#Soylent | Logs for 2014-04-17

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[00:00:29] Blackmoore is now known as Blackmoore|ZZZ
[00:00:35] <Blackmoore|ZZZ> gnight
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[00:35:04] <NCommander> Transfered this Month 17.5 MB in - 1.29 GB out (1.31 GB total)
[00:35:05] <NCommander> Damn
[00:35:15] <NCommander> ^- (traffic through the LB in the last 24 hours)
[00:36:04] <paulej72> NCommander: how does that match with our past usesage amounts?
[00:36:39] <NCommander> paulej72, on par. We transfer ~60 GiB per month ATM
[00:37:23] <NCommander> paulej72, our alexa rank has gone up considerably, http://www.alexa.com We were ~300,000
[00:38:18] * NCommander notes he's not getting stats emails anymore
[00:38:19] <NCommander> Hrm
[00:39:16] <paulej72> did you break them when we updated the messsagin system, or did we not apply that to prod.
[00:40:30] <xlefay> Oh my.. Alexa finally got a sensible layout
[00:41:00] <xlefay> I like #5 in "What sites link to soylentnews.org?"
[00:41:09] <xlefay> 5. slashdot.org apple-beta.slashdot.org/story/14/02/10...
[00:41:11] <xlefay> beta even rofl
[00:47:14] <NCommander> paulej72, I get them from dev and chillax ...
[00:47:21] <NCommander> paulej72, I suspect we're dealing with a mailer issue somewhere
[00:47:23] <NCommander> someplace
[00:47:25] <NCommander> Somehow
[00:47:49] <xlefay> probably postfix itself..
[00:47:59] <xlefay> did you change the e-mail address to @soylentnews.org? If so, that's the problem.
[00:48:13] <NCommander> xlefay, I don't think I did
[00:48:15] * NCommander checks
[00:49:09] <NCommander> Huh
[00:49:14] <NCommander> Well, THATS why we don't see problems
[00:49:15] <NCommander> Do admins have to bother with formkeys?
[00:49:23] <NCommander> ^- no wonder I never seem to get ratelimited -_;
[00:50:26] <paulej72> set to zero
[00:52:08] <NCommander> paulej72, dollars to donuts that zero means admins don't have to deal with formkeys
[00:52:42] <paulej72> NCommander: do believe you are correct.
[00:53:18] <paulej72> test email from slash user on hydrogen recieved from my princeton account
[00:53:28] <paulej72> postfix is working
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[00:54:39] <xlefay> paulej72, yes.. postfix works, unless you try to send to a soylentnews.org account
[00:54:51] <xlefay> prod still believes it's responsible for soylentnews.org e-mail, which it isn't
[00:56:20] <paulej72> xlefay: NCommander is using his SN account for email on prod.
[00:56:41] <NCommander> hrm
[00:56:56] <xlefay> Well, if it uses that e-mail to send, then there's the issue
[00:56:59] <NCommander> mcasadevall@hydrogen:~$ mail
[00:56:59] <NCommander> No mail for mcasadevall
[00:57:49] <paulej72> NCommander: went to /dev/null
[00:58:36] <NCommander> paulej72, yup
[00:58:38] <NCommander> Joy
[00:59:40] <xlefay> So, remove soylentnews.org from postfix's config
[01:00:05] <paulej72> mailbox_size_limit = 0
[01:01:12] <xlefay> So, remove soylentnews.org from postfix's config <--- best solution
[01:01:15] <paulej72> mydestination = soylentnews.org, localhost.com, localhost
[01:01:28] <xlefay> Yes, remove soylentnews.org, from that list, and 'localhost.com' seriously?
[01:01:29] <paulej72> that is also set
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[01:02:14] * xlefay facepalms
[01:02:20] <xlefay> ugh, that entire config stinks
[01:02:34] <paulej72> It wasn’t me :)
[01:02:46] <xlefay> I hit my limit of idiotic shit, cya
[01:03:26] <paulej72> well I am not up to breaking the site today so I am not going to chanage anything
[01:03:40] <paulej72> cya xlefay
[01:04:48] <xlefay> <bad-joke> we'll do it tomorrow, one breakage a day right? </bad-joke>
[01:05:17] <paulej72> agreed
[01:08:47] <NCommander> I don't remember who did the postfix config
[01:09:18] * xlefay notes that was the config from the start
[01:09:32] <paulej72> lets blame robind or mechanicjay as they are not here to defend themselves :)
[01:10:21] <xlefay> ugh, cat blame > /dev/null; it doesn't matter, it just needs to get fixed]
[01:10:54] <xlefay> but we're all afraid shit'll break.. for obvious reasons
[01:12:14] <paulej72> xlefay: I am not afraid to break mail as it will not be noticealbe on the front end. I just do not want to worry about another fix today. Also I need to get some food soon.
[01:12:42] <xlefay> eh, registration mails, password resets?
[01:13:08] <paulej72> yes but not all users at once type of breakeages
[01:13:20] <xlefay> it shouldn't break.. but then again, how often have we said "it shouldn't break" in the past..
[01:13:23] <xlefay> *le sigh*
[01:13:34] <xlefay> Well, that's true
[01:16:18] <paulej72> xlefay: do we want hydrogen to realy mail throug mail.sn?
[01:17:02] <paulej72> It may be a good idea as we get multiple front ends that the mail goes out from one place (or maybe not)?
[01:17:03] <xlefay> It isn't now, but it should, especially when we add more frontends..
[01:17:12] <paulej72> lol
[01:17:57] <xlefay> then again, I think we really should be having a dedicated mail server instead of all these mail servers spread around, SVC getting crowded (can't even properly run clamd) etc.
[01:19:03] <paulej72> mail is on beryllium correct
[01:19:28] <paulej72> our bastard child cnetos box
[01:19:51] <paulej72> nuke and repave
[01:20:31] <paulej72> Ok I really need to go and get food now. bbl
[01:20:31] <Cyprus> you probably want 1 mail server from a deliverability perspective
[01:21:05] <xlefay> yea.. it is
[01:21:19] <paulej72> Cyprus: at least what looks to be one mail server (may be redundant ones)
[01:21:21] <xlefay> Cyprus, from as far as it makes sense, agreed
[01:21:28] <xlefay> eh paulej72
[01:21:46] <Cyprus> yeah, i didn't say it couldn't be redundant, but you want to try to concentrate on 1 outbound
[01:21:51] <xlefay> mail.soylentnews.org & staff.soylentnews.org have MX records so far..
[01:22:11] <xlefay> Cyprus, makes SPF and shit also a whole lot simpler
[01:22:16] <Cyprus> it may not be affecting you yet, but a lot of orgs look at rate
[01:22:20] <Cyprus> and spread
[01:22:29] <Cyprus> SPF is pointless
[01:22:40] <xlefay> Cyprus, sure it is, doesn't mean lot's don't check for it
[01:22:46] <Cyprus> ~all =P
[01:22:48] <xlefay> (although granted.. most just softfail anyway)
[01:23:09] <xlefay> That reminds me, domainkeys and shit
[01:23:14] <Cyprus> yeah that is worth doing
[01:23:21] <Cyprus> and single egress makes it much simpler
[01:23:25] <xlefay> ugh.. this todo list is insufferably long
[01:23:31] <xlefay> indeed
[01:23:42] <paulej72> !todo delete todo list
[01:23:42] <deadbeef> todo item 14 added
[01:23:53] <xlefay> I really want it on a dedicated box though, would make shit a lot simpler
[01:23:57] <Cyprus> i would
[01:24:07] <xlefay> besides it being more sensible.
[01:24:10] <Cyprus> mail gets complicated enough, you generally want it seperatre
[01:24:24] <Cyprus> last mail system i built used like 15 services
[01:24:34] * Cyprus loves sqlgrey
[01:25:01] <xlefay> sqlgrey is nice
[01:25:22] <paulej72> Cyprus: we disabled clamd on the main mail server as it was eating up too much resources
[01:25:29] <xlefay> Used it in the past, saves quite a bit of time in the long run when waiting for mail
[01:25:50] <paulej72> never used sqlgrey
[01:25:57] <Cyprus> i love it because it's one of the few grey implementations that can scale to multiple nodes
[01:26:03] <Cyprus> without persistant lb inteligence
[01:26:09] <xlefay> sqlgrey is greylisting but then it stores shit in a db so, like cyprus says, it scales along
[01:26:40] <Cyprus> means you can use a braindead lvs
[01:26:44] <xlefay> Essentially, my favorite mail config would be, dedicated mail box - and have SVC/beryllium & boron as backup MX's
[01:26:51] <Cyprus> and the whole table can sit in memory on 1 big box
[01:26:58] <paulej72> how many users were you supporting on your mail servers Cyprus
[01:27:13] <Cyprus> several big ISPs
[01:27:28] <Cyprus> well, big at the time
[01:27:38] <xlefay> Cyprus, heck, you an even do some replicating stuff to ensure that's always retained (although.. for sqlgrey alone that's silly, unless, the main db goes down and sqlgrey doesn't handle that gracefully [don't know how it deals with that..])
[01:27:47] <paulej72> I have only done vainty mail severs for a few small groups of ~20 users
[01:27:59] <Cyprus> meh replication requires using a sql db that has inteligence
[01:28:09] <Cyprus> mysql is lighter if you dont need it
[01:28:21] <xlefay> Doesn't it support PostgreSQL also?
[01:28:22] <Cyprus> dont get me wrong, postgres is awesome
[01:28:31] <Cyprus> but this was trying to be efficient as possible
[01:28:35] <xlefay> yeah
[01:28:45] <xlefay> guess you could even use sqlite on nfs or w/e
[01:28:51] * xlefay pukes at the thought of sqlite
[01:28:59] <NCommander> xlefay, when you get IRC migrated to carbon, we'll talk at getting a dedicated mail node :-)
[01:29:00] * NCommander ducks
[01:29:02] <Cyprus> nah, needed something that can at least do in memory
[01:29:14] <Cyprus> oh on nfs
[01:29:15] <Cyprus> rofl
[01:29:20] <paulej72> xlefay: that seems like a challenge
[01:29:26] <Cyprus> why not go the whole hog and use ms access
[01:29:45] <xlefay> paulej72, really? those statements generally sound like empty words to me
[01:29:59] <paulej72> lol
[01:30:05] <xlefay> "once you do X, we'll talk about Y" .. 9/10 times, Y isn't even on the table after you do X
[01:30:09] <Cyprus> pauliej72: i dont remember the user count, it was about 25mb of incoming SMTP flow
[01:30:19] <xlefay> Cyprus, ugh, screw MS access, let's just go Oracle all the way
[01:30:25] <Cyprus> the queues had to be in ram to handle the traffic
[01:30:27] <xlefay> Heck, we can even get their unbreakable linux!
[01:30:34] <NCommander> xlefay, ... please tell me you are joking
[01:30:52] <xlefay> NCommander, 9 of out 10 times no, but I'll make an exception for you
[01:31:08] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Environment Shown To Alter Perception Of Taste - http://sylnt.us - water-tasting-like-wine-again?
[01:31:26] <xlefay> deadbeef, is there a question somewhere?
[01:31:44] * xlefay goes to rage against couchpotato
[01:31:47] <paulej72> Cyprus: I am glad I am not a full time mail admin. It would drive me crazy.
[01:31:59] <Cyprus> i wasnt a fulltime mail admin, just one function
[01:32:16] <xlefay> ugh, mail stuff can be insane at times
[01:32:42] <Cyprus> mail is easy once you learn it, and postfix makes it really easy, just have to read the entire documentation =)
[01:32:49] <xlefay> one misconfiguration and woops, shit ain't getting delivered! Properly configured? Ooh, XYZ server doesn't agree!
[01:32:49] <Cyprus> we were doing spam filtering as a service
[01:33:07] <paulej72> I think mail is like IPV4 so many people use it, it can’t be fixed until everyone changes at once.
[01:33:17] <xlefay> Cyprus, just showing that a lot of shit is so messed up
[01:33:23] <xlefay> paulej72, but e-mail is _awesome_
[01:33:30] <Cyprus> well clearly, but there isn't much you can do about it
[01:33:38] <Cyprus> hell people still FAX
[01:33:41] <xlefay> with domain keys, you can even verify the sender properly
[01:33:49] <Cyprus> email has at least 10 years after faxes die
[01:33:51] <xlefay> I'll take e-mail over the smartphone bullshit anyday
[01:33:54] <Cyprus> i dont see faxes dying
[01:34:14] <xlefay> don't see it either
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[01:34:16] <paulej72> email is awesome, but many of the foundations come from sending mail on a single system with the internet stuff bolted on top
[01:34:18] <Cyprus> xlefay: don't make me send you a FUSUP checklist =P
[01:34:38] <xlefay> Cyprus, can you fax it to me?
[01:34:39] * xlefay ducks
[01:34:43] <Cyprus> lol
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[01:35:08] <xlefay> paulej72, the biggest issue with e-mail is verification imo
[01:35:25] <paulej72> xlefay: yes there is none
[01:35:25] <Cyprus> the biggest issue with email is the need to not block legitimate email from idiots
[01:35:28] <xlefay> back when the internet was still awesome, people could trust one another, you could just trust that xyz@xyz.com WAS xyz!
[01:36:13] <xlefay> That's a bit discriminate against spam isn't it?
[01:36:31] <Cyprus> just drop email that has the evil bit set
[01:36:35] <xlefay> "I block every email equally" doesn't quite have the same ring to "I hate everyone equally" but it'll work!
[01:37:07] <xlefay> How much do spammers even make nowadays?
[01:37:09] <paulej72> bbl, going for food now
[01:37:23] * xlefay doesn't believe they actually make a good profit out of it unless they do it on a huge scale
[01:37:28] <xlefay> .. least not anymore
[01:37:33] <xlefay> ciao paulej72
[01:38:02] <xlefay> NCommander, unless you were talking about the oracle shit then YES, I'm joking..
[01:38:12] <xlefay> who needs and unbreakable Linux kernel? Well I sure as hell don't
[01:38:42] <xlefay> I wonder if the still have ksplice stuff
[01:39:57] <Cyprus> actually, spam makes stupid money
[01:40:07] <Cyprus> they generally break even after 2 days
[01:40:10] <Cyprus> per month
[01:40:37] <xlefay> wow.
[01:40:58] <Cyprus> all they have to do is stay up for like 5-6 days to make the run worth it
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[01:41:42] <Cyprus> most impressive one i ever saw was a guy who would get a phone line for each server, like 50 servers
[01:41:48] <Cyprus> have them dial up to an isp
[01:42:06] <xlefay> Wow. Crime does pay
[01:42:12] <Cyprus> get an ip, use the ip on the dial up as the sending ip, so all packets come back on it, and spoof the outbound out the big datacenter link
[01:42:18] <Cyprus> so the complaints dont come to the isp
[01:42:33] <Cyprus> works as long as the isp doesn't do bcp38, or notices
[01:43:45] <Cyprus> he tried to pull his servers when we found him out after about 16 hours
[01:43:58] <Cyprus> cops were involved, he paid his month and got them
[01:44:58] <xlefay> rofl
[01:45:01] <Cyprus> we didn't do bcp38 at the time due to acl issues with the catalysts, but we still had netflow
[01:45:14] <Cyprus> he tried to claim he was doing security scanning
[01:45:21] <Cyprus> we're like, to fucking hotmail on port 25?
[01:46:50] <SpallsHurgenson> fun and vaguely informational movie made for the general public when the IRS switched over to computer processing back in the '60s: http://www.networkworld.com
[01:52:21] <xlefay> Cyprus, rofl
[01:53:30] <Cyprus> the best part was we got a call from like every local isp in the area within a few days asking about him because he wanted space
[01:54:26] <NCommander> Damn it, I need to do something useful
[01:54:29] <NCommander> THat isn't incorporation
[01:59:21] <Cyprus> ncommander: you could always put the +- js live =P
[02:01:12] <NCommander> paulej72, thoughts on doing so?
[02:01:31] <NCommander> or xlefay
[02:02:02] <xlefay> no objections, just don't break anything
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[02:21:49] <crutchy> g'day soylent
[02:25:19] <paulej72> NCommander: that code is not ready yet for general abuse. We need a new comment listing that does not hide comments below your threshold.
[02:28:49] <Cyprus> that was one thing i was wondering about was the threaded mode threshold affects, as well as the comment count limit. It needs to have placeholder spots for "more here below threshold" etc
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[02:52:04] <NCommander> paulej72, gah, forgot about that
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[02:52:50] <paulej72> NCommander: you could always sanitize the homepage settings
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[02:54:52] <NCommander> paulej72, ick
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[02:55:59] <paulej72> Cyprus: I want a view that spits out all of the comments and gives them all a class based on the threshold. You would then set the css on each class based on what your threshold is, so hiiden+1 shown+1 or some such.
[02:57:14] <Cyprus> thats not a bad idea
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[02:59:46] <paulej72> the threshold dropdown would be tied to js if on and would dynamically set the page view. The other buttons for show and hide would work on the individual comments and threads. Looked into this before, but did not make much headway. Need to look into that code again
[03:03:16] <NCommander> paulej72, it shouldn't be that hard to do, most of the base work is there
[03:04:50] <paulej72> I was having trouble figuring out were the code decide a post was below the threshold and to spit out a link to the comment instaed of the comment itself.
[03:05:33] <Cyprus> so i have a question, you know how you can set values to insightful etc in user settings? how do ya'll feel about expanding the mod options a bit as an experiment, and letting users select on their own if they want them to be -2, -1, 0, +1, +2 ?
[03:05:39] <paulej72> that code is split bettween Comments.pm, comments.pl and the various templates
[03:06:30] <paulej72> Cyprus: you already can set the individual levels of a given mod. make funny -1 or what ever
[03:07:08] <Cyprus> yeah i understand that, i mean like adding additonal mod options that werent on /. like wrong, naieve, etc
[03:09:15] <crutchy> groundbreaking...awesome...engaging...meh...pfft...piss poor....who is this asshat?
[03:09:17] <paulej72> we have thougt about that, but we have not come to a concensus of what to add and how it would break modding. a wrong mod is not necessarly correctly applied if the modder is mistaken or naieve.
[03:10:43] <chromas> (-1, Circlejerk)
[03:12:36] <Cyprus> with metamod coming back, and the modding changes, it gives the opportunity to have things like factually wrong and not have it abused too much
[03:13:14] <Cyprus> chromas: -1 intelectual masturbation
[03:13:22] <Cyprus> though i'd probably set it to +1
[03:13:50] <Cyprus> *factually incorrect, sorry not factually wrong
[03:17:09] * SpallsHurgenson demands a "+1 Sexy" mod so the people may finally mod me up for the right reasons :)
[03:18:54] <NCommander> Cyprus, metamod might be delayed
[03:19:00] <chromas> -1, Too sexy for your mod
[03:19:04] <NCommander> Cyprus, I drastically overestimated the usability of the original coe :-)
[03:19:09] <Cyprus> rofl
[03:19:26] <NCommander> Cyprus, were you around for the original M2 on /.?
[03:19:47] <chromas> Is that the version you have?
[03:19:48] <Cyprus> i was a lurker for a long time, which is why CyprusBlue113 is such a high number, instead of 4 digit
[03:19:50] <NCommander> Yeah
[03:19:56] <NCommander> chromas, Cyprus: https://dev.soylentnews.org - feel the brainbleed
[03:19:58] <Cyprus> so i wouldn't have seen any of it
[03:20:28] <Cyprus> i'm currently not elligible since my login doesnt exist on dev
[03:20:35] <NCommander> Cyprus, .... well frack
[03:20:41] <NCommander> Let me post a screenshot
[03:20:48] <Cyprus> lol
[03:21:52] <NCommander> Cyprus, http://imgbin.org
[03:21:53] <chromas> wtf Firefox won't let me accept cert
[03:21:59] <Cyprus> if it's anything like the rest of the starting interface, i'm sure it sucks
[03:22:19] <Cyprus> oh that's so pretty
[03:22:33] <NCommander> Cyprus, the blue?
[03:22:38] <Cyprus> the interface
[03:22:44] <Cyprus> im leaving the skin out of this =)
[03:22:44] <NCommander> srsly?
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[03:22:56] <Cyprus> sorry, forgot the sarcasm tags
[03:23:06] <NCommander> Yeah
[03:23:15] <NCommander> I think what I'm going to do is have it load an entire article
[03:23:27] <NCommander> And then have people go through and moderate *every* comment
[03:23:31] <Cyprus> or an iframe with php and a real interface *ducks*
[03:23:36] <NCommander> (as though they had unlimited points)
[03:24:11] <Cyprus> hmmm that seems too far the other way
[03:24:50] <NCommander> Yeah
[03:25:11] <Cyprus> im not a fan of the current implementation on /. though either
[03:25:21] <Cyprus> so i dont really have any good ideas
[03:25:39] <NCommander> I think I need to implement thread ids
[03:25:45] <Cyprus> i was about to say that
[03:25:45] <NCommander> And then let people metamoderate entire threads
[03:25:48] <Cyprus> pick a thread
[03:25:59] <NCommander> That's a fucking bitch and a half to implement though
[03:26:02] <Cyprus> or maybe pick a random childless post, and show all the parents?
[03:26:11] <Cyprus> nah you dont need the ids, just a recursive crawl
[03:26:19] <NCommander> Cyprus, you underestimate how hard that is
[03:26:24] <NCommander> There's no concept of threading internal to slash
[03:26:37] <Cyprus> how do the comments nest in the db?
[03:26:39] <NCommander> The way it works is it is select * from comments where story_id = sotry
[03:26:48] <NCommander> Then it sorts chronologically
[03:27:25] <NCommander> Child posts will always have a higher CID than its parent, so that gets it roughly 40% correct by itself
[03:27:36] <Cyprus> but it wouldn't show it as a sub post
[03:27:40] <Cyprus> how does it know?
[03:27:47] <NCommander> parent_cid field
[03:27:54] <Cyprus> yeah, thats all you need
[03:28:05] <NCommander> Having a proper thread id is useful for other reasons
[03:28:16] <Cyprus> yes, its certianly cleaner to do it that way
[03:28:36] <NCommander> I want that so its possible to moderate+post-threads you've participated in
[03:29:03] <Cyprus> it still wouldn't be that hard to pick a single comment that doesn't exist in the parent_cid list
[03:29:18] <Cyprus> then walk the tree in code from a query containing ids and parents
[03:29:38] <NCommander> Yeah, but its very hard if a moderation is valid without context
[03:29:47] <Cyprus> but you'd get the entire thread that way
[03:29:48] <NCommander> Fuck it
[03:29:52] <Cyprus> just not siblings
[03:29:53] * NCommander just implements thread IDs
[03:30:03] <NCommander> This probably isn't as hard as I think it is
[03:30:04] <NCommander> But
[03:30:17] <Cyprus> what you're talking about, where do you call it a "thread" ?
[03:30:25] <Cyprus> from the first parent? or what?
[03:30:33] <Cyprus> its all 1 big rooted tree
[03:31:08] <Cyprus> thread id is like a cache of manually walking it
[03:31:27] <NCommander> From parent post downwards
[03:31:33] <Cyprus> so origional parent
[03:31:42] <Cyprus> that still could be a lot
[03:32:00] <NCommander> ughhhhhhh
[03:32:02] * NCommander grumbles
[03:32:16] <Cyprus> it could be 1 post, it could be every comment in an article minus some spam idiot
[03:32:18] <NCommander> Limit it to 20 or so comments at most?
[03:32:31] <Cyprus> thinking
[03:32:33] <NCommander> Not every moderation needs to get meta-modded
[03:32:58] <Cyprus> hmm well you can still build the entire tree with one query in memory
[03:33:10] <Cyprus> lemme think about how you'd pick the cluster target
[03:33:24] <NCommander> rand() a comment, then get its children?
[03:33:25] <Cyprus> that's really what you're wanting
[03:33:37] <Cyprus> kind of a hadoop like cluster of related posts
[03:33:42] <NCommander> ugh
[03:33:44] <paulej72> NCommander: the greasmonky script give the tid as the same as the cid
[03:34:26] <NCommander> paulej72, BTW, since you did the preferences screen rework, can you get the Subscription thing to show up properly as a tab? :-)
[03:34:41] * NCommander is going for lower hanging fruit here
[03:34:49] <Cyprus> well, are you wanting just random metamod, or are you wanting to target specific post moderation?
[03:34:49] <NCommander> Easier crap to fix
[03:34:55] <paulej72> NCommander: would you want to have all the threads a comment bleongs to in its theread fielsd
[03:34:59] <Cyprus> the cluster is easy to compute around a target post
[03:35:06] <NCommander> Cyprus, hrm ...
[03:35:19] <Cyprus> like a post with one moderator
[03:35:21] <paulej72> NCommander: That was on my list to fix subscriber prefs
[03:35:23] <NCommander> Well, my thoughts is we will show the story, then comments, threaded like normal (though all of them expanded)
[03:35:23] <Cyprus> thats -
[03:35:56] <Cyprus> im trying to think of a compromise between single post metamod of /., and an impenetrable wall of mod
[03:36:12] <Cyprus> because i agree with you, context is very important
[03:36:16] <Cyprus> and you lose that on /.
[03:37:58] <NCommander> paulej72, oh, BTW, I found what that java call was in symlink
[03:38:03] <NCommander> Its for doing instant minification
[03:38:38] <paulej72> NCommander: not sure what you are taking about
[03:39:17] <NCommander> paulej72, there was a call to "/opt/java/bin/java", its meant to invoke yuicompress to minify everything
[03:39:52] * Cyprus gags seeing "opt"
[03:40:45] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Evidence Jobs Was a Bully to be Excluded at Trial? - http://sylnt.us - now-the-dance-really-begins
[03:40:45] <paulej72> NCommander: OK, I did not look at that file completely and missed that part
[03:42:48] <NCommander> Cyprus, welcome to the world world of slash
[03:43:02] <NCommander> paulej72, http://gtmetrix.com - I'd like to fix this
[03:44:32] <paulej72> NCommander: we are not using many images so doing sprites would be an easy fix. was discussing this yesterday.
[03:44:50] <Cyprus> i see i've been out of the web game too long, i didn't even know what a css sprite was
[03:45:04] <crutchy> holy crap that's a cool website
[03:45:04] <paulej72> not sure what is the issue with non-optimized images
[03:45:17] <crutchy> yeah i don't do that and my site got A+
[03:45:29] <Cyprus> it's probably related to size and count
[03:45:33] <crutchy> s/A+/A/
[03:45:36] <Cyprus> and filetype
[03:45:38] <NCommander> paulej72, its just saying we can compress better
[03:45:52] <paulej72> Need to kill most of the js so that would fix most issue, but I am not alwasy a fan of minifying everything
[03:46:01] <crutchy> yeah maybe related to jpg compression
[03:46:04] <crutchy> i use gifs
[03:46:04] <Cyprus> the main ding was the lack of hint headers for caching though
[03:46:35] <paulej72> NCommander: I understand that but the biggest images we have are the logos
[03:46:48] * NCommander is looking at the filesizes of the JS
[03:46:56] <crutchy> they only need to be little gifs surely
[03:47:26] <Cyprus> heh they're talking about very small savings on the images
[03:47:43] <Cyprus> but they do have a point
[03:47:51] <paulej72> crutchy: I believe they are png files because of tansparency, but I could be wrong
[03:48:05] <crutchy> running another page on my site for a gallery... it might not do so well :-P
[03:48:25] <crutchy> hmm 96% :-)
[03:48:46] <crutchy> got penalised for not leveraging browser caching
[03:48:59] <Cyprus> expire headers are your friend =)
[03:49:11] <NCommander> Holy crap
[03:49:16] <crutchy> they're only little gifs anyway
[03:49:22] <crutchy> not really worried
[03:49:24] <NCommander> 121/150 kib is our total page load due to javascript
[03:49:28] <NCommander> If we could nuke that
[03:49:32] <crutchy> eechk
[03:49:34] <NCommander> We'd be dialup friendly
[03:49:41] <paulej72> plus the savings on css files is small because the browser will cache them once loaded
[03:49:43] <Cyprus> their point on the images is to reduce the request count
[03:49:52] <Cyprus> err sprite
[03:49:56] <NCommander> Cyprus, we've got some technical issues that make caching difficult
[03:50:02] <crutchy> you know you gots a problem when size(js) exceeds size(content)
[03:50:15] <Cyprus> 150kb is still quite small
[03:50:18] * NCommander looks at slashdot.org
[03:50:24] <crutchy> lol
[03:50:29] * crutchy looks at google.com
[03:50:35] <paulej72> Cyprus: i know and that is why I want to do sprites
[03:51:01] <crutchy> that's a fun little website you found ncommander :-P
[03:51:06] <NCommander> rofl
[03:51:10] <NCommander> When it went to slashdot, it got classic
[03:51:13] * crutchy likes little tools like that
[03:51:14] * NCommander wants to compare classic and beta
[03:51:26] <paulej72> NCommander: send to to beta directly
[03:51:27] <NCommander> slashdot classic:
[03:51:28] <NCommander> Total page size: 1.12MB
[03:51:29] <crutchy> dammit google.com beat me by 1%
[03:51:31] <Cyprus> crutchy: there's lots of sites like that out there for developers to gage
[03:51:33] <NCommander> Total number of requests: 235
[03:51:40] <NCommander> wtf
[03:51:43] <Cyprus> rofl
[03:51:49] <crutchy> all the spamvertising
[03:52:04] <NCommander> That's fucking absurd
[03:52:38] <Cyprus> you think that's bad, a state lottery site had 200 db connections from the main page due to ads etc when i looked at the code to see why it was nuking it's server
[03:52:38] * crutchy remembers why he bailed on /.
[03:53:08] <NCommander> Comparing to beta
[03:53:15] <NCommander> Cyprus, slash hits the DB pretty hard
[03:53:20] <NCommander> LOT of unoptized queries
[03:53:23] <NCommander> But it uses memcache heavily
[03:53:28] <Cyprus> i said connections, not queries =)
[03:53:42] <NCommander> Huh
[03:53:45] <NCommander> Beta does slightly better than classic
[03:53:56] <NCommander> Only a page load size of 1.13 MiB, 122 connections
[03:54:37] <NCommander> I still think thats kinda absurd though
[03:54:41] <crutchy> who connects to a db more than once? (unless you're like me... midway through a mysql_* > pdo migration, in which case 2 connections)
[03:54:57] <NCommander> We do
[03:55:01] <NCommander> But that's somewhat justified in our case
[03:55:04] <Cyprus> lots of code does it
[03:55:09] <NCommander> The backend has various roles for different users
[03:55:10] <Cyprus> sometimes it's justified
[03:55:15] <NCommander> logs/reader/writer/slashd/etc.
[03:55:18] <crutchy> mkay
[03:55:19] <Cyprus> but they're persistant right?
[03:55:26] <NCommander> I think the frontend maintains 10-15 connections at a given time?
[03:55:42] <NCommander> Cyprus, mostly. They do expire out after awhile, but when I last rebooted the DB server, its connection count was like 13700
[03:55:49] <Cyprus> jesus
[03:55:57] <crutchy> wow!
[03:55:59] <Cyprus> total or simultaneuos?
[03:55:59] <NCommander> Lifetime
[03:56:02] <Cyprus> ohhh ok
[03:56:08] * NCommander runs netstat on helium
[03:56:21] <Cyprus> i was like.. please god tell me that's not high water
[03:56:37] <NCommander> mcasadevall@helium:~$ netstat -an | grep 3306 | wc -l
[03:56:37] <NCommander> 23
[03:56:44] <NCommander> That's not TOO bad
[03:56:51] <paulej72> NCommander: wanted to test dev, but it does not like the cert
[03:57:01] <NCommander> paulej72, I'll disable the autoredirect, stand by
[03:57:04] <Cyprus> heh, you guys graphing / icingaing all that yet? =)
[03:57:04] <NCommander> Cyprus, tcp6 0 0 2600:3c00::f03c:91:3306 2600:3c00::f03c:9:39124 ESTABLISHED
[03:57:04] <NCommander> tcp6 0 0 2600:3c00::f03c:91:3306 2600:3c00::f03c:9:39086 ESTABLISHED
[03:57:08] <NCommander> Yeah
[03:58:40] * crutchy wonders how http://gtmetrix.com gives a site run off a home webserver a similar performance score to google.com... seems fishy
[03:59:26] <Cyprus> in the internet, no one knows its your home connection =)
[03:59:47] <NCommander> Fixed
[03:59:59] <NCommander> paulej72, dev ssl redirect disabled
[04:00:03] <NCommander> Cyprus, we are actually
[04:00:09] <crutchy> so it takes traffic into account... makes sense
[04:01:41] <NCommander> Ugh
[04:01:45] * NCommander should just fix IPv6 support
[04:01:51] <NCommander> */fuck it*
[04:01:58] <paulej72> http://gtmetrix.com
[04:02:47] <crutchy> better :-)
[04:02:56] <crutchy> a little bit anyway
[04:02:59] <swiss> ipv6 is the future man
[04:03:17] <paulej72> damit the topic icons are all poorly compressed
[04:03:55] <crutchy> just gifify them all
[04:04:02] <crutchy> or delete them lol
[04:04:08] <crutchy> text is fine
[04:04:24] * Cyprus throws lynx at crutchy
[04:04:39] <paulej72> got them from |. and noone checked them for size
[04:05:08] <crutchy> isn't text-only better for lynx?
[04:05:31] * crutchy googles lynx
[04:06:02] <crutchy> aww a lynx is a kitty cat :-P
[04:07:50] <Cyprus> maybe i should go back to linux engineer, forgot how much fun some of this could be
[04:09:42] <crutchy> linux admin?
[04:11:06] * NCommander checks pipedot for shits and giggles
[04:11:57] <NCommander> Hrm
[04:12:08] <NCommander> pipedot has a smaller page load size but they don't have tons and tons of dead JS
[04:12:21] <NCommander> paulej72, honestly, looking at the headers, all of this is for the AJAX-ifyed frontend
[04:12:24] <NCommander> (aka, firecrap)
[04:12:26] <crutchy> js is the devil... just like foozball
[04:13:05] <Cyprus> firehose isn't horrible, it's just horribly implemented =)
[04:13:31] <paulej72> NCommander: I suggest we kill it on dev with the sn theme and see what happens to amin interface.
[04:14:27] <NCommander> paulej72, you mean chillax, right?
[04:15:28] <paulej72> leave the chillax theme alone just kill the js on the soylentnews theme for testing. can swithc themes to get js back.
[04:16:00] <NCommander> paulej72, k
[04:16:08] <swiss> beta.soylentnews.com
[04:16:24] * NCommander installs yslow for firefox and starts nuddering
[04:16:34] <Cyprus> ?? nuddering
[04:16:56] * Cyprus really misses definition bot
[04:17:08] <NCommander> paulej72, I know the jquery stuff needed for the admincp, but a lot of this can go away
[04:17:24] <NCommander> I'll move the jquery stuff to is_admin, and then tag the rest to load only for firehouse
[04:17:59] <paulej72> why do firehose as we do not have it
[04:18:17] <swiss> BOTS ARE THE CANCER OF IRC
[04:18:20] <swiss> someone had to say it
[04:18:32] <Cyprus> no they aren't
[04:19:00] <swiss> they so are
[04:19:19] <Cyprus> swiss--
[04:19:19] <deadbeef> karma - swiss: 4
[04:19:19] <swiss> suddenly the channel can be filled with junk people didn't want to press alt+tab and type into google
[04:19:32] <NCommander> paulej72, fair enough
[04:19:36] <swiss> things like karma are okay
[04:19:42] <NCommander> paulej72, looking at comments.js, this looks like this is *all* for D2
[04:19:52] <swiss> link information
[04:19:58] <Cyprus> swiss: that's not the bot's fault, that's a lack of beatings =)
[04:20:00] <crutchy> aaaww i writed bots
[04:20:05] <crutchy> :-(
[04:20:12] <swiss> but all the things that you trigger to try to win, or you use to search... cancer of irc
[04:20:57] <crutchy> i made one to get php function syntax
[04:21:06] <Cyprus> you misunderstand, the definition bot didn't connect to google or a real dictionary. it was a big hash array of !defines
[04:21:15] <NCommander> paulej72, yeah, this is *all* for D2
[04:21:17] * NCommander nukes
[04:21:22] <crutchy> lol
[04:21:25] <Cyprus> so it was basically an inside joke dictionary
[04:22:47] <crutchy> i have a define bot that scrapes www.wolframalpha.com
[04:22:58] <crutchy> is that what you mean by cancer?
[04:23:10] <NCommander> javascript.js
[04:23:11] <NCommander> Joy
[04:23:26] <Cyprus> ncommander: that's technically an accurate name
[04:23:53] <crutchy> it's redundant
[04:23:57] <crutchy> like atm machine
[04:24:09] <crutchy> calling a file the same as its extension
[04:24:09] <Cyprus> its more like machine machine
[04:24:13] <crutchy> lol
[04:24:17] <Cyprus> because it contains javascript
[04:24:40] <crutchy> like spreadsheet.xls or document.doc
[04:25:23] <crutchy> or craziness.pl
[04:25:55] <NCommander> Ok, massive JS stripping complete
[04:25:59] <NCommander> jquery stuff only loads for admins
[04:26:04] <NCommander> Everything else is gone
[04:27:37] <paulej72> NCommander: did you load all of the jquery stuff?
[04:28:10] <paulej72> NCommander: admin.js has some firehose subs in it that could be stripped later.
[04:29:55] <paulej72> NCommander: you should have put the admin.js load in the upper if statement
[04:30:05] <Cyprus> mmmm zombie js
[04:30:23] <NCommander> paulej72, I see the admin.js just fine
[04:31:19] <NCommander> paulej72, I'm going to flip the sites default theme to soylentnews so we can test it
[04:32:06] <paulej72> OK
[04:33:50] <NCommander> paulej72, Page load time: 2.37s
[04:33:50] <NCommander> Total page size: 80.4KB
[04:33:50] <NCommander> Total number of requests: 19
[04:33:52] <NCommander> yay
[04:35:14] <NCommander> paulej72, honestly, I'm not seeing any breakage
[04:35:52] <paulej72> NCommander: Do you think we need all of the jwuery addons loaded?
[04:36:21] <NCommander> paulej72, probably not, but I'm not sure which ones we need to make the admin interface go
[04:37:39] <NCommander> paulej72, its a seriously drastic performance boost
[04:37:43] <NCommander> Like stupid drastic
[04:37:56] <NCommander> Dev feels 100x faster
[04:38:37] <paulej72> NCommander: do you think it was pulling the js files for each page load?
[04:38:44] <NCommander> paulej72, yes :-)
[04:38:50] <NCommander> paulej72, it was doing that because ENOCACHECONTROL
[04:38:58] <crutchy> dev is now 65% on gtmetrix
[04:39:11] <NCommander> Dumping that much JS really fucking ligthened the load
[04:39:25] <NCommander> We shaved a 2/5ths of the page load size
[04:40:18] * NCommander is going to run optipng on all the images
[04:40:23] <NCommander> Lets see how small we can go with small tweaks
[04:41:53] <paulej72> NCommander: the nice thing about dev, it has the imageless css styles so we save on loading those images
[04:42:12] <NCommander> Wow, the first good thing someone has said about our CSS :-)
[04:42:28] <NCommander> optipng is running
[04:42:36] * NCommander is reprocessing all the png/gif files
[04:43:34] <paulej72> NCommander: I did not remove the unneed image files yet from the repo. Better to test the css first.
[04:44:01] <NCommander> paulej72, I already ran the pngs, going through the gifs now
[04:44:09] <NCommander> 128 file(s) have been processed.
[04:44:09] <NCommander> 5 error(s) have been encountered.
[04:44:13] * NCommander DEPLOYS
[04:44:23] <crutchy> jetpack?
[04:44:25] <paulej72> what were the errors?
[04:44:32] <NCommander> paulej72, files it couldn't get smaller
[04:44:44] <NCommander> paulej72, hrm, submission might be broken, I get an error to wait before using this resource
[04:44:53] <crutchy> gif should be pretty small already'
[04:45:10] <paulej72> the 5 images for the admin submission interface
[04:47:11] <paulej72> NCommander: were you using the New from the admin menu?
[04:48:31] <NCommander> paulej72, no, submission
[04:48:43] <NCommander> I think the new images are stuck in the varnish cache
[04:49:46] <paulej72> NCommander: I am having no issues with submissions
[04:50:04] <NCommander> Might just be for me then
[04:51:16] <paulej72> NCommander: you can purge the images from the varnish cache.
[04:53:18] <crutchy> everyone grap hold of ncommander to help him pull the stuck images out of varnish
[04:54:12] <crutchy> might need to polish varnish to make it less sticky
[04:54:15] * SpallsHurgenson backs away slowly "Count me out; that's how it starts but before you know it there are sheep invoved!"
[04:54:32] <crutchy> only if you're in new zealand
[04:54:55] <crutchy> or scotland apparently
[04:55:00] <NCommander> paulej72, hrm
[04:55:03] <crutchy> lol
[04:55:10] <NCommander> paulej72, appears optipng sucks :-)
[04:55:45] <crutchy> NCommander: s/opti//
[04:55:45] <SedBot> <crutchy> <NCommander> paulej72, appears png sucks :-)
[04:56:26] <paulej72> what is the issue?
[04:57:53] <NCommander> paulej72, not getting very small images
[04:58:50] <NCommander> paulej72, appears smushit or tinypng is better for this
[04:58:51] <NCommander> hrm
[05:07:43] <NCommander> paulej72, ok, crunched the images through tinypng
[05:07:49] <NCommander> lets see what the improvement is after a redeploy
[05:08:07] <paulej72> ok
[05:09:40] <NCommander> paulej72, Page load time: 0.79s
[05:09:40] <NCommander> Total page size: 44.5KB
[05:09:40] <NCommander> Total number of requests: 17
[05:09:43] <NCommander> \o/
[05:09:48] <NCommander> A rank on image optimization
[05:10:09] <NCommander> We've gone down 2/3rd page load size
[05:11:54] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Screen Time and Young Children - http://sylnt.us - do-you-know-that-the-TV-has-an-off-switch
[05:12:07] <paulej72> NCommander: I can sprite the topic images as one file and that should help a lot. I can look at what else we can sprite as well.
[05:12:19] <NCommander> paulej72, whats browser compatibility with that like?
[05:12:30] * NCommander notes going from 152->44 kib for ~1 hours worth of work == WIN
[05:12:44] <paulej72> NCommander: google does it
[05:12:56] <NCommander> k :-)
[05:14:17] <paulej72> NCommander: waht about setting the caching info for the images? Not sure how to do that.
[05:15:17] <crutchy> is it just me or has dev.soylentnews.org dropped in score on gtmetrix?
[05:15:34] <crutchy> i thought it was 65% before, now it's gone down to 62%
[05:15:45] <NCommander> crutchy, don't think so?
[05:15:51] <NCommander> crutchy, we need to get expires headers on there
[05:16:01] <NCommander> That requires putting our brain to work and figuring out the best way to do it
[05:16:41] <crutchy> $ brain
[05:16:41] <crutchy> bash: brain: command not found
[05:17:11] <Cyprus> so the funny thing is, you probably just cut your bandwidth in half
[05:18:58] -!- everdred [everdred!~irssi@Soylent/Users/110/Everdred] has parted #Soylent
[05:20:48] <crutchy> Cyprus: s/bandwidth/load/
[05:20:48] <SedBot> <crutchy> <Cyprus> so the funny thing is, you probably just cut your load in half
[05:20:57] <crutchy> ?
[05:21:06] <Cyprus> i doubt the load will change much
[05:21:16] <Cyprus> varnish should be covering most all of the change
[05:21:41] <crutchy> Cyprus: s/bandwidth/sausage/
[05:22:01] <crutchy> lol start(brain)
[05:23:00] <paulej72> NCommander: did anything we removed from the js files affect the built in slash page load stats funciton?
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[05:24:57] <crutchy> probably improved the result it returns, no?
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[05:31:03] <NCommander> paulej72, possibly
[05:35:18] <NCommander> paulej72, let me get this branch setup and a pull request done
[05:35:50] <NCommander> paulej72, w.r.t. page load statstics, honestly, I don't think those numbers are very useful
[05:36:29] <NCommander> paulej72, i.e., comments 1554.52s +334%
[05:36:39] <paulej72> NCommander: are you going to set all three templates to the same js. And can you make sure to combine the two admin if statements into one.
[05:36:50] <NCommander> paulej72, let me do that now
[05:44:39] <paulej72> NCommander: did you add the site_news to master, if not we can include it with this pull
[05:45:04] <NCommander> paulej72, https://github.com
[05:45:08] <NCommander> paulej72, I did
[05:45:21] * NCommander just committed that one directly since you checked it on dev
[05:52:50] <paulej72> pull 157 merged
[06:01:03] <NCommander> paulej72, I'm doing a writeup of our site explosion today in my journal
[06:01:08] <NCommander> paulej72, when did we notice that shit went boom?
[06:04:13] <paulej72> I noticed at about 14:00 UTC that all users were getting the same IPID, but I was looking at apply a ban on a spammer so I did not relize athat naything else was wrong. When I erturned from lunch at 18:00 UTC users were complining about not being able to post from reskey errors and not being able to mod for unknown resons.
[06:05:36] <paulej72> I realized that the problems were because everyone had the same IPID and thus SUID (subnet).
[06:07:53] <NCommander> paulej72, http://soylentnews.org
[06:11:31] <paulej72> two thumbs up NCommander
[06:12:06] <NCommander> paulej72, yeah, that was pretty epic fail on my part. I should have *#@! caught that
[06:12:38] <paulej72> I did not realize Linode gave out the wrong IP address that the LB used.
[06:14:57] <NCommander> paulej72, it gives the public facing one
[06:15:05] <NCommander> It doesn't tell you anywhere it uses a different IP internally
[06:15:26] <paulej72> It should give both
[06:15:55] <NCommander> Yup
[06:16:18] <NCommander> paulej72, I'm *very* happy w/ our work on dev
[06:17:06] <paulej72> cut our bandwidth use by 2/3
[06:17:45] <paulej72> once we apply it.
[06:20:48] <crutchy> still 62% on gtmetrix :-(
[06:20:56] <crutchy> for dev
[06:22:30] <crutchy> logo_soylentnews.png load time 60ms
[06:22:31] <paulej72> crutchy: it really wants us to have our image files set with a proper cache ttl. I think it gives a higher porption of the score to this issue now that our page load is so much smaller.
[06:24:30] <crutchy> is the logo inserted with css as a div background image?
[06:27:38] <crutchy> nope
[06:27:43] <crutchy> loaded by js?
[06:30:09] <crutchy> ahh yup css background img
[06:30:25] <crutchy> in slashcode.css
[06:30:49] <crutchy> wow every page load downloads 7 css files
[06:31:05] <crutchy> lol sorry 3 css files :-P
[06:31:23] <crutchy> start(brain)
[06:32:49] <crutchy> 4 css files
[06:32:53] <crutchy> fuck
[06:33:51] <crutchy> 13 js files
[06:33:55] <paulej72> crutchy: on dev with the new themes, 4 css files (5 if admin). I could merge some of them together, but we would still have base, theme, print and admin.
[06:35:52] <crutchy> need to kill jquery
[06:36:11] <crutchy> jquery--
[06:36:11] <deadbeef> karma - jquery: -1
[06:40:20] <NCommander> crutchy, you think we're bad, go look at the other site
[06:40:47] <crutchy> lol i'm already sure it sucks :-P
[06:41:02] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - China's Weather machine - http://sylnt.us - someone-is-to-blame
[06:41:02] <crutchy> and we're not bad... we're awesome!
[06:41:53] <paulej72> crutchy: jquery is killed for non admin users on dev
[06:42:11] <crutchy> and slowly but surely progressing to groundbreaking :-)
[06:42:46] <crutchy> the other site is "who is this asshat?"
[06:43:14] <NCommander> paulej72, honestly, I suspect we can kill the jquery stuff pretty easily, just requires going through the admin interface with a fine tooth comb
[06:44:37] <paulej72> NCommander: the nexus/topic selector for submissions looks very dependent on jquery
[06:44:52] <paulej72> the gui one that is
[06:45:46] * arti o.o
[06:46:32] <crutchy> @.@
[06:46:48] <crutchy> -@.@-
[06:47:16] <crutchy> g'day arti
[06:47:35] <arti> the JS and CSS should be combined and minified /sure this has been discussed
[06:47:42] <arti> requires going through the templates
[06:47:49] <arti> that's the not so fun part depending on how its organized
[06:48:04] <crutchy> into a million different directories :-P
[06:48:31] * crutchy got bored with slash very quickly
[06:48:44] <paulej72> arti: not going to minify the css until we do a full site redesign. silly to waste the time on a few bytes.
[06:49:21] <paulej72> JS is mostly purged for non admin users on dev.
[06:49:32] * arti imagines an iced tea spoon is involved
[06:50:00] <crutchy> or a teaspoon of ice
[06:51:11] <crutchy> arti: got bacon working to execute arbitrary scripts
[06:51:15] <crutchy> in #test
[06:51:39] <crutchy> still working on hardening a bit
[06:52:04] <crutchy> (chromas is a good penetration tester :-)
[06:52:08] <arti> just expose it to some female users
[06:52:23] <crutchy> lol
[06:52:30] <chromas> I do tend to prefer the back door
[06:52:34] <crutchy> it might get infected with the female program then
[06:53:04] <arti> this is why protection is extremely important
[06:53:09] <crutchy> yes
[06:53:12] <arti> make sure you're following protocol
[06:53:25] <crutchy> and don't use the wrong port
[06:54:02] <arti> as long as there's a rule in the fw, you're good
[06:55:28] <arti> also, belated g'day
[06:55:41] * crutchy salutes :-)
[06:58:47] <NCommander> arti, to give you an idea of how much purging
[06:58:54] <NCommander> arti, our site load size is 2/3rds smaller
[06:59:15] <arti> nice, what is the majority of the traffic?
[06:59:24] <arti> text/html, text/js, images ?
[06:59:30] <crutchy> js
[06:59:41] <crutchy> jquery to be precise
[06:59:48] <arti> dat compression?
[07:00:06] * arti offers pasta to those who want it
[07:00:22] <crutchy> just squish it through the tubes to me arti :-P
[07:00:36] <arti> that's my general philosophy
[07:00:49] <arti> "let's put something in there"
[07:01:02] <arti> http://imgur.com
[07:01:11] <crutchy> and see when it falls out the other side
[07:01:19] <arti> nah, it's fucking gone man
[07:01:31] <arti> aaaaaand it's gone
[07:01:45] <crutchy> lol south bank manager :-P
[07:01:49] <arti> yeah, classic dude
[07:02:06] <crutchy> love that one... and.... its gone
[07:02:11] <crutchy> its all gone
[07:02:15] <paulej72> lol arti
[07:02:25] <arti> :)
[07:02:56] <crutchy> dunno why i never thought to stick a hotdog in my bike frame as a kid
[07:03:07] <crutchy> just seems like a logical thing to do
[07:03:36] <arti> hahaha
[07:03:41] <arti> "more hotdogs mr. bike?"
[07:04:27] <paulej72> crutchy: when I was a kid ther was no quick release for the seat adjustment, so a lot harder to think this up as it took tools to do.
[07:05:12] <arti> i think this is referred to as motivation
[07:05:17] <arti> just like people programming in asm
[07:05:48] * arti is still chugging along with haskell
[07:06:01] <arti> the pattern matching is pretty cool
[07:06:23] <arti> oh, there's a game you guys gotta check out, if you haven't already
[07:07:16] * NCommander installs traincraft
[07:07:18] <arti> no man's sky
[07:07:21] <NCommander> Need to get my mind off things
[07:07:28] <arti> http://www.no-mans-sky.com
[07:07:30] * NCommander might seriously setup a MC server
[07:07:32] <NCommander> not sure if I'll run mods though
[07:07:34] <arti> go scope this out ncommander
[07:07:42] * arti will find a video
[07:07:55] <arti> https://www.youtube.com
[07:08:25] <arti> i also think your minecraft idea is worthy
[07:08:42] <NCommander> arti, I don't like huge amounts of mods, I find tekkit for instance makes things too complex
[07:08:48] <arti> i only like a few things
[07:08:50] <NCommander> But I'd like Railcraft and possibly traincraft
[07:09:01] <arti> auto saving, some teleports, maybe some geometry stuff.
[07:09:13] <NCommander> autosaving/tp can be done with pure bukkit
[07:09:22] <NCommander> Honestly, my biggest issue with mods is dealing with forge is a PITA
[07:09:22] * arti just uses bukkit
[07:09:35] <arti> i agree, i'm leery about what to use, for fear of upgrade issues
[07:09:36] <NCommander> I ran an old server called perdition's path
[07:10:00] * arti imagines donner party shit
[07:10:10] <NCommander> Well, the name came from the box it ran on
[07:10:12] <NCommander> which was called Perdition
[07:10:21] <arti> ah okay, speaking of which did you see that movie?
[07:10:21] <NCommander> (I miss that machine, 32 GIB of RAM == awesome MC server)
[07:10:24] <NCommander> Not yet
[07:10:32] <arti> 32gb, just enough for java :D
[07:10:37] * arti snickers
[07:10:48] <arti> java's cool, i kid
[07:11:28] <arti> how's everyone doing btw?
[07:12:14] <paulej72> bed time for me. Good night all
[07:12:19] * arti salutes
[07:12:41] <arti> don't let the bed bugs bite :D
[07:12:48] <NCommander> night paulej72
[07:12:51] * arti is terrified of getting those at a hotel
[07:13:04] <arti> another fun thought is how the bodies are discovered, not until they smell :D
[07:13:20] <arti> sweet dreams
[07:13:38] <paulej72> cya tomorrwo
[07:22:44] -!- anthem [anthem!~textual@c-57-259-236-77.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #Soylent
[07:22:46] <crutchy> cya paulej72
[07:31:13] * NCommander fiddles with Forge
[07:31:22] <NCommander> Ugh, I have a serious love hate relation with Minecraft
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[07:54:15] <arti> ncommander, let it flow through you
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[08:12:10] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Hidden Vulnerability Discovered in Air Network - http://sylnt.us - you-can't-get-there-from-here
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[09:02:46] <arti> :D
[09:04:25] <crutchy> g'oop
[09:04:59] <arti> g'oop
[09:05:05] <arti> man, haskell has some sweet functions
[09:05:38] <arti> they use some strange terms for things though, not everywhere
[09:05:58] * arti wants to understand a good way to break apart a program
[09:06:11] <arti> how goes the day off?
[09:06:26] <crutchy> good
[09:06:38] <crutchy> spent bit of time out with the kiddywinks
[09:06:57] <crutchy> now back trying to get this up time thingy working
[09:07:00] <arti> oh nice
[09:07:02] <crutchy> my brain isn't working
[09:07:04] <arti> time thingy?
[09:07:11] <arti> oh for the bot
[09:07:19] <arti> return system uptime?
[09:07:30] <crutchy> decided to put it into a separate script and just pass the start time via a template
[09:07:42] <crutchy> at least then i don't have to keep dc/reconnect
[09:08:01] -!- bacon [bacon!~bacon@724-640-25-593.cust.aussiebb.net] has joined #Soylent
[09:08:01] -!- bacon has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[09:08:04] <arti> to show how long the bot's running?
[09:08:40] <crutchy> oops. rogue return after join
[09:08:48] -!- bacon [bacon!~bacon@724-640-25-593.cust.aussiebb.net] has joined #Soylent
[09:09:15] <crutchy> ~up
[09:09:16] <bacon> bacon up: 50.591672897339
[09:09:34] <arti> is it measured in strips?
[09:09:37] <arti> or slices?
[09:09:40] <crutchy> just shows seconds atm, but i can change the script on the fly now
[09:09:42] <arti> "bits"
[09:09:46] <crutchy> lol
[09:09:47] <bacon> It is not doing the thing we like to do, but liking the thing we have to do,
[09:09:47] <bacon> that makes life blessed.
[09:09:47] <bacon> -- Goethe
[09:10:09] <arti> do you have the script actually counting or does it compare time from init?
[09:11:04] <crutchy> bot records start time, and script that's executed on demand calculates delta
[09:11:13] <crutchy> ~up
[09:11:13] <bacon> bacon up: 168 seconds
[09:11:38] <arti> spiffy
[09:11:49] <arti> you should have it say done at prime intervals
[09:12:00] <crutchy> filtered nick and chan now too so i'm reasonably happy with security
[09:12:03] <arti> or maybe "fsssst" "sizzle"
[09:12:08] <crutchy> haha
[09:12:45] <arti> cool, progressing nicely
[09:12:57] <arti> how long until you add scripting support for *rolls dice* LUA?
[09:13:05] <crutchy> i'll push the latest
[09:13:11] <crutchy> is there a program for that?
[09:13:15] <crutchy> dice?
[09:13:17] <crutchy> haha
[09:13:25] <crutchy> we all love that word
[09:13:54] <arti> i've been extremely lazy about bringing my bot here
[09:14:06] <crutchy> can pretty much execute any cli command with an alias
[09:14:25] <arti> ah, that's one way to do it.
[09:14:31] <crutchy> so you don't actually type the command in irc, just the alias, and any arguments
[09:14:40] <SirFinkus> that sounds... dangerous
[09:14:49] <crutchy> could be
[09:15:04] <crutchy> calling for penetration testers!
[09:15:07] <crutchy> :-P
[09:15:11] <crutchy> go nuts
[09:15:16] <SirFinkus> !rm -rf --no-preserve-root /*
[09:15:19] <arti> rm -f /
[09:15:45] <SirFinkus> dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/sda
[09:15:47] <arti> hope its jailed
[09:15:53] <crutchy> nah
[09:16:28] <SirFinkus> rm -rf porn/
[09:16:31] <SirFinkus> you're screwed now
[09:16:43] <crutchy> might help if you have a squiz @ source
[09:16:47] <crutchy> ~
[09:16:47] <arti> certainly you mean faxes-sent
[09:16:47] <bacon> IRC SCRIPT EXECUTIVE
[09:16:48] <bacon> by crutchy: https://github.com
[09:16:48] <bacon> visit http://wiki.soylentnews.org for more info
[09:17:16] <crutchy> you not trying to rm my pr0n are you?!
[09:17:29] <arti> its just a bunch of naughty bits
[09:18:09] <crutchy> doing things that are strange to me... being married
[09:19:06] <arti> hahaha
[09:19:26] <arti> like being able to sleep and use the whole bed
[09:19:38] * arti enjoys this
[09:20:01] <SirFinkus> even better, sleeping in other people's beds
[09:20:03] <arti> sleeping diagonally for maximum space for exampl
[09:20:45] <crutchy> what is this "sleeping diagonally"?
[09:20:52] <crutchy> something to do with trigonometry?
[09:21:10] <arti> [/] <-
[09:21:11] <chromas> It's how you end up when she pushes you half-way off the bed
[09:21:32] <crutchy> hahaha yeah
[09:21:37] <crutchy> now i get it :-P
[09:22:02] <crutchy> nice pictorial arti... a picture say a thousand pixels
[09:22:05] <crutchy> i mean words
[09:23:28] <crutchy> still can't get that stupid uptime thing to work chromas
[09:23:38] <crutchy> i must have retard mode enabled again today
[09:23:59] <crutchy> moved it off the bot though
[09:24:33] * arti enjoys terse pictograms
[09:24:41] <arti> .!..
[09:24:45] <crutchy> moo
[09:24:45] <bacon> (__)
[09:24:45] <bacon> (oo)
[09:24:45] <bacon> /------\/
[09:24:45] <bacon> / | ||
[09:24:45] <bacon> * /\---/\
[09:24:45] <bacon> ~~ ~~
[09:24:46] <bacon> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[09:24:54] <arti> i eat lots of fiber, yes.
[09:25:03] <crutchy> that cow looked very terse
[09:25:14] <crutchy> pissed off even
[09:25:19] <arti> if you ever plan on using the bot on other networks i'd consider a limiter for the line output
[09:25:24] <arti> so you don't flood off
[09:25:42] <crutchy> prolly won't but yeah that would be a good idea
[09:25:47] <crutchy> even here
[09:26:28] * chromas just noticed the apt-get cow faces the other way
[09:26:31] * chromas doesn't have apt
[09:27:12] <crutchy> apt-get cow doesn't work for me :-(
[09:28:10] <chromas> oh apt-get moo
[09:28:18] <crutchy> ah
[09:28:26] <crutchy> cow above is apt-get moo
[09:28:27] <chromas> faces opposite cowsaw cow
[09:28:35] <arti> need reverse cow
[09:28:36] <chromas> /s/aw/ay/
[09:28:36] <crutchy> well, on my pyewta anyways
[09:28:47] <chromas> SedBot:
[09:28:47] * SedBot is a 53-line awk script, https://github.com
[09:28:49] <crutchy> sounds kinky
[09:28:50] <chromas> /s/aw/ay/
[09:29:23] <crutchy> reverse cow is prolly something more suited to the bacon channel :-P
[09:29:30] <chromas> s/*/Bad SedBot/
[09:29:46] <crutchy> i won't be reversing cows with my bot here lol
[09:29:56] <arti> hahaha
[09:32:07] <chromas> cowsay ";cat ~/.pr0nz/reverse\ cow/* |cowsay\
[09:32:08] <bacon> ______________________________
[09:32:08] <bacon> < cat .pr0nzreverse cow cowsay >
[09:32:08] <bacon> ------------------------------
[09:32:08] <bacon> \ ^__^
[09:32:08] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[09:32:08] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[09:32:08] <bacon> ||----w |
[09:32:08] <crutchy> ~up
[09:32:09] <bacon> || ||
[09:32:09] <bacon> bacon up: 0d 0:23:43 seconds
[09:32:22] <arti> cow saw lol
[09:32:26] <arti> say*
[09:32:37] * arti has flashbacks to mschat
[09:32:39] <crutchy> ~up
[09:32:40] <bacon> bacon up: 0d 0:24:14
[09:32:53] <arti> # appears as tiki
[09:33:04] <crutchy> lol i used your function chromas
[09:33:05] <bacon> Don't try to outweird me, three-eyes. I get stranger things than you free
[09:33:05] <bacon> with my breakfast cereal.
[09:33:05] <bacon> -- Zaphod Beeblebrox
[09:33:12] <crutchy> thanks matey :-)
[09:33:26] <crutchy> think i might disable the lol aliases
[09:33:47] <crutchy> ~reload
[09:33:47] <bacon> successfully reloaded exec
[09:33:50] <crutchy> lol
[09:33:53] <crutchy> :-)
[09:34:01] <chromas> aw
[09:34:05] <crutchy> rofl
[09:34:06] <bacon> I don't love you, asshole, I love your daughter.
[09:34:06] <bacon> -- The Undergraduate
[09:34:13] <crutchy> ^still works
[09:34:20] <crutchy> for xlefay :-P
[09:46:59] <SirFinkus> is the site still having problems?
[09:47:24] <crutchy> someone might be tinkering :-P
[09:49:03] <xlefay> hehe ;D
[09:49:26] <crutchy> he lives!
[09:49:28] <chromas> crutchy: s/ker/kl/
[09:49:40] <chromas> SedBot doesn't like me
[09:49:40] * SedBot is a 53-line awk script, https://github.com
[09:49:54] <xlefay> I just woke up.. holy shit it's 9:49 and I _woke_ up
[09:49:55] <xlefay> :o
[09:50:51] <xlefay> cow-fortune
[09:51:01] <SirFinkus> can't get the "reply" function to work :/
[09:51:05] <SirFinkus> page just keeps loading
[09:51:14] <xlefay> cowsay-fortune
[09:51:14] <bacon> ________________________________________
[09:51:15] <bacon> / The more they over-think the plumbing \
[09:51:15] <bacon> \ the easier it is to stop up the drain. /
[09:51:15] <bacon> ----------------------------------------
[09:51:15] <bacon> \ ^__^
[09:51:15] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[09:51:15] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[09:51:15] <bacon> ||----w |
[09:51:16] <bacon> || ||
[09:51:17] <SirFinkus> the instant I say that it works again
[09:51:23] <crutchy> https://github.com
[09:51:25] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Face Recognition CAPTCHA - http://sylnt.us - time-to-face-up-to-it
[09:51:45] <xlefay> I keep getting signed out it's annoyin
[09:51:47] <xlefay> annoying*
[09:51:53] <crutchy> of irc?
[09:51:57] <crutchy> or github?
[09:52:04] <crutchy> or some porn site?
[09:52:10] <xlefay> SN.org
[09:52:15] <crutchy> oh
[09:52:17] <arti> maybe he's in the matrix, so he just goes into a coma
[09:52:20] * crutchy checks
[09:52:32] <crutchy> someone shot the white rabbit
[09:52:43] <arti> "i'm late, i'm late, i'm late!"
[09:52:56] <crutchy> hmm i'm still logged in
[09:53:28] <crutchy> ooh the site news slashbox has been prittied up a bit
[09:53:43] <xlefay> Isn't that one new?
[09:54:06] * xlefay has a hard time keeping track of all these random developments
[09:54:15] <crutchy> i think i saw it thismorning or last night but looked a little bit less formated
[09:54:35] <crutchy> random is fun
[09:54:59] <crutchy> ~join ##
[09:55:03] <SirFinkus> xlefay: I think it has to do with www.soylentnews.org vs soylentnews.org
[09:55:13] <xlefay> ' xlefay replied to all his spam. This terrible calamity has slowed him 0 days, 12:30:48 from level 50.' Yes, yes I do cause who doesn't want porn subscriptions that come with free viagra?
[09:55:17] <arti> aaah, subtle
[09:55:28] <crutchy> i'm in http://soylentnews.org
[09:55:33] <xlefay> SirFinkus, ehm, I never use www. I only use soylentnews.org and _only_ via SSL
[09:55:36] <SirFinkus> and I think some of the links go to the www
[09:55:44] <crutchy> might have something to do with load balancer
[09:55:48] <xlefay> I'm sure this has to do with the SSL being terminated on the load balancer instead of main site directly.
[09:55:49] <crutchy> maybe it fell down
[09:55:57] <SirFinkus> well, that works too
[09:56:21] <xlefay> I hardly ever click a link on SN.org anymore tbh
[09:56:28] <xlefay> just go to the main page, see the news and ctrl+w along
[09:56:35] <xlefay> s/along/off/
[09:56:35] <SedBot> <xlefay> just go to the main page, see the news and ctrl+w off
[09:56:38] <crutchy> i mainly troll here
[09:56:58] <crutchy> and spam with weird bots :-P
[09:57:15] <xlefay> rofl
[09:57:16] <bacon> A man needs a mistress, just to break the monogamy.
[09:57:55] * arti hopes that's some kind of baked treat
[09:58:16] <arti> i assume its cream filled
[09:58:46] * SirFinkus resists making the joke
[09:58:51] <xlefay> aah, like oreos ;-)
[09:59:00] <crutchy> lol
[09:59:06] <crutchy> eeeew
[09:59:36] <xlefay> you can twist them and.. uh oh
[09:59:39] <crutchy> little johnny is growd up
[09:59:40] <SirFinkus> oreos are delicious
[09:59:49] <SirFinkus> idk what crutchy is on about
[10:00:02] <crutchy> u never heard little johnny jokes?
[10:00:16] <SirFinkus> nope
[10:00:40] <SirFinkus> but seriously, I don't think I've ever met someone who doesn't like oreos
[10:00:47] <crutchy> http://unijokes.com
[10:00:49] <SirFinkus> that shit's in our DNA
[10:00:57] * xlefay notes I've only had similar cookies but no real oreos
[10:01:07] <crutchy> sure sure where the joke about the cream filled bikkies
[10:01:10] <arti> we should do a junk food exchange
[10:01:28] * arti did this with a german friend
[10:01:32] <arti> malzbier ftw
[10:01:49] <xlefay> rofl that first joke
[10:01:49] <bacon> Computer scientists are programmed to do it by macro insertion.
[10:01:53] <arti> got some sweet local beers as well :>
[10:02:21] <xlefay> all your bacons will belong to me? Yes?
[10:02:24] <SirFinkus> fake oreos are nothing like the real thing
[10:02:34] <arti> yeah, also, they have the double stuffed ones
[10:02:42] <SirFinkus> I'll make you a deal arti, send me lots of beer and I'll drink it
[10:02:48] <arti> ugh, inner fatty might limitbreak
[10:03:09] <arti> sending beer is expensive
[10:03:19] <arti> "yeah i ship people rocks"
[10:03:40] <SirFinkus> naw it's cool
[10:03:42] <SirFinkus> I promise
[10:03:58] <SirFinkus> jesus christ arti, they're MINERALS
[10:04:14] <arti> ITS JUST PROTEIN WHY ARE YOU FREAKING OUT
[10:04:46] <arti> hmm... beer.
[10:04:51] * arti fetches one
[10:17:20] <crutchy> ~join #sublight
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[10:51:39] <SirFinkus> lol just grabbed another beer expecting it to be some wimpy 5% abv belgian wheat beer, but it's an ipa with 8.5%
[10:54:03] <arti> nice
[10:54:08] <arti> next step is wine
[10:54:35] <SirFinkus> I actually really like this
[10:54:50] * arti is enjoying newcastle
[10:55:04] <SirFinkus> I just wish I had known before I opened it
[10:55:11] <SirFinkus> I just had a big stout
[10:55:54] <arti> get some nuts
[10:55:58] <SirFinkus> I was kind of hoping to do some programming tonight
[10:56:01] <arti> sounds like a party
[10:56:06] <arti> follow it up with some water
[10:56:15] <arti> and a little food, you'll be fine
[10:56:42] <SirFinkus> ehh, I'm retarded, programming requires 100% of my concentration
[10:56:54] <SirFinkus> can't even listen to music or anything while doing it
[10:57:04] <arti> even ambient stuff?
[10:57:22] <SirFinkus> maybe really ambient stuff
[10:57:34] <arti> you should rock some white noise mp3s
[10:57:42] <arti> sound of rain, thunder, humms etc.
[10:58:06] <SirFinkus> to what end?
[10:58:24] <arti> so i can watch your blood pressure spike from afar
[11:01:07] <SirFinkus> music really isn't something I can have on in the background, I always want to pay attention
[11:01:22] <SirFinkus> I even have trouble reading and stuff
[11:01:41] * arti can be easily distracted when reading
[11:01:50] <arti> i usually use headphones to isolate
[11:02:02] <arti> but it goes away once i'm engrossed, depends on the material
[11:02:07] <SirFinkus> I like headphones, but I always feel paranoid wearing them
[11:04:03] <arti> well just set a cron job to poll for external cues
[11:05:24] <SirFinkus> it's kind of bad for me, I'm usually set up facing the door and I still worry about people sneaking up behind me
[11:05:43] <arti> get one of those monitor mirrors
[11:07:55] <SirFinkus> https://ca.answers.yahoo.com
[11:08:09] <SirFinkus> this?
[11:08:39] <arti> http://www.thinkgeek.com
[11:08:58] <SirFinkus> well, mine was a joke
[11:09:17] <chromas> I wish you'd told me that before I started spraying my display...
[11:09:18] <SirFinkus> it isn't the kind of thing a mirror would help anyway, it's a "lizard brain" thing
[11:30:17] <SirFinkus> hmm, q and a with putin and someone asked if he'd invade eastern ukraine
[11:30:24] <SirFinkus> it sounded like it was on the table
[11:30:41] <SirFinkus> if there was a referendum
[11:33:45] <arti> sounds like a good time to own property there
[11:36:25] * arti shall return after sleep
[11:36:30] * arti disappears into the rafters
[11:57:46] <SirFinkus> lol alaska = ice crimea
[11:57:53] <SirFinkus> someone trolling the putin q and a
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[12:07:57] <SoyCow0424> what is soylent green?
[12:08:19] <SirFinkus> just soybeans and lentils, nothing to see here
[12:09:03] <SoyCow0424> oh so it's not kale
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[12:13:08] <SoyCow0424> i'm up outty
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[12:16:54] <chromas> lol
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[12:30:26] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Study Concludes USA is an Oligarchy - http://sylnt.us - Also:-Sky-is-Blue
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[13:16:04] <SirFinkus> heartbleed email #2 from gearbox about my borderlands account
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[13:25:03] <dentonj> *yawn*
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[14:21:25] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Bytram|away] by juggler
[14:28:20] juggs is now known as juggs|afk
[14:48:55] <crutchy> good evening soylent
[14:50:11] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Espresso as a Service - http://sylnt.us - How-about-pet-food?
[14:50:24] <xlefay> EAAS, was about time!
[15:05:27] -!- Woods [Woods!~41a24c20@65.162.qp.hv] has joined #Soylent
[15:08:05] -!- TK [TK!~9ff52002@159.245.ju.y] has joined #Soylent
[15:30:42] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - I Hate My Job, I Hate My Job, I Hate My Job - http://sylnt.us - Tell-us-how-you-really-feel
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[15:31:16] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v mechanicjay] by juggler
[15:49:00] <Blackmoore|ZZZ> mornin
[15:49:07] Blackmoore|ZZZ is now known as Blackmoore
[15:57:32] <AndyTheAbsurd> deadbeef: tell AndyTheAbsurd "this is only a test"
[15:57:54] <AndyTheAbsurd> hrm, I guess that's not the command. :(
[15:57:58] <xlefay> deadbeef, doesn't do that
[15:58:05] <xlefay> aqu4, tell AndyTheAbsurd "this is only a test"
[15:58:09] <xlefay> $tell AndyTheAbsurd "this is only a test"
[15:58:09] <aqu4> I'll tell them in a PM next time I see 'em.
[15:58:15] <AndyTheAbsurd> ah
[15:58:34] <xlefay> meh, memoserv ftw
[15:59:00] <AndyTheAbsurd> I like the phenny bot that does it in-channel better
[15:59:22] <AndyTheAbsurd> well, I suppose I should get my ass out of bed and get ready to go to the office.
[15:59:48] <xlefay> or convince your boss to set up a VPN and just dial in :P
[16:02:35] <AndyTheAbsurd> I have VPN access already
[16:03:19] <AndyTheAbsurd> but I'm across the country from where I normally work visiting corporate HQ
[16:03:25] <AndyTheAbsurd> the wifi in this hotel sucks ass. :(
[16:03:44] <xlefay> auch
[16:05:23] -!- Subsentient has quit [Quit: Derp.]
[16:14:02] <Landon> linode <3 https://blog.linode.com
[16:20:19] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - First Half of New Chernobyl Cover on the Move - http://sylnt.us - Ukraine-news-that-doesn't-suck
[16:20:46] Bytram|away is now known as Bytram
[16:40:34] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Chernobyl Cover Completion Compromised by Crisis - http://sylnt.us - one-step-forward-two-steps-back
[16:41:23] <Blackmoore> um that was fast
[16:41:57] <crutchy> ooh click bait... *clicks*
[16:42:03] <Landon> was that a ... dupe?
[16:42:12] <Blackmoore> link didnt change.
[16:42:17] <Landon> ohhh
[16:42:21] <mechanicjay> Perhaps a title edit?
[16:42:25] <Landon> not just title
[16:42:28] <Landon> the department changed too
[16:42:34] <Landon> that's why I was confused
[16:44:45] <Blackmoore> ooh- i got to read both :P
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[16:47:46] <Blackmoore> moo
[16:47:46] <bacon> (__)
[16:47:46] <bacon> (oo)
[16:47:46] <bacon> /------\/
[16:47:46] <bacon> / | ||
[16:47:46] <bacon> * /\---/\
[16:47:46] <bacon> ~~ ~~
[16:47:47] <bacon> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[16:47:54] <Blackmoore> bacon++
[16:47:54] <deadbeef> karma - bacon: 222
[16:48:10] <TK> Now make the cow dance
[16:48:56] <Blackmoore> cowsay eat more bacon
[16:48:56] <bacon> ________________
[16:48:57] <bacon> < eat more bacon >
[16:48:57] <bacon> ----------------
[16:48:57] <bacon> \ ^__^
[16:48:57] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[16:48:57] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[16:48:57] <bacon> ||----w |
[16:48:58] <bacon> || ||
[16:49:20] <Blackmoore> who's bot is this?
[16:49:21] <TK> cowsay bacon++
[16:49:21] <bacon> _______
[16:49:22] <bacon> < bacon >
[16:49:22] <bacon> -------
[16:49:22] <bacon> \ ^__^
[16:49:22] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[16:49:22] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[16:49:22] <bacon> ||----w |
[16:49:22] <bacon> || ||
[16:49:37] <TK> Nice udders
[16:49:42] <TK> I assume
[16:50:29] <Blackmoore> it is a cow, not a steer
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[16:51:41] <Blackmoore> cowsay-fortune
[16:51:41] <bacon> _____________________________________
[16:51:42] <bacon> / You can tell how far we have to go, \
[16:51:42] <bacon> | when FORTRAN is the language of |
[16:51:42] <bacon> \ supercomputers. -- Steven Feiner /
[16:51:42] <bacon> -------------------------------------
[16:51:42] <bacon> \ ^__^
[16:51:42] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[16:51:43] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[16:51:43] <bacon> ||----w |
[16:51:44] <bacon> || ||
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[17:02:05] <dentonj> moo
[17:02:05] <bacon> (__)
[17:02:06] <bacon> (oo)
[17:02:06] <bacon> /------\/
[17:02:06] <bacon> / | ||
[17:02:06] <bacon> * /\---/\
[17:02:06] <bacon> ~~ ~~
[17:02:06] <bacon> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[17:02:08] -!- willyg_cos [willyg_cos!~joeuser@06-377-63-214.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #Soylent
[17:03:41] <Blackmoore> well the other bot wont spit out quotes for me, but this one will moo on command
[17:03:58] <Bytram> mmu
[17:04:02] <Bytram> mumu
[17:04:42] <crutchy> ~
[17:04:43] <bacon> IRC SCRIPT EXECUTIVE
[17:04:43] <bacon> by crutchy: https://github.com
[17:04:43] <bacon> visit http://wiki.soylentnews.org for more info
[17:16:41] <Blackmoore> :)
[17:20:28] -!- michealpwalls [michealpwalls!~michealpw@dq-p708q-fi65.georgianc.on.ca] has joined #Soylent
[17:20:32] <michealpwalls> Hi, everybody! :)
[17:21:49] <crutchy> hi michealpwalls :-)
[17:21:59] <michealpwalls> That soylent story about the "I hate my job" stegonographer made me chuckle. It reminded me of some of the 'support officers' in my office... They answer the same question over and over and over all day every day.
[17:22:17] <michealpwalls> I was thinking, I could make a little Arduino that listens for those terms and automatically plays back their response LMAO
[17:22:20] <michealpwalls> Hi Crutchy! :)
[17:23:22] <michealpwalls> How are things, Crutchy?
[17:23:39] <crutchy> not bad thanks. you?
[17:23:52] <michealpwalls> Exhausted :(
[17:23:57] <crutchy> oh
[17:24:00] <crutchy> work?
[17:24:03] <michealpwalls> LOL can't wait for home time today hehe
[17:24:11] <crutchy> yeah
[17:24:18] <michealpwalls> Yea, late nights plus I'm sick so it makes me feel so much mor etired than I really am
[17:24:25] <crutchy> it's nearly 1.30am here
[17:24:33] <michealpwalls> Ohh, 11:24am here ;)
[17:24:34] <crutchy> not working atm :-P
[17:25:03] <crutchy> got a long weekend?
[17:25:35] <michealpwalls> I do it to myself LOL. I made a script to do ETL (Extract, Transform, Load) 'cause I had a feeling people would give me data in random formats at the last minute (and they did!) but spent way too much time on the script
[17:25:47] <michealpwalls> Yes, finally! Long weekend wooOO! :)
[17:25:51] <michealpwalls> Going to sleep all over that bed! :)
[17:26:09] <crutchy> sounds like a plan
[17:26:16] <michealpwalls> Yea
[17:26:24] * crutchy tries to ignore clock
[17:27:16] <michealpwalls> hehe
[17:28:17] <crutchy> what's extract/transform/load? is that trying to get data from one program into a format that can be read by another?
[17:28:58] <michealpwalls> Yea
[17:29:23] <crutchy> useful skill ;-)
[17:29:28] <michealpwalls> Indeed!
[17:29:32] <michealpwalls> regular expressions (flex)
[17:30:09] <Blackmoore> mornin!
[17:30:26] <Blackmoore> :P
[17:30:35] <Blackmoore> (it's nearly noon here)
[17:30:38] <michealpwalls> Good morning Blackmoore! :)
[17:30:44] <crutchy> g'day Blackmoore :-)
[17:30:51] <crutchy> it's morning here too
[17:30:54] <crutchy> :-P
[17:31:24] <Blackmoore> is NC serious about the minecraft server?
[17:31:36] <crutchy> he is a tinkerer
[17:31:37] <mattie_p> I believe he is semi-serious
[17:31:40] <michealpwalls> Minecraft is awesome :)
[17:31:47] <mattie_p> but there are other priorities at the moment
[17:32:04] <mattie_p> he was fine with the MUD, after all, so long as he didn't have to do it
[17:32:05] <michealpwalls> They've really considered the idea of using Minecraft to visual teach complex concepts to new programming students
[17:32:14] <crutchy> though if he gets one we may never hear from him again... i'm sure the minecraft rabbit hole is deep
[17:32:19] <Blackmoore> I actually run a private one. modded of course
[17:32:21] <michealpwalls> s/visual/visually
[17:32:21] * SedBot offers michilpwills a /
[17:32:29] <michealpwalls> I don't want it! :)
[17:32:49] <crutchy> i haven't touched minecraft
[17:32:51] <michealpwalls> I don't think the Minecraft rabbit hole has a bottom? :/
[17:32:54] <crutchy> my wife would kill me
[17:32:55] <michealpwalls> LOL that's a good thing, crutchy!
[17:32:58] <Woods> Sorry, did someone say something about a Minecraft MUD?
[17:33:00] <Woods> I would play that.
[17:33:25] <Blackmoore> it is. I started skyblock on monday, and my wife was about to kill me. i got so sucked in
[17:33:52] <mattie_p> umm, how would one go about constructing one, Woods? Using minecraft to build a turing complete virtual machine?
[17:34:00] <Blackmoore> *contemplating running skyblock on my server*
[17:34:04] <michealpwalls> https://www.youtube.com
[17:34:38] <crutchy> build a cpu from scratch using those switch thingys as gates maybe?
[17:34:45] <michealpwalls> Logic Gates, demonstrated in Minecraft :D
[17:34:55] <Blackmoore> "it is dark. you are likely to be blownup by a creeper"
[17:35:33] <michealpwalls> That's exactly what a CPU is, though... Essentially. Transisters are made up of many logic gates and essentially CPUs are very large collections of transisters.
[17:36:02] <michealpwalls> Just like when we build half-adders by connecting logic gates in a series and then connect the half-adders in series to create full adders (addition with carrying)
[17:36:15] <Blackmoore> i really dont get the compulsion to make logic gates/adders in minecraft.
[17:36:16] <michealpwalls> Same concept, just very low level. But from that foundation you can get a very strong grasp of how computers actually work
[17:36:29] <michealpwalls> It's got a lot of potential for teaching the concepts, Blackmoore.
[17:36:30] <mattie_p> so ... sometime today we are going to get comment number 32768, or 2 ^ 15
[17:36:31] <Woods> "You swing your pickaxe at the stone and chip away a chunk, which you collect, then take a step forward" repeat ad infinitum.
[17:36:31] <drussell> Rocky's boots
[17:36:57] <Landon> Blackmoore: because it's a "solved" problem outside of minecraft, you just have to translate it for the constraints
[17:37:01] <Landon> at least, thats what I imagine the compulsion is
[17:37:09] <Landon> you don't have to actually invent computers, just make them work :)
[17:37:10] <Blackmoore> it is cool that you can. I know that some school is using the Q-craft mod to teach the consepts of quantum mechanics in MC
[17:37:46] <michealpwalls> For me it's purely educational :)
[17:38:09] <crutchy> it looks like a strange way of engineering things
[17:38:16] <Blackmoore> "there is a chest here" "you have found 3 bones, a name tag, 4 rottenflesh, and a bottle of poison"
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[17:38:40] <crutchy> https://www.youtube.com
[17:38:46] <crutchy> How to Build a Digital Clock in Minecraft! Part 3 [In Game Time!]
[17:38:51] <Blackmoore> "you have died in Lava"
[17:39:05] <michealpwalls> People have too much free time on their hands? LOL!
[17:39:20] <drussell> Rocky's Boots on an Apple ][ in about grade 3 was my first intro to logic... It all made perfect sense ever since
[17:40:04] <crutchy> wholly carp: https://www.youtube.com
[17:40:05] <Woods> "You see in the distance an Enderman, do you look directly at him?" yes
[17:40:15] <Woods> "He teleports to you and kills you. You are dead"
[17:41:11] <Blackmoore> "you bed was destroyed. you have respawned in a completely random location"
[17:41:28] <Blackmoore> "it is dark, and raining"
[17:42:03] <crutchy> wholly crap shit: https://www.youtube.com
[17:42:13] <crutchy> some people just have waaaaay too much spare time
[17:42:53] <Blackmoore> *shrug* it's an endless supply of legos.
[17:43:06] <Blackmoore> and ones i cant step on.
[17:43:36] <Woods> Crutchy: You can design and assemble red stone "computers" outside of Minecraft and side-load them into the game with a third party app. That removes all of the "physical" monotony of placing blocks, etc.
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[17:50:56] <Blackmoore> i wonder if that's how people are building the note-block music.
[17:51:28] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Reddit Auto-Censors Tech Security Related Language - http://sylnt.us - First-rule-of-censorship
[17:53:57] <crutchy> catchy tune: http://incompetech.com
[17:56:21] <crutchy> g'day n1
[17:59:40] <TK> 1) Can you make a display in minecraft? 2) Can you emulate Pong in minecraft?
[18:00:11] <Landon> 1) yes
[18:00:14] <Landon> 2) probably
[18:00:29] <Landon> http://static.planetminecraft.com
[18:00:39] <michealpwalls> Story: http://www.dailydot.com
[18:01:02] <michealpwalls> Mother and son commit suicide after an argument over "video game addiction" (League of Legends)
[18:01:03] <michealpwalls> LOL
[18:01:42] <Woods> TK: The screen refreshes horribly slow though, because of the method you have to use to impliment the video display.
[18:02:42] <michealpwalls> At what point do people simply get into programming, I wonder? :O
[18:02:45] <Landon> but really, just give them an FPGA and decent tools :)
[18:02:58] <michealpwalls> Like, building pong in Minecraft is much, much more difficult than actually making a fucking Pong program :/
[18:03:53] <Landon> ++
[18:04:14] <michealpwalls> Oh man that story is cray cray :O
[18:04:28] <michealpwalls> Apparently the father was going to follow the son and mother into some river to kill himself, too, but was stopped (rofl)
[18:05:30] <SirFinkus> review of tacobell bacon am crunchwrap: tastes better than it smells
[18:05:39] <michealpwalls> LOL
[18:05:53] <Woods> Wow
[18:06:04] crutchy is now known as crutchy|zzz
[18:06:06] <Woods> Rivers are apparently the best conversation/life enders.
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[18:07:44] <michealpwalls> haha
[18:08:41] <SirFinkus> crutchy|zzz http://mkv25.net
[18:08:52] <SirFinkus> oh wait, that's not the video
[18:09:26] <michealpwalls> wth?
[18:09:36] <Blackmoore> @tk.. yes, I would assume the sethbling (look for him on youtube) has done it
[18:10:04] <Blackmoore> There is also a mod called Computercraft that you can program with Lua.
[18:15:03] <TK> woods: Can I run minecraft in a VM with 10x clockpeed and mod the game so I walk at 0.1x speed?
[18:17:13] <michealpwalls> No, games don't generally work that way these days. A lot of the older 16-bit MS-DOS games did, though.
[18:17:22] <michealpwalls> Can't you just configure the speed of Minecraft in the settings? LOL
[18:17:36] <michealpwalls> Also a lot of console games, too
[18:18:02] <michealpwalls> since the speed of the console is static, you can tie a lot of the in-game mechanics to the hardware like speeds and even timings
[18:18:14] <michealpwalls> Which is why emulating those console games is a big kick in the balls on a Desktop machine ^
[18:18:18] <Landon> _but_ most console games are multiplatform to PC these days
[18:18:25] <michealpwalls> Indeed ^
[18:18:33] <michealpwalls> Most modern "console" games are actually Windows, DirectX games hehe
[18:19:28] <Blackmoore> Where as Minecraft is java.
[18:19:37] <michealpwalls> I was mainly talking about the more "traditional" consoles, like the SNES and Sega Genesis (Sorry, I'm old hehe)
[18:20:10] <Blackmoore> I grew up with atari. you arent old
[18:20:39] <Blackmoore> if i want to emulate that hunk of junk - now i have to emulate a crt too.
[18:21:13] <michealpwalls> LOL yea, colours were very hw based "back in the day" hehehe
[18:22:43] <michealpwalls> I think, ultimately, the best way to think about it is the older consoles basically didn't have an OS. LOL. YOu put in the console and the console's software started running and handled the entire system on it's own. Many console cartridges even had companion processors embedded in the cartridge to assist in processing (Donkey Kong, etc. all had these companion processors)
[18:24:46] <Blackmoore> yup. a lot of them did.
[18:25:16] <michealpwalls> SNES was a really cool system :)
[18:25:32] <Blackmoore> you even saw that on "advanced consoles" like genesis and SNES
[18:25:44] <michealpwalls> Parallel power (flex)
[18:25:51] Blackmoore is now known as Blackmoore|AFK
[18:35:01] <Woods> TK: Probably. But I do not know.
[18:43:08] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Fake Mayor Twitter Account Leads to Police Raid - http://sylnt.us - I-Miss-Fake-Steve-Jobs
[18:43:31] <michealpwalls> LOL
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[18:50:19] <michealpwalls> I hate how much Steve Jobs is idolized.. What exactly did he do for "humanity", exactly? :/
[18:50:43] <michealpwalls> Bill Gates is curing fucking diseases like Polio, don't see him idolized like Jobs is.. It's really quite irrational to me.
[18:51:31] <SirFinkus> dude, he designed the iphone by himself while on LSD
[18:51:35] <SirFinkus> it's a true story
[18:52:00] <michealpwalls> Steve Jobs was a fucking dead-beat father that used his "friend" Steve Wozniak to make himself rich. He then got drunk with that money, nearly ran Apple into the fucking ground (Had ot be bailed out financially by Microsoft in exchange for a very large volume of Apple shares) and was ultimately *fired* from the Company...
[18:52:16] <michealpwalls> He came back after blowing billions at the failed NeXT company only to die not long after by Cancer.
[18:52:23] <michealpwalls> This is a "hero" ? Sound slik ea royal fuckup to me :)
[18:52:46] <SirFinkus> well, you're skipping a bit there
[18:53:10] <michealpwalls> The only reason, in my opinion, that he was brought back was so that Apple could ackquire the products that NeXT had (Namely, the Darwin OS that became OS X)
[18:53:24] <michealpwalls> 'course that last bit is pure speculation :P
[18:53:26] <michealpwalls> hehehe
[18:53:49] <michealpwalls> I don't think I've skipped much, really. I think I put in the main points hehe :)
[18:56:15] <michealpwalls> The original idea for the iPhone's design was great and all.. Not sure how much of this came from Steve but even if 100% of the idea came from him, it doesn't justify the ridiculous idolization he received after his death, at least not in my opinion.
[18:59:33] <SirFinkus> well, nothing would, I wouldn't call him a loser
[19:00:07] <SirFinkus> Apple pretty much invented the consumer tablet market under him
[19:00:07] <michealpwalls> Nope, definately wouldn't call him a loser LOL.
[19:00:25] <michealpwalls> Consumer Tablet Market? So we're going to pretend that Palm and et al never existed?
[19:00:31] <michealpwalls> The idea of a "Personal Data Assistant" ?
[19:00:32] <michealpwalls> LOL
[19:00:48] <SirFinkus> yeah actually, they weren't mainstream consumer items
[19:00:56] <Blackmoore|AFK> and the failed newton?
[19:00:56] <michealpwalls> Wait...
[19:01:08] <michealpwalls> Now you're saying "Mainstream" but before you tried to claim they *invented* the market.. Which they clearly did not.
[19:01:13] Blackmoore|AFK is now known as Blackmoore
[19:01:32] <michealpwalls> They simply made it "look cool", "hip" for fanbois or whatever, I don't know.. LOL. They def. did not invent it.
[19:01:39] <SirFinkus> I said they invented the market, not the devices
[19:01:53] <SirFinkus> very few people wanted tablets before the ipad
[19:02:11] <michealpwalls> That's not "inventing" a market, though.. That's increasing demand.
[19:03:20] <michealpwalls> I think more accurately, they increased public demand for a niche market that already existed.
[19:04:09] <SirFinkus> well, I guess it's mostly semantics
[19:04:16] <michealpwalls> Pretty much :P
[19:04:46] <Teckla> michealpwalls: From what I've read, Microsoft didn't bail out Apple. Apple had some number of billions in the bank and Microsoft bought some piddly number of shares amounting to something like 150 million.
[19:05:09] <SirFinkus> main point is that nobody really wanted or had tablets until the ipad came out
[19:05:23] <SirFinkus> not for lack of people trying to introduce them, microsoft had been trying for years
[19:05:33] <Teckla> That is, Microsoft's purchase of Apple shares wouldn't have made enough difference to matter (at the rate Apple was bleeding at the time).
[19:05:52] <michealpwalls> Do you remember those Windows Tablet PCs that ran Windows XP?
[19:06:27] <SirFinkus> of course, I've never actually seen one in real life though, which shows how popular they were
[19:06:30] <Blackmoore> i do. underpowered. bad battery life..
[19:07:01] <michealpwalls> Teckla: Well, I'm not sure how you can consider a $150 million cash injection insignificant...
[19:07:07] <SirFinkus> I remember around the Vista release MS tried again, they had a huge marketing push about how good it would be on tablets
[19:07:25] <Teckla> Tablet PCs were a staple of sci-fi before Apple or Microsoft even existed. Science fiction invented the idea of tablet PCs, not technology companies.
[19:07:31] <paulej72> very underpowered I supported 5 or 6 over the years, but they did have full Wacom diitizers that were really good compared to today’s touch screens
[19:07:48] <michealpwalls> It was exactly what Apple needed at the time, facing bankruptcy and liquidation of assets. They got through the trouble without liquidating any of their assets, which was the goal I think. You're right I suppose, that for multinational corporations 150 million is pretty small
[19:08:00] <michealpwalls> But I think, don't forget that's a straight cash injection..
[19:08:03] <michealpwalls> That's serious cash :O
[19:08:08] <Teckla> michealpwalls: At Apple's scale at the time, $150 million was peanuts.
[19:08:15] <michealpwalls> It wasn't credit or "stock options" hehe
[19:08:44] <Teckla> But it's still a popular myth that Microsoft bailed out Apple, same as it's still a popular myth that Bill Gates claimed that 640k should be enough for anyone.
[19:08:57] <michealpwalls> Teckla: Exactly right about Sci-Fi, have to agree! :)
[19:09:06] <michealpwalls> Star Trek has done more to change our lives than any tech company I can think of :)
[19:09:51] <Teckla> michealpwalls: Microsoft's investment in Apple didn't save Apple. Apple was never anywhere near their last $150 million.
[19:09:54] <Blackmoore> ;)
[19:09:57] <Blackmoore> In 1996, Michael Spindler was replaced by Gil Amelio as CEO. Gil Amelio made many changes at Apple, including extensive layoffs.[61] After numerous failed attempts to improve Mac OS, first with the Taligent project, then later with Copland and Gershwin, Amelio chose to purchase NeXT and its NeXTSTEP operating system, bringing Steve Jobs back to Apple as an advisor.[62] On July 9, 1997, Amelio was ousted by the board of directors after overseeing a thre
[19:10:08] <Blackmoore> http://en.wikipedia.org
[19:10:10] <michealpwalls> Things get taken out of context, but what Bill Said about memory still holds water today. Good programmers can make use of the memory they're given and I think that's ultimately his point, or at least, that's what *I* take away from it..
[19:10:13] <TK> Steve Jobs: Recently deceased CEO of a company that specializes in comsumer electronics, and distribution of electronic media
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[19:10:28] <Teckla> michealpwalls: What Microsoft actually did for Apple that actually mattered was sign an agreement to supply IE for Mac and to continue to supply Office for Mac.
[19:10:53] <TK> There, a statement that doesn't call him a visionary genius or a bullying hack
[19:11:21] <michealpwalls> LOL
[19:11:36] <Teckla> Also, regarding BG's philanthropic efforts, I believe Jobs' stated opinion was that charity should be anonymous. Nobody really knows how much he invested in philanthropic efforts.
[19:11:38] <michealpwalls> At least it doesn't make any bold claims! I like it :)
[19:12:29] <TK> Now whoever made the decision to use itunes to generate untold amounts of essentially free money, that's your visionary genius right there.
[19:12:44] <michealpwalls> ^ Agreed
[19:12:49] <michealpwalls> 99 cent music.. Genius.
[19:13:08] <michealpwalls> iTunes is like the legitimate Napster
[19:13:40] <Blackmoore> yup
[19:15:50] <michealpwalls> Teckla: Meh. The same logic can be used to claim anything as 'potentially true'. It's a fact that BG has donated an incredible amount of time and money to philanthropic initiatives and has achieved quantifiable results (I.E: Polio and Malaria). I have seen nothing about Steve except that he was a dead-beat father. I have a hard time beleving dead-beat fathers donate to charities :)
[19:16:03] <michealpwalls> And even if they do, does it matter? THey're still popping out children they don't take care of..
[19:16:19] <michealpwalls> The guy's a royal douchebag. Not sure why people defend him as you do, to be fair..
[19:17:01] <michealpwalls> Granted you make some good points :P
[19:17:14] <TK> All human beings are douchebags, some are serfs, some are royals
[19:17:36] <michealpwalls> hah
[19:17:43] <michealpwalls> Nicely put, TK :)
[19:19:07] <michealpwalls> I miss the Retina display that my MacBook Pro had :O
[19:19:13] <michealpwalls> Was soooo incredible.
[19:20:59] <SirFinkus> I can't wait for the desktop monitors to mature a bit
[19:21:19] <SirFinkus> all the ones released now have issues based on what I've seen
[19:21:38] <SirFinkus> 30hz, TN panels, no scaling etc
[19:21:56] <SirFinkus> and most of them are 1k
[19:27:37] <michealpwalls> desktop retinas?
[19:27:43] <michealpwalls> Didn't even know there was any :O
[19:28:29] <SirFinkus> I think dell has a 28" 4k one
[19:28:51] <SirFinkus> which sounds about right PPI wise
[19:29:01] <michealpwalls> Interesting!
[19:29:54] <michealpwalls> Google Pixel looks pretty nice. Pixel ChromeBook or whatever it's called
[19:30:07] <michealpwalls> http://www.google.com
[19:30:21] <michealpwalls> Not sure if I like the website better than the laptop, though.. Beautiful website! :O
[19:30:31] <SirFinkus> http://accessories.us.dell.com
[19:31:02] <michealpwalls> Wow that's a lot of pixels :O
[19:31:04] <michealpwalls> LOL!
[19:31:08] <SirFinkus> for the price of the pixel, you might as well get a rmbp
[19:31:41] <michealpwalls> Yea, true SirFinkus. Then you're on OS X though :/
[19:31:43] <SirFinkus> I think the dell one I linked doesn't use the latest hdmi standards, so you only get 30hz
[19:31:55] <michealpwalls> lol jk
[19:32:06] <michealpwalls> You make a pretty valid point though. The Pixel is crazy expensive for what it is :/
[19:32:19] <michealpwalls> But damn that website is smooth.. LOL look at it!
[19:32:28] <SirFinkus> ehh, osx still handles the resolution better than anything else I've tried
[19:32:46] <michealpwalls> $700 for a monitor, though. My wife would flip out. This entire laptop was ~$699 hehehe
[19:33:37] <SirFinkus> there's these too
[19:33:38] <SirFinkus> http://en.wikipedia.org
[19:34:10] <michealpwalls> YOu mean how everything is scalable? OS X is crazy for it's graphics. I think everysingle tiny, minute little graphic in the OS X interface is a vector graphic that can scale seamlessly... It gives it a massive advantage when shrinking/expanding :/
[19:34:16] <michealpwalls> Whereas most other systems are not..
[19:34:28] <michealpwalls> Scalable at all, LMAO if they even *support* vector graphics at all, that is ;)
[19:34:35] * arti o.o
[19:34:40] <SirFinkus> wut
[19:34:40] <arti> most of the icons are pngs
[19:34:54] <SirFinkus> osx doesn't use vectors extensively, or at all afaik
[19:35:15] <arti> but you're right about scalable, especially with the price :D
[19:35:24] <arti> greetings
[19:35:35] <michealpwalls> It's not vectors?
[19:35:42] <SirFinkus> nope
[19:35:45] <michealpwalls> I thought they were svgs all over the place
[19:36:34] <SirFinkus> that's probably be too cpu intensive for now
[19:37:32] * arti needs to examine mavericks more
[19:38:03] <SirFinkus> looking for svgs?
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[19:40:47] <arti> there is quartz, which is a graphics api that allows vector transforms and gradients
[19:41:16] <arti> https://developer.apple.com
[19:41:52] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Negative Life Events Vary by Neighborhood & Have An Affect On Health - http://sylnt.us - life-is-a-rigged-game
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[19:47:16] <michealpwalls> I admired at how elegantly everything scaled when changing resolutions on OS X though. Even very low or very high resolutions, everything (Including the text) scaled to be a comfortable size in relation to the chosen resolution
[19:47:25] <michealpwalls> Wheras on Windows and most other systems, everything stays static..
[19:47:49] * arti agrees
[19:47:57] <michealpwalls> And becomes unreadable (Text) at high resolutions and imagines become distorted and pixelated at low resolutions. I always assumed OS X did that by implementing everything as a scalable graphic
[19:48:19] * arti likes many things about osx
[19:48:26] <arti> uninstallation is sweet
[19:48:31] <arti> drag that app the to trash
[19:48:33] <arti> done
[19:48:50] <arti> you just have to be able to tolerate their workflow
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[19:49:43] <SirFinkus> the window management stinks
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[19:51:00] <michealpwalls> Yea OS X has a lot of good ideas that other systems can learn from
[19:51:30] <michealpwalls> Their disk-image based app distribution is pretty slick... It contains fat-file binaries for various different platforms, allowing seamless "double-click" to run regardless of platform :/
[19:51:48] <michealpwalls> Very smart. Jus tlike the Android .apk files. Just a zip file with big binaries and everything it needs all in one place.
[19:52:34] <michealpwalls> Well maybe like like .apk
[19:52:37] <michealpwalls> More like a .deb
[19:59:36] <michealpwalls> To be fair, if the rmbp was much less expensive, it would likely be my ideal machine. The price makes it impossible for me to really like though :/
[20:04:52] <SirFinkus> I have one, it's the best laptop I've ever used
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[20:05:52] nick is now known as n1
[20:08:01] <SirFinkus> Negative Life Events Vary by Neighborhood & Have An Affect On Health
[20:08:07] <SirFinkus> s/Affect/Effect
[20:08:08] * SedBot tosses a / to SarFenkas
[20:08:14] <SirFinkus> s/Affect/Effect/
[20:08:14] <SedBot> <SerFynkos> Negative Life Events Vary by Neighborhood & Have An Effect On Health
[20:08:37] <SirFinkus> thanks sedbot!
[20:12:40] <michealpwalls> amagad I'm like the bug king
[20:12:52] <michealpwalls> LMAO no matter how much I test and review it, I end up releasing it with a bug :(
[20:13:02] <michealpwalls> At least one :)(
[20:15:23] <Teckla> michealpwalls: I could argue that all the money BG has dedicated to philanthropic initiatives was stolen money in the first place. ;)
[20:15:40] <michealpwalls> hah
[20:15:57] <michealpwalls> How could you argue that, I wonder? (You've made me interested, if only a morbid interest..)
[20:17:07] <Teckla> michealpwalls: All the immoral and unethical things MS has done, etc.
[20:17:33] <michealpwalls> Jah. Would that simply make the money 'immoral', then? Certainly not stolen :P
[20:18:00] <Teckla> Not that I actually care one bit about Steve Jobs or Bill Gates. If people want to demonize one and angelify the other, I guess I don't care. People need their idols and their enemies.
[20:18:06] <michealpwalls> And, one could argue, if you use immoral money for moral things (Philanthropy..) does it balance out? :/
[20:18:12] <SirFinkus> they're both assholes
[20:18:23] <Blackmoore> i'm with SirFinkus.
[20:18:40] * Teckla is with Blackmoore who is with SirFinkus.
[20:18:50] <Blackmoore> both assholes. they know how to use people. and profited from it
[20:18:52] <michealpwalls> I accept that. I don't think anyone should be idolized, per se. I certainly have a lot of respect for Bill Gates, though! I'm not afraid to admit it :)
[20:19:26] <Blackmoore> I think my problem is that im burned out on the argument.
[20:19:31] * arti wonders if he has a painting of the brownshirts thing on his wall
[20:19:32] <michealpwalls> haha
[20:19:40] * arti would totally do that
[20:19:43] <michealpwalls> brownshirts?
[20:19:46] <Blackmoore> "they both suck can we just shut up about it?"
[20:19:48] <SirFinkus> RMS is kind of an asshole too, but he doesn't know any better
[20:19:56] <michealpwalls> RMS is a legend
[20:19:57] <michealpwalls> LMAO
[20:20:03] <dentonj> moo
[20:20:03] <bacon> (__)
[20:20:04] <bacon> (oo)
[20:20:04] <bacon> /------\/
[20:20:04] <bacon> / | ||
[20:20:04] <bacon> * /\---/\
[20:20:04] <bacon> ~~ ~~
[20:20:04] <bacon> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[20:20:20] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Negative Life Events Vary by Neighborhood & Have An Effect On Health - http://sylnt.us - life-is-a-rigged-game
[20:20:27] * SirFinkus claps
[20:20:35] <michealpwalls> I still can't get past the video I seen... He was explaining something at a conference whilst sitting in a chair... Without missing a beat in his conversation he bends over, slips off his sock and starts picking stuff from his foot :O
[20:20:42] <michealpwalls> Then he proceeds to eat whatever it was he picked from his foot.
[20:20:45] <michealpwalls> (puke)
[20:20:58] <SirFinkus> Torvalds is an asshole too, but in a good way
[20:21:00] <Blackmoore> *throws up*
[20:21:09] <arti> oh the toe jam thing was awesome
[20:21:14] <Blackmoore> i just ate lunch man..
[20:21:20] <michealpwalls> LMAO of course I found it! https://www.youtube.com
[20:21:21] <Blackmoore> ew.
[20:21:22] <michealpwalls> Top result
[20:21:24] <michealpwalls> (rofl)
[20:21:34] <arti> "your move audience"
[20:21:34] <michealpwalls> God this guy's a legend
[20:21:38] <michealpwalls> LMAO arti
[20:22:15] <SirFinkus> His flesh is libre
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[20:22:50] <michealpwalls> haha
[20:23:55] <arti> meh, i've seen worse....code
[20:24:29] <michealpwalls> hehe
[20:24:45] <SirFinkus> you are free to incorporate his genetic material, as long as you redistribute it and make the source available
[20:24:56] * arti thinks about stds
[20:25:04] <arti> turtle.sh
[20:25:12] <michealpwalls> hehe
[20:26:30] * SirFinkus begins modifying the gpl so that it works for flesh
[20:26:40] <arti> the clone wars!
[20:27:08] <SirFinkus> I'll have a stack of them bedside, next to the condoms
[20:27:28] <michealpwalls> (puke)
[20:27:37] <arti> "and that's how we make hotdogs"
[20:27:39] <SirFinkus> oh wait, those would be disallowed under the lisense
[20:27:59] <SirFinkus> they're like DRM
[20:29:47] <SirFinkus> wow, my train of though is alarming me now
[20:30:07] <arti> hahahaha
[20:30:13] * arti focuses on email sending
[20:30:29] <michealpwalls> Gah, so "fear", "depression" are "health affects"? (dull)
[20:30:32] <michealpwalls> That's just lame!
[20:30:56] <michealpwalls> Just in: Being in a poor neighbour leads to fear and depression! SHOCKER
[20:31:57] <SirFinkus> so heterosexual sex = GPL, homosexual sex = BSD, masturbation = closed source
[20:32:04] <michealpwalls> Beside anecdotes, I wonder how much evidence there is to suggest real health-related effects of Depression.
[20:32:12] <michealpwalls> Masturbation is def. proprietary/closed source.
[20:32:22] <michealpwalls> I think public/filmed sex == GPL
[20:32:36] <SirFinkus> well, the effects of stress are well documented
[20:32:42] <arti> an amusing masturbatory reference i've been using
[20:32:47] <arti> the solitary vice
[20:32:49] <michealpwalls> Homosexual/Heterosexual Sex in private is like Open Source (Open != Free) and masturbation is just proprietary/closed source (And wrong!)
[20:32:59] <SirFinkus> nope, you've got it wrong
[20:32:59] * arti came across some victorian era stuff
[20:33:01] <michealpwalls> LOL solitary vice
[20:36:05] <michealpwalls> THis article is such fluff. 5 paragraphs in and there hasn't been a single tangible case mentioned. Always vague, generalizations such as "negative events", "physical and social risks", "stressors"... LOL it's like the research report of a fucking Politician :/
[20:36:22] <Blackmoore> well fine. *zip* the things I have to do to be GPL compliant :(
[20:36:35] <TK> @michael makes sense, people learn "little tricks" from their partners, then teach them to future partners
[20:36:47] <Blackmoore> *nope.. not going to type in that next line*
[20:37:08] <SirFinkus> so let me explain my rational
[20:37:23] <TK> But you never share what you learn on your own
[20:37:24] <SirFinkus> without being too graphic, sex is basically information exchange
[20:37:25] <michealpwalls> TK: Indeed! But they cannot share these events from past partners, that would be wrong (Hense Open Source, but not GPL)
[20:37:30] <michealpwalls> haha TK, indeed!
[20:38:06] <SirFinkus> the act of conception is taking the source and modifying it with the mother's dna
[20:38:12] <michealpwalls> LOL
[20:38:18] <SirFinkus> or vis-versa depending on how you look at it
[20:38:18] <michealpwalls> It's like Forking
[20:38:21] <TK> Just imagine the number of bugs are errors one could be unknowingly repeating without third party eyes to verify technique
[20:38:25] <michealpwalls> By impregnating a woman, you are forking her DNA.
[20:38:26] <michealpwalls> LOL
[20:38:28] <SirFinkus> the result is a new "project"
[20:38:53] <michealpwalls> LOL TK that is why I televise all my sexual acts. It's the responsible thing to do(tm)
[20:38:59] <SirFinkus> now with homosexual sex, the source is incorporated, but it's a dead end
[20:39:09] <michealpwalls> (rofl) SirFinkus
[20:39:15] <SirFinkus> the receiver of the source may be gratified, but it ends there
[20:39:17] <TK> Cam girls are the masturbatory equivalent of a third party review of your source
[20:39:36] <TK> You pay them to be honest, but really, they're going to tell you what you want to hear
[20:40:05] <arti> isn't it what you want to see, and why would they be reviewing
[20:40:10] <michealpwalls> The Consultants of sex, if you will?
[20:40:11] <arti> they should have to pay for that :P
[20:40:15] <SirFinkus> and closed source, you're only gratifying yourself and nothing comes of it
[20:40:24] <michealpwalls> LOL SirFinkus. Touche!
[20:40:30] <michealpwalls> That was well reasoned :)
[20:40:30] <arti> SirFinkus: oh something comes of it
[20:40:46] <TK> "Shuffling the GUI" should be a euphemism for something
[20:40:53] <michealpwalls> That's why Linus refers to as "Mental Masterbation", I believe :)
[20:41:01] <michealpwalls> s/why/what/
[20:41:01] <SedBot> <michulpwulls> That's what Linus refers to as "Mental Masterbation", I believe :)
[20:41:18] <SirFinkus> yeah, I spend a lot of time alone in my room with the door locked
[20:41:46] <michealpwalls> "See, I would have thought that living in a crap neighborhood would have a stronger correlation to having crap income and therefore crap access to healthcare and nutrition, which would then have direct, causal relationships with the subject's health. But what do I know?" LMAO wish I had mod points :)
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[20:42:56] <Blackmoore> it's like noone has ever figured out that misery instills misery in people.
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[20:43:14] <michealpwalls> I Blame society, myself :)
[20:43:31] <Blackmoore> you are right michealpwalls - I wish i was kidding
[20:44:01] <Blackmoore> it is society who determines what areas are affulent, and which are decreptit
[20:44:05] <n1> because people being the product of their environment causes the 'personal responsibility, it's your fault anything bad happens to you' to lose value
[20:44:25] <michealpwalls> Indeed. Although both are true to an extent, in my opinion..
[20:44:53] <michealpwalls> Largely I blame society for making it so difficult, though..
[20:44:56] <Blackmoore> I would agree that it is an individual who has to determine to go where they want to be.
[20:45:02] <michealpwalls> Growing up in a shit neighborhood, that is.
[20:45:10] <Blackmoore> but you cant do that in a vaccuum
[20:45:17] <n1> an individual can determine and get to their goals
[20:45:21] <SirFinkus> not really that easy Blackmoore
[20:45:26] <n1> but the idea as long as we work hard and are dedicated, we all can
[20:45:28] <n1> is just bullshit
[20:45:28] <Blackmoore> no not at all
[20:45:37] <Blackmoore> it is BS
[20:45:42] <n1> you can be a great person, you can work every day, as hard as you can
[20:45:53] <Blackmoore> but if you dont even mke a decision that is your fault too
[20:45:57] <n1> but you still might get shit on from a great height, regardless of the troubles you have overcome
[20:46:06] <n1> indeed
[20:46:10] <Blackmoore> i should know I get shit on every day
[20:46:12] <SirFinkus> naw n1, you just need to pull yourself up by your bootstraps
[20:46:14] <michealpwalls> Indeed. It *always* comes down to personal choice and personal responsibility. However, the reason I blame society is that it's society that builds these "communities" that are essentially large ghettos. In such an environment, it is very very difficult for a child to take responsibility in a way that's productive.. That's the bottom line. They *are* taking responsibility when they join a gang
[20:46:15] <michealpwalls> or become a drug dealer...
[20:46:24] <michealpwalls> That's a person choice they've made, that was heavily influence by the environment they grew up in.
[20:46:33] <michealpwalls> The environment was built by society as a whole...
[20:46:41] <n1> I know people who don't make decisions, and never have, because they grew up in an environment where they were told
[20:46:47] <n1> they'd never be anything, the world is against them
[20:46:50] <n1> and they will always lose
[20:47:05] <michealpwalls> When you fill massive apartment complexes... 6, 7 and 8 full size apartment buildings in a single block with *all* low-income families.. Where is the role models for the kids growing up?
[20:47:21] <Blackmoore> and I've know rich people who - never made decisions, and continued to be rich assholes
[20:47:25] <SirFinkus> I had to explain to my dad that you can't really pay for college + room and board working a part time janitorial job anymore
[20:47:49] <michealpwalls> The only people with money and cars are drug dealers and gang bangers. Yet we're all shocked when little Jimmy decides he wants to join a gang when he grows up, instead of going to college. I'm not sure why it's so shocking really LOL.
[20:47:52] <n1> Blackmoore, but those people get a free pass because their dad did the work, so they inheret the right to tell people less fortunate how lazy they are
[20:47:55] <Blackmoore> SirFinkus: i had to explain that to my dad 40 years ago
[20:47:58] <n1> inherit*
[20:48:39] <Blackmoore> n1: yeah - and i guess that is part of what makes me bitter about it
[20:48:50] <n1> me too
[20:49:04] <n1> its a complex situation which too many people see in black and white
[20:49:29] <Landon> michealpwalls: that's funny, because I was just listening on NPR how drug dealers and gang bangers are sending their kids to volunteer organizations and whatnot to get them out of the life
[20:49:33] <Blackmoore> I've known both ambitous and lazy poor. and ambitious and lazy rich
[20:49:40] <michealpwalls> n1: That's true, very true. (Working hard does not always lead to 'success')
[20:49:45] <Landon> I wish I remembered any details about it so I could find the story online
[20:49:59] <michealpwalls> Landon: Right. That's what percentage? You can't take 1 or 2 anecdotes and consider it the norm...
[20:50:02] <n1> michealpwalls, the easiest statistic on that to draw is how many businesses fail in the first 3 years of business
[20:50:03] <michealpwalls> That certainly is not the norm.
[20:50:18] <Blackmoore> and no matter how hard the ambious poor guy works - it is always f'in hard. the rich kid gets breaks that that other guy would never see.
[20:50:18] <Landon> michealpwalls: flame shields down, not trying to discredit your point
[20:50:21] <Landon> just adding extra information
[20:50:25] <n1> the vast majority who start their own business are dedicated and work very hard... but most still fail
[20:50:39] <michealpwalls> Landon: Sorry hehe. I'm kind of an example of your point, though :)
[20:50:43] <SirFinkus> https://www.youtube.com here, have an example of a lazy rich person
[20:50:57] <Blackmoore> most people who start businesses FAIL at least 3 times
[20:51:11] <michealpwalls> I'm from a very poor neighborhood and made the choice to go to college, stay out of trouble etc. Although it wasn't easy and I suffered for a long time to get here. I just easily see why so little people follow in the path I took..
[20:51:17] * SirFinkus really just discovered this video and wanted to post it because it was slightly relevant
[20:51:18] <michealpwalls> It's not an easy path :/
[20:51:30] <Blackmoore> no it aint.
[20:51:41] <n1> Blackmoore, from experience, my first business failed.
[20:51:43] <Landon> I grew up rurally, never realized until college how much effort my parents made to keep me from going the path of most other people there
[20:52:02] <michealpwalls> Basically my entire plan for the future is to build a foundation for my kids hehe
[20:52:06] <Landon> kids/married right out of highschool, don't bother to do a strenuous degree in college, etc
[20:52:16] <Landon> yep
[20:52:23] <michealpwalls> So they don' thave to climb as high as I had to, you know? Also to be that role model that I never had hehe
[20:52:39] <Landon> my parents both saved for my college and then decided to outright pay for it (not out of savings), so those accounts are going to be handed down to my kids eventually
[20:52:41] <Blackmoore> I didnt have folks who helped. they assumed you could get by on a HS diploma, and get married and everything would fall into place.
[20:52:44] <michealpwalls> It's cool that you can see the hard work your parents put in, Landon!
[20:52:50] <michealpwalls> That probably means a tonne to them :)
[20:53:19] <michealpwalls> Blackmoore: Well, that's what society seems to instruct...
[20:53:27] <n1> my parents worked hard for me, so i could work hard for my kids, so they could work hard for their kids
[20:53:30] <michealpwalls> Get a job, get married, have kids, buy a car, buy a house... Profit?
[20:53:34] <Landon> well.. it does work to some extent :) until you get a whiff of ambition
[20:53:39] <n1> in maybe another 300 years, my kids-kids-kids-kids-kids
[20:53:42] <n1> might be able to enjoy life
[20:53:42] <michealpwalls> haha Landon
[20:53:51] <Blackmoore> I'm really proud of my kids - they learned from us(the parents) and doing well in college
[20:53:52] <michealpwalls> ROFL n1. Atta boy!
[20:53:58] <michealpwalls> That's the way to look on the bright side :)
[20:54:36] <n1> heh
[20:54:59] <Blackmoore> I'm pertty sure that they'll do better than me. (but they do have a rich aunt who will probably open doors for them)
[20:55:02] <n1> ive said similar things before, and it's surprising how people get angry at me saying that
[20:55:07] <n1> but dont have anything to counter it with
[20:55:14] <n1> just anger that i thought and then said it
[20:55:24] <michealpwalls> Well, it's true pretty much. It took awhile for me to convince my brother..
[20:55:30] <Landon> n1: and then the kids^10 will blow their money and the cycle starts over :)
[20:55:44] <Landon> (or basic income rolls out, blah blah blah)
[20:55:47] <michealpwalls> To stop with his retarded 'get-rich-quick' schemes and just think about making life easier for his kids... So they can make life easier for *their* kids and so on/so forth.
[20:56:01] <Blackmoore> well, if I want to think about my Great ^5 kids.. i hope that there was a revolution and the politics and economics are better
[20:56:24] <michealpwalls> Look at some of the most powerful families out there. Of course, this doesn't apply to all cases (Or even a majority cases, to be frank..) but many of them grew this way over time.. Investing in the family, not the individual.
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[20:56:32] <Blackmoore> but it wont have anything to do with what i do.
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[20:58:45] <n1> michealpwalls, the get-rich-quick scheme is a way of making life easier for your kids
[20:58:55] <n1> working hard doesn't give you economic security
[20:59:04] <TK> michaelpwalls: I would think that retarding a get rich quick scheme would make it not work, just by definition
[20:59:05] <n1> unless you happen to find a job where working hard pays a lot
[21:00:25] <SirFinkus> skilled labor can qualify for that
[21:00:49] <michealpwalls> Even skilled trades isn't worth it
[21:00:52] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Project Ara: Google's Modular Smartphone - http://sylnt.us - plug-and-play
[21:01:03] <n1> you can get paid a lot but that doesnt mean much if your obligations end up matching them
[21:01:20] <michealpwalls> 'cause you're away too damned much, in my 3rd-person experience (Why wife's father was an electrician. He made good money but was basically *never* around. That's a massive sacrafice:/)
[21:01:27] <Blackmoore> eh, get-rich-quick are usually scams, but someone usually ends up rich in the end.
[21:01:29] <n1> you need to be paid a lot so you have more than a years worth of 'everything went to shit' money in the bank.
[21:01:41] <n1> or under the bed or wherever you keep your money
[21:01:43] <michealpwalls> Also his expenses were very high, since he traveled all the time. Paid outrageous taxes and duties etc.
[21:02:16] <n1> michealpwalls, a lot of people have been without parents because of that kind of thing
[21:02:19] <Blackmoore> (saw amway from the ground floor. I cant do it morally, but at least i understood how it stays legal)
[21:02:32] <michealpwalls> Yea, unfortunately n1 :/
[21:03:00] <michealpwalls> I stopped doing inventory for that reason
[21:03:11] <michealpwalls> Out traveling for the week, back for the weekend. That was shit
[21:03:47] <michealpwalls> lol Blackmoore that's true. zero-sum game :P
[21:04:01] <michealpwalls> For all the suckers losing their shits, some lucky bastard is up a whole bunch of shirts :)
[21:04:02] <michealpwalls> (rofl)
[21:04:40] <michealpwalls> You're starting to sound like some kinda COMMUNIST, Blackmoore!
[21:04:43] <michealpwalls> hehehe
[21:05:04] <n1> michealpwalls, those shirts are for his family
[21:05:08] <michealpwalls> LOL!
[21:05:12] <michealpwalls> He's got a lot of kids?
[21:05:26] <n1> his kids, his kids kids etc etc
[21:05:44] <michealpwalls> Checkout the Rothschilds family. Go allll the way back, though.
[21:05:48] <n1> just looking after his family, those other people need to take personal responsibility to look after theirs
[21:06:08] <michealpwalls> There's a massive history of incremental growth with that family. Each member sacraficed their individual lives for the good of the family as a whole...
[21:06:46] <michealpwalls> Everysingle year they would all write to each other and update each other on the current status. What was working, what wasn't working and etc. How much they've managed to add into the family trust, etc.
[21:06:57] <michealpwalls> Check 'em out sometime :)
[21:07:03] <michealpwalls> I think we can all learn a lot from that family.
[21:07:27] <Blackmoore> michealpwalls: eh - it was the evengelical christianity that they were pushing that turned me off
[21:07:47] <Blackmoore> the way that they moved money - I was fine with that
[21:07:57] <michealpwalls> hehe well a lot of powerful families use religion as a tool to strengthen the family tie, like their bond.. Iunno.
[21:08:41] <michealpwalls> I still more to practicalities, but again that's probably more of environment. This is 2014, back then I'm sure it was much more common to be so evangelical?
[21:08:55] <michealpwalls> KInda like reading about U.S founding fathers.. They were all a bunch of freakish bible thumpers :/
[21:11:43] <Blackmoore> most of the US founders were theists, not bible thumpers
[21:11:56] <michealpwalls> What do you mean?
[21:12:15] <michealpwalls> I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to religion, hehe. What is the difference between a theist and a 'bible thumper' (Pretty silly term, sorry :P)
[21:12:20] <arti> blackmore: we can only deal with extremes
[21:12:26] <michealpwalls> LMAO arti
[21:12:28] <michealpwalls> Exactly.
[21:12:33] <arti> michaelpwalls: if you're a male, you're a rapist
[21:12:44] <Blackmoore> well, they belived in a higher power, and did attend church - but they didnt try to play the game of "my religion is better"
[21:12:44] <michealpwalls> Interesting view!
[21:13:20] <arti> btw what's your stance on aliens michael?
[21:13:44] <arti> do you believe ET exist?
[21:13:45] <Blackmoore> a number of them were also masons, so they had a wider background, and most of them studied many religions (as part of a process of always learning)
[21:14:08] * arti has considered becoming an Elk
[21:14:15] <michealpwalls> arti: Depends on the context, I suppose? To be vague, I think it's a mathematical certainty that intelligent life exists outside Earth...
[21:14:27] <Landon> "who rigs the elections, we doooo, we dooooooooooooooo"
[21:14:36] <arti> without proof, it's belief.
[21:14:45] <SirFinkus> Jefferson was a deist or maybe an atheist
[21:15:15] <michealpwalls> I'm an atheist. I used to be agnostic but life experience pushed me more to atheism.
[21:15:38] <michealpwalls> I feel organized religions do more harm than good, hense atheist. The whole submitting to a higher power and etc. It's very destructive idea IMHO.
[21:15:45] <arti> well as long as you're not a vegan athiest, then you'd be a total asshole
[21:15:53] <michealpwalls> LOL arti
[21:16:13] <Blackmoore> if you look at the resumes, you have a set of founders who were damn sure the bible was a story, to be learned from - not a fundamental truth
[21:16:16] <michealpwalls> I'm an omnivore..
[21:17:13] <Blackmoore> they saw church as a function of community - a social tool to bind a community together and help people through hard times
[21:17:37] <Blackmoore> I dont know any evengelical churches who help the poor.
[21:17:46] <arti> you're far too sensible blackmoore, religion is a control mechanism to many people
[21:18:04] <michealpwalls> I though when you said evengelical, you meant pushy.. Sorry, I'm very ignorant when it comes to religion.
[21:18:10] <Blackmoore> arti: yes - and it always has been.
[21:18:15] <michealpwalls> If you start throwing around sects like Protestants and that you've totally lost me :P
[21:18:17] <arti> by that same logic, so is math.
[21:18:29] <SirFinkus> http://evangelcathedral.net
[21:18:33] <Blackmoore> Evengelicals are born again xtians.
[21:18:47] <michealpwalls> I agree, arti. Religion is a destructive, manipulative mechanism of control.
[21:18:54] <SirFinkus> has a pretty good rundown
[21:19:01] <Blackmoore> todays group of them preach a kind of "jesus says you should be rich - so give us your money"
[21:19:13] <Blackmoore> thing going on.
[21:19:19] <arti> take from the poor :|
[21:19:29] <arti> michealpwalls: what isn't that is run by man
[21:19:34] <Blackmoore> AND then claim to give it to the poor.
[21:19:53] <arti> michealpwalls: even absense of relgion isn't some paradise, mao, stalin
[21:20:38] <michealpwalls> It's destructive in that it teaches complacency and this whole "submit to a higher power" crap. Even if you exclude all the political bullshit, such as "Submit unto Caesar" the way it teaches people that they are powerless is complete shit.
[21:20:42] <Blackmoore> true arti - in the begining it was how you kept order in the clan. a set of rules to keep the tribe alive
[21:20:43] <arti> Blackmoore, wasn't there some scandal with mother theresa?
[21:21:08] <michealpwalls> If you're homeless, the only thing that will bring you up is to get up and do something about. WAiting around for a "miracle" or intevention from some "higher power" is counter-productive...
[21:21:21] <arti> michealpwalls: since you're ignorant of religion how are you coming to these opnions, take buddhism, that's inward focused
[21:21:22] <michealpwalls> That's essentially the fundamental issue I take with organized religion. They all preach the same bullshit.
[21:21:41] <arti> i think you need a larger brush to paint with
[21:21:44] <arti> lets do a kickstarter
[21:21:50] <michealpwalls> My brush is pretty wide, it's doing fine
[21:21:52] <michealpwalls> LOL
[21:22:06] <arti> we can do a prototype on the MC server
[21:22:14] <Blackmoore> and if they followed what they preached - that homeless guy would be able to go there - and actually get help to get out of that situatiuon. instead they are more likely to get him arrested for vagrency
[21:22:29] <arti> assuming most homeless people wanted help
[21:22:37] <Blackmoore> well, yes.
[21:22:49] <arti> the ones that are on the street are usually there by choice, they've got substance abuse issues
[21:22:56] <Blackmoore> that is an awful assumption
[21:22:57] <michealpwalls> Mental health etc.
[21:23:17] <Blackmoore> well, all of us.
[21:23:24] <michealpwalls> Well it's not entirely false. I wouldn't say 'most' but a very lage portion do indeed choose to be there, because homeless shelters will *not* let intoxicated people stay there...
[21:23:30] <arti> Blackmoore: there are many programs to deal with homeless people
[21:23:46] <n1> because the programs are there doesnt meant they work
[21:23:51] <n1> or are even the right ones
[21:23:53] <michealpwalls> So, the choice is.. Abuse your substance of choice, or stay in the shelter. This is partly why you see many homeless people sleeping on the sidewalk. There's also rampant mental health reasons, too...
[21:23:55] <Blackmoore> today - yes. if you go back a hundred years, not so much
[21:24:08] <arti> this is where those evil churches helped out
[21:24:16] <michealpwalls> "helped" bullshit
[21:24:22] <n1> and if a homeless person feels safer on the streets than in one of the 'programs' that says something about the quality of the program
[21:24:31] <michealpwalls> I've been homeless. Churches use your fucking status as a carrot-stick..
[21:24:32] <Blackmoore> indeed it does.
[21:24:45] <michealpwalls> The only thing that will help is yourself..
[21:24:45] <arti> michealpwalls: i've been bitten by a dog, all dogs are bad.
[21:25:13] <michealpwalls> I understand your fear, arti :)
[21:25:23] <dentonj> moo
[21:25:24] <bacon> (__)
[21:25:24] <bacon> (oo)
[21:25:24] <bacon> /------\/
[21:25:24] <bacon> / | ||
[21:25:24] <bacon> * /\---/\
[21:25:24] <bacon> ~~ ~~
[21:25:24] <bacon> ...."Have you mooed today?"...
[21:25:32] <arti> fucking crutchy lol
[21:25:45] <michealpwalls> LOL
[21:26:44] <Blackmoore> cowsay-fortune
[21:26:44] <bacon> _______________________________________
[21:26:44] <bacon> / Air pollution is really making us pay \
[21:26:44] <bacon> \ through the nose. /
[21:26:44] <bacon> ---------------------------------------
[21:26:44] <bacon> \ ^__^
[21:26:44] <bacon> \ (oo)\_______
[21:26:45] <bacon> (__)\ )\/\
[21:26:45] <bacon> ||----w |
[21:26:46] <bacon> || ||
[21:27:45] <michealpwalls> arti: I think, in the same way a Marketing & Public Relations Department of a large corporation "helps people", Churches "help people" :)
[21:27:53] <michealpwalls> Everything they do, is done with the goal of increasing membership...
[21:28:10] <arti> i disagree.
[21:28:26] <arti> people can do nice things, regardless
[21:28:38] <michealpwalls> They can, sure. But I don't agree that that is why organized religions do things.
[21:28:41] <arti> you forget people are irrational.
[21:28:46] <michealpwalls> They do things to increase membership, to increase donations.
[21:29:21] <arti> people also breed and increase membership
[21:30:11] <SirFinkus> at best, churches are middlemen when it comes to charity
[21:30:30] <SirFinkus> I'm sure there are a few exceptions, but in general
[21:31:59] <michealpwalls> I agree, SirFinkus. Suppose that's a pretty fair way to put it :)
[21:32:08] <michealpwalls> arti: HEH! Is that why the pope disagrees with condoms? :)9
[21:32:21] <Blackmoore> I've known some decent church leaders who actuall DID help people; and didnt give a damn if it helped the church.. I also saw them forced out of that church.
[21:32:26] <michealpwalls> 'cause Condoms indirectly limit membership growth in the church and thereby indirectly limit donation growth? :)
[21:32:51] <arti> ~shrug~ how about just support yourself and don't depend on others
[21:33:14] <arti> "damn them for offering some help that i wasn't forced to take!"
[21:33:28] <michealpwalls> I suppose my opinion can be offensive. Apologies. I'm sure there are many religious individuals that do many selfless acts to help people. I still, however, have absolutely no trust or respect in the actual organizations. In fact I see the organizations are harmful to society as a whole.
[21:33:45] <Blackmoore> arti noone lives in a vaccuum. we all depend on people around us.
[21:33:52] <michealpwalls> arti: No man is an island :)
[21:33:52] <arti> Blackmoore: some more than others
[21:33:58] <michealpwalls> LOL arti
[21:34:07] * arti pays more in than he gets out
[21:34:13] * arti shakes fist
[21:34:24] <michealpwalls> I used to, although now it's opposite.
[21:34:34] <arti> well as long as it isn't a net negative you're not a POS
[21:34:38] <michealpwalls> I don't put much of anything in and take out quite a big
[21:35:09] <michealpwalls> Just be happy that you're "investing" in the nation's future, or some other fluffy thing :)
[21:35:10] <arti> there's a lot of issues in the world, i'm curious where we'll be in 50 years
[21:35:10] <michealpwalls> (giggle)
[21:35:40] <michealpwalls> Oh man.. Don't get me started. I have an extremely depressing view on the world's future. Probably why I push myself so hard to save money and build foundation for the kids :/
[21:35:46] <michealpwalls> I think, it's going to be completely ridiculous for them LOL!
[21:36:41] <arti> so uh, how many vietnam vets does it take to change a lightbulb?
[21:36:50] <TK> Better teach them how to each carrion
[21:36:51] <michealpwalls> LOL what? Iunno
[21:36:57] <arti> you don't know! you weren't there!
[21:37:01] <michealpwalls> LMAO!
[21:37:10] <TK> eat*
[21:38:00] <arti> what separates man from the animals?
[21:38:04] <michealpwalls> My long term goals: Get the kids fluent in Mandarin. Save tuition for Business Administration and Management.
[21:38:08] <arti> the mediterranean :D
[21:38:21] <michealpwalls> Ohhh that was politically incorrect arti (rofl)
[21:38:36] * arti enjoys !PC
[21:39:10] <SirFinkus> I thought you typed IPC and lost respect for you
[21:39:21] <arti> implying you had some in the first place...
[21:39:23] <SirFinkus> err, ICP
[21:39:35] <arti> great melinko is an excellent album
[21:40:08] <SirFinkus> respect--
[21:40:08] <deadbeef> karma - respect: -1
[21:40:13] <n1> lol
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[21:42:37] <michealpwalls> lol
[21:42:57] <SirFinkus> I really need to make a list of irc people so I can keep track of this easier
[21:43:26] <arti> you making another marry, fuck, kill list?
[21:43:35] <michealpwalls> I need a list so I can keep track of all my lists easier
[21:43:36] <michealpwalls> (drunk)
[21:44:01] <SirFinkus> I'd marry all of you
[21:44:09] * SirFinkus blows kisses
[21:44:10] <michealpwalls> Marriage is sillytalk
[21:44:17] <arti> it's a pretty good panty dropper
[21:44:24] <arti> changeofheart.sh
[21:44:37] <michealpwalls> Pfft, it only drops one panty?
[21:44:48] <michealpwalls> And only on rare occassions har har har
[21:44:50] <arti> lol, how many are you used to them wearing?
[21:44:54] <michealpwalls> LOL
[21:45:00] <michealpwalls> Variety is the spice of life!
[21:45:31] <arti> that's a good stripper name
[21:47:53] <michealpwalls> Spice of Life?
[21:47:56] <michealpwalls> Or the whole thing?
[21:48:13] <michealpwalls> I think 'Variety' or 'Spice of Life' would both be good stripper names :/
[21:48:23] <chromas> The whole thing
[21:48:24] <arti> i agree
[21:48:29] <chromas> Like A Pimp Named Slickback
[21:48:32] <Blackmoore> *just a little bit, just a little bit*
[21:48:33] <arti> :/
[21:48:35] <michealpwalls> LMAO chromas
[21:48:37] <arti> slickback sounds like a prison name
[21:48:51] <michealpwalls> "In prison, they called me SlickBack"
[21:48:53] <michealpwalls> LMAO that's gross
[21:49:01] <arti> more hot yogurt?
[21:49:22] <Blackmoore> I knew a stripper who used the name Variety
[21:49:41] <SirFinkus> I knew a variety of strippers
[21:49:42] <michealpwalls> See, I told you it was a good name!
[21:49:43] <Blackmoore> I miss those legs
[21:50:00] <michealpwalls> 'cause... get it... variety is the spice of life? She's the... nvm :(
[21:50:08] <arti> show yourself out pls
[21:50:11] <arti> :P
[21:50:13] <michealpwalls> LOL
[21:50:19] <Blackmoore> yup that's exactyly why she chose it :)
[21:50:45] <michealpwalls> Strippers are an integral part of our society. Lets all take a pause to appreciate our Strippers :)
[21:51:00] <chromas> strippers++
[21:51:00] <deadbeef> karma - strippers: 1
[21:51:06] <michealpwalls> LOL!
[21:51:09] <michealpwalls> Touche
[21:51:20] <arti> nothing gets glitter off of you
[21:51:34] <michealpwalls> Yea, Glitter is a great stripper name ^
[21:51:43] <arti> then you can be all buzzed and say Gutter
[21:51:55] <michealpwalls> "C'mere Gutter!'
[21:52:10] <arti> i'd probably bust a blood vessel in my eye from laughing
[21:52:16] <michealpwalls> "Daddy's got a .. *stumbles into a table*"
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[21:53:30] <michealpwalls> Gah, only 3gb to go... LMAO if I stop it now and continue at home it'll probably take all fucking weekend :(
[21:53:36] * arti pingfloods cyprus
[21:54:21] <Blackmoore> I too support single mothers. at the strip joint.. (well i used to. too damn expensive now)
[21:54:40] <michealpwalls> Blackmoore: Everybody's gotta do their part. It takes a whole village to raise a child, they say :)
[21:54:44] <Blackmoore> hell I knew at least one who wasnt even single.
[21:54:46] <michealpwalls> I'm pretty sure they're talking about Strippin' ^
[21:55:32] <Blackmoore> (dont you judge me.. I was willing to pay for a conversation at that point.. *sob*)
[21:55:45] <Cyprus> arti: ??
[21:57:04] <arti> your hostmask is localhost
[21:57:20] <arti> my cunning plan...
[21:58:46] <Cyprus> lol
[21:58:50] <Cyprus> i'm in your house...
[21:59:46] <SirFinkus> xkcd
[21:59:55] <SirFinkus> don't need to post it, we've all seen it
[22:00:12] <arti> hahaha
[22:00:19] <arti> that is how xkcd should be handled
[22:00:27] <arti> %xkcd%
[22:00:32] <arti> "oh yes, very applicable"
[22:00:56] <Blackmoore> lol
[22:01:28] <Cyprus> rofl
[22:01:28] <bacon> The Religious Right aren't, and Scientific Creationism isn't.
[22:01:32] <michealpwalls> xkcd is my favorite
[22:01:40] <michealpwalls> Followed (closely) by The Oatmeal
[22:01:53] <Cyprus> never heard of the oatmeal
[22:02:06] <michealpwalls> Google.. Google right now and we'll forget this conversation ever happened!
[22:02:07] <michealpwalls> :)
[22:02:35] <arti> theoatmeal.com
[22:02:44] <arti> the web design hell is pretty accurate
[22:02:59] <arti> boyd's toast
[22:07:27] <Blackmoore> http://theoatmeal.com
[22:08:45] <michealpwalls> I like the top spelling mistakes
[22:10:31] <michealpwalls> LOL 'A hate so rich and foul' LOL
[22:10:36] <michealpwalls> I love the humour
[22:10:41] <arti> do you like it alot :P
[22:10:49] <michealpwalls> I like it a lot ;)
[22:11:45] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - Student Arrested for Exploiting Heartbleed - http://sylnt.us - which-color-hat-to-wear-today
[22:12:13] <michealpwalls> indefatigable is a confusing word
[22:12:19] <michealpwalls> Why not simply.. Infatigable? :/
[22:12:21] <michealpwalls> LOL
[22:12:27] <michealpwalls> *had to look it up*
[22:12:36] <Cyprus> great, now my productivity is shot for the rest of the day
[22:12:46] <michealpwalls> LOL Cyprus. Told you! :)
[22:13:07] <arti> hahahaha
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[22:13:18] <arti> read the one on horses
[22:13:25] * arti had a good laugh at that
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[22:13:42] <Cyprus> im dying from reading "if you do this in email i hate you" along with every web designer ever
[22:14:13] <Cyprus> the "pop" and "comic sans" reminds me of the rants of a designer i used to work with
[22:15:18] <arti> as a ceo i don't feel as if i've done my job properly unless i make a few recommendations
[22:15:48] <Cyprus> i actually remember this one http://theoatmeal.com
[22:16:47] <michealpwalls> LOL
[22:17:15] <michealpwalls> That's what makes XKCD and TheOatmeal so incredibly funny, I think. It's so fucking true :/
[22:17:24] <michealpwalls> Makes you think back to real-life experiences with a humorous slant
[22:17:30] <michealpwalls> It's perfect!
[22:17:50] <michealpwalls> The Horse one is hilarious, yea
[22:17:55] <arti> "punch the grizzly bear in the ass to win an ipad 3"
[22:18:03] <arti> BigTimeAwesomeTorrentBucket.com
[22:18:19] <michealpwalls> http://theoatmeal.com
[22:18:24] <n1> comedy is tragedy+time, which is why in context even things like genocide can be found amusing.
[22:18:28] <arti> the worlds biggest shitpumps
[22:18:31] <Blackmoore> try http://amultiverse.com
[22:18:45] <arti> n1, comedy is tragedy.
[22:18:54] <michealpwalls> That's interesting, n1. Iunno if I could find genocide funny though (Never know until you try? )
[22:19:26] <n1> it's about how it's done, i've laughed at jokes about Nazi's in WW2 for example
[22:19:34] <n1> even though the actual situation was far from amusing
[22:19:38] <arti> take hitler and michael phelps.
[22:19:45] <michealpwalls> Thehitler ones kill me...
[22:19:47] <arti> at least phelps can finish a race
[22:19:56] <michealpwalls> The youtube hitler videos? You guys gotta know what I'm talking about.. LOL!
[22:19:57] <Blackmoore> ow
[22:20:20] <arti> you know what i really like youtube for, the old school propaganda films
[22:20:25] <arti> especially disney
[22:20:42] <arti> wonder when the remaster of song of the south will be out...
[22:20:52] <michealpwalls> Yes!
[22:20:55] <michealpwalls> They're amazing
[22:21:01] <michealpwalls> Ever seen the anti-marijuana videos?
[22:21:06] <michealpwalls> That's fucking hilarious
[22:21:22] <n1> it's hilarious, until the point people still believe them
[22:21:26] <michealpwalls> Or the "duck and cover" public service announcements
[22:21:28] <n1> which sadly, a lot of people do.
[22:21:49] <n1> because as shocking as the anti-marijuana propaganda is, the essence of it is still carried over in todays propaganda
[22:22:02] <arti> i watched reefer madness for the first time like 6 months ago
[22:22:09] <arti> what an awesome film
[22:22:41] <n1> those propaganda films have shaped the views of people now called Judges
[22:22:49] <michealpwalls> https://www.youtube.com
[22:22:53] <michealpwalls> Sorry, couldn't help myself :)
[22:25:29] <michealpwalls> Gah, downloaded enough I think
[22:25:32] <michealpwalls> brb when home :)
[22:25:47] * arti salutes
[22:26:24] <n1> laters, michealpwalls
[22:29:35] -!- michealpwalls has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
[22:31:20] <Woods> Bad news guys, I did like... 20 situps a couple days ago, and it still hurts my abs to cough... I think I am out of shape.
[22:32:59] <Blackmoore> Woods: i had strarted going to the gym, but had to stop. I'm hoping I'm healed up enough to go back.
[22:34:29] <Woods> Blackmoore: You should definitely go back. As soon as I can stretch without too much pain, I am going to continue.
[22:34:45] <arti> nice
[22:34:56] * arti remembers starting squats
[22:35:01] <arti> the hamstrings :|
[22:35:12] <Blackmoore> yeah - i need to get back. I'm pretty sure i wont bleed on the stuff now.
[22:35:31] <Blackmoore> (it really wasnt that bad after the first week)
[22:35:39] <Woods> If you are bleeding on the equipment, something has definitely gone wrong.
[22:35:52] <Blackmoore> surgery will do that :P
[22:36:10] <Woods> Aahh
[22:36:38] <Cyprus> if you're bleeding at the gym, you shouldn't be at the gym, or should wear a tampon
[22:36:54] <Blackmoore> you know my wife suggested tampons too.
[22:36:55] <Cyprus> im not sure there are other cases
[22:37:00] <Woods> lol
[22:37:06] <Woods> There are probably no other cases.
[22:37:06] <Blackmoore> just shove one up each nostril
[22:37:26] <Blackmoore> hope the brain didnt spill out..
[22:39:09] <Blackmoore> .. seriously I'm waiting for stitches to heal up and be able to do stuff. it was sinus surgry.
[22:39:27] * arti o.o
[22:39:35] <arti> inflamed?
[22:39:49] <Blackmoore> nearly closed up drainage
[22:40:02] <arti> man that must've hurt
[22:40:11] <Blackmoore> yes.
[22:40:22] <Blackmoore> very much so.
[22:40:27] <Woods> Did they hook you up to the biggest netty pot ever?
[22:40:46] <Blackmoore> nah. worlds smallest rotorooter.
[22:40:59] <Woods> I figured it was one extreme or the other.
[22:42:00] <Blackmoore> i feel much better now.
[22:49:43] <Woods> I feel better just hearing about it.
[23:06:29] * arti begins googling for "is brown" and auto complete/google recommend, comes up with period blood...
[23:06:33] <arti> :E
[23:07:00] <NCommander> Well, that was fun
[23:07:04] <Blackmoore> ew..
[23:07:15] <arti> ncommander: complete another structure in minecraft?
[23:08:13] <Blackmoore> eh, NCommander i'm afraid to ask.
[23:09:03] <Blackmoore> what was broken today?
[23:09:54] <arti> lol seattle changed manhole covers to be person-hole
[23:10:00] <arti> HAH
[23:14:11] <Blackmoore> cripes. just label them "sewage" and most people will not bother them
[23:15:10] <TK> that's agist
[23:15:20] <TK> label it sewyouth
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[23:17:17] <NCommander> arti, minecraft stuff
[23:20:37] <deadbeef> [SoylentNews] - How a 17-Year-Old Android Developer Scammed Thousands - http://sylnt.us - I-hear-madison-ave-is-hiring
[23:20:42] <Blackmoore> http://www.comicbookmovie.com
[23:20:45] <Blackmoore> i dont even
[23:21:02] <Blackmoore> NCommander: vanilla or modded?
[23:22:14] <NCommander> Blackmoore, modded ATM, w/ traincraft
[23:24:46] <Blackmoore> I've been neglecting my server. started Agrarian Skys monday.
[23:25:20] <Blackmoore> server is FTB.. but weve changed the list of mods.
[23:26:11] <NCommander> I played Tekkit for awhile
[23:26:19] <NCommander> The problem is far too many mods ar ejust too fiddly for my taste
[23:30:36] <Blackmoore> i did tekkit under 1.2.5 untill the update that broke everything.
[23:31:01] <Blackmoore> i'll agree that it is fiddly.
[23:31:27] <Blackmoore> thats why i like FTB, they typically take care of the configs and id crap
[23:32:31] <Blackmoore> Trancraft looks cool
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[23:35:09] <NCommander> Blackmoore, more it was so many reciepes, so many items. If you need "TooManyItems" to play, I think you've done it wrong
[23:35:12] <NCommander> */2 cents&
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[23:40:50] <Blackmoore> I still need NEI for vanilla. :)
[23:41:04] <Blackmoore> (that and a minimap)
[23:42:35] <NCommander> Blackmoore, NEI is ok I guess, Rei Mininmap <3
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[23:43:03] <michealpwalls> LOL back to the 60KiB/s download speed wooOO!
[23:43:08] <michealpwalls> This download'll never fucking finish (facepalm)
[23:43:15] -!- pbnjoe [pbnjoe!~pbnjoe@Soylent/Users/313/pbnjoe] has joined #Soylent
[23:43:28] <Blackmoore> Rei is very nice, I havent anything bad to say about zans, or mapwriter.
[23:44:20] <Blackmoore> michealpwalls: at least you dont have my DSL speed (pretty sure that's in BPS.)
[23:44:47] <michealpwalls> har har har
[23:44:56] <michealpwalls> Nah KiB is Kilobytes hehe
[23:45:15] <Blackmoore> and I'm sure verizon dropps the K
[23:45:37] <Blackmoore> can almost hear the bits move if it's reall quiet
[23:45:39] <michealpwalls> Bits per second, it's interesting that ISP advertise in bits per second. It's confusing for the average person :)
[23:45:44] <michealpwalls> LOL Blackmoore
[23:47:16] <Blackmoore> oh they PROMISE me Mb/S
[23:47:28] <Blackmoore> but they deliver far far less.
[23:47:30] <michealpwalls> Yea, Mega *bits* per second..
[23:48:56] <michealpwalls> Just remember: There's 8 bits in 1 byte. 1024 bytes in a kilobyte and 1024 kilobytes in a megabyte. When you're downloading, it's displayed in multiples of bytes, never bits. Only ISPs deal in bits when they're selling an internet package to Grandma :)
[23:50:06] <Blackmoore> well - it's verizon. my other option is cable. and while the speed is better. the cost is too high
[23:50:18] <michealpwalls> All my options suck :(
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[23:52:10] <Blackmoore> yeah. thats why I submitted the story about being an ISP
[23:54:32] <michealpwalls> lol yea, seen that story. Havent got 'round to reading it but the title made me chuckle
[23:55:35] <Blackmoore> frankly i think i had better speeds on dial-up some days.
[23:56:03] <Woods> Michaelpwalls: KiB is Kibibytes. You know, for confusion.
[23:56:20] <Blackmoore> but who knows. it might be pushing a lot more crap through the tube.
[23:57:12] <Woods> I would look up the difference, but I am about to head out
[23:59:03] <michealpwalls> LOL Woods, it's Kibibytes but it's meant to eliminate the confusion. At least in my opinion. See... Kilo implies 1000, but a Kilobyte does not have 1000 bytes it has 1024 bytes...
[23:59:10] <michealpwalls> A significant rounding error, by the way..
[23:59:10] <michealpwalls> LOL
[23:59:23] <Woods> Ahhh
[23:59:33] -!- Woods has quit [Quit: Web client closed]
[23:59:51] <michealpwalls> Also when some jerk like me says "KiB" you can't possibly think I meant Kilobits (kbps) although had I said KB/s... You could *easily* think that meant Kilobits