access too. why you think the big push to ban guns?
[06:38:31] <SirFinkus> they kill them 50:1, but have they really made any progress?
[06:38:32] <Ethanol-fueled> http://en.wikipedia.org
[06:38:33] <NetCraft> ^ 04Wiki: 03Shawn Nelson
[06:38:49] <juggs> SirFinkus, away from home sure. Not so much on home territory.
[06:39:12] <Ethanol-fueled> Stole a fucking TANK from a guard armory only tens of feet from where I went to school, then went on a rampage
[06:39:18] <crutchy> juggs, google 'big sandy shootout'
[06:39:39] <juggs> I'd rather not put myself on the grid any more than I am
[06:39:46] <crutchy> it would be interesting to see the US government try to take guns from texans
[06:39:48] <SirFinkus> naw, it'd be worse for the military on their own soil
[06:39:56] <crutchy> i hope they broadcast it live when it happens
[06:40:02] <SirFinkus> if it's off in the middle east, they're shooting *them*
[06:40:21] <SirFinkus> very easy to put brown people who don't speak your language into another category
[06:40:35] <SirFinkus> it's different when they're your neighbors
[06:40:52] <crutchy> all they seem to say is 'hallah akbar' or something like that
[06:41:01] <crutchy> maybe they're star wars fans or something
[06:41:27] <Ethanol-fueled> Texans are statist bootlickers
[06:41:29] * juggs wishes SirFinkus well in his armed US rebellion. I don't see it happening when the majority are grazing on reality tv shows and fast food.
[06:41:42] <SirFinkus> oh, I don't think it's going to happen
[06:41:47] <Ethanol-fueled> half of them are state troopers, they would enFuck each other fast.
[06:42:06] <crutchy> Ethanol-fueled, they're prolly the most likely to secede first from the union if it all turns shitty
[06:42:12] <SirFinkus> I'm just saying if it did, they'd have more success than those jackasses in the middle east
[06:42:13] <crutchy> lol
[06:42:30] <SirFinkus> texax dosen't give a fuck about civil liberties
[06:42:40] <crutchy> they do care about guns though
[06:42:51] <crutchy> and they have an infinite supply of oil to fuel them
[06:42:52] <SirFinkus> they have laws on the books that prevent athiests from becoming state officials
[06:43:06] <crutchy> yeah its full of neocons
[06:43:12] <SirFinkus> constitution be damned
[06:43:31] <crutchy> texas voted in ron paul for years, so not all of them
[06:44:12] <crutchy> i think ted cruz is from texas too?
[06:44:21] <SirFinkus> ron paul is better than most us politicians, but he's far from ideal
[06:44:39] <crutchy> he was consistent
[06:44:46] <crutchy> that's ideal for a politician :p
[06:45:08] <SirFinkus> there's cruz, and then another guy
[06:45:17] <SirFinkus> christ, can't remember his name
[06:45:30] <SirFinkus> held some huge state-sponsored prayer rally or something
[06:45:32] <Ethanol-fueled> fuck cruz. Brown-Menace fifth-columnist.
[06:45:36] <crutchy> lol
[06:45:37] <ciri> heh
[06:45:45] <juggs> much like the uk has laws that the PM must uphold the church of england... funny how after being in that position ex-pm's sometimes find they want to become catholic. I think Brown went that way once out of office,.
[06:45:51] <SirFinkus> ahh, rick perry
[06:45:54] <crutchy> texas seems to be home to a lot of anti-big-gov anyway
[06:46:16] <crutchy> regardless of the religious crap
[06:46:25] <Ethanol-fueled> Who America needs is somebody with proven experience as a leader. PATRICK STEWART.
[06:46:33] <Konomi> mmnn fabric softener smell
[06:46:34] <Ethanol-fueled> https://www.youtube.com
[06:46:35] <NetCraft> ^ 03Patrick Stewart in the drive through - YouTube
[06:47:16] <Konomi> love to know how I get hiccups taking washing off the freaking line...
[06:47:22] <crutchy> america needs chuck norris
[06:47:33] <crutchy> chuck_norris_for_potus++
[06:47:33] <Bender> karma - chuck_norris_for_potus: 1
[06:47:41] <juggs> Yes.. what you need is an actor in charge. You know someone schooled in portraying faux emotion and beliefs... that seems like a good idea.
[06:47:43] <crutchy> nobody would mess with america then
[06:47:56] <Konomi> https://www.youtube.com
[06:47:56] <NetCraft> ^ 03Greetings from Chuck (The epic christmas split) - YouTube
[06:48:07] <crutchy> Konomi, its chuck norris... he's no mere actor!
[06:48:09] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com
[06:48:09] <NetCraft> ^ 03Patrick Stewart on Extras - YouTube
[06:48:16] <SirFinkus> better stewart video
[06:49:47] <crutchy> just like openssl needs bruce schnier
[06:49:49] <crutchy> http://www.schneierfacts.com
[06:49:50] <NetCraft> ^ 03Bruce Schneier Facts
[06:50:50] <chromas> Bruce Schneier >>>> Chuck Norris
[06:51:04] * juggs forces Konomi's nick to HiccupDiva
[06:51:50] <Ethanol-fueled> I'm going to fall asleep now
[06:52:10] <Ethanol-fueled> See ya in a week cogsuggers
[06:52:51] <Ethanol-fueled> ====!===== Ethanol-fueled has left [k-lined] /me
[06:53:08] -!- Ethanol-fueled has quit [Quit: Web client closed]
[06:54:25] <crutchy> that chuck norris video was... magical
[06:54:32] <crutchy> chuck_norris++
[06:54:32] <Bender> karma - chuck_norris: 1
[06:54:58] <crutchy> zomg! only 1. it must have overflowed
[07:00:30] <Konomi> ;p
[07:00:41] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Scientists Discover Virus that Makes People Stupid - http://sylnt.us - stupid-virus
[07:01:06] <juggs> the bbc's coverage on the "dark net" is comical. They're running stories about how tor could be compromised rather than run the insider informant angle. We should all be scared of this means of communication because it is not open to government review.
[07:01:29] <juggs> Sleep walking nation.
[07:03:15] <Konomi> it's a possiblity but not the only one
[07:03:21] <Konomi> there could be a flaw but it's no reason to stop using tor
[07:04:17] <SirFinkus> I'm willing to believe tor has some weaknesses, but most of the sites I've seen seized have been due to opsec failures
[07:04:18] <Konomi> I kinda compare it to condoms there's some slim chance you may get an std but that doesn't mean you should stop using them \o/
[07:04:32] <Konomi> well the current theory is a ddos
[07:04:44] <Konomi> so they ddos the route to the hidden service
[07:04:45] <SirFinkus> and probably tons of honeypots
[07:04:57] <Konomi> until a guard node they have compromised is connected to
[07:05:03] <SirFinkus> I'm fairly certain sr 2.0 was a honeypot all along
[07:05:03] <Konomi> and then they get the real ip
[07:05:17] <SirFinkus> nope, not even that
[07:05:23] <Konomi> guard node has the ip of the real server
[07:05:36] <SirFinkus> the dumb motherfucker running sr 2.0 logged into it over clearnet to admin it
[07:05:47] <Konomi> yeah there's alwatys op sec failures
[07:05:48] <SirFinkus> and all the admins were able to see the access logs
[07:05:50] <Konomi> but 400 sites is a lot
[07:05:56] <SirFinkus> it isn't 400 sites
[07:06:01] <SirFinkus> it's 17 or something
[07:06:07] <Konomi> and tor devs have admitted some weaknesses in the hidden service protocol
[07:06:14] <SirFinkus> it was 400 urls
[07:06:24] <juggs> There's no flaw, the whole thing is BS. Initial press releases vaguely mentioned 400+ sites, that became 400 pages most of which redirected to others, became 27 servers, became 17 people cuffed. But the initial impression is what will linger "dark web, takedown 400+ sites peddling bad things". It's getting to the point of propaganda.
[07:06:36] <Konomi> it may be op sec but it's still good to look into protocol security
[07:06:46] <SirFinkus> it has weaknesses, but the big one (sr 2.0) was likely a honeypot all along
[07:06:56] <SirFinkus> sure Konomi, I agree with that
[07:07:00] <Konomi> note
[07:07:14] <SirFinkus> the first silkroad takedown is much more suspicious in that regard though
[07:07:45] <SirFinkus> supposedly they "randomly" discovered the operators fake id shipment
[07:07:47] <Konomi> without detailing I am involved with tor to a degree ;p
[07:07:58] <SirFinkus> that's some parallel construction bs
[07:08:06] * crutchy doesn't know much about tor, but assumes you can't merely use traceroute
[07:08:18] <Konomi> crutchy: no but there are weaknesses
[07:08:28] <Konomi> use tor it has flaws everything does but they're not show stoppers
[07:08:32] <SirFinkus> the second one I'm almost sure was a honeypot because the lead guy was posting "invite codes" over twitter on clearnet
[07:08:50] <Konomi> but we need to make sure they can be improved or mitigated
[07:08:52] <SirFinkus> which is a great way to associate real ip addresses with accounts buying illegal goods
[07:08:53] <juggs> lol
[07:08:58] <Konomi> timing attacks protocol poisoning etc
[07:09:04] <SirFinkus> a number of other sites are doing that too
[07:09:18] <SirFinkus> one is promoting free vendor accounts on reddit right now
[07:09:24] <SirFinkus> with "invite codes"
[07:09:44] <Konomi> also one of the hidden service using peeps is posting on the tor mailing list atm trying to figure out if any protocol exploits have taken place
[07:09:51] <Konomi> or if we cna put the whole thing down to bad op sec
[07:10:03] * SirFinkus posted that earlier on the tor story
[07:10:11] <Konomi> so far none have been found
[07:10:21] <Konomi> yeah I seen your post
[07:10:21] <Konomi> ;p
[07:10:36] <SirFinkus> it's pretty a pretty interesting read, although I don't have the technical chops to begin to analyze the logs
[07:10:37] <Konomi> I prefer to keep my tor related interests strickly on tor though
[07:10:45] <Konomi> with a few exceptions
[07:10:57] <Konomi> they're not hard to get
[07:11:01] <Konomi> they're looking for timing attacks
[07:11:13] <Konomi> the gist of it atm is they ddosed the hidden service
[07:11:21] <Konomi> forcing it to skip guard nodes until one wasn't congested
[07:11:32] <SirFinkus> my attitude is that tor is fairly safe, unless you're operating a hidden service that becomes the target of a large entity, like the NSA
[07:11:36] <Konomi> the evil whatever trying to get the hidden service has that as their guard node
[07:11:40] <Konomi> causing them to get the actual ip
[07:11:42] <Konomi> that is the theory
[07:11:46] <Konomi> no evidence yet though
[07:11:52] <crutchy> 6 lines in a row Konomi. girl you're as bad as me :D
[07:12:01] <SirFinkus> and it's far more likely to fuck up opsec than it is someone is attacking you directly
[07:12:10] <Konomi> and the ddos they referred to was unrelated and someone else has stepped up to the plate admitting they were experimenting with testing hidden services site uptime
[07:12:15] <Konomi> I believe it was one of the hidden wiki peeps
[07:12:22] <SirFinkus> since it's so easy to fuck up that stuff
[07:12:26] <juggs> I thought SR 2.0 was busted by a FBI plant who got on staff.. perhaps I imagined those stories as I can't find them now :-/
[07:12:28] <SirFinkus> and you only have to fuck up once
[07:12:37] <SirFinkus> no juggs, that's the fbi story now
[07:12:38] <Konomi> juggs: probably yes but other site got taken down too
[07:12:48] <Konomi> tor devs wnat to cover all the bases
[07:13:15] <SirFinkus> so the other sites, my theory is that they just got pwned with opsec failures and shit like sql injections
[07:13:29] <Konomi> it's possible
[07:13:39] <SirFinkus> the feds lumped all the seizures together to make it look like tor was comprimised
[07:13:42] <SirFinkus> FUD stuff
[07:13:53] <Konomi> tor dev team has already put a call out to hidden service operators to submit their logs so they can check for any exploits
[07:14:03] <Konomi> I'm aware
[07:14:07] <Konomi> they did the same thing last time
[07:14:20] <Konomi> javascript side firefox windows specific exploit of old versions of tor browser
[07:14:22] <juggs> Or shared admins between sites, one compromised admin brings down a bunch of sites.
[07:14:25] <Konomi> I read the code
[07:14:40] <SirFinkus> SR 2.0 smelled like an undercover op from the beginning
[07:14:52] <Konomi> >undercover op
[07:14:56] <Konomi> try to control your paranoia ;p
[07:15:04] <SirFinkus> I have evidence!
[07:15:08] <Konomi> assumption has no place in security
[07:15:12] <SirFinkus> so, sr is siezed
[07:15:22] <crutchy> wouldn't surprise me if there were tor honeypots run by governments
[07:15:33] <crutchy> esp by the DEA
[07:15:42] <SirFinkus> miraculously, some of the admins aren't caught, and they have all the code and shit to set up a site like a week later
[07:15:44] <Konomi> I couldn't really care less about peeps doing that sort of thing on tor
[07:15:48] <juggs> exit nodes for sure crutchy, not so much with onion sites
[07:15:54] <Konomi> I exclusively use tor to make political commentary
[07:16:06] <SirFinkus> then they start offering "invite codes" over clearnet
[07:16:41] <SirFinkus> all of this stuff is consistent with a honeypot
[07:16:43] <Konomi> I personally like to avoid down the track threat possiblities to what i say ;p
[07:16:53] <Konomi> or a stupid person
[07:17:08] <Konomi> op sec is not easy
[07:17:13] <crutchy> governments don't need an excuse to lock you up and throw away the key
[07:17:14] <SirFinkus> the timing doesn't make sense
[07:17:18] <Konomi> mise well be a freaking martial art tbh
[07:17:29] <Konomi> it takes the same kind of devotion
[07:17:45] <crutchy> terrorism has the loosest definition in the history of... everything
[07:18:01] <SirFinkus> with this kind of thing, I think of how easy it would be for LEO to set up the second site VS someone else
[07:18:05] <juggs> I don't use tor currently. But it interests me given the observation we seem to be under. Hence my SN IRC TOR question thing.
[07:18:25] <SirFinkus> it seems to me that it would be much easier for LEO to set up the second site
[07:18:33] <Konomi> you need to do some good coding for irc tor
[07:18:38] <Konomi> I've mentioned it before I believe
[07:19:10] <Konomi> needs a freenode like service but with a better bootstrap
[07:19:28] <Konomi> and I doubt anything open source is floating around for it unless freenode is publishing their code somewhere
[07:19:41] <SirFinkus> for instance, if I was hoping to start the sr 2.0, and the previous one had been seized, I'd be super careful about the code running it
[07:20:03] <SirFinkus> I'd audit it somehow before relaunching, it seems like the dumbest motherfucker would do this
[07:20:22] <SirFinkus> and that'd take longer than the short time before sr 2.0 was launched
[07:20:23] <juggs> Konomi, yup. A lot of making irc good over tor is client side config. But this is a public server not a hidden irc, so it would be more about hiding the identity of those connecting than the operators of the irc server.
[07:20:28] <Konomi> audit it how?
[07:20:31] <Konomi> you could onlu do that over tor
[07:20:39] <crutchy> just use irc.schneier.com
[07:20:43] <crutchy> it secures itself
[07:20:46] <SirFinkus> sure you could, if you had the source code for the site
[07:20:56] <Konomi> yes but you have to get the source code out
[07:21:01] <Konomi> withyout your identity spilling
[07:21:06] <SirFinkus> which, given how quickly the guy who relaunced it did, he did
[07:21:06] <Konomi> which means exclusively over tor
[07:21:17] <Konomi> you then need t obe able to trust what you get back from tor
[07:21:18] <SirFinkus> sr 2.0 was started by a "former admin" of sr 1.0
[07:21:30] <Konomi> you know
[07:21:39] <Konomi> they might've already had his details
[07:21:47] <Konomi> it might not be an op sec failure on his part at all
[07:21:52] <Konomi> they might'be just had it from the first take down...
[07:22:05] <SirFinkus> well, he had a number of failures in any case
[07:22:27] <SirFinkus> that would fit with my theory, just kind of an alternate version
[07:22:30] <juggs> no-one is ever going to be perfect
[07:22:38] <Konomi> and that's the problem
[07:22:39] <SirFinkus> that sr 2.0 was under fed control
[07:22:41] <Konomi> one fuck up is all it takes
[07:22:42] <Konomi> just one
[07:23:11] <SirFinkus> controlled opposition, or explicitly run by the feds
[07:23:13] <Konomi> and you'll never know until it's too late
[07:23:14] <juggs> and that is where technology is letting us down. We need to make this stuff push-button simple.
[07:23:21] <Konomi> it takes a very very strong willed person to handle that
[07:23:28] <Konomi> or someone ignorant to the fact
[07:23:32] <SirFinkus> I lean towards the latter because of the public "invite codes" stuff
[07:23:35] <Konomi> no no we don't
[07:23:44] <Konomi> making it push button simple invites stupid people to screw up
[07:23:51] <Konomi> and encourages them not to learn
[07:24:03] <SirFinkus> which seems like a deliberate de-anonymisation attack
[07:24:32] <Konomi> it needs to be well documented is what is really needed
[07:24:43] <Konomi> good setup proceedure good information all very detailed and well supported
[07:24:44] <juggs> making it push button simple means stupid people CANNOT screw up, likewise stupid people cannot accidentally out a friend
[07:24:57] <Konomi> yes cause no one has ever broke their mac or iphone ;p
[07:25:16] <SirFinkus> the biggest gap seems to be in running the website itself, not tor
[07:25:20] <Konomi> problem with simple is the same old problem
[07:25:24] <Konomi> when shit hits the fan they cannot cope
[07:25:30] <Konomi> they need to be able to cope when something goes wrong
[07:25:35] <SirFinkus> a lot larger attack surface
[07:25:39] <ar> moin
[07:25:43] <Konomi> and something WILL always go wrong.
[07:25:51] <ar> tea++
[07:25:51] <Bender> karma - tea: 234
[07:25:53] <ar> coffee--
[07:25:53] <Bender> karma - coffee: 903
[07:25:56] <juggs> stupid people do not read, stupid people do not follow best practise, the infrastructure has to accept this and work around it as there is no way to bar stupid people.
[07:26:17] <SirFinkus> even smart people fuck up
[07:26:23] <juggs> exactly
[07:26:33] <Konomi> apple isn't going to be there to catch them I'm not going to be there to fix whatever xyz thing broke from them messing with things they shouldn't or just randomly decided to stop being deterministic
[07:27:05] <juggs> tangent detected.
[07:27:16] <SirFinkus> I figure tor is more secure than the site itself just because more eyes are looking at it
[07:27:22] <ar> uhm… what happened?
[07:27:32] <juggs> ar nothing much
[07:28:05] <crutchy> tama, yo mama is so fugly when she tried to take a selfie her camera suicided
[07:29:16] <juggs> diversion detected.
[07:29:51] <crutchy> juggs, one for regurgitator: https://www.schneier.com
[07:29:51] <NetCraft> ^ 03Schneier on Security
[07:29:54] <juggs> eek my paranoia warning bot got lose :D
[07:30:06] <juggs> loose
[07:30:49] <SirFinkus> as far as internet stuff, is any of it really paranoia anymore?
[07:31:24] <SirFinkus> it seems like the worst of the paranoid fears about internet spying have been well document
[07:31:32] <juggs> newp. But watching for social manipulation is still relevant.
[07:31:51] <SirFinkus> nsa backdoors, widespread traffic collection
[07:31:59] <SirFinkus> oh, that's been documented too
[07:32:01] <juggs> Thanks crutchy, added it to the todo
[07:33:04] <SirFinkus> pretty sure I saw a NSA doc detailing how to derail conversations about "sensitive" matters
[07:34:08] <juggs> SirFinkus, it's multi-faceted. At this point we should assume all comms channels are compromised - as I believe is standard practice within the US gov't TLAs themselves. So until that is addressed, it is not beyond the wit of man to watch for social engineering activity. psyops is it not?
[07:34:45] <SirFinkus> absolutely, I don't think it's going away either
[07:34:48] <juggs> SirFinkus, just look up the stasi manuals post 1989 on infiltration and manipulation.
[07:35:24] <SirFinkus> if we roll back all the NSA survelience laws, they'll still do it
[07:35:31] <crutchy> juggs, this one not as frequently updated but still chock full of awesomesauce: http://feeds.feedburner.com
[07:35:31] <NetCraft> ^ 03Steve (GRC) Gibson's Blog
[07:35:33] <juggs> They are freely available. Have been since the wall came down in Berlin.
[07:35:42] <SirFinkus> just as they've always done
[07:36:00] <SirFinkus> and really, people make enough damning information publicly available
[07:36:18] <SirFinkus> I mean, is the NSA crawling facebook really extrajudicial?
[07:36:46] <juggs> crutchy, also added to the todo. Even though Gibson has a history of over dramatising threats.
[07:37:15] <crutchy> he's not as chuck norris-like as scheier
[07:38:17] <crutchy> umm.. https://www.nsa.gov
[07:38:37] <crutchy> add this one at own risk :p
[07:39:25] <juggs> SirFinkus, it's up to us to determine what is and is not judicial. I am tired of people trying to explain such actions away by saying "well it's legal". Sorry, who sets the fucking laws here. Last I was aware, we had rule by consent. These days we seem to have law by dictat.
[07:39:44] <SirFinkus> well, here's what I mean
[07:40:21] <SirFinkus> if you make it publicly available who your friends are, and share it on sites like facebook, can you really expect governments not to save that information?
[07:40:43] <juggs> will add crutchy, I'll bounce it through 7 proxies, tor and i2p to make it look sus too :D
[07:40:52] <crutchy> lol
[07:40:53] <ciri> it's not that funny :)
[07:41:29] <crutchy> at very least it might serve up some flamebait
[07:41:50] <crutchy> flamebait makes the troll world go round
[07:42:04] <juggs> SirFinkus, no, you can't. But the NSA / GCHQ bods were snarfing traffic off the wire that was between servers that may or may not have been public. That is where the line is crossed to my mind.
[07:42:19] <SirFinkus> same here, but lets say they don't
[07:42:34] <SirFinkus> realistically, how much difference does that make?
[07:42:51] <crutchy> mitm existed prolly before the NSA cared to sniff around
[07:42:52] <SirFinkus> so they don't know what your emails say, they still know your entire social network
[07:43:07] <SirFinkus> to an extent, where you've been
[07:43:20] <SirFinkus> who you've been talking to
[07:43:38] <SirFinkus> all this "metadata" which is really the important stuff
[07:44:13] <SirFinkus> they have a profile of what your writing looks like, so if you make an anonymous blog post they can determine with a good degree of certainty that you made it
[07:44:27] <juggs> eh? you see no difference between crawling public profiles and snarfing a company's internal inter-server traffic?
[07:44:50] <SirFinkus> oh, absolutely
[07:45:20] <crutchy> secret peoples prolly use things like steganography
[07:45:21] <SirFinkus> but lets say the snarfing internal traffic stopped today
[07:45:33] <SirFinkus> the nsa only looked at stuff that was publicly available
[07:45:41] <SirFinkus> how much data would they lose?
[07:45:42] <ciri> not sure
[07:45:48] <SirFinkus> shut up ciri
[07:45:51] <SirFinkus> ciri--
[07:45:51] <Bender> karma - ciri: -18
[07:45:55] <Konomi> ciri--
[07:45:55] <Bender> karma - ciri: -19
[07:46:05] <SirFinkus> people willingly share all that information anyway
[07:46:05] <crutchy> unless the NSA suspects that an innocent looking cat pic contains a secret message they dont bother looking
[07:46:12] <SirFinkus> if you don't personally, your family does
[07:46:14] <juggs> so what are we even discussing? We already agree, if you put it online for all to see it's going to get snarfed and analysed. Whether that should be so is a whole other discussion.
[07:46:28] <crutchy> cos images and video takes up big space
[07:46:45] <Konomi> I see this escalated quickly while I was sewing ;p
[07:46:46] <crutchy> so hiding messages in video increases the cost of surveillance dramatically
[07:46:53] <SirFinkus> I'm just saying that even if you reign in governments to only "legal" snooping, you're still fucked
[07:47:01] <SirFinkus> they don't need it
[07:47:08] <SirFinkus> the "privacy" cat is out of the bag
[07:47:32] * Konomi chases the privacy kitty
[07:47:43] * crutchy likes chasing pussy
[07:47:49] <SirFinkus> I don't envision a scenario in which we get it back without a massive change in human attitudes towards it
[07:47:50] <Konomi> http://vimeo.com
[07:47:50] <NetCraft> ^ 03Cryptocat Adventure! on Vimeo
[07:47:52] <juggs> SirFinkus, "publically available" does not mean the same to the nsa as you or I. If I had fibre taps in every major telco, a lot of traffic would be in the clear. It's stretching the definition of publically available to farcical lengths.
[07:47:59] <Konomi> this video always gave me fuzzy feelings speaking of cats and privacy ;p
[07:48:22] <SirFinkus> when I say "publicly available" I mean the definition most reasonable position would have
[07:48:39] <SirFinkus> "I posted this online, therefore it's publicly avialable"
[07:48:40] <crutchy> cats don't care about privacy. anything that licks its own ass in full public view has no sense of dignity
[07:49:06] <SirFinkus> the nsa's definition seems to be anything that's posted on a 3rd party server
[07:49:34] <crutchy> nsa's definition is anything they can tap into
[07:51:40] <juggs> ^^
[07:51:54] <SirFinkus> well, actually it seems to be "anything"
[07:52:40] <SirFinkus> there was a good talk on it, I wish I remembered what it was
[07:52:48] <juggs> after all anyone in the public could sneak a fibre tap in - sure they'd be committing a crime in doing so, but it is still within the bounds defined by "publically available"
[07:53:07] <crutchy> there's stuff they can tap into, and stuff that they can't *yet* tap into :p
[07:53:08] <SirFinkus> point is, they don't need fiber taps anymore
[07:53:43] <crutchy> fiber taps are still cool though
[07:54:27] <crutchy> and they only need to tap a couple of trunk lines to pwn everything
[07:55:07] <crutchy> except maybe subnets that don't pass traffic through trunk lines
[07:55:27] <juggs> SirFinkus, the point I'm trying to make is that in this scenario legal definitions mean naught as it stands - it is this we need to address. Trying to hide in shadows is admitting defeat.
[07:56:13] <SirFinkus> so I think it's already a lost cause
[07:56:25] <SirFinkus> you and I might value privacy, but most people don't
[07:56:26] <juggs> Only if you admit defeat.
[07:57:01] <crutchy> most people don't realize their privacy is being violated till they hear about it on CNN
[07:57:06] <SirFinkus> even if we got all of the laws we wanted passed, the vast majority of people value convenience over privacy
[07:57:10] <crutchy> if they knew they might be offended
[07:57:20] <crutchy> and send nasty letters and tweets
[07:57:24] <SirFinkus> it's similar to the herd immunity
[07:57:35] <SirFinkus> it only works if the vast majority of people are onboard
[07:57:45] <juggs> crutchy, then get imprisoned for sending an obnoxious tweet no doubt
[07:57:53] <crutchy> most users of the internet don't have a any idea how it works
[07:58:19] <crutchy> just like a lot of city folk might hurl if they found out milk came from a cow's tit
[07:58:51] <juggs> SirFinkus, but securing the underlying infrastructure should not need userland changes, the grazing herds can be protected without ever looking up.
[07:59:17] <SirFinkus> no they can't if they demand sharing their information publicly
[07:59:18] <chromas> crutchy: that's what makes it so hot and delicious
[07:59:18] <crutchy> we need a biodome :p
[07:59:28] <crutchy> mmmm hot cow titties
[07:59:44] <SirFinkus> people love "checking in" "liking" and "friending" shit
[07:59:56] <SirFinkus> they like their discount cards
[08:00:08] <juggs> SirFinkus, circular discussion between what is chosen to be shared and what is not but is snarfed anyway.
[08:00:22] <juggs> ekkk, I'm tired.
[08:00:25] * chromas suggests milk booths—like blood drives but for mothers who make more than they know what to do with
[08:00:29] * juggs aways to sleep
[08:00:57] <SirFinkus> trying to get a different point across juggs, that the effort should be towards people rather than laws
[08:01:34] <SirFinkus> laws restricting information collection are nearly useless without people realizing that sharing everything isn't a good idea
[08:01:58] <crutchy> chromas++ # now there's an idea
[08:01:58] <Bender> karma - chromas: 51
[08:02:26] <crutchy> or just have them lined up on the street with their titties flopped out :p
[08:02:38] <crutchy> did i just say that?
[08:03:03] <chromas> Bender: grab crutchy's previous message
[08:03:03] <Bender> I don't think that's a nick....
[08:04:41] <chromas> They can make a buck and we get milk made for us instead of milk made for our meat
[08:04:46] <JamesNZ> emacs++
[08:04:46] <Bender> karma - emacs: 12
[08:11:06] <SirFinkus> oh fantastic, fixed my guitar
[08:12:31] <crutchy> cool
[08:20:43] * chromas has a mostly empty garbage can this week. Anyone have something to put in? No questions asked…
[08:21:29] * SirFinkus slips some bodies in
[08:21:50] <Konomi> okay then...
[08:27:41] <SirFinkus> gonna ask my guitar teacher about the devils interval tomorrow
[08:27:44] <SirFinkus> err, later today
[08:37:54] <ar> tea++
[08:37:54] <Bender> karma - tea: 235
[08:38:02] <ar> coffee--
[08:38:02] <Bender> karma - coffee: 902
[08:39:52] <Konomi> caffeine++
[08:39:52] <Bender> karma - caffeine: 40
[08:45:17] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[08:45:17] <Bender> karma - coffee: 901
[08:47:17] <ar> coffee--
[08:47:17] <Bender> karma - coffee: 900
[08:47:22] <ar> tea++
[08:47:22] <Bender> karma - tea: 236
[08:52:03] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - USDA Approves Genetically-Engineered Super Potato - http://sylnt.us - fish-and-super-chips?
[08:59:05] <chromas> Super Size it!
[09:02:05] <ar> coffee--
[09:02:05] <Bender> karma - coffee: 899
[09:02:15] <ar> (yay, back to <900)
[09:02:37] <chromas> systemd++
[09:02:37] <chromas> coffee++
[09:02:37] <Bender> karma - systemd: -19
[09:02:38] <Bender> karma - coffee: 900
[09:02:53] <ar> systemd--
[09:02:53] <Bender> karma - systemd: -20
[09:03:15] <chromas> I know you love it
[09:05:50] <SirFinkus> tea++
[09:05:50] <Bender> karma - tea: 237
[09:05:53] <SirFinkus> cider++
[09:05:53] <Bender> karma - cider: 4
[09:13:56] <ar> coffee--
[09:13:56] <Bender> karma - coffee: 899
[09:16:23] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:16:23] <Bender> karma - coffee: 898
[09:18:08] <SirFinkus> that stupid virus story is too easy
[09:18:15] <SirFinkus> I refuse to get myself sucked in
[09:18:34] <SirFinkus> should have been from the explains-a-lot dept.
[09:45:45] <crutchy> i think i wants me one of these: https://www.youtube.com
[09:45:46] <NetCraft> ^ 03LNT-S 11-axis CNC w/ live tools & back machining - YouTube
[09:46:30] <crutchy> either that or maybe one of these: https://www.youtube.com
[09:46:30] <NetCraft> ^ 03robot milling stone using 7 axis - YouTube
[09:55:38] -!- pbnjoe has quit [Quit: bedtime]
[09:57:39] <JamesNZ> Holy shmokes. https://gnome.org
[09:57:40] <NetCraft> ^ 03Help the GNOME Foundation defend the GNOME trademark
[09:59:09] <SirFinkus> fuck
[09:59:21] <SirFinkus> I hate gnome, but this seems pretty cut and dry
[09:59:45] <JamesNZ> Yeah :|
[10:02:28] <chromas> "make sure that when people hear about GNOME software they learn about freedom"
[10:02:29] <chromas> heh
[10:17:54] -!- aqu4 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[10:18:56] -!- Subsentient1 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[10:23:47] -!- aqu4 [aqu4!~aqu4bot@universe2.us/ircbot/aqu4] has joined #Soylent
[10:31:11] -!- Subsentient1 [Subsentient1!~WhiteRat@216.161.ghn.ql] has joined #Soylent
[10:41:24] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Polaris — an Initiative Dedicated to Internet Privacy - http://sylnt.us - is-true-anonymity-still-possible?
[10:43:47] <chromas> Bender: s/os/lau/
[10:43:47] <sedctl> <chromas> <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Polaris — an Initiative Dedicated to Internet Privacy - http://sylnt.us - is-true-anonymity-still-plausible?
[10:46:10] <crutchy> Bender: s/lari/onu/
[10:46:10] <sedctl> <crutchy> <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Poonus — an Initiative Dedicated to Internet Privacy - http://sylnt.us - is-true-anonymity-still-possible?
[10:47:34] <chromas> sedctl: s/riv/ir/
[10:47:38] <chromas> oh yeah
[10:47:40] <chromas> :(
[10:47:51] * chromas doesn't know why that don't work no mo'
[10:48:13] <crutchy> maybe it never worked
[10:48:53] <crutchy> ~sed on
[10:48:54] <exec> sed enabled for 10#Soylent
[10:48:55] <chromas> It did at one time; we used to sed SedBot until the message was a pile of <names>
[10:48:55] <crutchy> sedctl: s/riv/ir/
[10:48:56] <exec> <crutchy> <sedctl> <crutchy> <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Poonus — an Initiative Dedicated to Internet Piracy - http://sylnt.us - is-true-anonymity-still-possible?
[10:48:56] * sedctl is a 53-line gawk script, https://github.com
[10:49:03] <crutchy> ~sed off
[10:49:04] <exec> sed disabled for 10#Soylent
[10:49:13] <chromas> should just use exec
[10:49:48] <chromas> /murder sedctl
[10:49:48] * sedctl is a 53-line gawk script, https://github.com
[10:49:52] <NetCraft> Are you sure, Dave?
[10:50:02] <crutchy> does it work if you use SedBot nick?
[10:50:17] <chromas> SedBot: s/ /1/g
[10:50:18] <crutchy> dunno why that would change anything but just throwing it out there
[10:50:42] sedctl is now known as SedBot9k
[10:50:46] <chromas> SedBot: s/ /1/g
[10:50:52] <chromas> oh wait
[10:51:03] <chromas> s/ / /
[10:51:03] <SedBot9k> <chromas> oh wait
[10:51:09] <chromas> SedBot9k: s/ / /g
[10:51:12] <chromas> :(
[10:51:45] <chromas> can't take SedBot 'cause FoobarBazbot's SedBot is using it (but not in any channels)
[10:51:54] <crutchy> ah yeah
[10:52:18] <chromas> FoobarBazbot: yo dawgg! Get yo bot in here! and also we found a bug ages ago
[10:53:09] -!- SedBot9k has quit [Quit: bewbctl]
[10:53:30] <chromas> ignoring_the_rest_of_the_quit_message--
[10:53:30] <Bender> karma - ignoring_the_rest_of_the_quit_message: -1
[10:53:33] <chromas> ~sed on
[10:53:34] <exec> sed enabled for 10#Soylent
[10:53:48] <chromas> (unless crutchy has objections)
[10:54:11] <crutchy> doesn't bother me
[10:54:20] <crutchy> only problem is exec isn't always online
[10:54:32] <chromas> exec++
[10:54:32] <chromas> coffee++
[10:54:32] <chromas> crutchy++
[10:54:32] <chromas> bacon++
[10:54:32] <Bender> karma - exec: 13
[10:54:32] <Bender> karma - coffee: 899
[10:54:32] <Bender> karma - crutchy: 115
[10:54:32] <Bender> karma - bacon: 277
[10:54:43] <crutchy> lol
[10:54:59] <crutchy> userlist_buttons++
[10:54:59] <Bender> karma - userlist_buttons: 2
[10:55:21] <crutchy> bacon++
[10:55:21] <Bender> karma - bacon: 278
[10:55:30] <crutchy> i runded out of normal coffee :(
[10:55:39] <chromas> so you got bacon coffee?
[10:55:50] <chromas> I wonder if it would be considered bad form to manually trigger the bots to karma up
[10:55:55] <chromas> all at once >:)
[10:55:55] <crutchy> i think its vienna style shit
[10:55:59] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[10:55:59] <Bender> karma - coffee: 898
[10:56:05] <crutchy> its ok but not like normal coffee
[10:56:43] <crutchy> chromas, it would prolly raise some eyebrows at very least :p
[10:57:06] <chromas> coffee++ # even though I think it's gross; party_line++
[10:57:06] <Bender> karma - coffee: 899
[10:57:50] <chromas> coffee++ is good in chocolate cakes and stuff; is chocolate good in coffee?
[10:57:50] <Bender> karma - coffee: 900
[10:59:14] <chromas> oh yeah, SedBot's two or so processes per channel
[10:59:52] <crutchy> 1 shared and 1 per channel from memory
[11:00:24] <chromas> I'm seeing a tail and a gawk each in separate processes, though htop does show things differently from regular top
[11:00:38] <chromas> top--
[11:00:39] <Bender> karma - top: -1
[11:00:55] <JamesNZ> htop++
[11:00:55] <Bender> karma - htop: 1
[11:00:56] <crutchy> ah yeah forgot about tail
[11:01:15] * crutchy is running htop on a separate screen
[11:01:21] <crutchy> cos it looks cool :D
[11:01:22] <chromas> htop++
[11:01:22] <Bender> karma - htop: 2
[11:01:28] <chromas> it does :)
[11:01:44] <JamesNZ> Makes one look extra clever :P
[11:01:48] * chromas mostly uses yakuake but wishes it would pop up from the bottom
[11:02:06] <crutchy> htop is bottom half and exec term is upper half. looks totally hacker-sweet
[11:02:11] <chromas> (where yakuake = popdown terminal)
[11:02:39] <chromas> crutchy: need to shrink the font and make it your root window
[11:02:52] <chromas> or maybe that could be syslog
[11:04:16] <chromas> sudo journalctl -xf
[11:05:02] <chromas> crutchy: journalctl can output json. Better install systemd so you can pipe your journals through exec
[11:06:27] <crutchy> journalctl tail buttpipe
[11:06:58] <chromas> Failed to add match 'tail': Invalid argument
[11:10:34] <TheMightyBuzzard> ~weather
[11:10:36] <exec> Weather for Ada, OK - currently 36°F / 2°C, overcast, wind N at 22 mph, humidity 75% - Tuesday partly cloudy (25°F-48°F / -4°C-9°C), Wednesday partly cloudy (23°F-39°F / -5°C-4°C), Thursday partly cloudy (23°F-41°F / -5°C-5°C), Friday partly cloudy (27°F-48°F / -3°C-9°C) - source: Google
[11:10:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[11:10:44] <Bender> karma - coffee: 901
[11:11:08] <crutchy> coffee++
[11:11:08] <Bender> karma - coffee: 902
[11:11:45] <crutchy> listening to 'Two Steps From Hell - Strength Of A Thousand Men Dubstep Remix ( BURN )'
[11:12:13] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++ #cause tea can't cut it below 40°F
[11:12:13] <Bender> karma - coffee: 903
[11:12:28] <crutchy> actually there's another remix of that song that's better
[11:12:43] <chromas> ~weather
[11:12:44] <exec> Weather for Walla Walla, WA - currently 36°F / 2°C, overcast, wind NE at 3 mph, humidity 76% - Tuesday clear (21°F-37°F / -6°C-3°C), Wednesday clear (23°F-34°F / -5°C-1°C), Thursday snow (30°F-37°F / -1°C-3°C), Friday chance of snow (21°F-41°F / -6°C-5°C) - source: Google
[11:12:47] <chromas> yay!
[11:12:54] <chromas> exec++ # wx
[11:12:54] <Bender> karma - exec: 14
[11:13:33] <chromas> but it's earlier here; that means tmb's 0314 was probably colder than mine
[11:14:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> nah, this is the current low for the day, or rather 6am-ish will be
[11:15:03] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[11:15:03] <Bender> karma - coffee: 902
[11:15:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> oi, crutchy, aren't you lot sposed to give NZ guys shit about molesting sheep or something?
[11:16:36] <JamesNZ> Not anymore, I bribed him with coffee B-)
[11:16:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> see, there ya go. behold the power of coffee.
[11:17:09] <JamesNZ> coffee-- # That's all it's good for!
[11:17:09] <Bender> karma - coffee: 901
[11:17:23] <crutchy> https://www.youtube.com
[11:17:24] <NetCraft> ^ 03Two Steps From Hell - Strength Of A Thousand Men [Instrumental Core Remix] - YouTube
[11:17:38] <JamesNZ> Alright time for bed, night all \o
[11:17:43] -!- JamesNZ has quit [Quit: Busying myself...]
[11:19:47] <chromas> coffee++ # for spite
[11:19:47] <Bender> karma - coffee: 902
[11:20:31] <crutchy> subwoofers++
[11:20:31] <Bender> karma - subwoofers: 1
[11:20:59] <crutchy> ~restart
[11:21:01] <exec> successfully saved buckets file (26.5 kb)
[11:21:09] -!- exec has quit [Quit: dafuq]
[11:21:17] <crutchy> fuck
[11:22:12] <TheMightyBuzzard> https://www.youtube.com
[11:22:13] <NetCraft> ^ 032CELLOS - Thunderstruck [OFFICIAL VIDEO] - YouTube
[11:23:18] <TheMightyBuzzard> almost wanna go fishin but it's proper fuckin cold out there
[11:23:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> guess i can work on the api again
[11:28:02] <crutchy> damn. now i gotta load some ackadacka into my playlist
[11:28:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> man, you're an aussie... how could you NOT have them in your playlist?
[11:28:54] <chromas> derpaderpa?
[11:29:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> that'd be like me not having ZZ Top in mine
[11:29:43] <chromas> internet's no help
[11:29:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> https://www.youtube.com
[11:29:46] <chromas> "FlingFinder Melbourne Adult Personals"
[11:29:46] <NetCraft> ^ 03ZZ Top - La Grange - YouTube
[11:34:55] <TheMightyBuzzard> and just because i'm on a roll of rockin guitars... https://www.youtube.com
[11:34:58] <NetCraft> ^ 03Van Halen - Hot For Teacher [HD] - YouTube
[11:35:59] <chromas> now how's that gonna be in hd?
[11:36:08] * TheMightyBuzzard shurgs
[11:36:31] <chromas> would be nifty if they took the film and digitized it in hd
[11:36:48] <chromas> assuming they used film for music videos back then
[11:37:46] <chromas> I don't think I've seen the beginning of that. /me is highly amused
[11:39:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, i completely didn't remember that either
[11:51:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> nah, some minecraft first then api work
[12:02:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> whew, one floor of one wing to go and the first three floors of my keep are finished. only took me like four months.
[12:22:48] -!- exec [exec!~exec@utioner/T-800/BeVeryAfraid] has joined #Soylent
[12:23:59] <TheMightyBuzzard> ~weather crutchy
[12:24:00] <exec> Weather for Traralgon VIC, Australia - currently 51°F / 11°C, clear, wind NE at 8 mph, humidity 70% - Tuesday partly cloudy (36°F-64°F / 2°C-18°C), Wednesday partly cloudy (46°F-75°F / 8°C-24°C), Thursday partly cloudy (52°F-90°F / 11°C-32°C), Friday mostly cloudy (37°F-66°F / 3°C-19°C) - source: Google
[12:24:21] <crutchy> exec now has a new piece of awesomeness :D
[12:25:14] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh ya?
[12:26:33] <crutchy> startup directives inside script files
[12:26:35] <crutchy> https://github.com
[12:27:34] <crutchy> now scripts are pretty much self-contained
[12:28:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm
[12:28:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> well, single journal entries done now too
[12:28:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> http://tmbvm.ddns.net
[12:29:00] <crutchy> cool :D
[12:29:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> gonna doc it real quick
[12:29:10] <crutchy> topical journal entry too
[12:29:28] <crutchy> oh that's from march :p
[12:30:45] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - GNOME vs. Groupon - http://sylnt.us - I-bet-that-the-money-wins
[12:30:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, dev is a dump of live and my vm is a dump of dev
[12:35:48] <chromas> oh no! crutchy, he's got our secret passwords!
[12:36:11] <crutchy> well, hashes of them
[12:36:11] <chromas> (1066, the same as my bank pin)
[12:36:14] <crutchy> lol
[12:36:15] <ciri> hahaha
[12:36:17] <chromas> and the salt
[12:36:53] <crutchy> if we lose them we can always ask the NSA nicely
[12:37:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> and yer email addresses. prepare for v1@gr@ spam!
[12:37:08] <chromas> it's important, 'cause it's not like he has access to the entire database :D
[12:37:43] <chromas> nice; can I get bigger too while you're at it?
[12:37:54] <crutchy> devs have access to god server powahs, no?
[12:38:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> not supposed to but i do cause paulej72 and NCommander keep trying to put me on the sysadmin team.
[12:38:56] <crutchy> hahah you gunna get pwned
[12:39:07] <crutchy> your person that is :D
[12:39:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> i got enough admining to do for work. not interested in even more.
[12:39:46] <crutchy> speaking of which, where is our illustrious leadership?
[12:40:07] <crutchy> they not doin a dice on us?
[12:40:09] <TheMightyBuzzard> NC is on walkabout somewheres.
[12:40:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> pj is just having a busy work time.
[12:40:41] <TheMightyBuzzard> was around last night though
[12:40:56] <crutchy> yeah pj swings by occasionally
[12:41:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> crutchy, learn perl so's i can have a minion
[12:50:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> okay, that's all i got in my brain for api calls not needing you to auth
[12:51:42] <chromas> TheMightyBuzzard++
[12:51:42] <Bender> karma - themightybuzzard: 108
[12:52:15] <chromas> now you gotta come up with an auth interface to collect a session token
[12:52:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> eh, prolly just use oauth or something
[12:52:49] <chromas> can't just use the slash stuff?
[12:53:09] <TheMightyBuzzard> could if i wanted to use cookies
[12:53:09] <chromas> send user/pass, get a cookie string that has to be used afterward
[12:54:11] <chromas> well it could just be a string that gets returned to the user, who has to set it in a variable for requests
[12:54:21] <crutchy> maybe just a token attached to SN user account, like github api uses
[12:54:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> rather use oauth though cause that way i can revoke one bot easily by invalidating their secret keys.
[12:54:46] <chromas> [cookie: "bewbctl"]
[12:55:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> otherwise i gotta add a field to one of the user info tables named bot_banned
[12:55:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> yeah, guess i could do that.
[12:56:01] <crutchy> make it sorta like ssh keys in github
[12:56:15] <crutchy> user can add/revoke any time
[12:56:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> meh, just gonna either allow or disallow bots per user account i think. default to allow and revoke access if they abuse it.
[12:57:05] <crutchy> sounds good also
[12:57:17] <crutchy> like bot flag in mediawiki :)
[12:57:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> going to have to require https calls though
[12:58:14] <crutchy> thas ok
[12:58:48] <crutchy> well, for php anyways. never tried https with delphi or fp etc
[12:58:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> well not really but i think it's a good way to start moving the site entirely over to https
[12:59:42] <crutchy> ~suggest js hash of password on login submit in case of mitm over http
[12:59:50] <exec> *** suggestion successfully added to wiki - http://sylnt.us
[13:00:06] <chromas> once the api is 'done' then you can start porting slash to use it for web interface :)
[13:00:19] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm... fu on js
[13:00:41] <TheMightyBuzzard> this are an api, no js gets to get near it
[13:00:45] <crutchy> ~suggest-api gotta be at least one easter egg :)
[13:00:51] <exec> *** suggestion successfully added to wiki - http://sylnt.us
[13:01:08] <crutchy> nah the js thing was for the main site
[13:01:13] <TheMightyBuzzard> chromas, i actually could, yeah but it'd be slower
[13:01:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> crutchy, already got three easter eggs that i can think of in master.
[13:02:02] <chromas> crutchy: but if the server takes a user-hashed password, then a mitm would have the hash to pass in
[13:02:22] <crutchy> oh yeah
[13:02:24] <crutchy> duh
[13:02:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, might as well be plaintext stored pws then
[13:02:38] <chromas> though that doesn't help them if you're sharing passwords between other services
[13:03:37] <crutchy> maybe double-hash passwords for storage and single has with js for submit
[13:03:48] <crutchy> yeah im just making shit up now :p
[13:04:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm... guess i should add urls in to comments. though really you could construct that fine yourself.
[13:05:08] <chromas> don't need urls if the api doesn't need 'em
[13:05:18] <TheMightyBuzzard> nod nod
[13:05:21] <crutchy> sid/cid combo is fine
[13:05:45] * chromas imagines building an interface where the comments occasionally refresh and get inserted into their threads with unnecessary animation
[13:05:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> may put em in anyway, save you lot having to create them
[13:06:11] * crutchy is wondering whether the double-hash kookiness would be plausible
[13:06:20] <chromas> no
[13:06:29] <chromas> 'cause you'd still be sending the hash in the clear
[13:06:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> crutchy, it'd be exactly the same as just having a stronger password
[13:07:21] <crutchy> would it be any better against mitm, since you're not transmitting the actual password the user typed?
[13:07:31] <crutchy> and then hashing the hash to compare against the db
[13:07:45] <chromas> you could use a 1MB key
[13:08:06] <chromas> crypt to the max
[13:08:11] <crutchy> lol
[13:08:22] <chromas> tails -from the crypt
[13:08:34] <crutchy> exec used a big long key to post map images to the server
[13:08:40] <crutchy> but that was only over lan
[13:08:52] <chromas> the key should be larger than the data :)
[13:08:58] <TheMightyBuzzard> crutchy, no, wouldn't be any better against mitm. the attacker could just send the same hash and never need to know what the user typed.
[13:08:59] <crutchy> needed to secure it from mitm by my guinea pigs
[13:10:04] <crutchy> reason why i was wondering was more to do with preventing password interception for attempts on other sites like fb etc due to password reuse
[13:10:40] <crutchy> cos if users view soylent over http only, passwords are essentially being transmitted in cleartext
[13:10:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> one reason i'd like to use oauth
[13:12:31] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, there's really nothing we can do about that though if they wanna be idjits
[13:13:26] <TheMightyBuzzard> i mean we can redirect them to https but that's about it.
[13:13:42] <crutchy> i have unique password for SN so i'm not worried
[13:13:58] <TheMightyBuzzard> javascript rule is it can't be used for anything where it is required for the site to work.
[13:14:11] <crutchy> yeah that's fair enough
[13:14:19] <chromas> "crutchy's secret sn password hunter12345 luggage"
[13:14:36] <crutchy> chromas, s/luggage/pants/
[13:14:37] <exec> <crutchy> <chromas> "crutchy's secret sn password hunter12345 pants"
[13:14:38] <TheMightyBuzzard> and if ya do use it to add a feature, it has to degrade gracefully if js isn't present.
[13:14:53] <crutchy> nod
[13:15:39] <crutchy> might write a journal and then wander off to bed
[13:15:49] <crutchy> haf fun gents
[13:16:07] <TheMightyBuzzard> so, have default subs in the api link you to docs for the api? cause they only get called if you fubar'd up the call.
[13:19:55] <chromas> TheMightyBuzzard: how about a 💩 error?
[13:20:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> could if ya like but i think docs would be more useful
[13:22:14] <chromas> So any broken api calls would return a link to the docs?
[13:23:14] <Konomi> browser crashed while I wasn't even in my room x.x
[13:23:18] <TheMightyBuzzard> chromas, yep
[13:23:26] -!- mattie_p [mattie_p!~mattie_p@Soylent/Staff/Editor/mattiep] has joined #Soylent
[13:23:26] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v mattie_p] by juggler
[13:23:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> mornin, mattie_p
[13:23:57] <chromas> "Error: malformed api call; your dev is an idiot. Tell him to visit http://tmb.api"
[13:23:57] <NetCraft> ^ 03ERROR: The requested URL could not be retrieved
[13:24:05] <mattie_p> Hi, TheMightyBuzzard. Whatcha working on today?
[13:25:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> think i'm nearly done with an api for the site. at least for public calls that don't require authorization.
[13:25:42] <TheMightyBuzzard> guess i should allow for AC posting of comments/stories though.
[13:26:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> will allow folks to write command line scripts or phone/tablet apps for the site.
[13:27:28] <chromas> Konomi: pale moon died like that while I was asleep. Came back to the computer to no sign of a running browser to be found
[13:28:12] <chromas> TheMightyBuzzard++
[13:28:12] <Bender> karma - themightybuzzard: 109
[13:28:53] <chromas> coffee++ will soon be beat by your own karma
[13:28:53] <Bender> karma - coffee: 903
[13:29:22] <Konomi> caffeine++
[13:29:22] <Bender> karma - caffeine: 41
[13:29:48] <TheMightyBuzzard> caffeine++
[13:29:48] <Bender> karma - caffeine: 42
[13:29:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[13:29:50] <Bender> karma - coffee: 904
[13:30:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> http://tmbvm.ddns.net
[13:33:23] <chromas> Lol
[13:33:24] <ciri> hahaha
[13:33:32] <chromas> Operation Chickenbutt
[13:33:58] <chromas> tama: guess what
[13:34:13] <TheMightyBuzzard> wrong channel
[13:34:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> there am no tama here
[13:35:27] <ar> coffee--
[13:35:27] <Bender> karma - coffee: 903
[13:35:29] <ar> tea++
[13:35:29] <Bender> karma - tea: 238
[13:35:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm... does the api need a preview for subs?
[13:36:26] <chromas> Hmm, probably for webbies
[13:36:36] <chromas> Anyone wanting to html
[13:36:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> yeah, i spose.
[13:36:54] * chromas wonders how that would work
[13:37:08] <chromas> Would it return a whole page?
[13:37:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm... good question
[13:38:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> likely it'd return a whole page but without the sidebars or anything else but the rendered submission
[13:38:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> which is gonna be just a bit of a pita
[13:39:07] <TheMightyBuzzard> lots of css and extra crap would be involved
[13:39:35] <chromas> Can't just use the regular css?
[13:39:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> s'what i mean
[13:39:59] <chromas> But just not emit the other html
[13:40:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> vs giving back JUST the submission text.
[13:40:27] <TheMightyBuzzard> still have loads of css involved at the very least
[13:41:27] <crutchy> ~suggest-exec SN journal feed
[13:41:34] <exec> *** suggestion successfully added to wiki - http://sylnt.us
[13:41:34] <chromas> Yeah, maybe give back the html block that represents the comment, with whatever mangling slash will do upon posting
[13:42:08] <crutchy> ~g'night
[13:42:14] <crutchy> ~g'night all
[13:42:15] * exec dexterously slides a coffee++ mug of bewb to all
[13:42:26] <TheMightyBuzzard> nite, crutchy
[13:42:28] <chromas> As long as it's as correct we slash will make it, let the client worry about prettiness
[13:42:36] <chromas> Night crutchy
[13:42:58] <chromas> s/we/as/
[13:44:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> eh, i can prolly rig it up to spit out both a "exactly as on SN", a "just the story as we would render it without our pretty dressings", and a plaintext version.
[13:44:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> it's all coming back as json anyway
[13:44:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> can just stuff each version in a hash
[13:53:19] <TheMightyBuzzard> think i'll monkey with that later. need more minecrafting.
[14:29:59] <paulej72> I am alive and well.
[14:30:14] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Official Demands $16k To Fulfill FOIA Request, Prosecutor Says Official's Arrest Imminent - http://sylnt.us - a-prosecutor-I-can-get-behind
[14:30:30] <paulej72> I just am trying to catch up at work for things I put off since February :P
[14:35:51] blackmoore|afk is now known as Blackmoore
[14:36:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> quality slacking, that
[14:36:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> mornin, Blackmoore
[14:38:54] <Blackmoore> mornin
[14:38:59] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[14:38:59] <Bender> karma - coffee: 904
[14:39:48] <Blackmoore> what's up?
[14:39:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[14:39:53] <Bender> karma - coffee: 905
[14:40:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> minecrafting and pondering what else needs done to the api to release a 0.1 version
[14:40:37] <Blackmoore> cool cool.
[14:40:48] <Blackmoore> thanks for the script help
[14:41:25] <Blackmoore> now i just have to figure out what is causing the server to crash.
[14:42:07] <Blackmoore> but i didnt have enough brainpower yesterday to even look at the logs.
[14:42:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> nod nod
[14:42:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> reminds me, i needa nuke the old logs from mine
[14:55:27] <paulej72> Blackmoore: not enough memory
[15:02:08] <Blackmoore> probable - but i ve been comforably rrunning in 2Gb
[15:03:06] <Blackmoore> but this is a modded sever - so there is a good chance that one or some combination / interaction is also happening
[15:03:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> how much memory you have in the server and what are your memory settings on the command line?
[15:18:20] <Blackmoore> 2GB, and 2GB. like i said it could be the fault
[15:20:14] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, absolutely. you gotta leave room for the server to have shit like the kernel in memory.
[15:49:36] <Blackmoore> yup. I'm still fiddling. may have to upgrade to 4gb
[15:50:39] <Blackmoore> the server shouldnt need more than 1.5gb to work, but that also depends on how many of us are on.
[16:11:29] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Linux Community Mulls NSA Involvement With systemd - http://sylnt.us - trust-no-one
[16:25:46] -!- SirFinkus has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[16:35:56] <Blackmoore> ok. i have to admit i thought to that. and then dismissed the idea as conspiracy theory.
[16:36:40] <Blackmoore> but hey. one init system, tied into everything, nice and easy attacj vector..
[16:37:15] <Blackmoore> never mind that the NSA has been using Linux for years. they like what it can do.
[16:47:37] <nick> in many ways, conspiracy or no it's inevitable
[16:47:56] <nick> the NSA wouldn't be doing its job if they let all these major linux distros run wild without a way in
[16:48:55] <nick> and as you said, systemd is a great way in
[16:51:24] <nick> if they are not at minimum trying to get in through these methods then they're not doing their job properly.
[16:58:10] <Konomi> irony is
[16:58:20] <Konomi> systemd isn't really giving them any more exploit space
[16:58:27] <Konomi> there was still other things doing what it does most of now
[16:58:34] <Konomi> could just go after those instead
[17:00:00] <nick> one would assume they're not putting all their eggs in one basket
[17:01:00] <nick> there would have been progress before systemd, otherwise it goes back to they suck at doing their job, regardless of the legality/moral standing of it.
[17:01:08] <Konomi> well you could argue by having a more diverse distribution of eggs you have more different ways to exploit the eggs ;p
[17:02:05] <nick> can argue things either way, and im sure the NSA is prepared for either outcome
[17:02:25] <Konomi> people over estimate the nsa a lot
[17:02:39] <Konomi> if you watch jake's presentations they generally go after the low hanging fruit
[17:02:42] <nick> i dont know what their capabilities are
[17:02:48] <nick> all im saying is they have to be at least trying
[17:03:01] <Konomi> well thanks tot he snowden leaks we actually do know
[17:03:13] <Konomi> software wise none of it surprised me
[17:03:21] <Konomi> hardware wise was definitly a surprise and super creepy
[17:03:40] <nick> but with how things move, the snowden files are of that time, things are going to progress beyond that
[17:03:54] <Konomi> ofc and so will software as well
[17:04:03] <nick> indeed
[17:04:12] <Konomi> I doubt hte nsa are going to drastically change their tactics though
[17:04:23] <Konomi> even though we now know what they were doing and can predict where they are going
[17:05:14] <Blackmoore> and yeah - low hanging fruit is what they like
[17:05:52] <Blackmoore> they have got to be salivating at the new generaton of TV's - all internet wifi ready, with a camera and a microphone built in..
[17:06:20] <Blackmoore> someone had to ask - how could we make hacking linux easier
[17:06:46] <Blackmoore> and make it something people will want. or be required to install
[17:07:17] <nick> and just talking about the NSA doesn't really help either, there are lots of other agencies that will have their own projects for these kinds of things.
[17:07:41] <Blackmoore> sure; you could do that through binary blobs attached to video drivers
[17:07:56] <Konomi> well the best thing to come out of the leaks is this
[17:08:00] <Blackmoore> but that doesnt get everyone
[17:08:01] <Konomi> they cna't break strong crypto
[17:08:06] <Konomi> and they have no answer to it
[17:08:09] <Blackmoore> nope
[17:08:18] <nick> indeed
[17:09:18] <nick> all is not lost, but the only way to ensure it stays that way is to keep in the mindset that they are always on the heels of progress
[17:09:20] <Konomi> I'm trying to find the one where Jacob goes over them custom embedding hardware into peoples laptops
[17:11:08] <Konomi> https://www.youtube.com
[17:11:09] <NetCraft> ^ 03Jacob Applebaum: To Protect And Infect, Part 2 [30c3] - YouTube
[17:11:09] <Konomi> here it is
[17:11:14] <nick> but to be conspiracy theorist for a minute, that supposes they're trying to find evidence rather than plant it. 'suspicious' person with 100% encrypted traffic and data, why find the evidence when you can make some.
[17:11:27] <Konomi> you want to know all about the stuff they do to people and their pcs
[17:11:29] <Konomi> there it is
[17:11:44] <Blackmoore> http://soylentnews.org
[17:11:45] <NetCraft> ^ 04SN comment by Anonymous Coward
[17:12:27] <nick> i remember a while ago reading some leaked GCHQ docs which listed many of their 'tools'
[17:12:53] <nick> and all i saw with the tools was, using 2 or 3 of them in combination would be the way to set up anyone
[17:12:59] <Konomi> what annoys me is there's good reaosn to believe that certain agency was DDoSing freaking freenode
[17:13:25] <Blackmoore> they were
[17:13:33] <Konomi> kinda makes the nsa look nice in comparassion
[17:13:43] <Konomi> cayse hey they're just spying on you
[17:13:51] <Konomi> not wrecking parts of the network you actually freaking use
[17:14:06] <Blackmoore> true, the NSA really doesnt DO anythign with the data
[17:14:23] <nick> the nsa is a tool for the other agencies
[17:14:25] <Blackmoore> that's some other agencies job
[17:14:40] <nick> i'm sure the CIA wouldn't take advantage of those tools
[17:14:43] <Blackmoore> FBI, CIA, FTA
[17:15:05] <Konomi> worst part is I had to sit through those attacks
[17:15:07] <Blackmoore> hell, i've seen agancies use other agencies as cover
[17:15:14] <Konomi> I remember them that's how bad they were
[17:15:43] <Blackmoore> i vaugly remeber a ddos that was officially run by the dept of commerce.
[17:15:50] <Konomi> I also can't think of a reaosn for anyone to be poking freenode they have some of the most strict rules of any damn irc network
[17:16:36] <nick> doesn't have to be a good reason, just some memos passed around inside the agencies which make it sound like a threat in some way
[17:16:50] <Konomi> they irony of that
[17:17:03] <Konomi> considering they'r eprobably using half the software that freenode supports chat channels for
[17:17:14] <nick> I can only ever conclude, the people that action those kind of things arn't people who understand what they're actually singing off on
[17:17:20] <nick> oh, completely
[17:17:49] <Konomi> it's just a collective face palm really
[17:17:56] <Konomi> don't know if I should hate em or like em
[17:18:12] <Konomi> cause they've been really really good at encouraging everyone to encrpyt freaking everything
[17:18:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> woah, channel exploded while i was drawing some redstone circuitry out
[17:18:37] <Konomi> thanks for giving lazy people a reason to care guys I've been trying to get them to secure their shit forever
[17:18:52] <nick> they do seem to have facepalmed in the way it has increased online security quite a lot
[17:18:59] <nick> people are taking it much more seriously now
[17:19:09] <Konomi> http://www.wired.com \o/
[17:19:10] <NetCraft> ^ 03Encrypted Web Traffic More Than Doubles After NSA Revelations | WIRED
[17:19:12] <nick> the result is the same, even if they're only thinking about being a target of 'cybercrime'
[17:19:47] <nick> which is the perspective most non-tech people have taken
[17:19:49] <nick> that i know anyway
[17:20:06] <nick> russian and chinese mobs trying to steal all your shit fear
[17:20:21] <Konomi> well irony is
[17:20:30] <Konomi> people doing the wrong thing are going to be using protection anyway
[17:20:33] <Konomi> cause they have more to lose
[17:20:51] <Konomi> so there's no point trying to get the low hanging fruit
[17:21:04] <Konomi> you're just picking up the idiots not the real douche bags
[17:21:04] <nick> well, depends what their goal is
[17:21:10] <Konomi> true
[17:21:17] <Konomi> I was going for logic I know they're not a huge fan of it
[17:21:18] <nick> low hanging fruit proves how effective it is, and think how much more they could do with 20% more budhet
[17:21:26] <nick> budget*
[17:21:46] <nick> works well on the statistics to get the low hanging fruit, prove the system works.
[17:22:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> personally i'm just thinking it'd be a really, really good idea to not be running systemd on anything important going forward. they're going to be after it hard cause it gives them more bang for their buck if it becomes ubiquitous.
[17:23:02] <Konomi> sysvinit is already common
[17:23:04] <nick> nearly all, if not all of the stories of people being caught in these ways, have been idiots organizing their criminality on facebook and such
[17:23:08] <Konomi> as is everything else systemd is replacing
[17:23:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya but not the one init to rule them all like systemd is becoming.
[17:23:35] <Konomi> actually
[17:23:47] <Konomi> how many linux distros werne't using sysvinit before systemd came along?
[17:23:53] <Konomi> 2?
[17:23:55] <Konomi> maybe 5?
[17:24:08] <Konomi> I can't thinkl fo any
[17:24:12] <TheMightyBuzzard> all the ubuntu-based ones for certain.
[17:24:14] <Konomi> with maybe the exception of gentoo
[17:24:24] <Konomi> they have rinit
[17:24:58] <TheMightyBuzzard> can run sysv init scripts != runs sysv init for this discussion purposes btw
[17:25:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> cause both upstart and systemd can technically run a sysv script if you really want them to.
[17:27:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> my absolute most beefy beef with it though is it's new. you never put "new" on anything important. it hasn't stood the test of time without bugs being found.
[17:28:12] <Blackmoore> amen
[17:28:29] <Konomi> sure new is a good reason
[17:28:43] <Konomi> my down sides to it so far are it's new new is not testing
[17:28:44] <TheMightyBuzzard> i mean there's a reason you don't run gentoo on a production server...
[17:28:48] <Konomi> tested*
[17:28:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> nod nod
[17:28:57] <Konomi> and the other is it's a bit too inderdependant
[17:29:01] <Konomi> that's my only two gripes
[17:29:21] <Konomi> I was a bit stuck up on the binary logs but eh makes no sense anymore
[17:29:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> binary logs are a minor gripe too but really only a minor one
[17:30:27] <TheMightyBuzzard> have a pretty big problem with it pulling in world+dog as far as features though. single point of failure for a wider surface of breakage.
[17:31:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> i mean if pulseaudio failed before, it'd just fail quietly and not have an opportunity to take out your whole init system.
[17:31:39] <Konomi> I've already looked intot he log thing
[17:31:43] <Konomi> you can copy the log file to another machine
[17:31:52] <Konomi> read any file with --file on journald
[17:31:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> nod nod, it's easy enough to get around
[17:31:57] <Konomi> and corruption is pretty well handled
[17:32:24] <Konomi> and /var/log/ is a freaking mess anyway
[17:32:32] <Konomi> everyone go do an ls right now and look at the damn crap
[17:32:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> depends on the box
[17:33:05] <TheMightyBuzzard> eh, i got like 10 things in it, not counting backups
[17:33:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> desktop box though
[17:39:10] <Konomi> just annoys me
[17:39:26] <Konomi> speically the way people gripe about DEs deping on it
[17:39:42] <Konomi> news flash they're depping on it cause they're sick of supporting 4 different console daemons
[17:40:36] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Neil deGrasse Tyson Fact-Checked Interstellar. - http://sylnt.us - planetary-intergalactic
[17:59:13] -!- Plasmastar [Plasmastar!~Plasma@137.118.xxg.oqw] has joined #Soylent
[17:59:31] -!- Plasmastar has quit [Client Quit]
[18:05:44] -!- n1 [n1!~nick@Soylent/Staff/Editor/n1] has joined #Soylent
[18:05:44] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v n1] by juggler
[18:05:57] -!- nick has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by n1))]
[18:06:06] n1 is now known as nick
[18:51:28] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Burning Ammonium Dichromate and Mercury Thiocyanate - http://sylnt.us - ph'nglui-mglw'nafh-Cthulhu-R'lyeh-wgah'nagl-fhtagn
[18:57:49] <chromas> init aside, most of the software is the same between distros anyhow
[19:53:45] <ar> http://www.pointerpointer.com
[19:53:45] <NetCraft> ^ 03Pointer Pointer by @StudioMoniker
[20:00:19] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Time Lapse ISS Video - http://sylnt.us - final-frontier
[20:15:08] <Blackmoore> http://pipeline.corante.com
[20:15:08] <NetCraft> ^ 03In the Pipeline:
[20:41:46] -!- arti has quit [Quit: Ende gut, alles gut.]
[20:42:32] -!- arti [arti!~arti@iminylescdbcem.com] has joined #Soylent
[20:52:43] <crutchy> coffee++
[20:52:43] <Bender> karma - coffee: 906
[21:01:37] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[21:01:37] <Bender> karma - coffee: 907
[21:04:34] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[21:04:34] <Bender> karma - coffee: 908
[21:04:59] <ar> coffee--
[21:04:59] <Bender> karma - coffee: 907
[21:05:09] <ar> you're upvoting overzelously ;)
[21:05:12] <ar> tea++
[21:05:12] <Bender> karma - tea: 239
[21:05:26] <ar> tea++
[21:05:26] <Bender> karma - tea: 240
[21:05:26] <nick> fruit_flavour_carbonated_stimulation_drink++
[21:05:26] <Bender> karma - fruit_flavour_carbonated_stimulation_drink: 1
[21:05:45] <ar> nick: it makes your teeth bad
[21:06:17] <crutchy> ~restart
[21:06:18] <exec> successfully saved buckets file (25.5 kb)
[21:06:19] <chromas> So does tea; look at the Brits >:)
[21:06:26] -!- exec has quit [Quit: dafuq]
[21:06:53] <ar> brits simply don't clean their teeth
[21:07:03] <chromas> They clean it with tea
[21:07:13] <nick> lol
[21:07:24] <chromas> gtk-- # for broken autocompletion in the file dialogs
[21:07:24] <Bender> karma - gtk: -4
[21:07:34] <ar> gtk-- # for existing
[21:07:34] <Bender> karma - gtk: -5
[21:07:36] <nick> well, it is true that chairman mao did 'rinse' his teeth with green tea
[21:07:42] <nick> instead of cleaning them
[21:08:48] <nick> "The result was that Mao's teeth were green and his gums oozed pus from infections. Li encouraged the Great Helmsman to brush, without much success. "Does a tiger brush his teeth?" Mao demanded. "
[21:09:49] <chromas> A tiger will brush its teeth if it finds the appropriate accouterments in your bag after eating
[21:24:31] <Blackmoore> and drink another coffee.
[21:24:35] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[21:24:35] <Bender> karma - coffee: 908
[21:28:20] -!- idetuxs [idetuxs!~idetuxs@221-698-27-38.cab.prima.net.ar] has joined #Soylent
[21:36:47] <ar> tea++
[21:36:47] <Bender> karma - tea: 241
[21:36:49] <ar> coffee--
[21:36:49] <Bender> karma - coffee: 907
[21:38:23] -!- mattie_p has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[21:50:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[21:50:50] <Bender> karma - coffee: 908
[21:50:59] <TheMightyBuzzard> bit late in the day for it but oh well
[22:19:48] <chromas> "Whats the difference between a Unix, Linux, and a Intel. I hope I spelled "Intel" right. Anyways, I have two Operating Systems on my laptop, Linux Kubuntu, and Windows 7. I know a few about Linux, but I just installed it so I don't know that much. I would like to know more about Unix, and Intel, and what's better, and would like to see a visual picture about Unix to. By the way I ordered the Linux Kubuntu and Ubuntu for free, it took 8 weeks to come in. Is it
[22:19:48] <chromas> possible to request a free cd for Unix? If so what website can I subscribe a Free Unix cd."
[22:23:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> ouch. painful english.
[22:24:43] <juggs> I see somewhat of a learning curve in that individual's near future
[22:24:59] * chromas goes off to install an Intel
[22:30:10] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - BeagleBoard.org to Release New Beagleboard-X15 - http://sylnt.us - new-and-improved
[22:56:20] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v arti] by juggler
[23:03:40] Blackmoore is now known as blackmoore|afk
[23:30:55] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Radical Ideas for Reinventing College, From Stanford’s Design School. - http://sylnt.us - or-just-deeper-into-debt?
[23:35:39] -!- SirFinkus [SirFinkus!~SirFinkus@l-64-313-06-125.hsd0.wa.comcast.net] has joined #Soylent
[23:48:55] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com
[23:48:55] <NetCraft> ^ 03(1/4) Intro/History: Introducing a 100-year-old mechanical computer - YouTube
[23:49:03] <SirFinkus> real computers have wheels
[23:51:08] -!- TheMightyBuzzard has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]