#Soylent | Logs for 2014-09-23

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[00:01:17] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Nvidia Debunks Moon Landing Conspiracy Photo Using Virtual Light - http://sylnt.us - co-conspirators
[00:03:07] -!- Preston [Preston!~Preston@bxht8.thefirehorn.com] has joined #Soylent
[00:03:40] <Preston> Hey all, ltns.
[00:03:53] <Blackmoore> nite all
[00:03:53] <ciri> nitty nite! Blackmoore
[00:04:03] Blackmoore is now known as blackmoore|afk
[00:06:29] <SpallsHurgenson> yay, my IR remote for my computer is working :)
[00:13:54] <juggs> hey Preston and welcome :)
[00:17:48] * SpallsHurgenson is suddenly bored by his new toy and chucks it into the corner
[00:18:26] <juggs> that didn't last long
[00:18:53] <SpallsHurgenson> I spent longer getting it to work, I know, but that was the fun part
[00:19:00] <SpallsHurgenson> honestly, who the hell needs a remote for a computer?
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[00:21:53] <juggs> might be useful if using it to show films etc to a big screen
[00:22:19] <SpallsHurgenson> yeah, but I still need to mouse about to select the file :)
[00:24:36] <juggs> well that does rather defeat the point
[00:24:59] <swiss> you need a better frontend
[00:25:11] <juggs> mebbe it is useful for xbmc type setups (??)
[00:25:24] <SpallsHurgenson> or a better remote (it's a cheap thing that came with the motherboard :)
[00:28:21] <juggs> my motherboard has some function to play a CD at a set time. So let's see how that goes - power up to put CD in and access bios and set time, power off. Weird, why would anyone even both coding such a thing?
[00:29:27] <SpallsHurgenson> probably fairly easy to do, and adds a checkbox to the box-copy :)
[00:30:32] <chromas> ✔ Superfluous features!
[00:33:12] <juggs> Pretty sure it required the 4 pin CD audio cable connecting to work. Never cared enough to find out.
[00:34:01] <SpallsHurgenson> probably also requires an optical drive installed and who still has one of those these days? :-)
[00:34:28] <swiss> i remember getting pissed when they took it out of the mac mini
[00:34:34] <swiss> cursed them for being idiots
[00:34:45] <SpallsHurgenson> I still do.
[00:34:50] <swiss> a year later, i was like "holy shit, that's brilliant"
[00:35:14] <juggs> I have one in my desktop lump. But that's relatively geriatric these days. I'll likely keep it in there if I ever get around to upgrading the m/b etc
[00:35:24] <SpallsHurgenson> I'm not... but then I often need to transfer big files and the recipients are usually unable to handle Dropbox (much less FTP)
[00:35:53] <SpallsHurgenson> and I sure as hell ain't buyin' 'em a flash-drive for every transfer (or accepting it back after its been in their dirty machines :)
[00:36:10] <juggs> wise
[00:36:33] <SpallsHurgenson> so... need an optical drive that can burn discs. stupid apple
[00:37:41] <swiss> usb drive works fine for niche cases
[00:37:51] <juggs> generic external? probably a damn sight cheaper than getting an internal drive repaired when it inevitably shits its pants.
[00:37:56] -!- Subsentient [Subsentient!~WhiteRat@Soylent/Staff/Editor/Subsentient] has joined #Soylent
[00:37:56] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Subsentient] by juggler
[00:37:56] <SpallsHurgenson> yeah, but I gotta pay extra for it :)
[00:38:12] <juggs> this i sapple we're taking about
[00:39:11] <juggs> hey Subsentient - you doing OK?
[00:39:32] <Subsentient> juggs: I am mostly ok, yes.
[00:40:00] <SpallsHurgenson> speaking of repairs... I was quite disappointed when the video-card that died in my computer didn't magically start working when I plugged it into another PC
[00:40:05] <juggs> good to see you back :)
[00:47:22] <juggs> were you expecting a miracle Spalls?
[00:47:41] <SpallsHurgenson> sorta :)
[00:48:00] <juggs> likely just a popped cap
[00:48:24] <SpallsHurgenson> no, I think the fan died at one point and it fried.
[00:48:47] <juggs> ahh, yeh - that would be terminal :D
[00:49:26] <SpallsHurgenson> but maybe the CPU and GPU just had a falling out on the old PC and a change of locale would get everything working again :)
[00:52:15] <SpallsHurgenson> alas, it was not to be... and now I got a big hunka plastic and silicon lying dead on the desk :(
[00:52:49] <juggs> always a good excuse for an upgrade
[00:52:50] <mythterj> Shit if that worked we could just all swap failed cards and drives and we would all be happy. I have a drawer full of stuff looking for a new home.
[00:52:50] <ciri> i hope you wiped your ass :)
[00:54:34] <SpallsHurgenson> It worked (sorta) for me once before... although I was fairly certain the "failure" that time was more due to an underpowered PSU on the first machine :)
[01:01:53] <mythterj> I had a case of bulging capaciters that gave me brief hope once. Luckily a close look at the MOBO prevented me from making a fool of myself.
[01:02:57] <SpallsHurgenson> that sounds like a nerdy pick-up line, "Hey babe, is this a bulging capacitor in my pocket or am I just happy to see you?"
[01:04:27] <chromas> "No, it's a capacitor and it's not much of a bulge"
[01:06:41] <SpallsHurgenson> ouch :)
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[01:11:36] * juggs chucks another couple of logs on the fire
[01:12:03] * chromas makes a 'fruit smoothie' for the first time ever; can't drink 'cause it's too thicl
[01:12:18] <chromas> Guess I should learn how before doing
[01:12:31] <juggs> use a spoon :D
[01:12:47] <chromas> spoons++
[01:12:47] <Bender> karma - spoons: 1
[01:13:13] * SpallsHurgenson has no fireplace, so revs up a few more GPUs instead
[01:14:23] <juggs> I have fireplaces in every room, but no fire on the go right now - that was the #soylent firepit I refuelled
[01:15:07] <SpallsHurgenson> bah, you wanna heat this place up you gotta be more like wasshisname, our resident troll :)
[01:15:14] <swiss> chromas: just don't use a straw
[01:15:55] <systemd> Did somedoby mention flames?
[01:16:11] <juggs> loooooool
[01:17:14] -!- JamesNZ [JamesNZ!~james@43-567-441-22.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #Soylent
[01:20:17] <silverly> java--
[01:20:17] <Bender> karma - java: -5
[01:20:19] <silverly> java--
[01:20:19] <Bender> karma - java: -6
[01:20:23] <silverly> java--
[01:20:24] <Bender> karma - java: -7
[01:21:17] * SpallsHurgenson wonders what is getting all the hate: the country, the chemical or the language
[01:21:21] <chromas> java-- won't keep the fire going around here
[01:21:21] <Bender> karma - java: -8
[01:21:42] <chromas> there's a country called systemd?
[01:21:46] <chromas> Or java?
[01:21:51] <JamesNZ> I never understood why people hate Java so much.
[01:22:45] <SpallsHurgenson> its an island. part of indonesia I think
[01:22:58] <chromas> oh yeah, java the hut
[01:23:41] <juggs> big ass volcano isn't it?
[01:24:47] <juggs> ~45 active volcanoes on Java - sounds like a nice place to live!
[01:25:13] <chromas> blueberry_seeds_in_my_teeth--
[01:25:13] <Bender> karma - blueberry_seeds_in_my_teeth: -1
[01:25:25] <SpallsHurgenson> wait... blueberries have seeds?
[01:25:30] * SpallsHurgenson has never noticed that
[01:25:33] <juggs> ya - can;t see that one getting much use :)
[01:26:43] <juggs> hmmm googlying "blueberry seeds" does not give the expected results :/
[01:26:50] <silverly> language
[01:26:59] <chromas> suddenly got yellow out and a bit thundery
[01:27:17] <silverly> literally a living hell to develop in.
[01:30:31] * silverly not actually literally but pretty damn close.
[01:35:22] <juggs> I didn't find it troublesome last time I used it - but that was something fairly trivial.
[01:39:37] <silverly> i dunno, whenever i had to use it, its always a PITA.
[01:40:05] <silverly> im making a web app server now, and my library makes me uses annotations
[01:41:40] <silverly> annotations are the dumbest fucking thing in code "lets make this code impossible to debug since there is some magic glue that the programmer cant see since since by using an annotations it saves 3 lines of copypaste code"
[01:41:58] * silverly rants
[01:50:08] <juggs> ok - I just read some guff on Java annotations - I'm none the wiser what purpose they serve :/
[01:50:39] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - China Clamps Down on Web, Pinching Companies Like Google - http://sylnt.us - knowing-when-you're-not-wanted
[01:52:49] <juggs> hmm - now I'm reading something about self-modifying code - I think I need a lie down
[01:54:10] <swiss> AI CODE
[01:55:05] <SpallsHurgenson> why does China need the Internet? The Net's great strength is the dissemination of information, and we're straight-out GIVING all our secrets to 'em anyway.
[01:55:29] <juggs> ugh - and now polymorphic code.... ARRRGH! Break out the single malt.
[01:56:04] <Popeidol> SpallsHurgenson: I assume for the same reason as the rest of us
[01:56:10] <Popeidol> to send photos of our genitalia to each other
[01:56:48] <silverly> Literally death
[01:56:53] * silverly off to lunch
[01:57:10] <SpallsHurgenson> dead people don't get lunch breaks
[01:57:28] <juggs> you know this how?
[01:58:08] <SpallsHurgenson> erm... umm... I used to work in HR?
[01:59:42] <swiss> lunch violation
[02:00:27] <juggs> don't they tend to stink up the place though? all that decomposing all over the place will have HR and Health and Safety going to war.
[02:02:15] <SpallsHurgenson> nah, just transfer 'em all to sales; its so full of bullshit over there anyway, nobody will notice the smell :)
[02:03:10] <chromas> that's not a person; it's an air freshener
[02:06:53] <JamesNZ> food++
[02:06:53] <Bender> karma - food: 3
[02:13:35] <juggs> This comment in a PC hardware discussion just made my day - "Also there are led lightnings on the fans. I couldn't find a way to disable the lightning. is there a way to shut them off. I'm using the pc to watch movies, those lightnings will be a big distraction."
[02:14:57] <juggs> It brings to mind the picture of someone settling in to watch a good film, hitting play and lightning zapping all over the room and them saying "Well that's a little distracting" - talk about understatement :D
[02:15:21] <SpallsHurgenson> dunno about disabling it, but he could use a conductive rod to redirect it
[02:16:56] <juggs> clearly not a native english speaker and I in no way intend to mock that, it's more the comedic impact of their accidental substitution of "lightning" made me imagine funny scenarios.
[02:17:00] <SpallsHurgenson> just jam a big copper rod into his motherboard, turn on the PC and all his LED lightning problems will be over :)
[02:19:40] <juggs> perhaps that's the problem with your GPU - needs impaling with a copper stake
[02:21:08] <SpallsHurgenson> well, it worked for Frankenstein
[02:39:50] <Subsentient> $wz
[02:39:51] <aqu4> [Game 1] Name: 3v3 | Map: NTW3v3_NoArty2-T1 | Host: NeoVortex Lv4 | Players: 4/6 | IP: 189.69.67.231 | Version: 3.1.1
[02:39:51] <aqu4> [Game 2] Name: This is real NTW | Map: NTWFor4-v3-T1 | Host: Subsentient | Players: 2/4 | IP: 216.161.165.96 | Version: 3.1.1
[02:39:52] <aqu4> [Game 3] Name: Harley | Map: deathvalley-T1 | Host: Dr Death | Players: 3/4 (private) | IP: 98.248.243.84 | Version: 3.1.1
[02:39:53] <aqu4> End of games list.
[02:39:58] * Subsentient wants players
[02:40:46] <SpallsHurgenson> why do I hear that in a diabolic voice?
[02:41:17] <juggs> I have no idea what it is
[02:46:31] * silverly back from lonch
[02:47:05] <silverly> games o.O
[02:48:37] -!- rand has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
[02:48:54] <juggs> think it's warzone something or other
[02:49:44] <silverly> neat
[02:50:06] <SpallsHurgenson> is that anything like battlezone?
[02:51:11] <juggs> My reverse find says Warzone 2100.
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[03:27:07] <Leebert> juggs: Yes. It is usually best to disable your Tesla coil prior to settling down for movie night.
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[03:30:51] <juggs> I'll bear that in mind Leebert - at least, I will next time I have a Tesla coil and a movie worth watching in temporal juxtaposition.
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[03:33:18] <Leebert> Safety first, ya know.
[03:40:27] <juggs> Na, gotta go sometime - for me it would be preferable to do that in some insta-splodge death event than trickling out a decade or more of near death care home crud incapable of basic hygiene and generally losing marbles.
[03:42:03] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Microsoft Gets Flack over "Rubbish" UK Data - http://sylnt.us - blame-game
[03:44:53] <Leebert> By that standard, I probably should go commit suicide now. :)
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[03:57:45] <juggs> Not at all Leebert. It was just a dig at western society's distinct lack of end of life care. Until that is sorted, personally I'd rather not rot away in a death home. I'd rather do something risky earlier and maybe peg out sooner. It's a personal choice of course - but I'm just not convinced I want to live to 100 if I'm a drooling incontinent oaf for the last 20% of that time. Better in my mind to live a full shorter life than eek out some puritan
[03:57:45] <juggs> ical existence that is completely grey and devoid of highs and lows. We choose our own particular path on this one, I'm just stating my position, I don't encourage anyone to follow my path.
[04:03:36] <chromas> who says it has to be devoid of lows? :)
[04:09:55] <juggs> the lows are unavoidable - might as well throw in some highs
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[05:08:57] <Konomi> http://paste.ofcode.org
[05:08:57] <monopoly> ^ 03Paste ofCode
[05:09:04] <Konomi> don't work? Fix it yourself >.<
[05:12:11] <chromas> ofcode is secretly getting you to write all the code they need
[05:12:14] * juggs pokes Konomi - inserts another coin... still doesn't work. Wait what is this frustration dump of code supposed to do?
[05:12:23] <JamesNZ> ~gday chromas
[05:12:24] <exec> * JamesNZ fanatically throws a bathtub of pancakes at chromas
[05:12:44] <Konomi> juggs: my replacement for pm-utils under systemd
[05:13:37] <chromas> ~g'day JamesNZ
[05:13:38] <exec> * chromas prematurely postulates a tinfoil hat of spew towards JamesNZ
[05:14:14] <Konomi> my netbook went from 4 hours battery life to 7 from writing that code
[05:16:02] <chromas> JamesNZ: did you get the code figured out?
[05:18:27] <JamesNZ> chromas: Nah, I ran out of time so I gave up and brute forced it.
[05:18:45] <chromas> aw
[05:19:07] * chromas nominates JamesNZ as the Bender wrangler
[05:19:09] <juggs> Konomi, I have a cheat sheet stowed away for power management and suspend crap on my laptop - paste this into X and add that in there. I suspect it will all be blown away once systemd lands with me. The fragmentation, it makes me sad. Perhaps I'll code systemd-pm-utild. No I won't as I have no idea where to start.
[05:19:23] <Konomi> hehe
[05:19:37] * JamesNZ bows humbly at the nomination
[05:20:08] * juggs decides Konomi is ebil
[05:20:15] <Konomi> +.+
[05:20:20] <JamesNZ> ~define ebil
[05:20:22] <exec> [urbandictionary] 3ebil: 1) Plesantly or cutely evil. 2) Slighly Evil But without malicious intent.
[05:20:49] * JamesNZ deduces that juggs finds Konomi cute!
[05:20:50] <Konomi> lies I am totally capable
[05:21:03] <chromas> it's because of the i; makes your evil diminutive
[05:21:17] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - NIH Bioethicist: "Why I Hope to Die at 75" - http://sylnt.us - but-what-dreams-may-come-when-I-have-shuffled-off-this-mortal-coil?
[05:21:29] <juggs> I see no mention of capability Konomi
[05:22:25] * Konomi whines
[05:22:41] <Konomi> hmm seems I fixed the slow down issue on my functions
[05:22:54] <Konomi> at least I hope so ._.
[05:24:42] <juggs> JamesNZ, I sincerely doubt Konomi gives a shit what I think or find. As to their being "cute" - feck knows, isn't that something puppies do??
[05:25:55] <Konomi> I'll be over here focusing on the code ;p
[05:30:32] <JamesNZ> juggs: Heh.
[05:30:40] <Konomi> "Why I hope to be an android at 75"
[05:31:54] <Konomi> must abstract all the things
[05:32:59] <Konomi> also idk about all GNU projects but nano at least fixed my bug so fast compared to any of my other bug reports on other projects
[05:33:45] <Konomi> hmm
[05:33:57] <Konomi> Subject: Don't leave planning for Windows Server 2003 End of Support until its too late!
[05:34:05] <Konomi> shame there's no feedback/contact info
[05:34:10] <Konomi> I was going to ask if it ran on linux
[05:38:30] <juggs> in a hypervisor perhaps - oh wait did we go back to hating centralised computing and shared resources or did the cloud die and someone dream up a new way of selling us old as new.
[05:39:06] <Konomi> https://chrome.google.com
[05:40:15] <juggs> ya - not clickying
[05:40:32] <chromas> you don't lick anything, do you?
[05:40:47] <chromas> it's a chrome extension
[05:41:03] <chromas> so it's totally evil
[05:41:26] <chromas> we should invent the p2p cloud
[05:41:27] <Konomi> I'd buy that for a dollar
[05:42:34] * juggs finds a comfy chair to comatose in
[05:42:54] <chromas> don't click on it :D
[05:43:01] * Konomi gives juggs some Brawndo
[05:47:23] <juggs> I'd issue thanks mebbe if I knew what that was, but I don't so "meh" or whatever is current parlance for a shrug.
[05:48:42] <Konomi> hint
[05:48:47] <Konomi> it's got what plants crave
[05:50:03] <chromas> juggs: you're not still drinking water, are you? Like out the toilet?
[05:51:26] <juggs> LIGHT! this is what plants crave
[05:54:45] <juggs> chromas - in my place water in the bog comes from the same place as water as the kitchen sink. I bleach the bog everyday, the sink, not so often..... now where would you rather drink from? Conditioning 101.
[05:55:35] <chromas> !give juggs Idiocracy
[05:55:39] <chromas> we need a giving bot
[05:55:57] <chromas> ~define brawndo
[05:55:58] <exec> [urbandictionary] 3brawndo: it's like shaving your chest with a lawnmower! that sounds dangerous, but it's not more dangerous than drinking BRAWNDO because drinking BRAWNDO is like riding a pony, which probably sounds no...
[05:56:24] <pbnjoe> juggs, who drinks from the sink? Normal people drink from a cup ;)
[05:56:47] <chromas> You know what sucks? Those basin sinks in bathrooms
[05:57:58] * juggs gains Idiocracy
[05:58:54] <juggs> chromas, you have no idea how I can wield this :D muahahahahhahah
[05:59:18] * chromas hides behind systemd
[05:59:36] * juggs hides behind chromas
[06:00:11] * systemd hides behind juggs
[06:00:12] <juggs> wait that can't be right
[06:01:31] * juggs hides behind ciri
[06:01:41] <juggs> That should do
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[06:25:13] * JamesNZ hides behind Java
[06:26:05] <chromas> We do happen to need a Java bot
[06:27:39] <JamesNZ> Why?
[06:27:48] <chromas> one for each language
[06:28:31] <JamesNZ> Really? O_o
[06:31:59] <chromas> We've got php, python, pascal and c
[06:32:08] <chromas> and a bash one hiding out somewhere
[06:33:21] <JamesNZ> Ah. I might do a CL bot one day, but probably not Java.
[06:33:55] <chromas> looks like several are python. Not sure about Loggie because he's the Timmy of the bots
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[07:20:46] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - This Spoon Could Help Improve the Lives of People with Parkinson's - http://sylnt.us - useful-technologies-for-more-normal-lives
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[07:40:57] <crutchy> coffee++
[07:40:57] <Bender> karma - coffee: 829
[07:59:08] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[07:59:08] <Bender> karma - coffee: 828
[07:59:09] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[07:59:09] <Bender> karma - coffee: 827
[07:59:09] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[07:59:09] <Bender> karma - coffee: 826
[07:59:10] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[07:59:10] <Bender> karma - coffee: 825
[08:04:02] <monopoly> meanie
[08:30:43] <crutchy> coffee++
[08:30:43] <Bender> karma - coffee: 826
[08:32:13] <crutchy> i remember when a r was going to try to keep it at 666, but the coffee++ force is strong
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[08:33:21] <crutchy> gopeh
[09:05:37] <crutchy> coffee++
[09:05:37] <Bender> karma - coffee: 827
[09:06:30] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:06:30] <Bender> karma - coffee: 826
[09:09:02] <chromas> slapfight++
[09:09:02] <Bender> karma - slapfight: 1
[09:12:10] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - What Europe Would Look Like if all the Separatists Won - http://sylnt.us - drawing-between-the-lines
[09:22:24] <crutchy> coffee++
[09:22:24] <Bender> karma - coffee: 827
[09:24:34] <chromas> coffee++ # for great justice!
[09:24:34] <Bender> karma - coffee: 828
[09:24:43] <monopoly> coffee++ # for great justice!
[09:24:43] <Bender> karma - coffee: 829
[09:24:50] <systemd> coffee++ # for great justice!
[09:24:50] <Bender> karma - coffee: 830
[09:25:46] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:25:46] <Bender> karma - coffee: 829
[09:25:47] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:25:47] <Bender> karma - coffee: 828
[09:25:48] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:25:48] <Bender> karma - coffee: 827
[09:25:49] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:25:49] <Bender> karma - coffee: 826
[09:25:50] <JamesNZ> coffee--
[09:25:50] <Bender> karma - coffee: 825
[09:25:58] <SedBot9000> coffee++ # for even moar justice!
[09:25:58] <Bender> karma - coffee: 826
[09:26:05] * JamesNZ hides from the wrath of crutchy
[09:27:08] -!- crutchy has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[09:27:28] <chromas> you killed him!
[09:28:20] <Popeidol> oh god what do we do
[09:28:35] <Popeidol> nobody can ever know
[09:28:49] <JamesNZ> We decrement coffee like there's no tomorrow! :P
[09:29:53] <Popeidol> surely we should be putting it back the way it was to hide the murder weapon
[09:30:49] <JamesNZ> Nah, I'll run off to Midian, no one'll find me there.
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[09:39:22] <crutchy> coffee++
[09:39:22] <Bender> karma - coffee: 827
[09:40:01] <crutchy> makes a good ping test when you're diagnosing a wireless network problem
[09:40:38] <crutchy> the ping-o-coffee
[09:41:35] <prospectacle> good idea
[09:41:37] <prospectacle> the karma ping
[09:41:40] <prospectacle> karmaping++
[09:41:40] <Bender> karma - karmaping: 1
[09:43:41] <Konomi> karma++
[09:43:41] <Bender> karma - karma: 19
[09:47:58] <crutchy> need a new name for slash
[09:48:10] <crutchy> maybe soycode
[09:48:49] -!- silverly [silverly!~65a1fbb6@101.161.wqo.sii] has joined #Soylent
[10:06:51] <prospectacle> trollcode+
[10:11:36] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[10:11:36] <Bender> karma - coffee: 828
[10:14:10] <crutchy> coffee++
[10:14:10] <Bender> karma - coffee: 829
[10:23:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> oi, crutchy, pick me a bug off the issue tracker that i can do in under a week.
[10:23:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> https://github.com
[10:23:54] <monopoly> ^ 03Issues · SoylentNews/slashcode · GitHub
[10:24:35] <crutchy> #277 ;-p
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[10:25:08] <TheMightyBuzzard> don't make me hurt you
[10:29:28] <crutchy> maybe 219
[10:29:56] * silverly ask a new phone toy thing
[10:29:59] <TheMightyBuzzard> was looking at that myself
[10:29:59] <silverly> *has
[10:30:19] <TheMightyBuzzard> aight, i'll look into it
[10:31:02] <crutchy> silverly, a iphone sex?
[10:31:34] <silverly> haha, not quite crutchy, one plus one (the stock android one)
[10:31:46] <silverly> im not paying 1 grand for a phone
[10:31:55] <silverly> its redic
[10:32:24] * crutchy has decided to create an irc event handler inside exec's main process cos putting it outside is too hard
[10:32:41] <crutchy> just for user tracking
[10:32:53] <crutchy> will still be external event handler for everything else
[10:34:55] <crutchy> fuck me drunk over a barstool sideways tyrone... that looks like a phablet
[10:35:06] <silverly> LOL
[10:35:19] <silverly> my last phone was galaxy note 1, which was 5"
[10:35:33] <silverly> this is only 5.5"
[10:36:09] <crutchy> i got a s4 mini cos the s2 screen was too big
[10:36:22] <silverly> oh man
[10:36:43] <silverly> you need to embrace these 4-6" phones
[10:36:56] <silverly> its like holding a small sandwich
[10:37:12] <silverly> but honestly, i like reading on them its nicer
[10:37:25] <crutchy> my lappy is for that :)
[10:37:35] <crutchy> hmm looks like its 4.3" screen
[10:37:51] <TheMightyBuzzard> sandwich > phone
[10:37:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> sammich++
[10:37:54] <Bender> karma - sammich: 2
[10:38:03] <crutchy> sammich++
[10:38:03] <Bender> karma - sammich: 3
[10:38:18] <crutchy> sammich_phone++
[10:38:18] <Bender> karma - sammich_phone: 1
[10:38:18] <silverly> sammich++
[10:38:18] <Bender> karma - sammich: 4
[10:38:51] <crutchy> phone_that_tastes_like_a_sammich++
[10:38:51] <Bender> karma - phone_that_tastes_like_a_sammich: 1
[10:38:59] <silverly> haha
[10:39:09] <prospectacle> ars reckons they sold more iphone 6 (and six+) already than they did 5s last year
[10:39:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> sammich_that_tastes_like_a_phone--
[10:39:25] <Bender> karma - sammich_that_tastes_like_a_phone: -1
[10:39:27] <crutchy> hopefully not too many got dropped
[10:39:43] <prospectacle> that's why they sold so many, made them extra slippery
[10:39:49] <crutchy> lol
[10:39:49] <ciri> lol that's funny!
[10:39:57] <prospectacle> ciri--
[10:39:57] <Bender> karma - ciri: 7
[10:39:59] <crutchy> no saphire screen apparently
[10:40:01] <TheMightyBuzzard> should put grip tape on them like on skateboards
[10:40:15] <chromas> fingerflip
[10:40:30] <crutchy> i gots a big rubbery case for mine. was a ripoff but it works good
[10:40:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> see, chromas knows how it is
[10:40:48] <prospectacle> guy at work has one. I would never buy an iphone while they're so crippled by design but damned if they're not sleek
[10:40:57] <chromas> s/flip/bang/
[10:40:57] <SedBot9000> <chromas> fingerbang
[10:41:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> shame you can't root em and install android
[10:41:14] * crutchy is surprised they still have a bezzle
[10:42:12] <silverly> they are good, but so expensive!
[10:42:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> my grammer used to wear a bezzle
[10:42:27] <Popeidol> I was using the web configuation tool for dell servers today
[10:42:40] <Popeidol> and apparently they come with free reduced bezel
[10:43:13] <crutchy> this would be a cool looking phone, even if it had a rotten apple on it: http://www.ijailbreak.com
[10:43:14] <Popeidol> so the racks at work should be looking much more stylish soon
[10:44:01] <crutchy> ooh you have racks at work? its really hard to find chicks that wanna be engineers :(
[10:44:24] <Popeidol> I initially wrote it as 'my rack should soon look a lot better'
[10:44:49] <crutchy> i have a server just sitting on a random desk in the office
[10:45:10] <crutchy> there's plenty of room in the rack but we runded out of shelves
[10:46:01] <crutchy> still waiting for new servers and rack hardware
[10:46:06] <Popeidol> when I started at my current job, the almost-retired main client database was running on XP on an old desktop
[10:46:13] <Popeidol> wedged underneath a desk and behind some shelves
[10:46:17] <Popeidol> it took me so fucking long to find that thing
[10:47:38] <Popeidol> now everything at least goes in the server room even if it's under a pile of cardboard boxes
[10:50:49] <crutchy> need more cooling in our server room. the genius architects designed a server room without A/C... saves space and power and everything. enironment man!
[10:51:23] <chromas> put water cooling in all the servers
[10:51:40] <Popeidol> did they give you a window?
[10:51:49] <Popeidol> they probably just meant for you to open a window
[10:51:49] <crutchy> no window
[10:52:00] <chromas> you just have to blow really hard
[10:52:04] <chromas> they like it when you blow
[10:52:09] <Popeidol> free office sauna I guess
[10:52:17] <Popeidol> feature, not bug
[10:52:21] <crutchy> yeah it gets pretty bad in summer
[10:53:14] <crutchy> i guess i could try sealing the door shut and filling the room up with water
[10:53:20] <crutchy> for cooling of course :)
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[11:03:32] <crutchy> wow if a galaxy s6 looks anything like this i might have a squiz: http://galaxys6samsung.com
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[11:11:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> okay, crutchy. i fixed 219 pending pj's approval. what's next?
[11:14:29] <TheMightyBuzzard> nevermind, i know the one i want to die
[11:16:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh, someone already fixed that
[11:16:50] <crutchy> mkay. i was thinking maybe all the login and cookie related ones (288,216,124)
[11:17:10] <crutchy> or 325 looks pretty easy
[11:17:56] <crutchy> might be worth checking all the feeds actually
[11:18:46] <crutchy> there's also a couple of UTF-related ones
[11:18:58] * crutchy wonders if you can group issues together
[11:19:44] <crutchy> or could update the authors file, or give the whole codebase a new name (brought that up earlier)
[11:20:35] <crutchy> soyslash or soycode or gnu/soylent
[11:21:07] <crutchy> gnu/toejam
[11:21:47] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Scientists Seen as Competent but Not Trusted by Americans - http://sylnt.us - who-CAN-you-trust?
[11:22:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> login/cookie one of yours is a varnish issue and i can't reproduce it to see if i've fixed it cause don't have varnish on the vm or dev
[11:23:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> feeds one i can have a look at.
[11:24:22] <crutchy> scientists have been getting a bad wrap due to all the religious kooks that spout their bullshit in the name of science
[11:25:12] <crutchy> science should be less about theories of the origins of the universe and more about the practical scientific method
[11:29:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> trying to decide how i feel about just serving up all rss links as https
[11:29:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> or enabling the dynamic rss
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[11:33:59] <prospectacle> in ie9 if I have lots of audio elements on one page it ruins my audio playback system wide and I have to restart it. Stay class, microsoft
[11:34:13] <prospectacle> classy
[11:44:23] <prospectacle> safari has a noticeable delay between .play()ing an audio element and it actually playing
[11:44:34] <prospectacle> coincidentally these are the two browsers that don't support ogg vorbis
[11:44:43] <prospectacle> proving conclusively that browsers which support ogg vorbis are better
[11:45:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> well yeah but who cares if they support ogg vorbis. nobody uses it to encode tunes.
[11:46:55] <prospectacle> well I care that I can encode a tune in such a way the browser can play it as a result of a javascript event, and without delay.
[11:47:07] <prospectacle> ie9 and safari (on windows at least) fail this test
[11:47:28] <prospectacle> well I say tune, it's just a sound effect
[11:48:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> mp3 then like the rest of the world
[11:48:53] <TheMightyBuzzard> never let politics get in the way of getting shat done
[11:49:25] <prospectacle> the problems still remain. ie9 will play some mp3s, but if there's a lot of them (even small ones) it breaks my systems audio completely, even for other applications afterwards
[11:49:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> weird
[11:49:43] <prospectacle> safari doesn't play the sound immediately, ruining the effect
[11:50:02] <prospectacle> these are the real problems. It's just a coincidence these are also the two browsers that don't support ogg
[11:50:03] <TheMightyBuzzard> i blame canada
[11:50:19] <prospectacle> makes sense
[11:51:19] <prospectacle> I'd be afraid to let ie users play my game now, I might break their sound completely. Although 11 seems ok.
[11:53:00] <TheMightyBuzzard> simple then, don't support < 11
[11:53:02] <prospectacle> maybe i'll test for ogg support and say "Sorry your browser doens't suppor the audio features used, etc." It's not nice but it's better than screwing up their audio completely until they restart it.
[11:53:16] <prospectacle> yeah I guess I could do that. I'll test one a few more computers with 11 to make sure.
[11:53:45] <prospectacle> ie is a big chunk of users, best not to dismiss them completely if possible
[11:54:35] <prospectacle> but it's almost always ie that's hardest to support
[11:55:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> go ahead n dismiss em. maybe it'll get em to upgrade
[11:55:21] <prospectacle> i hope so
[12:06:39] <crutchy> coffee++
[12:06:39] <Bender> karma - coffee: 830
[12:10:02] <crutchy> coffee++
[12:10:02] -!- crutchy has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[12:10:02] <Bender> karma - coffee: 831
[12:15:10] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[12:15:10] <Bender> karma - coffee: 832
[12:34:06] <ar> coffee--
[12:34:06] <Bender> karma - coffee: 831
[12:34:18] <ar> (spinning rust)--
[12:34:18] <Bender> karma - (spinning rust): -1
[12:34:28] <systemd> systemD++
[12:34:28] <Bender> karma - systemd: -4
[12:34:47] <ar> systemd--
[12:34:48] <Bender> karma - systemd: -5
[12:35:02] <ar> uselessd++
[12:35:02] <Bender> karma - uselessd: 1
[12:35:16] <chromas> kind of the same thing at the moment
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[12:39:48] * TheMightyBuzzard scratches his head
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[12:40:58] <crutchy> coffee++
[12:40:58] <Bender> karma - coffee: 832
[12:42:01] <crutchy> ~part
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[12:48:02] <prospectacle> ah ha! it was stupid dolby audio "enchancements" that was the culprit.
[12:48:27] <prospectacle> the other week it was soundblaster audio enhancements screwing up my system
[12:48:35] <prospectacle> stop enhancing audio it's perfectly good!
[13:01:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Israel Approves Intel's $6bn Investment - http://sylnt.us
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[13:40:35] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Blackmoore] by juggler
[13:40:57] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[13:40:57] <Bender> karma - coffee: 833
[13:53:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[13:53:24] <Bender> karma - coffee: 834
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[13:57:42] <Blackmoore> mornin
[13:57:47] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[13:57:47] <Bender> karma - coffee: 835
[13:58:03] <Blackmoore> how goes the fight with the code TheMightyBuzzard ?
[13:58:03] <ciri> doing good, and you?
[13:58:45] <TheMightyBuzzard> poorly today
[13:59:27] <TheMightyBuzzard> bout to give it up for lent or something, losing feeling in my fingers.
[14:07:22] <Blackmoore> that aint good.
[14:07:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> ain't abnormal but it does mean i need to stop typing and start stretching
[14:07:55] <Blackmoore> sounds like you need to give it a rest and get back to it later
[14:22:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - The Linguistics of Lolspeak - http://sylnt.us - watts-in-a-whirred?
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[15:06:45] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v n1] by juggler
[15:18:53] <Blackmoore> any one else happy to see the submission queue has been kept pretty full lately?
[15:19:28] <n1> i would be if i didn't make 5 submissions last night.
[15:21:46] <n1> and the quality of submissions (subjectively) are not consistent
[15:29:54] <TheMightyBuzzard> unfortunately neither is the quality of the news
[15:31:08] <n1> indeed
[15:31:15] <n1> it feels like slow news days to me, so far this week
[15:31:59] <n1> maybe too much excitement about bombing syria
[15:34:07] <Blackmoore> eh, I've been lax in submitting too. too busy at work.
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[15:36:44] <n1> Blackmoore, i know how that goes (life takes over for a few days) - but last night the queue was looking low so i put in some submissions, which i don't enjoy doing after just finishing editing a few other ones.
[15:41:57] <Blackmoore> geh. yeah. I get that alright.
[15:42:54] <Blackmoore> I was talking with dopefish a week or so ago and was thinking the editing team was gonna need some help. I have to get through the style docs still.
[15:44:40] <n1> any help is much appreciated, the editing is a 24/7 thing to keep ontop of, sometimes we're running nicely ahead, other times there are no stories in the queue
[15:45:36] <n1> if a couple of us have busy days or other obligations on the same day, makes things a bit more difficult to keep up with
[15:46:39] <_NSAKEY> n1: The fact that it seems like SN has been a flamefest lately doesn't help matters much.
[15:47:08] <n1> :(
[15:47:41] <n1> i have noticed more comments heading down that road
[15:47:49] <n1> they seem to get moderated down though
[15:48:15] <Blackmoore> _NSAKEY: i think that's inevitable; it depends on the articles that we pop, and we seem to be getting more trolls.
[15:48:30] <Blackmoore> and that's an unfortunate sing of sucess.
[15:48:40] <_NSAKEY> Blackmoore: Browsing at -1 is getting bad.
[15:50:07] <_NSAKEY> The Thailand/1984 story is a fine example.
[15:50:18] <_NSAKEY> Lots of -1 posts in that one.
[15:53:43] <n1> at least they are getting -1
[15:54:49] <n1> as much as i'd like to see the end of trolling and flaming, the only thing we can do is rely on the moderation system and the community to put those comments where they belong.
[15:56:18] <_NSAKEY> I named that story because it's proof that even banning ACs wouldn't stop the flaming and trolling.
[15:56:27] <_NSAKEY> Ethanol-fueld just doesn't care.
[16:01:16] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Power Blackouts in Europe? - http://sylnt.us - power-to-the-people
[16:02:15] <n1> ethanol-fueled is a self-proclaimed troll, so he wouldn't.
[16:03:58] <Blackmoore> and AC is part of the "tradition" of /. that we want to preserve. (sadly trolls and all)
[16:04:29] <Blackmoore> i cant say i read at -1. i dont have time for it
[16:05:11] <Blackmoore> but Ethanol-fueled? cripes.. he trolls even in the chat room
[16:08:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> he's consistent like that
[16:09:27] <n1> he puts some effort in with his trolling comments, which is something
[16:09:50] <n1> i think he's just too drunk the rest of the time.
[16:12:24] <mrcoolbp> Blackmoore, I think I agree that yourself and dopefish would be more useful just helping out the editor team at present
[16:12:48] <mrcoolbp> y'all can still develop the O.C. plan, or other cool editorial niceties in the background
[16:13:48] <mrcoolbp> but if our base editorial practice isn't great, there's seems to be little point to try to expand/innovate etc
[16:14:15] <mrcoolbp> and it's tough to be great when everyone is strapped for time / person-power
[16:14:20] <n1> I agree with mrcoolbp.
[16:15:16] <n1> I'd like to work on some O.C too, but trying to keep submissions rolling generally distracts from writing anything.
[16:16:18] <mrcoolbp> cool, just got a reply from Hugh Pickens
[16:16:32] <mrcoolbp> n1: exactly
[16:16:53] <n1> whats going on with mr pickens?
[16:19:36] <mrcoolbp> http://soylentnews.org
[16:19:39] <monopoly> ^ 04SN article 03 Why You Can't Manufacture Like Apple 04(17 comments)
[16:20:42] <n1> i'm sure it's not the first time that's happened from kaszz
[16:22:57] <mrcoolbp> I reached out to him
[16:24:05] <mrcoolbp> he has a lot of submissions (~75), and most of them accepted (~85%), but we cannot condone this practice.
[16:24:54] <mrcoolbp> One must quote or otherwise attribute where the content is coming from
[16:25:28] <mrcoolbp> I plan on integrating that into the docs sometime this week
[16:26:20] <n1> I often make a few quick googles checking when something doesn't feel right about the submission
[16:26:47] <mrcoolbp> n1: can you post a story to dev and attach it to a poll so we can see how that works?
[16:26:53] <mrcoolbp> I don't think we've ever done that
[16:27:11] <mrcoolbp> might have to click "New" instead of using a submission
[16:27:33] <n1> will give it a go
[16:27:48] <mrcoolbp> thanks
[16:33:42] <Blackmoore> I think we can work on th OC project and help with editing.
[16:34:15] <Blackmoore> we arent going to help with the base of the process; but we will help to spread the workload
[16:35:14] <n1> seems to work, mrcoolbp
[16:35:25] <n1> but its not obvious at first as the poll is in the normal place
[16:35:29] <mrcoolbp> lemme check
[16:36:47] <mrcoolbp> n1, hmm that's interesting
[16:37:11] <n1> i would have assumed it would have appeared underneath or be embedded in the story
[16:37:21] <mrcoolbp> the regular poll is still there, it didn't ovveride, it just makes that poll appear "in" the story
[16:37:25] <n1> yeah
[17:50:40] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Evidence of Gravity Wave could be Just Dust - http://sylnt.us - as-opposed-to-unjust-dust?
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[18:58:51] <idetuxs> SN lives
[19:04:31] <n1> !
[19:05:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> was there doubt?
[19:05:27] <idetuxs> never
[19:05:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh, good then
[19:06:24] <idetuxs> :D just making obvious statements haha
[19:08:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> well it's good that we have someone to make them or i'd have to
[19:21:28] <Blackmoore> Ford Prefect? is that you?
[19:21:47] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Missing Party Speeches, Now Online Again - http://sylnt.us - internet-never-forgets
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[19:57:39] <n1> anyone have experience with playing Mount & Blade: Warband?
[20:11:14] <Blackmoore> not i sir
[20:11:24] <n1> well that's helpful!
[20:11:40] <n1> damn humblestore and steam getting me to buy games when they make them so damn cheap
[20:14:43] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh ya, i should play some games
[20:15:23] <n1> i just picked up mount & blade: warband + napoleonic wars, farcry3 on humblestore for £8.57 or something.
[20:15:56] <n1> (deluxe edition farcry 3)
[20:16:19] <n1> steam wants to charge me £60 for all of that
[20:16:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'm playin a `98 era mmorpg, stress on the RP as in it's required you stay in character.
[20:18:18] <n1> how so?
[20:19:18] <TheMightyBuzzard> long n short of it is you a) can't advance past level 9 out or 100 without doing so and b) will get banned if you keep it up.
[20:19:52] <n1> for breaking character in text chat?
[20:20:09] <TheMightyBuzzard> yep, outside person to person messages
[20:20:19] <n1> thats pretty brutal but cool also
[20:21:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, only one i ever found actually requires you to be in character
[20:21:43] <n1> im going to give mount&blade a go now... which also has been available on linux for the last couple months
[20:21:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> like larp without having to leave your couch
[20:21:53] <paulej72> what character do you play
[20:22:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> what me? dude name of Ashbentiel. Wacky wiseass and spreader of mayhem.
[20:22:57] <paulej72> race and profession?
[20:23:11] <TheMightyBuzzard> none, gatekeeper. unique mythos.
[20:23:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> everyone's human unless they decide not to be but the toons are all the same.
[20:30:14] <TheMightyBuzzard> well aside from profession
[20:33:14] <Landon> n1: Warband?
[20:33:35] <Landon> oh, I see indeed
[20:33:38] <Landon> great :) you're set
[20:33:40] <Landon> that's the best one
[20:33:51] <Landon> I'm not sure why they still sell vanilla Mount & Blade, it's strictly a subset of warband
[20:49:32] <crutchy> coffee++
[20:49:32] <Bender> karma - coffee: 836
[21:01:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[21:01:47] <Bender> karma - coffee: 837
[21:02:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Google Will Stop Supporting Climate Change Science Deniers, Calls Them Liars - http://sylnt.us - trying-not-to-be-evil?
[21:10:56] <TK> Any greasemonkey script writers in here?
[21:11:50] <TK> I keep getting annoyed with comments like this one http://soylentnews.org
[21:11:50] <monopoly> ^ 04SN comment by Arik (4543)
[21:12:12] <TK> Where it's written in monospace font that shows up much smaller than everything else
[21:12:13] <ciri> hmmm thats a good question TK
[21:12:43] <TK> I was just wondering how long it would take someone to write something that strips the <tt> tags out of a page
[21:13:07] <TK> If it's not that bad, I'll give it a try myself
[21:13:45] <TK> but I'm not a programmer/dev/code monkey
[21:16:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> TK, take about thirty seconds in perl
[21:17:23] <TheMightyBuzzard> no idea in js which is what you'd need
[21:19:08] <TK> Yeah, I tried looking up some basics this morning, it seems possible
[21:19:23] <TK> But that's about all I can say
[21:19:49] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh wait, stylish can take care of that with a little css
[21:20:27] <TK> Similar amount of effort?
[21:21:03] <TK> I've never used Stylish
[21:21:59] <TK> I'll give it a shot in the morning
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[21:41:53] <paulej72> TK: the use of tt tags might be slash doing the code style. Also a simple css fix to the tt tag to set the monospace font to something sane might help as well. I’ll look into it.
[21:44:17] <paulej72> TK: it is the code comment style that sets the tt tags. I think there is an issue in the css that sets the size too small. It is currently set for 11px but should be 13. I dig up the issue and fix.
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[21:49:55] <chromas> TheMightyBuzzard: Ashbentiel?
[21:50:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> Ya, that'd be my dingus
[21:50:37] <TheMightyBuzzard> chromas, super-sleuth
[21:50:59] <chromas> Same as the one from ##altslashdot on freenode?
[21:51:33] <chromas> Wondered what happened to him
[21:52:05] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya, it got confusing having two nicks one for the site and one for the channel. is my default nick in most irc though.
[21:52:50] <chromas> Ah. Cool name, though
[21:53:01] <TheMightyBuzzard> thanks, i stole it.
[21:53:07] <chromas> Also, then it was you who let me into the 'secret' testing
[21:53:13] <TheMightyBuzzard> prolly lol
[21:53:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> i slept since then
[21:53:29] <chromas> at least once
[21:53:45] <chromas> But wait; you're not in character. Tattle! Tattle!
[21:54:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> irc's a whole nother world
[21:54:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> right now ain't anyone in game to be out of character around. i could start spouting perl and nobody'd care.
[21:55:14] <chromas> Maybe it should be part of your character
[21:55:29] <chromas> or if there's not enough room, switch to playing a sting
[21:55:30] <chromas> string
[21:55:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> could very well be. there's an entire nother language built in game for talking to mobs.
[21:56:06] <chromas> huh
[21:56:16] <chromas> well regex is for reading mobs. How do you write?
[21:57:02] <TheMightyBuzzard> print STDOUT
[21:57:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> or $mob->write if you're feeling oopy
[22:00:23] <paulej72> http://code.stephenmorley.org
[22:01:40] <chromas> I noticed the small monospace font; assumed my settings were broken
[22:02:03] <TheMightyBuzzard> that's how mine normally looks. i can read it okay.
[22:02:47] <paulej72> I was going to fix it at some point, but since TK brought it up I decided to look into it. It is really simple fix
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[22:05:40] <TheMightyBuzzard> I'm out for a bit. Fixin food n eatin it n cleanin up after it n such.
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[22:21:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Mars Orbiter Spacecraft from India Healthy, Ready to Enter Mars - http://sylnt.us - rise-and-shine || Record Companies Targeting Kim Dotcom's Album with Takedown Requests - http://sylnt.us - apparently-good-faith-has-no-due-diligence-requirement
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[23:21:47] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - 71% Of 16-To-24-Year-Olds Want 'Wearable Tech.' - http://sylnt.us - do-they-also-want-to-be-trackable-too?
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[23:23:30] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[23:23:31] <Bender> karma - coffee: 838