#editorial | Logs for 2015-06-01
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[22:41:34] <n1> they get quite enough as it is
[22:41:28] <n1> im not going to rush to give intel more publicity
[22:41:12] <n1> just means it wont jump the queue
[22:40:25] <takyon> i guess not
[22:36:06] <n1> is not time sensitive though right?
[22:32:31] <takyon> I mean breaking news
[22:32:27] <takyon> submitted truth about intel acquiring altera
[22:32:14] <takyon> it's the truth innit
[22:24:35] <n1> im down with that :p
[22:23:47] <chromas> Use "Dice" so we can rage harder :)
[22:23:01] <n1> thats the headline as is from TFA
[22:22:55] <n1> so if there's a better way of putting it, i'm all for it
[22:22:49] <n1> i didnt like the headline
[22:22:22] <chromas> Seems like it should be hypenated
[22:12:34] <takyon> Is the string "Slashdot Media Owned SourceForge" correct as-is?
[22:12:22] <takyon> "Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned SourceForge"
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[20:40:39] <pants--> ^ 03SN comment by [02takyon (881)] (02Score:2)
[20:40:38] <takyon> http://soylentnews.org
[20:14:11] <takyon> I'll disable it by default
[20:14:04] <takyon> oh yeah, the other feature I added was "stripEmail" which removes your auto-filled email from submission page. I have accidentally submitted stories with my anti-spam filtered email, which makes a huge mess as you may have seen
[20:12:37] <n1> i think 5 would be enough
[20:12:28] <takyon> it's completely arbitrary, other than the aesthetics of not exceeding the width of a single line/row maybe
[20:11:25] <takyon> should I add more than 5 macros?
[20:11:06] <n1> almost
[20:10:51] <takyon> anybody around?
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[18:52:18] <janrinok> got to go - have a good gig tonight Lammy
[18:33:28] LaminatorX_ is now known as LaminatorX
[18:32:48] <LaminatorX_> Fun Fact: The "Ninja Costume" came about from performers prtraying Ninja in Kabuki dressing in the Bunraku puppeteer outfit as a cue to the audience that the other characters could not see their character.
[18:29:12] <janrinok> handy for when they bring the bill, though
[18:25:39] <janrinok> rofl
[18:25:17] <LaminatorX_> I get that a lot. Mostly while in my Bunraku puppeteer garb. We have the worst time going out to eat after performances.
[18:22:39] <janrinok> just like a ninja...
[18:22:23] <LaminatorX_> Neither did I until my browser complained. I must have timed out while doing job stuff.
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[18:20:28] <janrinok> didn't notice you slip away LamX
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[18:11:02] <janrinok> .. must be an age thing ...
[18:10:50] <janrinok> ah, yes, it comes back to me now, thx paulej72
[18:10:34] <paulej72> slashboxes are the boxes on the right on the home page
[18:10:13] <paulej72> if I get a bionic arm and have it attached to my torso, I can use the bionic hand
[18:09:46] <janrinok> showing just how out-of-touch I am - what are slashboxes? paulej72 has just fixed 'em
[18:08:54] <CoolHand> but if I had it off accidentally I'd be all for it :)
[18:08:42] <CoolHand> not quite cool enough to chop mine off to get one though
[18:08:19] <CoolHand> janrinok: it *does* indeed
[18:07:52] <janrinok> that bionic hand looks cool
[18:07:48] <n1> so is not news/story/interesting
[18:07:40] <n1> from wikipedia
[18:07:37] <n1> "CDBurnerXP is freeware but closed source because it uses some proprietary libraries.[4] The standard CDBurnerXP installer comes bundled with OpenCandy, though a version without this is available, alongside x64 versions, a Windows Installer-based version for corporate deployment and a portable version.[1]"
[18:07:28] <CoolHand> cool
[18:07:26] <CoolHand> opencandy seems to be some advertisement thing in software
[18:07:25] <n1> it's going to be rejected
[18:07:21] <n1> agree
[18:07:14] <CoolHand> looks like same thing from 12/2012... I don't think enough soylentils would use it to care..??
[18:06:57] <pants--> ^ 03Notes tone unturned: How to install CDBurnerXP (and WinSCP) without Open Candy
[18:06:56] <CoolHand> http://notestoneunturned.blogspot.com
[18:06:56] <janrinok> if we had feedback, I would ask the sub to rewrite it, but as it stands, bin
[18:06:41] <n1> so the most bias of all sources right there
[18:06:35] <n1> the only sources are from cdburnerxp
[18:06:28] <janrinok> n1 - bin it is my view
[18:06:11] <CoolHand> I'm thinking reject, but I'm having to lookup what opencandy is and why I should care
[18:06:10] <n1> but i am half asleep right now, so i could be missing something
[18:06:01] <n1> that seems like a non-story soylvertisement random pointless shit to me
[18:05:46] <n1> what about the cdburnerxp/opencandy story
[18:05:38] <n1> is gone
[18:04:48] <CoolHand> n1, please reject
[18:04:40] <janrinok> ch k
[18:04:32] <janrinok> I hadn't looked, but will accept your opinion as good enough for me!
[18:04:31] <CoolHand> my maths got off somewhere
[18:04:20] <CoolHand> janrinok: I did! didn't mean to though! if u r 2nd'ing it, please change.. :)
[18:04:05] <n1> thats quite subjective, but the picture presented is certainly not flattering
[18:03:49] <janrinok> you mean she's not a minger?
[18:03:37] <n1> the summary is not only thin, it's also misleading
[18:03:21] <LaminatorX> Man, if the summery weren't so thin it might've been a good test case for /random only.
[18:02:49] <n1> and im also open to opinions on why the cdburnerxp/opencandy should not be rejected
[18:02:37] <janrinok> not from me n1
[18:02:24] <n1> im going to reject the 'loud sex' story unless there's any objections
[18:02:23] <pants--> ^ 03The Lonely Mountain String Band Music, Lyrics, Songs, and Videos ( https://www.reverbnation.com )
[18:02:21] <LaminatorX> Here's this though - http://lmsb.me
[18:01:28] <LaminatorX> Nothing current The group I play with sets the lyrics from songs in Tolkien to old-time string band music. We're about to open communication with the Tolkien Estate and Harper-Collins WRT licensing the lyrics for proper recordings, so we've been keeping a low profile online.
[18:01:09] <janrinok> do you want me to leave it there or move when I 2nd ed?
[18:00:14] <janrinok> CoolHand: you posted that bionic hand story only 55 minutes after the previous one?
[17:56:54] <janrinok> he just pauses for effect... ;)
[17:56:08] <janrinok> CH: standby!
[17:54:28] <CoolHand> LaminatorX: do u have anything on youtube or anything?
[17:54:12] <janrinok> no I was just looking at the spellcheck problem, I closed the window
[17:53:51] <janrinok> you'll be taking over from Pete Seager if you carry on like that, Lammy
[17:53:40] <CoolHand> janrinok: I submitted that bionic hand story, and I went back into the editor and it said you were working on it.. just wanna make sure you're 2nd editing it and we didnt' overlap..
[17:53:06] <LaminatorX> I wanted to keep the theme of labor exploitation, but update it for the service oriented economy of today.
[17:52:29] <janrinok> best of luck with that then!
[17:51:57] <LaminatorX> I'm actually hitting one tonight, Janrinok. I've re-written the lyrics to the old song, "Cotton Mill Girls" as "Coffee Shop Girls" and want to see how an audience reacts to it.
[17:49:51] <janrinok> I think it is just telling you to either select Learn in your local dictionary, or at least lets you select an alternative...?
[17:49:46] <cmn32480> it points to the words you need to go look up in the dictionary.
[17:49:40] <CoolHand> janrinok: that's usually what I use also... just thought I'd make use of the nifty new feature, but I ain't smart enuff to figger it out
[17:49:01] <janrinok> good question - I use the spellchecker built into the browser. Without a continuous exchange with the SN server, how could it work?
[17:47:18] <CoolHand> how's the spellcheck feature work? anyone? I selected "learn" on the boxes and thought after the next preview, it would come back without them, but seemed to have no effect..
[17:46:56] <janrinok> have you had any time to do open mike performances recently?
[17:46:06] <LaminatorX> thanks.
[17:45:53] <janrinok> wb LamX
[17:45:40] LamX|afk is now known as LaminatorX
[17:44:44] <janrinok> exactly, we can't be on 24 hours a day, and decisions get made when we are not here
[17:44:19] <n1> if i get told not to use something, i dont question why when it comes to this site
[17:44:05] <janrinok> np - I don't know where I heard it first
[17:43:47] <n1> i was only going off my memory from many months ago
[17:35:57] <janrinok> ah, by the time it reached me it was more 'h3s cause a problem' ....
[17:34:57] <paulej72> I mentioned that h3's in the intro text were under the h3 in the story title and should be h4s to make screen readers happy
[17:34:05] janrinok|afk is now known as janrinok
[17:33:10] <janrinok|afk> paulej72: I wonder where that rumour came from then. It was only about 3 months or so back
[17:30:29] <CoolHand> rushes grr - st00pid fingers
[17:30:21] * CoolHand rushed to use all available h tags!
[17:30:13] <CoolHand> w00t!
[17:29:48] <paulej72> nothing causes a problem in the db as far as I know
[17:28:53] <n1> h3
[17:23:35] <janrinok|afk> ?
[17:23:33] <janrinok|afk> n1: is h4 or h3 tags that cause the problem in the db
[17:05:35] <n1> i have updated the patriot act story to <h4> tags
[17:04:16] <n1> sort of thing
[17:04:12] <n1> x and y writes:
[17:03:55] <n1> usually its fairly easy as the subs tend to be blockquotes, so it's not a huge deal, and some merges have been made into one summary
[17:02:29] <CoolHand> yea, it's actually possible I removed them unintentionally for that same reason..
[17:01:18] <n1> or they're all extremely similar
[17:01:08] <n1> especially when 2/3 are the exact same
[17:01:01] <n1> but usually on merges i just remove them anyway, as a story doesnt need 3 headlines
[17:00:44] <n1> i think i changed them to <b> in the past
[17:00:39] <n1> that sounds familiar
[17:00:09] <paulej72> not remove but change to h4s when doing the merge
[16:59:42] <n1> but it was many months ago
[16:59:39] <n1> which you did explain at the time
[16:59:36] <n1> paulej72, i only brought it up as i recall one time you mentioned we should remove them for some reason
[16:59:07] <paulej72> I did not change the h tags, but they are mostly a problem for screen readers as they hevily use the heddings to prioritize info
[16:58:41] <n1> it's not that much of a big issue
[16:58:36] <n1> and is broken in other ways
[16:58:33] <n1> CoolHand, think it only affects search, and as most of the community doesnt use the search feature
[16:58:08] <n1> paulej72 can answer this, if h tags are still a problem
[16:57:21] <paulej72> Actually Breaking news can not be hidden by a user.
[16:57:21] <CoolHand> just sayin I never heard anyone complain on my merged stories (which I assume got the h tags added in)
[16:56:09] <n1> CoolHand, it's not a big deal and they only appear automatically on merged stories
[16:54:08] <CoolHand> I never removed any h tags...
[16:33:57] <n1> as nearly every editorial decision is
[16:33:52] <n1> depends on the submission, it's a story by story thing
[16:33:52] <takyon> well yeah
[16:33:44] <takyon> search is already a mess anyway. it will probably all work after it is revamped
[16:33:35] <n1> i remove them entirely usually, as a story doesnt need two headlines after the headline
[16:33:03] <n1> i might have been the only person here when paulej72 mentioned it
[16:32:43] <takyon> nobody's bothered to remove them for months AFAIK
[16:32:37] <n1> that sounds about right
[16:32:34] <n1> this was many many months ago, so things may have changed
[16:32:32] <takyon> breaking search maybe?
[16:31:23] <n1> because they broke something
[16:31:19] <n1> but we were told to remove them before
[16:31:14] <n1> i know
[16:30:03] <takyon> those are automatic when merging stories
[16:29:41] <n1> cant remember what exactly, just paulej72 saying to avoid using them
[16:29:21] <n1> i recall before using <h3> tags broke something
[16:28:57] <n1> are we ok with h tags now?
[16:28:28] <takyon> that's better
[16:25:44] <takyon> cached, wait a moment
[16:25:21] <n1> see what you think now, takyon
[16:22:36] <pants--> ^* 03Senate impasse: NSA spy tactics—including phone records collection—expiring | Ars Technica ( http://arstechnica.com )
[16:22:36] <n1> it's a copy/paste from http://arstechnica.com
[16:22:17] <n1> TFA even
[16:22:14] <n1> as it appears to be missing for sub#2
[16:22:06] <n1> will also include link to TFS
[16:21:39] LaminatorX is now known as LamX|afk
[16:21:35] <n1> i'll fix it now
[16:21:14] <n1> not sure where the unicode stuff came from
[16:21:12] <LaminatorX> I'm off to lunch. For now, lets do Topic+Main unless you feel like a story is of truly marginal general interest. We might do some more experiments once the bits settle on the update.
[16:21:10] <n1> that is the link
[16:21:05] <takyon> better than nothing
[16:21:01] <takyon> yeah put that one in
[16:20:18] <pants--> ^ 03H.R.2048 - 114th Congress (2015-2016): USA FREEDOM Act of 2015 | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
[16:20:17] <n1> https://www.congress.gov
[16:20:07] <n1> can fix?
[16:17:48] <takyon> I don't know if Phoenix666 or SoylentNews dropped the spaghetti with that original submission #2
[16:17:01] <cmn32480> the measure of a man's genius is how much he agrees with you....
[16:16:50] <takyon> kinda broken article here
[16:16:42] <pants--> ^ 03SN article: Key Sections of the USA PATRIOT Act Expired - For Now 04(2 comments)
[16:16:42] <takyon> http://soylentnews.org
[16:16:22] <LaminatorX> I'm uncertain of the utility of topic-nexus-only stories at our present volume. It strikes me as something that made sense for /.'s tens or hundreds of thousands of people and hundreds of submissions, but less so for out thousands and dozens.
[16:16:21] <cmn32480> do we have enough volume at this point to have stories in only a nexus? or is this going to be main page + nexus?
[16:15:10] <takyon> yes'
[16:13:59] <LaminatorX> I was talking to myself there for a bit, I think.
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[16:07:46] <n1> but it's a subjective story by story thing
[16:07:42] <LaminatorX> It might end up as still "just-enough" with a slightly larger value for enough and a bunch of staries with barely any views because they aren't on Mai.
[16:07:37] <n1> should go to the nexuses and not the main page most of the time
[16:07:23] <n1> i would say stuff like 'version x of y released' and other press release type stuff
[16:06:49] <LaminatorX> it might be worth an experiment once the bugs get shaken out of the update.
[16:06:22] <n1> i think it's all a double edged sword when it comes to encouraging submissions
[16:06:08] <n1> wouldnt like to say really
[16:04:25] <LaminatorX> I wonder how far the keep-the-queue-low approach would keep driving submissions. If we were to pace out stories to main at roughly 90-minute intervals, only going as far as the current day, and shunt the excess to the topic nexuses, would the subs keep coming?
[16:03:17] <n1> as you said, the priorities are at odds sometimes
[16:02:59] <n1> but a good story doesn't always generate lots of discussion
[16:02:50] <n1> a good story can be ruined by a bad summary and/or misleading headline
[16:02:06] <n1> but i really do not appreciate that kind of shit
[16:02:00] <n1> as ive mentioned before, ive removed clickbait headlines before, and im sure that has meant less comments overall
[16:01:53] <LaminatorX> (Though again, if the story submission volume continues to hover in the just-enough neighborhood this is all just noise.)
[16:01:02] <n1> agree
[16:00:32] <LaminatorX> True, there's a balance to be struck by shaping the information flow in a usefulle informative way and also in a pleasing to the reader way. Those priorities are sometimes at odds, even before you get into the diversity of tastes among the community.
[15:57:50] <n1> news is not a popularity contest
[15:56:49] <LaminatorX> It also is unlikely to be the case that interest in all nexus topics is equal. Some are more popular than others.
[15:55:55] <n1> lol
[15:55:48] <takyon> if it doesn't we cry ourselves to sleep
[15:55:40] <n1> aye x2
[15:55:31] <takyon> nexus feature should increase story volume and userbase
[15:55:02] <LaminatorX> That sort of implies that we have anough story volume to be choosey.
[15:54:52] <n1> i'd assume most of us here are more interested in the stuff that hasnt hit the RSS yet
[15:54:43] <LaminatorX> One thing I can see is moderating a glut of stories on the same topic in the main feed by shunting excess to topic-nexus-only.
[15:54:29] <takyon> it's faster for me since I have 20 other feeds in a single menu
[15:53:41] <LaminatorX> Same here.
[15:52:52] <n1> i dont use the rss as i spend most of the time looking at the stories queue anyway
[15:49:24] <takyon> mine gives me malformed URLs
[15:49:17] <takyon> is the RSS feed broken for you lot
[15:48:18] <LaminatorX> I can see someone wanting to just monitor "Breaking" via RSS, while checking in the main page once or twice a day.
[15:47:29] * n1 knows nothing about the current implementation of nexuses
[15:47:22] <takyon> if we just posted breaking stories every 20 minutes, hypothetically
[15:47:02] <takyon> is the advantage of separating Breaking from Main so that users can filter it out?
[15:46:50] <takyon> before even that, how do we anticipate how "Breaking" will be used?
[15:45:51] <LaminatorX> So, now that we have nexuses (nexi?) working, what thoughts do we have as to what makes for a story that wouldn't go on the main page?
[15:42:43] <n1> it made me very happy to see in my absence it wasn't all left to janrinok, Bytram and our dear leader LaminatorX
[15:41:54] <cmn32480> but we were glad when you came back n1
[15:41:12] <cmn32480> yes, yes we are
[15:40:50] <n1> you're lucky i wasnt around ;)
[15:39:35] <cmn32480> we are grateful for their guidance as well. janrinok and mrcoolbp have been a tremendous help in getting us going
[15:38:47] <cmn32480> doing what I can. We all throw in as we are able. You've been tossing a few in the queue as you have been available as well we've seen
[15:38:22] <LaminatorX> I'm double grateful for the more experienced hands for getting the new blood up and running in my absence.
[15:37:15] <takyon> http://puu.sh
[15:37:14] <LaminatorX> Thanks for pitching in, I've appreciated your contributions.
[15:36:52] <LaminatorX> You too.
[15:36:44] <cmn32480> and very nice to meet you LaminatorX
[15:36:11] <n1> i'm a pessimist, but poutine is mostly just a dick
[15:35:47] <n1> i assume cmn32480 is right
[15:35:24] <cmn32480> last night he was being a dick just to be a dick. we were all having a bit of fun and he came in and ruined all of our good time
[15:34:46] <LaminatorX> Where he (and many pessimists) misses the mark is failing to acknowledge that the problems they point out may in fact be solvable.
[15:34:28] <n1> so he's wrong about the biggest things
[15:34:26] <takyon> check out this incredibly useful macro: http://puu.sh
[15:34:22] <n1> well, we're still going and have paid the bills
[15:33:57] <LaminatorX> I suppose that's true of most pessimists.
[15:33:55] janrinok is now known as janrinok|afk
[15:33:44] <janrinok> got to go and do some cooking! laters guys.
[15:33:36] <LaminatorX> I noticed him sign in, and then be still. He's a pain, but he's also often right about things.
[15:32:46] <cmn32480> we are pretty sure it was the real thing
[15:32:36] <cmn32480> n1: been good. busy as hell w/ work
[15:32:34] <janrinok> not sure if he is the real thing, but if he was being a pita then it sounds likely!
[15:32:16] <cmn32480> wish he'd be quite for a few more
[15:32:08] <janrinok> he's been quiet for a few months.
[15:32:00] <n1> how i havn't missed that...
[15:31:49] <cmn32480> he was being quite the pita
[15:31:47] <janrinok> last night?
[15:31:36] <takyon> last night was suffering
[15:31:25] <cmn32480> last night janrinok
[15:31:13] <n1> hows things for you?
[15:31:12] <janrinok> --poutine has just joined #soylent - long time since I've seen him on here
[15:31:07] <n1> life is alright, back from living in a field, for a couple weeks
[15:30:44] <cmn32480> pardon if I don't read the back scroll
[15:30:36] <cmn32480> heya n1... how's life
[15:30:27] <n1> hey there cmn32480
[15:30:25] <LaminatorX> Nice to see we got the funding through July sorted by June, yes.
[15:30:07] <cmn32480> ok kids.. I am back. yeesh what a morning
[15:29:22] <takyon> I have had some success with extracting a "tag" (or topic) from a story using a set of keywords for each tag
[15:29:00] <takyon> however
[15:28:59] <takyon> if you're talking about summly, I haven't attempted something like that
[15:28:48] <n1> but when it comes to business/technomics and such, thats where i can do my best work, i think
[15:28:08] <janrinok> we are getting there...
[15:28:02] <n1> i'm not a coder, nor am i a scientist
[15:27:47] <n1> which is pretty much what i said when i first joined the team
[15:27:45] <janrinok> takyon: how much success are you having on parsing stories from links. I've got a similar project but still getting too much rubbish for it to be considered good enough for real use.
[15:26:23] <janrinok> n1: that is the idea.
[15:26:16] <n1> i did see that, was a very pleasant surprise
[15:25:59] <n1> if we have the nexuses up and working, then we might find people will be more interesting in editing, if they can focus on the areas they know about
[15:25:58] <janrinok> n1: LaminatorX: I don't know if you noticed but we hit our funding target yesterday. One very generous sub of $1000 but we will not discuss who it was on this chan
[15:24:29] <janrinok> yep, exciting but challenging stuff
[15:24:26] <n1> but i think we cant have one without the other either
[15:24:14] <n1> indeed, LaminatorX
[15:24:06] <LaminatorX> Things would have to be very different for us to have that kind of volume/staffing relationship.
[15:23:59] <n1> it would be better in some ways, editors can focus on the topics they are more aware of
[15:23:57] <takyon> the plan is that weaker editers, like nexus owners, will only have powers within a specific nexus scope
[15:23:57] <janrinok> I don't think anyone has thought it through to a conclusion there, but it is a possibility
[15:23:21] <janrinok> I think paulej72 mentioned this morning that some editors might only have permissions for some nexuses. It is not practical yet, but we might find some eds are happier concentrating on specific nexuses.
[15:22:31] <n1> rather than trying to fit in whatever niche they believe the site fills
[15:22:18] <n1> just because we cant have a big discussion on a story doesnt mean it's not worth people seeing, and i'd think it would make people more inclined to post things of varied topics
[15:21:35] <n1> but people might be more inclined to submit stories of passing interest
[15:21:33] <janrinok> I'm working on a program that skims rss-bot and I am now trying to parse the stories out of the links. A sort of automatic story writer - but some way to go yet
[15:21:22] <n1> will take some time to have an effect, if any
[15:20:48] <janrinok> well, if current submission rates are anything to go by, I would guess not
[15:20:26] <LaminatorX> It will be interesting to see if we get enough content to fill them meaningfully.
[15:20:05] <janrinok> I put a warning out on here a few hours ago. If you edit a story with a nexus other than Main Page, when you save the story the list will only contain other stories with the same nexus. It does not default to the full story list again. This is a bit of a bind when 2nd ed'ing. You have to return to the front page and request the story list page from there to get the full list again.
[15:19:49] <n1> nexuses should make 'doesn't belong on this site' arguments irrelevant
[15:18:49] <n1> diversity is what i see from the nexuses
[15:18:47] <LaminatorX> They will be valuable to people who only want tech news.
[15:17:44] <janrinok> well it never disappears nowadays. But I would hold on a while to see what effect the nexuses have. Many are not sure what their value will be.
[15:17:43] <n1> but if people are basing it off the queue, then the nagger is mostly irrelevant
[15:17:19] <n1> there's good and bad to it
[15:17:05] <n1> maybe we should get rid of the nagger
[15:16:52] <LaminatorX> The nagger, while effective, promotes a only-what-is-minimally-necessary approach to submitting.
[15:16:36] <janrinok> but we have a relatively small number of regular contributors. If you recall in the early days we would get concerned when the list nagger appeared, now we frequently only have a handfull of stories, usually from the same old names.
[15:14:48] <n1> i dont get that, but whatever, if thats what people do
[15:14:40] <LaminatorX> Seems reasonable.
[15:14:12] <janrinok> More than 4 or 5 subs in the queue and they slow down their efforts
[15:13:40] <janrinok> LaminatorX: another change is that we are keeping the submission list low and posting stories well in advance. The smaller submission list encourages more subs, even though they can see that the next 12 hours is fully taken care of
[15:13:28] <n1> and it's there for everyone to see
[15:13:23] <n1> i think it's worked quite well so far, if a submitter has a problem, they comment on the story and we can make our case, or admit a mistake
[15:12:21] <n1> without making it more convoluted
[15:12:15] <n1> but it's hard to keep things on-topic and getting enough subs as it is
[15:12:05] <n1> i like the intent behind a lot of these ideas
[15:11:52] <janrinok> we can also ask that it be re-written, links updated or whatever
[15:11:36] <janrinok> it keeps it simple and can largely be automated. When we reject, we simply say why
[15:11:08] <LaminatorX> I like the "Rejected queue" idea.
[15:10:53] <janrinok> I think you mis-spelled IRC, but I'm not 2 shure
[15:10:32] <LaminatorX> IRC is stream of conshusnus.
[15:10:07] <janrinok> ...and I must learn to spell/type, looking back over the last few lines!
[15:09:31] <janrinok> It gets around the spam emails / having to build a messaging system from scratch debates
[15:08:43] <janrinok> and we definately need some way of providing feedback to the submitters. One suggestion is an additional web page, showing subs followed by a text box which we can put messages in. If they want it it is there for them, if they don't they can ignore it
[15:08:29] <LaminatorX> It's a tricky balance to flense away the gratuitous flamebait while still allowing submittors to make a stAtement about the story., but it remains a worthwhile task, IMO.
[15:07:24] <janrinok> I've got to be a bit more careful on attribution, but it was a genuine mistake and I have apologised for it. Lesson learned there
[15:06:24] <janrinok> out*
[15:06:20] <janrinok> I think the silent majority have always supported that, but it wasn't until jugg's story that they spoke our
[15:05:44] <janrinok> If that means removing bias, inaccuracies or inflamatory comments then so be it
[15:05:02] <janrinok> I believe and have said that my job is to turn an unacceptable submission into an acceptable story
[15:05:02] <n1> i think that 'some' is very much in the minority
[15:04:41] <LaminatorX> A bot could do that.
[15:04:29] <janrinok> Some have the view that an editor should only correct spelling mistakes, check links work etc
[15:04:21] <n1> as it's not always appropriate
[15:04:17] <n1> and yeah, varying the 'x writes:'
[15:03:55] <n1> apart from one user and 1 AC that seems intent on sabotaging the site, no one else had a problem with what we're doing
[15:03:48] <janrinok> I think we have agreed on 'NICKNAME suggest the following story' or something similar to avoid it having to be their own words or nothing
[15:03:35] <n1> but otherwise, from everything i saw
[15:03:28] <n1> including a link to the original submission is a good/the right thing to do
[15:03:03] <janrinok> Well, a few format changes.
[15:02:28] <LaminatorX> Alright, I'm through the trouble threads. What were your takeaways from the ordeal?
[15:00:29] <n1> aye
[15:00:10] <LaminatorX> I've been checking in in the morning and evening as usual, and it's been nice to not have to post half-a dozen stories before bed time.
[14:58:50] <n1> was a great relief to see the new guys doing well, have been out of it myself as work has been pulling me in varying directions and just havnt had the time or energy to contribute as much as i would like recently
[14:58:43] <janrinok> makes the job so much easier too
[14:58:27] <janrinok> LaminatorX: yep they are a good bunch and we all work together well
[14:57:36] <n1> LaminatorX, indeed
[14:57:18] <n1> and i actually drink tea less and less these days, cant go wrong with cool refeshing life saving water
[14:57:01] <LaminatorX> Nice to see that the new lads have been working out.
[14:56:17] <n1> dont drink coffee
[14:56:15] <n1> water
[14:55:58] <janrinok> that and coffee, eh?
[14:55:48] <n1> silence is golden for the first 2 hours of my day
[14:55:12] <janrinok> lol
[14:54:52] <n1> especially when people insist on talking to me
[14:54:35] <n1> i am not great with 8am starts though
[14:54:25] <n1> but all the work stuff went well, which was the important bit
[14:54:03] <n1> it was fine, nothing really amazing, but wasnt expecting it to be
[14:53:43] <janrinok> festival, I mean
[14:53:26] <janrinok> A good concert?
[14:52:44] <n1> is nice to feel clean though
[14:51:50] <n1> actually wasn't too bad this time, between being rained on and using the land rover to get around site, wasn't too sweaty
[14:51:00] <janrinok> I wasn't going to mention it earlier....
[14:50:44] <n1> and now i'm clean, ya'll shouldn't be able to smell me from the other side of the channel or pond.
[14:49:41] <janrinok> you see, you were not forgotten!
[14:49:17] <LaminatorX> How lovely of her.
[14:47:00] <janrinok> LaminatorX: S has just asked me to say 'Hello' to you from her
[14:42:58] <janrinok> we also have IP6 - not that it will affect me here in France - and a few other nice bits
[14:41:49] <janrinok> that is one of the bugs! paulej72 is fighting the good fight on #dev, NCommander has finally gone to get some sleep after another mammoth session during the upgrade
[14:41:07] <LaminatorX> I had a little trouble logging in. Seems to have calmed a bit though.
[14:40:46] <janrinok> we also have nexuses as of today - but the update has introduced a fair number of bugs which didn't show on dev
[14:40:19] <janrinok> we have had a software update. Now using rehash - Apache2 etc.
[14:39:06] <janrinok> A point I made several times - some accused us of putting our own spin on all of their subs
[14:38:32] <LaminatorX> What they're complaining about is nothing we havent been doing since day one.
[14:37:10] <janrinok> LaminatorX: to be honest, you were better off out of it. Unfortunately, at the time, both mrcoolbp and NCommander were away so I was trying to fight the fire alone, having caused the problem in the first place. Didn't give me much of an edge in the debate that followed.
[14:35:55] <janrinok> we cannot edit submissions, only the stories we make out of them, so any dubious links means the entire sub gets rejected now
[14:35:45] * LaminatorX looks over the story while lamenting his shamefully lacking engagement of late.
[14:35:30] <n1> im going to shower, back in 10
[14:35:17] <janrinok> but we do now link to the original submission below each story - although there are some potential risks with that.
[14:34:48] <janrinok> a minority felt that whatever they write should just go straight to the front page. Not going to happen!
[14:34:03] <janrinok> Some in the community 'discovered' that we edit submissions and felt that we shouldn't alter personal views , tone or thrust. I pointed out the submission shouldn't contain personal views, tone or thrust but should be an accurate unbiased view of the source material
[14:33:48] <n1> 'are SN editors overstepping the mark?' was the end of the situation as far as i thought
[14:32:59] <n1> after i thought we'd drawn a line under that situation with the previous weekends discussions
[14:32:57] <janrinok> I made an editorial error about 10 days ago. Admitted it, apologised, and moved on.
[14:32:41] <n1> which i only caught while i was away, which was frustrating
[14:32:26] <n1> LaminatorX, just referencing the story juggs put out about the editorial process
[14:32:24] <janrinok> Long story short?
[14:32:10] <LaminatorX> What's the current connundrum?
[14:31:28] <janrinok> sounds good to me!
[14:31:26] <n1> mistakes are made, we admit them and apologise when they happen, we shouldnt have to review every bit of the process every time an error happens.
[14:31:21] * LaminatorX inhales, then exhales.
[14:30:50] <janrinok> LaminatorX: finally got some space to breathe again?
[14:30:26] <n1> if we keep doing things like that, its going to damage the site and community, letting a very small minority have the loudest voice
[14:30:12] <janrinok> they didn't like the fact that we have to edit
[14:29:49] <janrinok> n1: agreed, some view it as their own mouthpiece site
[14:29:43] <n1> ahoy, LaminatorX
[14:29:40] <n1> the first mountain out of a molehill wasn't good enough, so another had to be constructed...
[14:29:35] <LaminatorX> Calming down a bit, finally.
[14:29:22] <janrinok> how's things with you stranger?
[14:29:21] <n1> which is why i was quite frustrated to see it come up yet again
[14:29:14] <n1> i felt it was dealt with conclusively previously
[14:29:11] <LaminatorX> Howdy.
[14:29:02] <janrinok> hi LaminatorX !
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[14:28:51] <janrinok> well, I was a bit close to taking a long break, but what I see as commonsense prevailled. I actually caused it, of course, so I couldn't just not be involved.
[14:28:05] <n1> my first impression was 'ah fuck this shit'
[14:27:49] <n1> i was a bit confused as to why that needed to be done after the previous 2 stories last weekend
[14:27:24] <n1> yeah, thats what i saw
[14:27:13] <janrinok> juggs put out a story to the community and the majority came back with a resounding vote of confidence so to speak
[14:26:33] <n1> and i cant say i was all that excited to see it..
[14:26:27] <n1> i did check the site while i was away, and saw the latest 'hang the editors' post
[14:26:04] <janrinok> a bit of a backlash regarding editing and how others perceive our role. I think the community has now spoken and the few dissenters are silenced for the time being. Minor format changes will achieve the change required
[14:24:04] <n1> :( sorry to hear that
[14:23:53] <janrinok> not a good week last week - but it looks like things are getting resolved
[14:23:00] <n1> everything good with you?
[14:22:48] <n1> im not even opening my work emails today, heh
[14:22:36] <janrinok> no rush, stories good until tomorrow, and it's more a case of finding the bugs
[14:22:30] <n1> yeah, everything was good thanks
[14:22:18] <n1> need a shower, for the first time in a week...
[14:22:09] <n1> not rushing to check the site just yet, only just got back
[14:22:07] <janrinok> you have a good week?
[14:21:58] <n1> howdy janrinok
[14:21:45] <janrinok> we are having a few site probs following an update. Expect the unexpected
[14:21:21] <janrinok> hi
[14:21:16] <janrinok> nick high
[14:21:12] <paulej72> I think I fixed the login bug. you will need to relogin
[14:19:37] <n1> g'day
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[14:06:23] <janrinok> guru meditation XID: 1486369671
[14:05:53] <janrinok> getting 500s, 503s for about 5 seconds
[14:04:46] <janrinok> 1702 and counting - Yipee. I'm going to get ever so tipsy on 2000!
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[12:27:31] <CoolHand> janrinok|afk: thanks for the heads up!
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[11:51:57] <janrinok> This is only obvious when editing a story that has a nexus other than Main Page / Skin == _none. Try editing one the the meta stories, updating it, and see the resulting display for a better idea of the problem
[11:40:44] <janrinok> NOTICE TO ALL EDITORS: When you second edit a story from the story list, it takes you to a different nexus. When you save the story, you remain in the new nexus and only see those stories that also exist in that nexus. You have to return to the front page and reselect the story list in order to get back to the full list
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