#Soylent | Logs for 2014-03-19

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[00:10:32] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - GOG.com Announces its Linux Plans - http://sylnt.us - getting-there-eventually
[00:26:38] <Landon> 18:10:31 - #Soylent: + Bender ∈ [SoylentNews] - GOG.com Announces its Linux Plans - http://sylnt.us - getting-there-eventually
[00:26:40] <Landon> hahaha
[00:26:43] <Landon> shorturl redacted :}
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[00:47:08] <SpallsHurgenson> mmm, curry chicken 'n' rice.
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[00:54:22] * TME1040 is TME520, at home.
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[01:00:08] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Targeted Political Ads for Microsoft Products - http://sylnt.us - suddenly-not-a-game
[01:04:36] * SpallsHurgenson wonders a) who gives accurate demographic data to any of these services ("I am /so/ a 93 year old Chinese woman from Latvia!"), and b) who is stupid enough to then go ahead and buy all this innacurate customer information?
[01:08:16] <paulej72> SpallsHurgenson: so you are saying we should generate false user data for SN and sell it advertisers and other ne'er-do-wells to pay for the site. It genius I say!
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[01:18:38] <SpallsHurgenson> create a page for users to fill in their demographic info, but for every field put a "fill it in for me" button that randomly generates the info :)
[01:19:40] <SpallsHurgenson> you would probably STILL have advertisers and "business information" firms slavering over your data.
[01:21:24] <SpallsHurgenson> Slavering. Slavering. Slaaaaah-vering. I don't use that word often enough in conversation. I need more slaver in my life.
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[01:33:25] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v FunPika] by kobitch
[01:40:39] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Snowden: Big Things to Come - http://sylnt.us - now-you-see-him
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[01:52:50] <SpallsHurgenson> Steam's In-Home Streaming thing is pretty neat. I like being able to run games like Metro 2033 on my old AMD netbook...
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[01:56:25] <SpallsHurgenson> now I can play all the cool games while on the loo, just like the developers always intended!
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[02:09:32] <BadCoderFinger> Yo
[02:10:11] <SpallsHurgenson> eeep! Somebody else is awake!
[02:10:17] * SpallsHurgenson quickly pulls on his pant
[02:15:26] <BadCoderFinger> Yikes@
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[02:16:45] * NCommander goes blind
[02:16:46] <NCommander> MY EYE
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[02:29:55] <unitron> "* SpallsHurgenson quickly pulls on his pant" Now pull on the other one so you'll have a matched pair.
[02:30:20] <BadCoderFinger> Better than having a leg exposed.
[02:30:29] <SpallsHurgenson> never!!!
[02:32:55] <BadCoderFinger> Convert them to shorts?
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[02:41:25] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - 10,000 Linux Servers Hit by Malware - http://sylnt.us
[02:42:00] <SpallsHurgenson> see, that's why I stick with Windows! :-)
[02:43:38] <BadCoderFinger> Heh!
[02:44:16] FoobarBazbot|watch is now known as FoobarBazbot|watch|afk
[02:44:35] FoobarBazbot|watch|afk is now known as FoobarBazbot
[02:44:57] <SpallsHurgenson> you know, this whole Internet things was much more fun before they let everybody else online
[02:46:07] FoobarBazbot is now known as FoobarBazbot|watch
[02:46:39] <BadCoderFinger> Yeah, if they had an IQ test before access, it would solve a great deal.
[02:47:29] <SpallsHurgenson> yeah, no more smart people allowed! They just cause problems! :)
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[02:47:49] <BadCoderFinger> Clearly! Save the net for the trolls!
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[03:04:10] <Ethanol-fueled> Nipplebitings.
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[03:21:25] <Popeidol> !grab Ethanol-fueled
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[03:21:42] <Popeidol> curses
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[03:46:30] <kobach> Popeidol: odd, that should have worked, ill have to tell Fatphil when he gets back
[03:46:35] <kobach> !grab ethanol-fueled
[03:46:35] <Bender> Added quote 49
[03:46:39] <kobach> weird
[03:46:44] <kobach> !quote 49
[03:46:44] <Bender> Quote 49 - <ethanol-fueled> Nipplebitings.
[03:47:06] <kobach> !quote 48
[03:47:06] <Bender> Quote 48 - <IT_phreak> lol didn't mean to interrupt ;D
[03:47:09] <kobach> odd
[03:47:48] <IT_phreak> yes, i wholeheartedly wanted to interrupt some shady act
[03:47:56] <kobach> no u
[03:48:08] <IT_phreak> no u -> nou
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[03:48:21] <IT_phreak> lol you got corrected, failz ^^
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[04:03:32] <kobitch> balls hurgenson
[04:03:53] * SpallsHurgenson returns from his old man's evening nap, re-energized and ready for a good night's sleep!
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[04:20:40] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - EU Grapples with Net Neutrality Issues - http://sylnt.us
[04:22:53] <SpallsHurgenson> I'd be find not having net neutrality if they weren't all so insistent on net-chaotic-evilly.
[04:23:18] <FoobarBazbot_> !grab SpallsHurgenson
[04:23:18] <Bender> Added quote 50
[04:23:37] <SpallsHurgenson> ooh, immortalized forever!
[04:26:46] <SpallsHurgenson> either that or I've just been touched inappropriately by a bot...
[04:27:40] <SpallsHurgenson> whichever it is, I'm fine with it :)
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[04:42:51] <cykros> being touched inappropriately by a bot is one of my biggest turnons
[04:42:54] <cykros> but that might be tmi
[04:43:29] <SpallsHurgenson> tell me more. also, do you have a newsletter?
[04:43:54] <cykros> lol, like a listserv? or actual mimeographed mailed out shenanigans?
[04:44:38] <SpallsHurgenson> let's go old school :)
[04:45:19] <cykros> i distribute my newsletter via dead drops strewn about the city. usb sticks cemented into brick walls...
[04:45:36] <IT_phreak> old school where you dealt it real cool
[04:45:42] <cykros> my followers are many. they yearn merely to be touched by one who has been touched inappropriately by a bot
[04:45:46] <IT_phreak> old school where they smacked mad fools
[04:45:51] <cykros> what can i say. it's a living.
[04:46:14] <IT_phreak> cykros: being touch is a TMI, period
[04:46:17] <IT_phreak> touched&
[04:46:18] <SpallsHurgenson> I haven't seen a mimeograph - or anything mimeographed -in decades
[04:47:53] <SpallsHurgenson> huh, I could get one for ~$200 bucks on ebay :)
[04:49:33] <mattie_p> I used to love the smell of that blue ink
[04:49:42] <mattie_p> man, I could get high on that all day, every day
[04:50:30] <SpallsHurgenson> I remember how the damn ink never got off your clothes...
[04:51:59] <SpallsHurgenson> ... and the scary, scary typewriter-machine-thing that punched out the original plate. I swear, that thing could probably bite into steel plate
[04:54:53] <Popeidol> it'd be kind of cool to distribute a newsletter via floppy now
[04:55:14] <Popeidol> your audience would be quite restricted though
[04:55:37] * kobitch touches cykros
[04:55:52] <SpallsHurgenson> use 8-inch floppies for extra effect :)
[04:56:28] <Popeidol> I don't have any 8-inch drives so that could be trickier
[04:58:03] <SpallsHurgenson> don't worry, neither does (almost) anybody else :)
[04:58:33] <Popeidol> 5.25" is a completely different matter, I had to throw out half of my them because I had too many
[04:59:51] <SpallsHurgenson> I still have 3.5 and 5.25" drives... but blank media is a problem
[05:01:50] <Popeidol> you can still buy new 5.25" discs
[05:02:09] <Popeidol> I'm just working my way through a stash of 50 or so I picked up from a school that was binning old hardware
[05:03:48] <SpallsHurgenson> I wonder how "new" those disks really are... or are the sellers just going through merchandise that has been sitting on a shelf for the past fifteen years
[05:07:28] <Popeidol> a bit of both, I think
[05:07:55] <Popeidol> there are definitely still 5.25" and 8" discs being made, you just usually have to order them online
[05:09:57] <SpallsHurgenson> still, not old school enough. Core memory, hand-woven by yourself. That's the way you need to distribute :)
[05:10:08] <SpallsHurgenson> heh, a core-memory chip accessed by USB :)
[05:10:46] <Popeidol> I'll distribute as a custom bios chip
[05:11:35] <Popeidol> once you decide to read the newsletter, your computer will be able to do nothing else
[05:12:10] <SpallsHurgenson> but surely your writing is so convincing that once they read it they won't WANT to do anything else? :)
[05:12:39] <Popeidol> of course, I'm just saving them the time they would have spent coming to that realisation on their own
[05:13:15] <SpallsHurgenson> that is every so considerate of you :)
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[05:52:41] <xlefay> OOPS.
[05:52:44] <xlefay> Something went wrong.
[05:52:59] <NightHawk> what??
[05:53:08] <xlefay> someone set restricted on...
[05:53:34] <NightHawk> damn, you bacon-- once and you're paying for it the rest of the day...
[05:53:45] <FoobarBazbot_> lol
[05:54:10] <FoobarBazbot_> !grab NightHawk
[05:54:10] <Bender> Added quote 51
[05:55:12] <xlefay> it's fixed come in back
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[06:02:12] <mrcoolbp> someone tripped on a wire at the datacenter
[06:02:15] <mrcoolbp> sorry about that
[06:04:13] <xlefay> ^
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[06:31:19] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Civilisation Headed for 'Irreversible Collapse' - http://sylnt.us - we're-doomed,-I-tell-you,-doomed
[06:33:54] <NightHawk> wonderful, sounds like the premis for Elysium
[06:34:04] <xlefay> ^ true
[06:35:24] <NightHawk> or Stark by Ben Elton?
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[06:52:12] <unitron> "* SpallsHurgenson quickly pulls on his pant" It suddenly occured to me to wonder if this is actually correct because he's a merman.
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[07:24:53] <combatserver> Can someone explain why the recent Snowden article has +0 moderated posts expanded (when NOT logged in), yet has numerous +3 posts still collapsed, by deafult settings?
[07:26:03] <combatserver> There is one post that is at +0 zero, and was moderated troll before that, never reached +1 and it is one of the few posts in that hread that are expanded.
[07:26:52] <NightHawk> combatserver: I'd just blame the NSA and call it a day
[07:27:04] <combatserver> Not good enough.
[07:27:59] <NightHawk> maybe, but the site's a work in progress, bring it up in #dev?
[07:29:16] <combatserver> It gives the appearance that someone is pushing certain posts to the fore, just like SLASHDOT WAS.
[07:29:28] <combatserver> is, sorry.
[07:31:18] <combatserver> pretty much the same discussion.
[07:31:35] <combatserver> pretty much the same in every discussion... discussion.
[07:31:47] <combatserver> jebbuz, I cant type tonight
[07:32:11] <NightHawk> take it easy dude, doubt anything that shady is afoot
[07:32:31] <combatserver> Most recent discussion has a zero post expanded, while the HIGHEST modded post is minimized.
[07:33:14] <combatserver> I see, RESPONSES are not being expanded...
[07:33:38] <combatserver> So, as long as you don't respond to a post, your post gets automatically expanded.
[07:34:21] <combatserver> Kinda breaks moderation if trolls can't be minimized.
[07:39:49] <combatserver> posted it in the dev channel.
[07:43:40] <Popeidol> default view prioritises first-level comments over subsequent levels
[07:43:57] <combatserver> even higher modded posts?
[07:43:59] <Popeidol> no idea if that's relevant in this case, though
[07:44:19] <Popeidol> I believe so
[07:44:26] <combatserver> End result is troll posts being expanded, and +3 posts not.
[07:44:38] <combatserver> THAT needs fixed....
[07:45:04] <Popeidol> I changed to nested view on day one, so I'm not entirely certain
[07:45:06] <combatserver> No fucking wonder the posts counts are so low.
[07:45:51] <combatserver> People just come for a look, and see half the posts are modded -1 Troll, but failt o see the +3 insightful post right below it.
[07:46:59] <combatserver> Unless logged in, no -1 troll posts should EVER be visible unless you deliberately click it to expand it.
[07:47:33] <combatserver> I am ssuming it has been this way since day one....
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[07:52:35] <Popeidol> looks like teh default view only shows first-level comments as expanded
[07:53:06] <Popeidol> I guess nested view with +2 or something might make a better default view for new people
[08:32:05] * arti shares: http://gabrielecirulli.github.io
[08:32:23] <swiss> arti: i've been playin it
[08:32:30] <swiss> mid 7000's in score
[08:32:30] * arti shanks swiss
[08:33:53] <arti> nicely done, my first go was that divided by 10
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[08:37:45] <Bender> [ksuhku] nested view++
[08:42:08] <swiss> arti: 7192 is top
[08:42:22] <swiss> http://i.imgur.com
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[09:20:27] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Optical Switch Breaks Miniaturization Barrier - http://sylnt.us - room-at-the-botom
[09:22:13] <NCommander> Anyone know a decent free newsserver?
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[10:12:00] <prospectacle> INN (InterNetNews) looks ok but I haven't used it.
[10:12:00] <prospectacle> https://www.isc.org
[10:12:14] <prospectacle> ^^^ NCommander
[10:13:13] <NCommander> prospectacle, not what I meant, I don't want to runa local USENET server :-)
[10:14:33] <prospectacle> ok. I don't really understand how usenet works
[10:15:19] <xlefay> There's some pretty cheap services though, ranging from $1 to $10 a month, last I checked
[10:15:32] <xlefay> then again.. I use usenet to download stuff and paid for a year in advance....
[10:18:41] <crutchy> i remember back when i first got the internet i just used outlook express to search free news servers
[10:18:55] <crutchy> back when outlook express was cool :-P
[10:19:04] <xlefay> =p
[10:20:35] <crutchy> there was hundreds of them back then (90s)... there's prolly thousands now, full of **** knows what
[10:20:48] <prospectacle> lol yeah and remember the microsoft irc client, it made people into comics
[10:21:12] <crutchy> never used irc much
[10:21:18] <crutchy> until recently :-P
[10:22:04] <crutchy> i remember msn messenger... that was during the big animated gif storm
[10:22:25] <prospectacle> Last stable release 1999: http://en.wikipedia.org
[10:22:36] <prospectacle> it was a crazy time
[10:23:35] <crutchy> lol check out the list of nicks in http://en.wikipedia.org
[10:25:12] <xlefay> "assmaster" rofl
[10:25:32] <xlefay> Just don't misread that as masher ;')
[10:25:38] <xlefay> smasher*
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[10:26:20] <prospectacle> Yeah, stay classy people of #zdoom
[10:26:39] <xlefay> haha I actually misread that nickname the first time. Guess, that's a long time ago eh
[10:27:26] <Popeidol> I have a copy of comic chat at home
[10:27:37] <Popeidol> it semi-runs under wine
[10:27:44] <xlefay> Oh that's gold
[10:28:05] <prospectacle> wow, are you using it right now? That would be the weirdest thing that had happened to me all day.
[10:28:13] <Popeidol> sadly no
[10:28:27] <xlefay> Popeidol: you should run it one day in here and just make a few screenshots :D
[10:28:32] <Popeidol> I think comic chat required MS servers due to their non-standard IRCing
[10:28:53] <xlefay> probably, some weird additional ctcp protocol
[10:28:53] <Popeidol> but then, I've never tried to connect it to another server
[10:29:04] <prospectacle> I recall it being limited to ms servers
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[10:29:21] <Popeidol> I wonder if it could be fooled with a bit of hosts file redirect
[10:29:28] <prospectacle> I used to go on, what was it, undernet maybe? Was that a thing?
[10:29:35] <Popeidol> undernet was a thing, yeah
[10:29:37] <Popeidol> also dalnet
[10:29:38] <xlefay> Undernet still exists, no?
[10:29:44] <prospectacle> oh, still is
[10:29:46] <xlefay> Or has it died?
[10:30:06] <prospectacle> yeah I think i used to go on those two when I first got a computer with the internet and it had ms comic chat.
[10:30:08] <Popeidol> if I recall, I have a copy of bonzibuddy sitting right next to comic chat
[10:30:20] <Popeidol> so should it be required, I can go straight back to the best of the 90's
[10:30:54] <xlefay> rofl
[10:31:16] <prospectacle> what annoys me is that windows has finally stopped playing win3.11 software. I bought a "microsoft ancient treasures" from a charity shop for $2 becuase, I mean "multimedia", right? But no play nice with win7 64
[10:32:03] <xlefay> You can't enable compat mode?
[10:32:05] <prospectacle> I mean it was a multi-media CD Rom! It could play music and video right on your computer.
[10:32:12] <prospectacle> No compat mode doesn't go back that far anymore.
[10:32:23] <prospectacle> Turns out you can virtualbox win3.11 if you can get a copy of win3.11
[10:32:39] <xlefay> Well I suppose... at some point we have to move on
[10:33:28] <Popeidol> http://thepiratebay.se
[10:33:30] <prospectacle> I guess so. But it seems wrong. Dos still lives on in dosbox. Software shouldn't die, it's not like it's expensive to copy
[10:33:52] <prospectacle> lol @ popeidol. That was quick.
[10:34:01] <xlefay> prospectacle: it sure shouldn't ;)
[10:34:10] <Popeidol> it turns out you're not the only person who needs that software
[10:34:41] <prospectacle> Well, for a certain value of "need". I've been looking for encarta, but the few times I found it, the wrong CD was in the box
[10:34:58] <prospectacle> Got office 97 for $8 though. The last good version.
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[10:37:20] <Popeidol> I've got an encarta 95 CD at home
[10:37:41] <Popeidol> in a little folder with office 97 and win95
[10:37:46] <Popeidol> you never know when you'll need it again
[10:37:48] <prospectacle> Cool.
[10:37:58] <Popeidol> (it's from my original win95 install)
[10:38:08] <prospectacle> Yeah, they can fit a whole encyclopedia on there. It's a miracle of modern technology.
[10:39:49] <prospectacle> But now like everything else it's been pushed aside by the big guy. Like that notorious door-to-door encyclopedia and randian robber-baron saleman jimmy wales
[10:40:29] <chromas> Encarta is online
[10:41:01] <prospectacle> s/and randian robber-baron saleman/salesman and randian robber-baron/
[10:41:01] <SedBot> <prospectacle> But now like everything else it's been pushed aside by the big guy. Like that notorious door-to-door encyclopedia salesman and randian robber-baron jimmy wales
[10:41:15] <prospectacle> chromas: oh, well disregard then.
[10:41:28] MrBluze_ is now known as MrBluze
[10:42:11] <prospectacle> encarta.com redirects to bing. I see what they're trying to there. Sorry bing it's not gonna work.
[10:42:44] <chromas> Damn
[10:42:53] <chromas> I've never been wrong before
[10:46:11] <prospectacle> Has anyone tried the alternative wiki-based-encyclopedias, like the scholarpedia or citizendium
[10:46:37] <prospectacle> I like the idea, but having experts review stuff really slows them down. Maybe it's worth it in the long run.
[11:04:38] <prospectacle> Stupid 2048
[11:11:18] <crutchy> i have encarta 98 on cd :-P
[11:11:43] <crutchy> was a pretty cool encyclopedia back then
[11:12:09] <prospectacle> Cool, what are some of its best features?
[11:12:23] <crutchy> it was easy to navigate
[11:12:40] <crutchy> had videos, an information organiser thingy
[11:12:44] <prospectacle> Did it have any interesting videos, etc?
[11:12:48] <crutchy> (never used the organiser much)
[11:12:58] <crutchy> can't remember
[11:13:07] <crutchy> i think i have it on my hdd somewhere
[11:13:12] <prospectacle> I remember the first time i saw video on a comptuer i was like "holy crap how did they draw that it's so lifelike"
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[11:13:39] <crutchy> reminds me of the episode of the simpsons where homer goes on itchy and scratchy
[11:13:58] <prospectacle> where he asks if they're broadcast live?
[11:14:32] <crutchy> holy carp i have toolbook ii publisher
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[11:15:17] <prospectacle> what's that?
[11:16:58] <crutchy> http://en.wikipedia.org
[11:17:10] <crutchy> says there was never a 2.0 release
[11:17:28] * crutchy installs wine to install tb2 :-P
[11:19:15] MrBluze is now known as MrBluze__
[11:20:58] <prospectacle> Says there was a version 11 in 2011. I've never heard of it
[11:21:48] <crutchy> ah maybe its tb 5 that i got
[11:21:50] * prospectacle goes to find video of toolbook
[11:21:58] <crutchy> the files are named tb50*
[11:22:15] <crutchy> could have sworn it was called ToolBook II Publisher though
[11:26:07] <Popeidol> could it be toolbook \/ publisher?
[11:26:56] <crutchy> dammit stupid thing won't run on wine... i can't be fornicated getting my windows notebook out :-P
[11:27:14] <crutchy> prolly won't even run in win7 cos it's 16 bit
[11:27:43] <crutchy> i'd have to run it on the windows xp vbox on my win7 notebook
[11:27:49] <hka> dosbox?;)
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[11:43:48] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v MrBluze] by kobitch
[11:46:04] -!- MrBluze__ has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
[11:48:14] * MrBluze gets out the wednesday pin and drops it
[11:48:50] * hka watches it bounce
[11:49:14] * MrBluze watches hka watching it bounce
[11:49:17] * Konomi get some bubble gum and turns it into a nuclear warhead
[11:50:10] * MrBluze is impressed
[11:50:29] <Konomi> it seemed like the right thing to do
[11:50:45] <MrBluze> in this day and age, yes
[11:50:47] <MrBluze> brb .. testing something
[11:50:51] <MrBluze> not a nuclear warhead
[11:51:06] <hka> having a nuke ought to live things up
[11:51:24] MrBluze is now known as mrbluze|afk
[11:51:49] <xlefay> ... :)
[11:52:07] <xlefay> it work, mrbluze|afk? :)
[11:52:31] * mrbluze|afk nods
[11:52:36] mrbluze|afk is now known as MrBluze
[11:52:43] <MrBluze> except i change myself back ofc
[11:53:03] <xlefay> I thought it would do that by default oh well
[11:53:10] <xlefay> can't have everything I suppose
[11:53:14] <MrBluze> oh.. better if it doesnt lol
[11:53:16] <MrBluze> then i can lurk
[11:53:23] <MrBluze> im not always available anyway
[11:57:40] <Konomi> I never change my nick I just leave the keyboard
[11:57:42] * Konomi hides
[11:58:05] <xlefay> I do the same, but I just quit my IRC client and let my bouncer idle ;-)
[11:58:14] <Konomi> I don't have a bouncer sniff
[11:58:22] <Popeidol> I figure my lack of response will be a fair hint that I'm not here
[11:58:28] <Konomi> I am considering oen day getting a pi and using it to be one along with a bunch of other stuff
[11:59:09] <xlefay> I'll be happy to create a BNC account for you, but it can only connect to localhost (e.g. this server)
[11:59:18] <xlefay> most people on the BNC as it stands just use it for backlogs, etc.
[12:01:21] * MrBluze got a bouncer.. i call him biffo
[12:01:40] <Konomi> that'd kill all my security ;p
[12:02:39] <MrBluze> backlogs are good cause i miss stuff
[12:03:14] <Konomi> I save logs to an encrypted back up
[12:03:46] <Konomi> helps to have back logs for moderating
[12:03:51] <MrBluze> same
[12:03:53] <Konomi> I moderate a few other channels not on this network
[12:03:55] <kobitch> encrypted? truecrypt? xkcd?
[12:04:05] <MrBluze> well. my encrypted root is encrypted in the backup
[12:04:07] <Konomi> kobitch: encfs atm but I want to move to something more robust eventually
[12:04:34] <MrBluze> my encrypted vm boots an encrypted linux that backs up to an encrypted volume
[12:04:38] * MrBluze laughs .. that must be so slow
[12:04:38] <Konomi> ideally I'll do a luk fs eventually
[12:04:54] <Konomi> just too much to do on an existing install
[12:05:00] <Konomi> and reinstalling is what windows users do
[12:05:15] <MrBluze> Konomi: .. VM's is what i do now
[12:05:25] <xlefay> Well... just for good measures, I prefer recursive encryption, e.g. my roots root's root, etc.... just to be on the save side
[12:05:29] <MrBluze> the OS on a machien is jsut for running vm's now
[12:05:35] <xlefay> One can never be too recursive
[12:05:36] <xlefay> err, safe.
[12:05:44] <Konomi> I game and stuff VMs just don't cut it unfortnatly
[12:05:50] <MrBluze> fair nuff
[12:06:09] <xlefay> That's true, but hopefully soon that'll change (e.g. Steam's making good headway last I checked)
[12:06:35] <Konomi> VMs concern me a bit
[12:06:50] <Konomi> I'm worried if we remove people even further from the hardware we'll just cause more issues
[12:06:59] <Konomi> software abstraction is going overboard imo
[12:07:47] <MrBluze> Konomi: its a practical measure
[12:07:58] <Konomi> yeah I know I was more meaning in general
[12:08:00] <MrBluze> with fast external hdd's i can boot to the vm anywhere
[12:08:03] <Konomi> vms are nice if you wnat to secure
[12:08:13] <xlefay> not really that secure...
[12:09:21] <MrBluze> encrypted root is more secure
[12:09:31] <MrBluze> and then that stored in an encrypted vm
[12:09:46] <xlefay> Going overboard with encryption isn't going to do much good either tho
[12:09:50] <MrBluze> no
[12:09:52] <Konomi> I'll probably just do encrypted home partition if I ever get around to it
[12:10:05] <xlefay> I've got / encrypted and /home; besides that.. nah
[12:10:06] <MrBluze> well .. obfuscation by hdd encryption is good
[12:10:21] <MrBluze> so no one knows what the ext hard drive is for
[12:10:35] <MrBluze> .. i always encrypt root
[12:10:51] <xlefay> I do only if there's valuable information to me on there
[12:10:51] <MrBluze> depends who u are defending against
[12:10:59] <Konomi> there's like a cut out in MrBluze's mattress where he hides the hard drive
[12:11:01] * Konomi hides
[12:11:07] <MrBluze> lol Konomi
[12:11:13] <MrBluze> and if i wet the bed, i need to buy a new hard drive
[12:11:24] <Konomi> hehe
[12:11:27] <xlefay> e.g. my htpc, I'm not going to use encryption; it'd be unneeded
[12:11:41] <xlefay> That's why you have it in a plastic bag no?
[12:11:44] <Konomi> encrypt it all
[12:11:46] <MrBluze> all my stuff is portable, so all my stuff is encrypted
[12:11:50] <crutchy> mrbluze... tmi about your inter-hdd relations
[12:11:52] <crutchy> :-P
[12:11:54] <Konomi> just wanna make three letter organisations lives hard
[12:11:56] <MrBluze> lmao crutchy
[12:12:20] <MrBluze> if someone breaks into your apartment and steals your hardware ..
[12:12:23] <xlefay> Konomi: I'm fairly sure if they really wanted your infos they'd just pick you up
[12:12:25] <MrBluze> then all they have is hardware
[12:12:38] <xlefay> MrBluze: and in my case, quite the movie collection ;)
[12:12:40] <Konomi> it's not about me personally it's about making their lives hard in general
[12:12:41] <MrBluze> our infos are all over the internet
[12:12:46] <Konomi> and they'dhave to know where I am to pick me up for one
[12:12:58] <Konomi> and I promise you anything I do they could have a reason to do that for I do in tor
[12:13:01] <Konomi> ;p
[12:13:05] <MrBluze> the biggest security failure we have is our hardware imho
[12:13:14] <Konomi> depends
[12:13:17] <Konomi> if you order it online sure
[12:13:24] <Konomi> if you go to a brick and mortor store
[12:13:25] <Konomi> not so much
[12:13:45] <crutchy> biggest security failure we have is security theatre
[12:13:55] <Konomi> rot16 everywhere
[12:13:58] <Konomi> secure as
[12:14:14] <xlefay> 'humans'
[12:14:15] <MrBluze> lol
[12:14:19] <MrBluze> the hardware
[12:14:33] <Konomi> just buy a mac book what could go wrong
[12:14:37] <MrBluze> cause u can encrypt your stuff, secure your linux, and the blasted wifi snitches on u
[12:14:40] <Konomi> tbh
[12:14:45] <Konomi> I've frozen the bios on this laptop
[12:14:49] <Konomi> soo yeah
[12:14:55] <Konomi> with the keyboard I might add.
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[12:15:15] <Konomi> damn thing even has grammar mistakes...
[12:15:19] <xlefay> LOL
[12:15:21] <xlefay> !grab Konomi
[12:15:21] <Bender> Added quote 52
[12:15:32] <Konomi> I am not joking
[12:15:40] <crutchy> maybe you forgot to reformat your mouse konomi
[12:15:48] <MrBluze> its not bios
[12:15:51] <Konomi> computer is still great but when you see stuff like that you get a deep sinking feeling
[12:15:58] <Konomi> my oc is old enough it still has a bios ;p
[12:16:01] <MrBluze> its the hypervisor whatever.. system-on-a-chip that intel comes with
[12:16:32] <xlefay> laptop = bios; desktop (htpc) = eufi
[12:16:34] <xlefay> uefi*
[12:16:51] <Konomi> we all need to get lemotes
[12:16:54] <Konomi> gotta go stallman level
[12:17:08] <crutchy> lemotes = remotes that don't work
[12:20:29] <NightHawk> Food for thought, no password means guy gets his stolen laptop back - http://makezine.com
[12:20:43] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Leslie Lamport Wins the 2013 A.M. Turing Award - http://sylnt.us - distributed-accolades
[12:26:53] <MrBluze> hmm.. fukushima water hits the US coast in April
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[12:33:36] <MrBluze> NightHawk: food for thought .. a know several people who had their phones stolen, tracked them, told the police, and the police said "u dont want that phone back.. trust me"
[12:35:23] <NightHawk> cos... of the people who now had the number?
[12:35:46] <MrBluze> nah cause the ppl who stole the phone would go and do something to the police officer and the owner of the phone
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[12:36:37] <NightHawk> bit lame, but i guess in that instance it's just a phone after all.
[12:37:15] <MrBluze> yeah
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[12:37:18] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Bender] by kobitch
[12:37:36] <MrBluze> i think the best way is encrypt your data, back up, and accept the hardware is losable
[12:38:03] <NightHawk> Just got reminded of that story by all the chatter about encryption.
[12:38:32] <MrBluze> yes
[12:38:35] <MrBluze> interesting
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[12:59:22] MrBluze is now known as MrBluze|zzz
[13:09:14] * Subsentient is itching for a burrito storm'
[13:10:45] <crutchy> is that like metalstorm but with burritos?
[13:10:49] <crutchy> https://www.youtube.com
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[13:36:47] <crutchy> $sr hello
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[13:46:18] <weeds> Good Morning (US Eastern)
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[13:51:08] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - TOR-Anonymised Pedophile Ring Busted - http://sylnt.us - special-victims-unit
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[14:11:55] -!- Popeidol has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
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[14:21:23] <AgTiger> Gah, I wish moderator points didn't expire so quickly. By the time I got done the article on the Windigo attack on SSH under posted article "10,000 Linux Servers Hit by Malware", my moderator points disappeared.
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[14:21:59] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Bender] by kobitch
[14:22:52] FoobarBazbot|afk is now known as FoobarBazbot
[14:32:40] <weeds> AgTiger: Foo, that hasn't happened to me. Was it right after you logged in?
[14:37:28] -!- Brylarke [Brylarke!~Brylarke@73-51-404-28.dsl.zen.co.uk] has joined #Soylent
[14:38:15] <AgTiger> Nah, I'd been logged in for a while, but I just sat down for morning coffee at my computer, was reading the article, then decided I needed to digest the info in the attached PDF and by the time I got back... well, no more mod points
[14:38:41] <AgTiger> Probably got given the mod points in the wee hours before I was up, but I'd love to know what the duration of the mod points is.
[14:38:47] <AgTiger> Just seems.... fast.
[14:39:26] <AgTiger> Pardon delays, multitasking between windows.
[14:43:42] -!- drgibbon [drgibbon!~gibblets@100.percent.pure.coconut.water] has joined #Soylent
[14:44:01] <drgibbon> I'm seeing different versions of the site when logged in vs logged out
[14:44:33] <AgTiger> Different, in what way?
[14:44:47] <drgibbon> the top 3 stories are not even there
[14:44:55] <drgibbon> logged in, the top story is
[14:44:56] <drgibbon> Civilisation Headed for 'Irreversible Collapse'
[14:45:03] <drgibbon> logged out, it's the TOR pedos
[14:45:49] <AgTiger> Could be your settings for what you prefer to see, you may have some things filtered. Logged out/in, I see the same story at the top (the Tor one)
[14:46:31] <AgTiger> Or possibly a caching issue?
[14:46:35] <drgibbon> could be, but I haven't changed any settings
[14:46:42] <drgibbon> let me see..
[14:46:55] -!- FoobarBazbot has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[14:47:26] <drgibbon> not a browser problem
[14:49:03] <weeds> AgTiger: I think it's on the order of hours. The component that dishes them out runs every 5 mins as I recall.
[14:49:55] <drgibbon> just seems strange, the 'civ headed for collapse' story was at the top of my page for ages, then I log out and see three new stories
[14:50:06] <drgibbon> and it's still the top when I log in
[14:50:12] <drgibbon> can anyone else replicate that?
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[14:50:45] <AgTiger> weeds: Okay. If I see NCommander talking in here live, I may throw the question his way. Thank you!
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[14:51:08] <AgTiger> drgibbon: I was unable to reproduce it (so far...) Looking into Soylent preferences to see if anything could explain this behavior.
[14:51:13] * NCommander tackles AgTiger
[14:51:13] <drgibbon> hmm ok
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[14:51:20] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v FoobarBazbot] by kobitch
[14:51:52] <AgTiger> *laughs* Ever vigilant, NCommander? :) I had a question about the amount of time that mod points last?
[14:52:22] <AgTiger> I spent time reading up on the Linux SSH exploit article (76 page PDF, took a while) and by the time I got back to Soylent, my mod points had expired.
[14:52:25] <NCommander> AgTiger, four hours from when granted, but they can be granted when you haven't actively refreshed the page
[14:52:33] <NCommander> since it works off a crontab
[14:52:41] <AgTiger> Kinda frustrating, when you bring yourself up to speed on the background necessary to give out insightful/interesting mod points, and .... they're gone.
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[14:53:09] <AgTiger> 4 hours might be a wee bit short on the duration...
[14:53:48] <weeds> AgTiger: I always log out when away for just that reason.
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[14:53:49] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v janrinok] by kobitch
[14:54:19] <AgTiger> weeds: Hrm. Good idea. I had stayed logged in overnight.
[14:54:23] <NCommander> AgTiger, *sigh*, the moderation QA was supposed to happen two weeks ago. Due to *drama* it got deferred
[14:54:39] <NCommander> AgTiger, weeds: its based off activity time. Mod points are only granted if you've clicked within the last 5 minutes
[14:54:47] <AgTiger> I recall the drama. By the way, you and your staff comported yourselves pretty well.
[14:55:03] <NCommander> AgTiger, from the comments, I dunno, I suspect a fair bit of people would flay me
[14:55:36] <AgTiger> Probably, but at the end of the day, the site was kept up, it's still rolling, and I call that a win.
[14:55:44] <weeds> NCommander: got it, thanks
[14:55:53] <AgTiger> You also (that I saw) didn't mudsling back, so that was also good.
[14:56:05] * NCommander needs to write up next steps
[14:56:11] <NCommander> We've got the ownership stuff mostly sorted
[14:56:18] <NCommander> So we're moving towards foundation of a not-for-profit
[14:57:31] <weeds> janrinok: Don't let them get you down.
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[14:59:43] <AgTiger> And NCommander, please don't take my comments about the duration of the mod points as a complaint, just a suggestion. Something for you to think about, that's all. I'm truly enjoying the new site, and the old look and feel.
[15:00:00] <AgTiger> Thank you for putting it online and keeping it going. :-)
[15:00:53] <weeds> NCommander: Please consider including Vision, Mission, Provence, and Charter in those next steps. Establish at least the basics of a strategic plan.
[15:01:48] <NCommander> weeds, its on the TODO list.
[15:02:49] <weeds> NCommander: Great - If there is anything I can do to help. It has been my experience that such things really matter.
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[15:03:21] <janrinok> weeds: Thanks for the encouragement - lets try again today...
[15:04:06] <NCommander> weeds, we've had a fair bit of internal communication. The biggest problem is I've been travelling for the last two weeks on a pre-SN iterinary I couldn't easily change
[15:04:47] <weeds> janrinok: What I really wanted to say was, "Don't let the bastards get you down." But that's not like me and I wouldn't say that in a public forum.
[15:06:08] <weeds> NCommander: Yes, I was aware of that. It's always the way. (I was camping on the testing weekend) I don't mean to nag.
[15:06:10] <janrinok> 'nil carborundum illigitimus' - don't let the bastards grind you down - although it isn't correct latin, it is at least repeatable in polite'ish company. :)
[15:06:38] <weeds> Ha ha I was going to say that, but didn't know if you would get it!
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[15:08:11] <TME520> Good (ugt) morning
[15:08:31] <AgTiger> Mornin'
[15:09:33] <weeds> Good morning
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[15:20:35] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - The End of "Full Disclosure" Security List - http://sylnt.us - infighting-and-you
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[16:19:26] <weeds> NC?
[16:20:10] <mrcoolbp> weeds?
[16:20:31] <mrcoolbp> (he's in #staff right now BTW)
[16:24:58] <weeds> khyber is offering to sell an exploit to our server to the highest bidder: http://soylentnews.org
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[16:42:47] <weeds> join #staff
[16:42:51] <weeds> oops
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[17:01:53] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - The Mostly Unread World of Academic Papers - http://sylnt.us - a-little-light-reading
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[17:05:54] janrinok is now known as janrinok|afk
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[17:53:49] <song-of-the-pogo> shhhh ... be vewwy quiet ...
[17:56:42] <mrcoolbp> I'm hunting wwabbit!
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[18:18:07] <swiss> arti: http://i.imgur.com
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[18:41:10] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - High-def, 3-D Images of Your Innards - http://sylnt.us - I-saw-what-you-did-there,-and-in-there
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[18:53:11] * NCommander bangs head relatively against the walls of the room
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[19:03:07] * mechanicjay cautions NCommander not to leave any dents in the walls.
[19:15:47] <weeds> NCommander: What's up dood?
[19:16:51] <NCommander> weeds, *drama*
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[19:46:52] <weeds> NCommander: :-\
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[19:49:30] <amblivious> yes, the mod points ttl is too short. I often pop into soylent for a quick look at breakfast time. It gives me mod points for the day but by lunch time they are gone and I don't much chance to use them ever. Either I avoid SN in the morning or get no points to use.
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[19:57:41] <NCommander> amblivious, point been made. I know it needs to be fixed
[19:57:43] <NCommander> also
[19:58:11] <amblivious> yeah, fair enough.
[19:58:26] <NCommander> http://soylentnews.org
[19:58:43] <amblivious> roger that too
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[20:11:37] <weeds> NCommander: Good. I was going to recommend that after he gets done with his AA meeting he should seek other professional help.
[20:21:05] <Cyprus|pmhell> oh its khyber
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[21:00:17] <LaminatorX> Submissions are rather low just now. If you have a moment, please consider pointing us at a story or two. Thanks. :)
[21:00:57] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Tips from Brian Krebs - When Your ID Gets Pwned - http://sylnt.us - sensative-and-I'd-like-to-stay-that-way
[21:01:15] <NCommander> LaminatorX, I could write another epic and post it
[21:02:57] <janrinok> NCommander: no, we need it more urgently than that..... :)
[21:04:39] * NCommander is slightly concerned as we didn't have issues w.r.t. to submissions until recently
[21:05:04] <janrinok> Its been gradual over the last 2 weeks or so.
[21:05:37] <NCommander> janrinok, decline?
[21:05:46] MrBluze|afk is now known as MrBluze
[21:05:54] <janrinok> yes the decline.
[21:06:25] <NCommander> swiss, ping, I've been told you've been a good source to talk to about security stuff
[21:06:25] <NCommander> janrinok, :-/
[21:06:52] <janrinok> We have a few stalwarts who provide some very good material but the rest seems to be dropping off.
[21:06:59] <NCommander> also when drama 1000 started
[21:07:22] <janrinok> I'm not sure that they are connected, but about the same timescales, yes.
[21:08:16] <LaminatorX> The novelty has worn off, perhaps.
[21:08:41] <janrinok> Well its something that we have all seen on other sites.
[21:09:12] <weeds> What do you think about offering mod points for articles?
[21:09:28] <janrinok> I'm not sure how you motivate the community to participate more actively rather than being 'spoon fed'.
[21:10:00] <janrinok> weeds - a possibility but I don't know that there is a shortage of modpoints to make that offer attractive enough.
[21:10:32] <weeds> There are as many as you want there to be, right?
[21:11:43] <janrinok> Yes - in theory. But NCommander would have to pick up part of the task because it might also require tweaks to the algorithm, and it would be a lower priority in all his tasks.
[21:12:01] <janrinok> s/lower/low/
[21:12:21] <janrinok> And I'm not at all sure it would work.
[21:12:34] * NCommander notes our hit per day goes up considerably each day
[21:12:43] <xlefay> We reach 400TB yet?
[21:13:41] <NCommander> janrinok, I threw it an article
[21:14:25] <janrinok> thx
[21:14:48] <weeds> I think that the submit system is a little rough n submitters. When you don't get accepted, you get a tough luck message and that 's it. That could put people off. COnstructive feedback would help.
[21:15:18] <NCommander> janrinok, honestly, looking at old stat emails
[21:15:25] <NCommander> janrinok, we've had a lot of lulls during the week
[21:15:37] <janrinok> Yes - its in the pipeline but so are many other things.
[21:15:46] * NCommander winces
[21:15:52] <janrinok> NCommander: you mean with putting stories out?
[21:16:07] <weeds> understood
[21:16:23] <NCommander> janrinok, yeah, slash keeps track of submissions per day
[21:16:29] <NCommander> janrinok, our lowest ever was seven last week
[21:16:34] <NCommander> We're between 10-15 a day
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[21:17:11] <janrinok> Yes, but we had a number of poor quality subs and at least 1 which was an attempt to get rubbish through the system.
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[21:18:10] * NCommander notes we probably shold put a nagger on the page when the queue is close to empty
[21:18:16] <janrinok> The other problem is that there has only been LaminatorX and myself on for much of the time and we cannot cover 24hrs a day. We have had to queue stories but if we haven't got many to choose from it is difficult.
[21:18:50] <NCommander> janrinok, we need to recruit more editors
[21:19:12] <Cyprus> ive definately noticed the article count issues
[21:19:21] <Cyprus> i read SN first tabbing articles, then /.
[21:19:40] <Cyprus> i manage maybe 3/4 sn tabs, and like 7 /. tabs
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[21:20:18] <NCommander> Cyprus, in terms of regulars, we get comments from approximately ~60 different IPLDs per day
[21:20:27] <NCommander> For a total of about 500-600 comments per day
[21:20:38] * xyzzyyzzyx looks for articles to submit and commenters to comment
[21:20:48] <Cyprus> the comments are definately much higher quality, excepting 1 or two idiots
[21:20:51] <weeds> I'm not in the staff meetings and don't know what you have on your priority list, but... <harping> give items that directly contribute to building community and participation top priority </harping>
[21:20:56] <NCommander> We're not growing
[21:20:57] <NCommander> That's the problem
[21:21:03] <janrinok> NCommander: its in hand, we have 3 lined up and we will get them inducted as soon as we can.
[21:21:21] <NCommander> janrinok, alright, I handed out a bunch of suadmin bits the other day so no one should block on permissions granting
[21:21:27] * NCommander notes that we need to grow some more
[21:21:33] * Cyprus agrees
[21:21:33] <xyzzyyzzyx> grow++
[21:21:34] <Bender> karma - grow: 1
[21:21:48] <Cyprus> ?? ipld
[21:22:01] <NCommander> Cyprus, Slash doesn't store raw IPds
[21:22:05] <janrinok> NCommander: thx, we'll get them up and running as quickly as we can.
[21:22:08] <NCommander> They're converted into salted hashs called IPLDs
[21:22:14] <Cyprus> ahh
[21:22:28] <NCommander> Except for the admin access log, we don't retain any IPs
[21:22:38] * NCommander notes we do collect user agents, but thats about it
[21:23:16] <Cyprus> so that probably inflates users by 2-3x
[21:23:28] * xyzzyyzzyx volunteers to edit someday when needed
[21:23:49] <NCommander> Cyprus, honestly, given the signal to noise ration on the other site, even 20 regular commenters is a good thing
[21:24:03] <dx3bydt3> here's an interesting astronomy story, I won't get a chance to write a summary today, if anyone thinks it's worthwhile it might be a good one for the site:
[21:24:05] <dx3bydt3> http://www.space.com
[21:24:05] <Cyprus> wasn't judging, just doing the math in my head
[21:24:19] <NCommander> I'm not sure how Slash counts hits per say (I dunno if its accurate or not)
[21:24:26] <Cyprus> agree on the s/n ratios between the sites
[21:24:32] <NCommander> But in terms of articles hit through article.pl, we get a couple hundred hits per article
[21:24:39] <NCommander> (that is, people clicking through to read comments)
[21:24:51] <NCommander> Which only counts logged in
[21:24:54] * NCommander checks the logged in counter
[21:26:22] <NCommander> We've got 928 users logged in right now
[21:27:22] <Cyprus> not bad considering they've never willingly put up an article about SN, its all been pretty much advertised via comments, and i haven't really seen aything about the site marketed anywhere
[21:27:50] <NCommander> Cyprus, yeah, we need to grow
[21:27:53] <NCommander> Word of mouth is decent but
[21:28:02] <NCommander> We'll bleed off users faster than we'll gain them
[21:28:17] <Alberto> bye bye fulldisc
[21:28:17] <Alberto> http://seclists.org
[21:28:18] <Alberto> T_T
[21:28:24] <Cyprus> indeed, without some kind of draw reason, and marketing
[21:28:50] <xyzzyyzzyx> knowing things are stable, with 'approped' submissinons hitting ... hourly or every half hour is vital, whether each one gets commented on or not, the opportunity is there
[21:28:53] <xyzzyyzzyx> IMHO
[21:29:05] <xlefay> xyzzyyzzyx++
[21:29:05] <Bender> karma - xyzzyyzzyx: 1
[21:29:34] <Cyprus> Alberto: Saw that post on fulldesc, anyone know what really happened?
[21:29:35] <NCommander> Cyprus, ugh, I think I need to address the community
[21:30:38] <xyzzyyzzyx> that's how I judge 'lifeblood' as I click around and refresh my news-ish sites, be they tech, political, or other - the eyeballs move around rapidly scanning for new content to keep us engaged and awake, etc
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[21:32:47] <swiss> NCommander: yeah, what's up?
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[21:33:11] <swiss> NCommander: btw, i'm in and out, but i'll always get messages prefixed by my name
[21:33:17] <NCommander> swiss, we need a security audit on slash, specifically I think we've got an SQL injection and we've had a relatively credible threat made against the site
[21:33:30] <NCommander> swiss, http://soylentnews.org
[21:34:04] <NCommander> Wow
[21:34:10] <crutchy> apache1.3 would fail such audit :-P
[21:34:11] <NCommander> new post on kuro5hin: http://www.kuro5hin.org
[21:35:06] <pbnjoe> " Why just the other day while I was furriously masterbating at the #SALMONCREEK #STARBUCKS mens room" - a site of quality, this one
[21:35:16] <xlefay> Slashdot?
[21:35:22] <xlefay> oh.. kuro5shin, explains a lot
[21:35:23] <pbnjoe> kuro5hin
[21:35:25] <pbnjoe> yeah haha
[21:36:04] <LaminatorX> We don't have the volume for hourly updates at the moment, xyzzyyzzyx.
[21:37:04] <swiss> NCommander: i am pretty busy till the weekend, but i also forwarded it to my friend who is better than me at website audits :)
[21:37:08] <swiss> we'll see if he takes an interest
[21:37:12] <crutchy> all eyes on: /slash/utility/environment/environment.pm
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[21:38:52] <crutchy> there are a lot of exports
[21:39:04] <xyzzyyzzyx> LaminatorX: yes, correct. I myself look for submissions daily. Yet it is still a goal to strive for, right? Once hourly submission hits on a regular basis, then I think one can say 'hey we've achieved baseline activity ( at minimum )'
[21:39:07] * xlefay goes to open github
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[21:40:09] <xlefay> https://github.com for this who care to read it via Github
[21:40:24] <crutchy> wouldn't be something to do with lack of verification of privelidges when calling setCurrentUser or getCurrentMenu or something like that?
[21:40:51] <xlefay> Fairly sure I just got my headache back after looking at that code.
[21:40:57] <crutchy> ($menu = $ENV{SCRIPT_NAME}) =~ s/\.pl$//;
[21:41:03] <crutchy> ^looks exploitable
[21:41:17] <xlefay> It's surprisingly readable compared to other Slashcode
[21:41:20] <crutchy> anything with a filename reference
[21:41:29] <crutchy> would be suspect
[21:41:45] <crutchy> line 240
[21:43:45] <crutchy> not possible to set environment variables from url is it?
[21:44:15] <crutchy> sorry i know dick about perl
[21:44:35] <crutchy> i'm just looking from perspective of general security exploit types that i'm aware of
[21:44:54] <Cyprus> i'd hate to even ask how bad it blows up with taint mode on
[21:45:07] <NCommander> Wow
[21:45:12] <crutchy> setting filenames as happens on line 240 looks really dodgy to me
[21:45:16] * NCommander notes the DB is 83 MiB bzip2 compressed
[21:46:49] <Cyprus> crutchy: don't disagree, that does look kind of sketch
[21:47:13] <Cyprus> should be a match map, not a basic sanity check
[21:47:57] <crutchy> $uri =~ s|^/(.*)\.pl$|$1|;
[21:48:00] <crutchy> line 2704
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[21:48:23] <crutchy> looks even dodgier
[21:48:34] <crutchy> looks like filename constructed from uri or something
[21:49:25] <Cyprus> so it basicly trusts input? that's cute
[21:49:45] <crutchy> actually 2704 just if statement condition so should be ok
[21:50:15] <xlefay> This is why people tend to use prepared statements.
[21:50:16] <crutchy> line 2740: $handler =~ s|^(.*)\.pl$|$1|;
[21:50:24] <crutchy> ^not so good
[21:51:00] * NCommander facepalms
[21:51:10] * NCommander needs to clone himself
[21:51:25] * xlefay puts NCommander on GitHub
[21:51:29] <xlefay> now we can all clone him!
[21:51:37] <Cyprus> you know, at some point you're going to have to take / out and shoot it, and rewrite things
[21:51:56] <FoobarBazbot_> !quote SoyCow4570
[21:51:56] <Bender> Quote 38 - <SoyCow4570> guys, don't mess with khyber, he'll send exploited eastern european womens to unplug your internet cables
[21:52:09] <xlefay> LOL
[21:52:12] <Cyprus> rofl
[21:52:29] <pbnjoe> ha!
[21:52:56] <pbnjoe> I love quoting
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[21:53:18] <NCommander> Cyprus, you know, I wonder how bad it is on the other site
[21:53:27] <crutchy> looks like there might be a syntax error down around line 3582
[21:53:51] <Cyprus> as far as i know, / does kind of what we did at my last job
[21:53:54] <crutchy> gedit picked up one in another file too... can't remember filename
[21:53:54] * FoobarBazbot_ just got off work, saw we apparently got a new round of threats from khyberspace?
[21:54:03] <Cyprus> clean what they can, filter what they cant at the level up
[21:54:35] <Cyprus> is pipe OSS?
[21:54:49] <Cyprus> actually, what the hell is pipe even built on
[21:54:50] <Bender> [ksuhku] not yet ...
[21:54:54] <FoobarBazbot_> Any helpful links, or do I just need to read some scrollback (like I'm going to anyway?
[21:55:03] <crutchy> anyway i'm prolly not helping at all... good luck finding exploit... may the nforce be with you!
[21:55:25] <Cyprus> crutchy: nah you had the right idea
[21:56:34] <crutchy> i know that any kind of links between uri and filesystem need to be examined very carefully
[21:56:39] <NCommander> Take a look at sub filter_param {
[21:57:34] <Cyprus> although instead of looking for filenames, i'd look for anywhere ENV is used
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[21:58:40] <crutchy> that's why line 240 jumped out at me first
[21:58:59] <crutchy> apart from it being near the top :-P
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[22:00:48] <Cyprus> this is why i don't like homemade frameworks
[22:01:12] <crutchy> actually line 240 kinda looks ok
[22:01:58] <crutchy> actually scratch that it looks dodgy
[22:02:08] <xlefay> Cyprus: I would argue this isn't even worth calling a framework
[22:03:16] <Cyprus> heh i got lost
[22:03:28] <Cyprus> i dont know how / works enough to figure out what's going on
[22:04:17] <crutchy> yeah i dunno i'm just pretending i have any idea what i'm on about, but it looks like on 240 $menu (however it's used) is being set from an environment variable without any filtering
[22:04:49] * xyzzyyzzyx runs away from the coding weeds ( ##dev is leaking )
[22:05:04] <crutchy> i don't even know what =~ means
[22:05:12] <xlefay> crutchy: that's for regex matching
[22:05:16] <crutchy> lol
[22:05:28] * crutchy has no hope :-P
[22:05:35] <stderr> Mmm... Reg exps...
[22:05:40] <xlefay> That's why you generally see regexs after the '=~'
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[22:06:57] <crutchy> so 240 takes the blah.pl part of the SCRIPT_NAME environment variable and puts it into $menu, no?
[22:06:57] <NCommander> funny
[22:07:06] <NCommander> I thought it was a squished oreo
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[22:07:27] <Cyprus> this looks XSSable but not really dangerous for the site, if i'm following it correctly
[22:07:33] <xlefay> crutchy: aah... that's going to be awesome.
[22:07:46] <crutchy> squished oreos sound like something you find in python scripts
[22:08:00] <Cyprus> since when do snakes like oreos?
[22:08:01] <xlefay> !grab NCommander
[22:08:01] <Bender> Added quote 53
[22:08:04] <xlefay> !grab crutchy
[22:08:04] <Bender> Added quote 54
[22:08:17] <Cyprus> mice maybe, but oreos?
[22:08:51] <stderr> crutchy: The "blah"-part of "blah.pl"
[22:10:00] <Cyprus> technically it just strips off the last .pl at the end
[22:12:31] <crutchy> how many index2.pl's are there in slash?
[22:13:32] <stderr> "# Yes, this is ugly, and we can ditch it in about 6 months" :-)
[22:14:17] * Cyprus chuckles
[22:15:15] * crutchy wonders if sub getCurrentMenu could hypothetically return admin menu for a non-admin user
[22:15:48] <crutchy> maybe from a doctored html request
[22:16:21] <Cyprus> i'm still trying to follow menu around
[22:16:21] <crutchy> or with help from the dark side
[22:16:24] <Cyprus> seeing what it does
[22:18:00] <Cyprus> suggest moving this conversation to a non logged channel though
[22:18:06] <janrinok> got to go guys - have a good one. cu.
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[22:19:46] <combatserver> I'm guessing that the "security issue" NCommander mentioned had something to do with the default layout of the site visible to non-logged in users. I see it's fixed now.
[22:20:21] <combatserver> Nobody noticed that that "problem" coincided with the latest Snowden article?
[22:20:46] <xlefay> stderr: I think they had a lot of those moments that at some point, they just started using it as an excuse
[22:21:50] <xlefay> crutchy: returning an admin menu and actually having access to the admin interface are two different things, the first wouldn't worry me as much as the second
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[22:24:23] <stderr> That's it! No more slashcode for me today...
[22:25:14] <crutchy> maybe also worth looking for anything that can execute code arbitrarily
[22:25:27] <xlefay> crutchy: I found it!
[22:25:29] <crutchy> i dunno perl, but any of the shell execs, eval, etc
[22:25:37] <xlefay> Does Slashcode count?!
[22:25:42] <Cyprus> that's mostly what i'm looking for
[22:26:20] <crutchy> or anything that determines the name of a function or script file to call/include
[22:26:53] <Cyprus> ok the menu stuff looks safe
[22:26:57] <Cyprus> it's a map compare
[22:27:10] <crutchy> one problem i've noticed with slash is that there seem to be duplicate files
[22:27:32] <combatserver> Are posts being intentionally deleted from discussions? See http://soylentnews.org If you look at the actual discussion, that parent post is missing entirely from the discussion. Now, I disagree with the guy (obviously, from my post) , but deleting posts isn't cool.
[22:28:09] <crutchy> Cyprus: as long as menu isn't set arbitrarily and then slash assumes that because admin menu exists for user that the user must have admin privs
[22:28:36] <Cyprus> ok let me rephrase, it could be design dangerous, it doesn't look retarded dangerous
[22:28:38] <crutchy> doesn't seem to be a lot in the way of checking admin status but that might be elsewhere
[22:28:44] <xlefay> combatserver: it's more likely it got modded down, look at the end of the thread and see if there's one post hidden?
[22:30:25] <xlefay> combatserver: just fyi, we don't remove posts, we don't need to either, people mod up/down stuff and the site's pretty much self regulating. Same as on /.
[22:30:36] <combatserver> xlefay: It IS hidden (2 posts below threshhold) BUT, I have viewing set to -1. NOTHING should be hidden....yet two posts are.
[22:30:52] <combatserver> That was my point.
[22:31:11] <combatserver> Why do those two posts not comply with settings?
[22:31:12] <stderr> combatserver: It says "threshold=0" in the URL...
[22:31:16] <Cyprus> I noticed there were issues with viewing one of the replies as well, and it looked like it was 2 posts too deep
[22:31:23] <xlefay> combatserver: it's modded to -2 also
[22:31:36] <Cyprus> but i figured it was my view settings, which i still assume it is =)
[22:31:40] <xlefay> but yeah.. -1 anyway, stderr is right
[22:31:53] <stderr> ... as always.
[22:32:04] * Cyprus chuckles
[22:32:09] <xlefay> ;]
[22:32:31] <crutchy> better take kids to skool and go to work
[22:32:32] <crutchy> cyas
[22:32:40] <Cyprus> that said, it showed a reply that was clickable, but the page just went to the origional comment, not the one i tried to view. That i assume is a bug
[22:32:42] <crutchy> good luck bughuntin'
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[22:34:16] <combatserver> Did someone make a change as to how the page is displayed to non-logged-in users LAST NIGHT?
[22:35:06] <combatserver> Because I am getting different results than I did last night
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[22:41:37] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Mozilla Joining Forces with Unity Technologies - http://sylnt.us - gaming-the-system
[22:42:53] <combatserver> 3 days into this project, I told several people there was a mole present amongst them--apparently this was ignored. Someone is actively altering view settings for non-logged-in users, on specific topics, as recently as yesterday. The SQL injection flaw NCom is talking about, was brought to his attention by me on day 4. (I'm sure it's in the logs...). FIND THE MOLE, or this is all for nothing.
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[22:47:09] * mechanicjay wonders how much of this anonymous/logged in differences people are talking about are just due to the caching and periodic update cycle for static anonymous users.
[22:48:56] <Cyprus> that would be my expectation
[22:49:27] <Cyprus> he's ascribing to maliece what is probably caching bugs introduced
[22:50:15] <mechanicjay> I might do a journal post explaining the process: Basically Slash regenerates static pages every 10 minutes. Varnish will cache up to 5 on top of that. So there is a potential 15 minute "lag" for anon users. Once you're logged in, it's all dynamic content.
[22:50:26] <mechanicjay> ...well mostly
[22:50:45] <mechanicjay> there's still some static stuff that even for logged in users (comment counts come to mind)
[22:51:18] <mechanicjay> And yes, sometimes the "freshenup" task in slash hangs and static generation dies until we kick slash in the nuts.
[22:51:34] <Cyprus> i hear there's monitoring solutions that exist =)
[22:51:41] <Cyprus> other than jimbob on irc =P
[22:52:06] <mechanicjay> Have you seen the way the "cron" jobs run in slash?
[22:52:27] <Cyprus> nope, haven't looked at the innards of /
[22:53:32] <mechanicjay> Okay, so there is the slash daemon that runs. On some configured interval it looks at the tasks database table, This table has a few columns, basically a task name, a flag for if it's running, last run time, next run time.
[22:54:09] <mechanicjay> Based on the info it gets from that table, it decides if it's time to run one of the maintenance tasks, of which there about two dozen.
[22:55:36] <mechanicjay> Here's the problem: When one of the processes fails, lets say "freshenup" in this case. The running flag stays set at one, and next run time gets really far in the past. Even if you update those fields and make sure theres no hung perl process, slash just won't run the damn job.
[22:56:46] <mechanicjay> restarting slash seems to be the only way to previously hung jobs to run again.
[22:57:12] <Cyprus> so it maintains a state table internally, and the db is just a reflection is my guess
[22:58:04] <mechanicjay> yeah probably. The thing is, I'm pretty sure we could just kick the perl jobs off manually with cron, and it'd be more reliable.
[22:58:23] <Cyprus> im kinda curious why youd want to use a daemon for this kind of thing
[22:59:01] <mechanicjay> yeah, me too.
[22:59:12] <Cyprus> but then, i've never been a fan of kittens instead of cattle either
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[23:00:22] <Cyprus> is the daemon meant to be the inteligence for a cluster of serving nodes?
[23:01:33] <mechanicjay> That's the only thing I can figure -- but still...seems goofy as you'd need a shared webroot amongst the clusters. If you did independt web-heads, they could each run out of cron and keep local copies of all the static generated stuff.
[23:02:01] <Cyprus> but some things cant be distributed, like the mod points management
[23:02:32] <mechanicjay> right. I think the problem is that there is DB stuff and webserver stuff all conflated into the same framework, which isn't really optimal.
[23:02:58] <chromas> Derp. I submitted a story and forgot the link. Need a redo!
[23:02:59] <Cyprus> sounds like a job for a scalpel
[23:03:24] <Cyprus> i get the need for task workers
[23:06:24] <Cyprus> shared webroot isn't unheard of via nfs
[23:06:32] <Cyprus> anyway i'm out
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[23:30:55] <FoobarBazbot_> !quote 5
[23:30:55] <Bender> Quote 5 - <soulde> I have friends that are better bots than Bender
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