#editorial | Logs for 2015-10-07

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[00:48:10] <cmn32480> hullo!
[00:49:23] <cmn32480> bueller?
[00:49:44] <cmn32480> zz_janrinok, I am having tea in your honor sir!
[00:49:48] <cmn32480> tea++
[00:49:48] <Bender> karma - tea: 17
[00:50:22] <nick> tea++
[00:50:22] <Bender> karma - tea: 18
[00:50:31] <cmn32480> exactly!
[00:50:41] <cmn32480> I'll have a tea for you in a bit nick
[00:51:11] <cmn32480> one cup at a time, old chap
[00:53:01] <nick> how goes cmn32480
[00:53:04] <cmn32480> seconding your stuff atm
[00:53:14] <cmn32480> it goes good actually
[00:53:22] <cmn32480> for a nice change of pace
[00:53:42] <cmn32480> today was one of the most fun days at a custoemr site that I cna remember in many months
[00:54:05] <nick> good times :D
[00:55:01] <cmn32480> makes it a lot more fun when it is somethign you dont' do every day, and the customer is smart, thoguhtful, and has as much invested in the job being done right (mostly as it was his idea) as I do as the contractor wanting to sell him the prioduct that they are piloting
[00:55:22] <nick> been a long time since ive experienced anything resembling that, glad you had a nice day though
[00:55:30] <cmn32480> ME TOO
[00:55:50] <nick> there are a few clients like that, it is very refreshing to hear they still exist
[00:56:12] <cmn32480> today was the fisrt time in a year (?) or more. I was laughing adn having a good time as we were arguing over the right way to do it
[00:58:02] <nick> :)
[00:58:18] <cmn32480> it was rather strange...
[00:58:39] <cmn32480> i had honestly forgotten what it was like to have fun at work...
[00:59:20] <nick> yeah, forgot it was even possible to be honest
[00:59:36] <cmn32480> today was a good day. I can cross my fingers and hope that tomorrow is too
[00:59:53] <cmn32480> it was the first in a very long time :(
[01:00:31] <nick> even if you can just laugh to yourself, it's something
[01:00:50] <cmn32480> certainly somethign that I have forgotten how to do this year
[01:01:01] <cmn32480> sounds much like we are in the same boat
[01:03:06] <nick> yeah, last few years have been all over the place for me, different jobs and different places, trying to learn from it all
[01:03:24] <nick> but its not been positive as such
[01:03:58] <cmn32480> I know how you feel, I think
[01:04:23] <cmn32480> this year (and certainly a part of last year as well), have been pretty rotten
[01:07:28] <nick> i am trying to be positive about things but it seems to lead to a lot of time and resources invested before contracts are signed
[01:07:45] <cmn32480> aye.
[01:08:00] <cmn32480> it was a nicely done piece you wrote about the Windows VPS
[01:08:58] <nick> several existing clients scaling back is not making my smile at the moment.
[01:09:14] <cmn32480> ick. sorry to hear that
[01:09:44] <nick> thanks, i tried to be clear as possible, but some people have an opinion they want to share which isnt quite what i asked, to be expected though
[01:10:09] <cmn32480> silly question?
[01:10:25] <nick> i found it quite surprising there is very little in the way of comparison of different providers out there, reviews or general discussion.
[01:10:40] <cmn32480> thought about running a linux VPS, but runnign it as a hypervisor for an MS OS?
[01:10:48] <cmn32480> you have to manage it is the problem
[01:11:26] <nick> i need to keep things simple, we have too many internal systems
[01:11:31] <nick> because of multiple industries
[01:12:02] <nick> and some day i might have to explain to someone how it all works...
[01:12:23] <cmn32480> you already host this stuff in house, yes?
[01:12:53] <cmn32480> that measn you already have all the OS licensing.
[01:12:57] <nick> yeah, but the VPS is part of a general infrastructure change
[01:13:05] <cmn32480> ahhhh
[01:13:21] <cmn32480> consider a colo instead of a VPS?
[01:13:47] <nick> cost is too high for how little resources we need on it
[01:16:54] <cmn32480> nuts
[01:17:06] <cmn32480> thought I had a decent idea for a change
[01:17:35] <nick> the whole thing is a big wish list, but you have to start somewhere
[01:17:41] <nick> there are options
[01:19:14] <cmn32480> heh... frojack suggested the same tihgn I ddid
[01:20:48] <nick> i really hoped to avoid the 'migrate off windows' ideas
[01:21:08] <cmn32480> he suggested the host your windows inside a linux instance
[01:21:25] <nick> i wasnt talking about his suggestion specifically
[01:21:40] <nick> i have been considering that more since reading the comments though
[01:22:49] <cmn32480> I'd be glad to help on the wondows side if needed. Unfortunately, I'm pants at the linux siude of things
[01:22:58] <nick> hyperturtles comment is very good
[01:23:33] <nick> but not really useful for me, but deserves +5 for being generally informative
[01:23:56] <cmn32480> it sought to be now. I modded him up a few mintues ago
[01:24:22] <cmn32480> s/sought/ought/
[01:24:29] <nick> well from what i know, your work is similar to much of mine
[01:24:30] <cmn32480> stupid missing bots
[01:24:35] <nick> the industry uses windows more than anything
[01:24:39] <cmn32480> uh huh
[01:25:22] <nick> which is the whole point of why as much as i'd like to, not windows is not an option currently.
[01:25:45] <cmn32480> I know the feeling
[01:25:53] <cmn32480> and I am very much in the same boat
[01:26:05] <nick> i have mostly used linux as a hobby, only in the last couple of years has it entered into the work.
[01:26:48] <cmn32480> most of my linux experience is through VMWare as the hypervisor
[01:27:04] -!- sedctl [sedctl!~sedctl@0::1] has joined #editorial
[01:27:06] <cmn32480> I've started to play a bit when I have time... but I don't reall yhave a ton of spare time.
[01:27:21] <sedctl> D
[01:27:21] <nick> but i am making a general shift more towards linux for the servers and desktop/laptop etc
[01:27:24] <cmn32480> better late than never I suppose
[01:27:26] <sedctl> :D
[01:27:55] <cmn32480> s/d/p/ sedctl
[01:27:56] <nick> it's easier to get things done with the tools you know
[01:28:01] <cmn32480> I agree
[01:28:14] <cmn32480> and in the camera business, there isn't much linux
[01:29:02] <nick> in the embedded firmware there's plenty
[01:29:40] <cmn32480> yes.. it is a lot of the backend software for the recording etc. where I have found linux to be a touch lacking
[01:29:51] <cmn32480> but I don't ahve near your experience, so I can't be siure of that
[01:31:22] <nick> it seems to be a real mix, in general the systems that have a windows client software or server are more advanced for the user, but everything else is linux based
[01:32:34] <nick> but there's very little in the customisation or compiling things yourself
[01:38:29] <cmn32480> I wish I had a good answer for you
[01:42:23] <nick> there are no good answers, just less bad ones when it comes to this stuff.
[01:42:45] <cmn32480> sadly... you are 100% correct
[01:42:51] <cmn32480> this tea's for you
[01:42:55] <cmn32480> tea++
[01:42:55] <Bender> karma - tea: 19
[01:43:07] <nick> tea++
[01:43:07] <Bender> karma - tea: 20
[01:43:12] <nick> cmn32480++
[01:43:12] <Bender> karma - cmn32480: 16
[01:43:31] <cmn32480> don't get too excited.. Ii'm in a hotel.. and it is k-Cup tea
[01:44:54] <nick> lol
[01:47:30] <nick> im going to have some hot chocolate now actually
[01:47:41] <cmn32480> good
[01:47:49] <cmn32480> hot cocoa is good for the soul
[01:47:58] <cmn32480> I don't know why.. but my Mom told me that once
[01:48:01] -!- Subsentient [Subsentient!~WhiteRat@Soylent/Staff/Editor/Subsentient] has joined #editorial
[01:48:01] -!- mode/#editorial [+v Subsentient] by SkyNet
[01:48:12] <cmn32480> as she made herself and me a cup of tea
[01:48:33] -!- aqu4 [aqu4!~aqu4bot@universe2.us/ircbot/aqu4] has joined #editorial
[01:48:37] <nick> if your mom told you, it must be true
[01:49:33] <cmn32480> with my mom, it likely woudl be
[01:50:25] <cmn32480> or at minimum, she believed it
[01:51:10] <nick> i'd say it is true, it feels so
[01:51:28] <cmn32480> it certainly calms the soul
[01:52:55] <cmn32480> shoudl I jsut deletee a dup?
[01:53:13] <nick> whats the dupe
[01:53:22] <cmn32480> Android marshmallow
[01:53:29] <cmn32480> same article from Ars
[01:53:37] <cmn32480> https://soylentnews.org
[01:53:38] <systemd> ^ 03SN article: What's in Android 6 (Marshmallow)? Twelve Pages of Changes 04(10 comments)
[01:53:44] <nick> yeah
[01:53:48] <cmn32480> https://soylentnews.org
[01:53:49] <systemd> ^ 03SN Submission by Phoenix666: Android 6.0 Marshmallow, Thoroughly Reviewed
[01:54:16] <cmn32480> schwifty got a new old name
[01:55:00] <nick> ?
[01:55:30] <cmn32480> schwifty was the name of Monopoly-bot that handles the URL's in the channels
[01:55:39] <cmn32480> currently, said bot is named systemd
[01:56:20] <cmn32480> HOLY SHIT
[01:56:21] <nick> i think i missed or was oblivious to the time it was called schwifty
[01:56:27] <cmn32480> 2 subs from Ethanol-Fueled
[01:56:44] <nick> but if it was a rick and morty reference, ++ to whoever did that.
[01:56:59] <cmn32480> i believe it was, and i think chromas
[01:57:20] <cmn32480> and they look like GOOD subs... I might fall over
[01:58:29] * Deucalion props cmn32480 up...... gonna be OK buddy
[01:58:56] <nick> he makes good submissions sometimes, more often than not in my experience
[01:59:02] <cmn32480> thanks Deucalion.. I'm jsut a touch woozy
[01:59:09] <nick> but most people only make good submissions...
[01:59:39] <cmn32480> well written, thoguhtful, and far from the personal he puts out on IRC and in many fo the commetns
[02:00:41] <Deucalion> An enigma!
[02:00:53] <nick> thats the intention i believe
[02:01:10] <Deucalion> All part of the troll :)
[02:01:12] <cmn32480> both more than worthy of the front page
[02:01:33] <cmn32480> if nothign else, he is certainly not a dullard
[02:01:41] <nick> Deucalion: if all trolls were of the e-f standard, the world would be a better place.
[02:02:14] <nick> and some of the trolling comments he makes are still quite terrible at times.
[02:03:58] <nick> there are plenty of people who comment on the site that i do not agree with the conclusions, but still find their comments interesting or insightful.
[02:04:35] <cmn32480> see nick.. there is your issue. can't be having an open mind
[02:04:43] <cmn32480> off to re-education camp wiht you
[02:05:03] <Deucalion> I can be unimaginative at times for sure. Something, Something, JEWS! That's not really a troll. His troll work is inconsistent in quality is what I think we are suggesting no?
[02:05:20] <Deucalion> s/I/It/
[02:05:37] <Deucalion> blech - I meant EF's trolling
[02:06:00] <nick> all your comments about jews do get quite tiresome ;)
[02:06:09] <cmn32480> I woudl agree... it can be inconsistant. and fotn times blatantly racist in flamebaity
[02:06:38] <cmn32480> but, he does have the occassional jewel that pops out and keeps us guessing
[02:06:40] * Deucalion whacks nick on the head with a casual sledgehammer.... twas a typo, I am not EF :P
[02:06:42] <nick> that stuff severely brings down the average
[02:06:53] <nick> but because of that some will turn off to the interesting stuff he does post
[02:07:48] <nick> yeah, thats what you want us to think...
[02:08:08] <cmn32480> bloody helll... I forgot to hit save!
[02:08:32] * Deucalion decides to leave.... we really shouldn't be having discussions about the quality of trolling on the site. That seems so wrong.
[02:08:33] <cmn32480> show of hands... who believes Deucalion when he says he isn't EF?
[02:08:41] <cmn32480> <crickets>
[02:08:41] * Deucalion shows hand
[02:08:48] <cmn32480> <crickets>
[02:08:51] <cmn32480> <crickets>
[02:09:05] <cmn32480> i disagree Deucalion.
[02:09:17] <cmn32480> the trolls are part of the fabric of the community
[02:09:28] <chromas> We want to have the highest quality trolls around
[02:09:47] <cmn32480> they are part of what makes us special
[02:10:01] <cmn32480> we have very few complete d-bag trolls.
[02:10:56] * Deucalion powders his dick extenders.... shot no, no I don't not in public. AHA! I have it... I AM Ethanol-Fueled! Deny that you contrary bastards!
[02:11:30] <cmn32480> you have to lube the extenders
[02:12:15] <cmn32480> otherwise they get bound up like a sausage in a garden hose.
[02:13:28] <chromas> too bad Bender doesn't grab actions
[02:13:41] <Deucalion> I sneakily said I would join staff under an alter-ego at some point in the future ~perhaps~ - psyche! I time travelled! :D Or did I...... is juggs / Deucalion really EF? Tune in to find out next time folks.
[02:13:48] <nick> does need to be kept on record
[02:14:12] <cmn32480> sorry...
[02:14:31] <cmn32480> who does the quote grabbing?
[02:14:37] <cmn32480> I thought it was bender
[02:14:51] <cmn32480> !grab Deucalion
[02:14:51] <Bender> Added quote 23
[02:14:58] <cmn32480> and it is!
[02:15:02] <chromas> it's Bender, but it ignores actions when grabbing
[02:15:17] <cmn32480> ahhhh
[02:15:24] <cmn32480> i learned somethign new... do I get to go home?
[02:15:51] <Deucalion> yup
[02:16:10] <cmn32480> sweet.... you gonna tell my custeorm I ain't gonna be back tomorrow?
[02:16:14] <chromas> sure, but we can't pay you for a full day's work
[02:16:28] <cmn32480> I tink I can take the hit on my editorial pay
[02:16:53] <Deucalion> I'll fly over and take care of your customer cmn32480 - don't you worry.
[02:17:02] <cmn32480> excellent!
[02:17:15] <cmn32480> we only pay for luggage class you know
[02:17:37] <Deucalion> That's fine... I am not alive anyway.
[02:18:01] <cmn32480> you must be. you are ethanol-fueled after all
[02:19:05] <Deucalion> or am I? muahahahaha!
[02:19:30] * cmn32480 pokes Deucalion like the Pilsbury Dough Boy......
[02:19:43] <cmn32480> yup... still warm. must be alive
[02:20:50] <cmn32480> though not quite fully baked
[02:20:51] <Deucalion> newp, I just contain a few suns in my upper digestive tract right now.... don't mean I'm alive you fool!
[02:25:54] <cmn32480> damnit
[02:26:03] <cmn32480> third time in two days I've posted an article twice
[02:27:19] <cmn32480> I gotta learn I am on a slow as shit hotel connection
[02:28:59] <Deucalion> Aren't you always?
[02:29:11] <cmn32480> i dind't say I learned fast
[02:29:18] <cmn32480> and yes... this year it seems that way
[02:30:16] * Deucalion gifts cmn32480 with Eagles - Desperado..... can't be out checking them fences the whole time.
[02:30:37] <cmn32480> thanks.
[02:30:48] <cmn32480> this year I am just past 60 nights on the road
[02:33:01] Bytram|away is now known as Bytram
[02:33:18] <Deucalion> That's not so bad given it is October already.
[02:33:34] <cmn32480> I dind't get my first night until March
[02:33:56] <cmn32480> so in the last 6 months, I have literally spent 1/3 of them on the road
[02:34:33] <Bytram> cmn32480: !!
[02:34:36] <Bytram> nick: !!
[02:34:42] <Bytram> Deucalion: !!
[02:34:45] <Bytram> chromas: !!
[02:34:49] <Bytram> hi everyone!
[02:34:57] <nick> Bytram !!
[02:35:05] <Bytram> how's htings?
[02:35:08] <nick> how are you good sir?
[02:35:11] <cmn32480> bytram !!
[02:35:14] <Bytram> better than my spelling, I hope!
[02:35:18] <Deucalion> Bytram, you seem a little exuberant this evening.
[02:35:36] <Bytram> just getting it out of my system, I guess!
[02:35:50] <cmn32480> shhhh... don't ruin it by telling him he is in charge of the Perl 6 rewrite for Rehash
[02:36:04] <Bytram> Ima actually pretty tired, but had a productive day at work, just finished eating dinner, and winding things down for the evening.
[02:36:20] <Bytram> oh, and I also have the next two days off -- very much looking forward to that!
[02:36:36] <Bytram> cmn32480: I already saw; nice try, kemosabe.
[02:36:49] <cmn32480> oh well
[02:37:01] <cmn32480> I tried
[02:37:12] <cmn32480> that rewrite better be done by the time you go back to work
[02:37:13] <Bytram> actually, I wouldn't mind bing in charge of it, as long as I did not have to do all the coding, too. :)
[02:37:21] <cmn32480> no personal hygene or eating until it is complete!
[02:38:21] <nick> g'night gentlemen
[02:38:27] * nick hat tip to all
[02:38:31] <cmn32480> pleasnat dreams nick
[02:38:42] <Bytram> nick: g'night! Good to see you, however briefly.
[02:38:49] <cmn32480> s/pleasnat/pleasant/
[02:38:49] <sedctl> <cmn32480> pleasant dreams nick
[02:39:17] <cmn32480> this tea is for you Deucalion
[02:39:19] <cmn32480> tea++
[02:39:20] <Bender> karma - tea: 21
[02:39:41] -!- nick has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[02:39:46] <Deucalion> why?
[02:39:51] <cmn32480> or ethanol-fueled or whatever your name is
[02:40:00] <cmn32480> you are the only brit left, AFAIK
[02:40:43] <cmn32480> in this channel I mean
[02:40:44] <Deucalion> Aha.... the seed of doubt is sown.....
[02:41:11] <cmn32480> sewn where? into a pocket?'
[02:41:28] <Bytram> yeah, sew what?
[02:41:54] <cmn32480> sew there!
[02:42:01] <cmn32480> I'm just needling you a bit
[02:42:11] <cmn32480> but I'm not sure where this thread is going
[02:42:20] <Deucalion> lol
[02:42:35] <cmn32480> think we can pin it on Bytram?
[02:42:39] <Bytram> GROAN!
[02:42:56] <cmn32480> sorry.. puns are in the fabric of my being
[02:43:10] * Bytram wonders how he can weave a bad pun into this conversation
[02:43:27] <cmn32480> we better button it up
[02:43:59] * Deucalion hides in the corner.... the wordsmiths are crackling again.....
[02:44:10] <cmn32480> I suppose we are just bobbin for ideas now
[02:44:28] <Bytram> yup. at this point, I'm starting to feel hemmed in.
[02:44:37] <cmn32480> rofl
[02:44:52] <Bytram> Wit, is intellect, dancing.
[02:44:52] <cmn32480> you sir, area stitch!
[02:45:13] <Bytram> we're just some dancing fools
[02:45:23] <cmn32480> well... fools anyway
[02:45:56] <Bytram> nod nod
[02:46:08] * Bytram goes in search of his pointy-toed slippers
[02:46:25] <cmn32480> i always enjoy those impromptu pun-runs
[02:47:16] <Bytram> same hear!
[02:47:39] <Bytram> some have been rather hare raising
[02:48:03] <cmn32480> that happens when the game is a foot
[02:48:18] <Bytram> though for the folliclely-challenged, like yours truly, it's more like hair razing
[02:48:29] <Bytram> just toeing the line, eh?
[02:48:42] <cmn32480> with a little luck
[02:49:27] * Bytram channels a song by paul mccrtney
[02:51:09] <Bytram> changing subjects, but I am constantly surprised by the community. There are times I put out a story and think 'this will get a lot of discussion' -- and -- *crickets*
[02:51:33] <cmn32480> and the opposite happens to
[02:51:34] <Bytram> and other times, I put out a story just to fill the time in the day and there's a veritable blizzard of comments.
[02:51:40] <Bytram> ninjad!
[02:51:47] <cmn32480> soetime, you never know
[02:51:58] <cmn32480> s/soetimes/sometimes/
[02:52:05] <Bytram> lately, it seems like I have not a clue!
[02:52:10] <cmn32480> s/soetime/sometimes/
[02:52:10] <sedctl> <cmn32480> sometimes, you never know
[02:52:22] <cmn32480> me neither
[02:52:40] <cmn32480> just keep filling the time and let them surprise us.... it is far more fun that way
[02:53:32] <cmn32480> on the upside.. the queue is currently +24 hoursw
[02:53:42] <Bytram> for us, definitely, but I like to surprise the community on occasion, too.
[02:53:46] <Bytram> yay!
[02:53:52] <Deucalion> We have a diverse community. Just roll with it.... as long as you're enjoying it :)
[02:53:59] <Bytram> which reminds me.... the poll is kinda stale...
[02:54:13] <Bytram> I had an idea for a new question; feedback appreciated.
[02:54:19] <cmn32480> hmmm>
[02:54:29] <cmn32480> who borke it?
[02:54:32] <cmn32480> bytram
[02:54:36] <cmn32480> bytram
[02:54:38] <cmn32480> bytram
[02:54:50] <cmn32480> somebody else (but helped by Bytram)
[02:54:58] <cmn32480> Cowboy Neal
[02:55:10] <Deucalion> woah there!
[02:55:22] <cmn32480> you are right.
[02:55:29] <cmn32480> pj and TMB shoudl be in there someplace
[02:56:06] <Bytram> if you could load an app on your phone to change your voice, which cartoon character would you choose? Yosemite Sam, Foghorn Leghorn, Bugs Bunny, Marvin the Martian, The Pink Panther, I'm a mute you insensitive clod, other - specify.
[02:56:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> wait, what's broke?
[02:56:35] <cmn32480> givr bytram a few minutes.. he jsut got here
[02:56:39] * Bytram is broke until the next paycheck. ;)
[02:56:41] <TheMightyBuzzard> oh, right then
[02:57:00] * cmn32480 is willing to lend his editorial paycheck to bytram
[02:57:02] <Bytram> TheMightyBuzzard: good to see you my friend. How's the fishing?
[02:57:04] <TheMightyBuzzard> in that case ima go to bed before he can break anything important
[02:57:05] <Deucalion> I vote for NC as the the new CN replacement.... oh aren't those initials strangely close.... /me invests in tin
[02:57:13] <Deucalion> :D
[02:57:23] <Bytram> at a generous rate of 100% interest, i assume?
[02:57:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> Bytram, took a day off in hopes i'll have enough freezer space by the time i go home.
[02:57:39] <cmn32480> nah.... i'M not that greedy
[02:57:51] <cmn32480> only 80%
[02:58:00] <Bytram> easy problem to solve... get a bigger freezer!
[02:58:04] <Bytram> deal!
[03:00:08] <Bytram> any thoughts on the poll idea? Suggestions for different cartoon characers?
[03:00:15] <Bytram> oh, Taz!
[03:01:35] * Deucalion breaks out of formation... this bird needs maintenance, have to tap out. Oh shit.... now I am going to tap out at the same time as TMB.... which makes me, TMB and EF all the same person by abstraction. I'm not sure TMB will like that, but maybe I can talk him down during our dozing off period.
[03:02:25] <Deucalion> So many voices in my head...
[03:02:34] * Deucalion checks out
[03:02:43] <cmn32480> night Deucalion
[03:18:00] <Bytram> night Deucalion
[03:21:40] Bytram is now known as Bytram|away
[03:21:54] <cmn32480> night Bytram|away
[03:22:07] <Bytram|away> cmn32480: and a very good night to you, as well!
[03:22:57] <Bytram|away> I stayed up too late last night, and have been dragging off and on throughout the day... need to get some sleep.
[03:23:12] <cmn32480> then go!
[03:23:20] <cmn32480> stop telling me why... just do it!
[03:24:08] <Bytram|away> If anyone has any further idea on the poll question I suggested above, please post them here and mention the word poll so I can search for it.
[03:24:13] <Bytram|away> this time for sure!
[03:24:32] <cmn32480> poll ish
[03:24:45] <cmn32480> poll itical
[03:24:51] <cmn32480> poll troon
[03:25:13] <cmn32480> foreign poll icy
[03:26:08] <cmn32480> poll tergeist
[03:27:41] <cmn32480> poll try
[03:29:08] <cmn32480> actually.. that should be poll tree
[10:42:25] <TheMightyBuzzard> poll cat
[10:47:23] -!- NCommander has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me]
[10:48:36] <cmn32480> poll dancer
[10:54:13] -!- NCommander [NCommander!~mcasadeva@tk151-39.members.linode.com] has joined #editorial
[10:55:11] NCommander is now known as SoyGuest76054
[11:10:22] cmn32480 is now known as cmn32480|travelin
[12:07:54] Bytram|away is now known as Bytram
[12:08:31] * Bytram is looking at the Bernie Sanders story: https://soylentnews.org
[12:08:32] <systemd> ^ 03- SoylentNews User ( https://soylentnews.org )
[12:42:35] <CoolHand> hello
[12:50:11] <Bytram> CoolHand: sry... was afk
[12:50:14] <Bytram> how's things?
[12:50:46] <Bytram> I've flagged the Bernie Sanders story (link just above) to not display. Please read my editor's note.
[12:51:19] <CoolHand> Bytram:
[12:51:40] <CoolHand> it was still showing as display for some reason, I 2nded your emotion, undisplayed it and pushed it back
[12:52:00] <Bytram> hmmm, maybe I didn't hit update?
[12:52:03] * Bytram goes to look.
[12:53:59] <CoolHand> that was my 2nd thought
[12:54:13] <CoolHand> (the first was that someone changed it back to display, but you had the last edit)
[12:55:17] <Bytram> thanks for following up, and for entering your view in the notes field.
[12:55:22] <Bytram> teamwork++
[12:55:22] <Bender> karma - teamwork: 32
[12:57:33] <CoolHand> yay teamwork :0
[12:57:35] <CoolHand> :)
[12:57:47] <CoolHand> I hate when it mis-type emoticons..
[12:57:53] <CoolHand> or it/I
[12:57:54] <CoolHand> haha
[13:02:10] <CoolHand> my fingers need more coffee for proper functioning...
[13:02:12] <CoolHand> coffee++
[13:02:12] <Bender> karma - coffee: 31
[13:04:35] <Bytram> yuppers
[13:07:56] zz_janrinok is now known as janrinok
[13:09:57] <Bytram> janrinok: !!
[13:10:09] <Bytram> how's things?
[13:11:53] <janrinok> good, and with you?
[13:12:16] <Bytram> pretty good!
[13:12:34] <janrinok> Bytram: CoolHand: thanks for your comments against the Sanders story - I'll kill it in a while
[13:12:38] <Bytram> had a good day at work yesterday and now have a couple days off *in a row*!
[13:12:46] <Bytram> so, you concur?
[13:12:58] <janrinok> Bytram: that is good news. Now don't go wasting them by spending all your time on here!
[13:13:00] <Bytram> for me, it's just opening pandora's box.
[13:13:13] <Bytram> this is no waist
[13:13:18] <janrinok> I wrote the first comment, (but forgot to initial it!)
[13:13:21] <Bytram> *waste ;)
[13:13:25] <Bytram> OH!
[13:13:34] * Bytram was wondering who that was!
[13:13:38] <janrinok> I thought that was an oblique reference to your size!
[13:13:53] <Bytram> not far off at all.
[13:14:30] <janrinok> My own view is that there are plenty of other sites reporting politics, and unless it impacts on STEM etc it shouldn't be our role to repeat it
[13:14:30] <Bytram> I have always been, ummm, thin... except for one time I was put on some meds that cranked up my appetite...
[13:15:02] <Bytram> I gained 10-15 lbs, and looked better, but it felt like I was carrying around a couple sacks of potatoes all day long and I just felt 'logey'
[13:15:16] <janrinok> I'm still slim but have put a few pounds on my middle since retiring!
[13:15:20] <Bytram> ostensibly, we are not a STEM-only site, but I share the viewpoint
[13:15:36] <janrinok> yep, I know, but you get my point
[13:15:56] <Bytram> now, if we had a nexus for politics, I might think otherwise, but as things now stand... unless there's something like a frontrunner all-of-a-sudden dropping out like, say, hillary...
[13:16:04] <Bytram> and even then, I'm of two minds
[13:16:11] <janrinok> but politics would need some other justification before it becomes print-worthy in my view. However, that is not policy
[13:17:20] <janrinok> I'm working on providing a web-based UI for Arthur - I've never worked with HTML, CSS or cgi and it is a big learning experience for me
[13:17:39] <janrinok> make that brower-based...
[13:17:46] <janrinok> browser!*
[13:19:18] <janrinok> so you are off to the cinema this afternoon - translation: movie-theatre
[13:46:17] <janrinok> Currently, all 18 submissions are from P666!
[13:46:55] <janrinok> it's getting difficult to publish different viewpoints! :)
[13:52:33] <Bytram> WOW! and, nod nod.
[13:52:54] * Bytram trolls the interewebs
[13:53:24] <Bytram> http://www.forbes.com
[13:53:24] <systemd> ^ 03Forbes Welcome ( http://www.forbes.com )
[13:53:32] <Bytram> urk.
[13:53:43] <Bytram> javascript required site :/
[13:55:49] <janrinok> I'm not a fan of JS either
[13:56:39] <janrinok> story queue topped up for a while :)
[13:56:54] <Bytram> nod nod
[13:57:03] <janrinok> we are currently running more than 24 hours in advance
[13:57:16] <janrinok> far less stressful imho
[13:57:29] <Bytram> btw, a heads up on P666 stories...
[13:57:41] <janrinok> in what way
[13:58:00] <Bytram> it looks like s/he does a dag-select across a bunch of text and pastes that in the submissions... tends to lose italics and HREFs
[13:58:07] <Bytram> s/dag/drag/
[13:58:07] <sedctl> <Bytram> it looks like s/he does a drag-select across a bunch of text and pastes that in the submissions... tends to lose italics and HREFs
[13:58:26] <janrinok> ah, OK, thx
[13:58:56] <Bytram> in the terrahertz story, e.g., in the original there is: "journal "<em>Nature Communications</em>"
[13:59:45] <Bytram> OTOH, physi.rg tends to insert links to 'explanatory' pages on their own site.
[14:00:02] <Bytram> e.g.:
[14:00:04] <janrinok> yes, Arthur strips those out automatically
[14:00:04] <Bytram> In the electromagnetic spectrum, <a href="http://phys.org/tags/terahertz+radiation/" rel="tag" class="textTag">terahertz radiation</a> lies between
[14:00:07] <systemd> ^ 03Phys.org - terahertz radiation
[14:00:44] <janrinok> any links inside a phys.org story originating from phys.org are binned by Arthur
[14:00:55] <Bytram> I generally view htose links as being, umm, gratuitous, and often remove them from stories we post or I submit.
[14:00:59] <Bytram> nodnod
[14:02:07] <janrinok> my problem with Arthur is that it is getting so good at collecting stories that I now need an effective way of managing the material. Hence, the browser UI ...
[14:02:34] <Bytram> browser UI? that's news to me!
[14:03:04] <janrinok> ^^^ that's what I was saying earlier when you went all quiet on me ... ;)
[14:03:30] <janrinok> I thought that you were sulking ...
[14:03:31] <Bytram> Again looking at the terahertz story, there is a link at the end of the pphys.org story to the journal article which P666 did not include.
[14:03:45] <Bytram> oh. had a phone call and cannot talk and tether at the same time. :/
[14:03:53] <janrinok> lol - np
[14:04:43] <Bytram> I'd not do that to you!
[14:04:43] <janrinok> As long as TFS stands on its own, our community can go read all the details from the original site if they wish
[14:05:55] <janrinok> I'm just throwing ideas around. They said 'a man cannot talk and be tethered' - Bytram proved them right!
[14:06:21] <Bytram> iz kinda hard to walk when one is tethered, too!
[14:06:41] <janrinok> I'm sure there is a movie in there somewhere ...
[14:07:36] <Bytram> nod nod
[14:08:25] * Bytram saves updates to THz story
[14:08:49] <janrinok> you mean the story that is already live?
[14:09:14] <Bytram> well, it's not a dead parrot!
[14:09:16] <Bytram> yes, it is.
[14:09:28] <janrinok> k
[14:10:04] <Bytram> if you've got a few minutes, was wondering what your thoughts were for an os other than Ubuntu mate...
[14:10:37] <janrinok> Linux Mint has a strong following, but are you trying to avoid Ubuntu for any particular reason?
[14:10:49] <Bytram> It's only after I D/Led it and launched it that I remembered how canonical was trying to, well, commercialize if by sendinbg all your desktop search stuff to their(?) servers, too.
[14:11:04] <Bytram> s/if/it/
[14:11:04] <sedctl> <Bytram> It's only after I D/Led it and launched it that I remembered how canonical was trying to, well, commercialize it by sendinbg all your desktop search stuff to their(?) servers, too.
[14:11:11] <janrinok> that is not included in MATE
[14:11:27] <Bytram> oh? nice!
[14:11:33] <janrinok> MATE doesn't use the same search software and it is one of the reasons that they don't!
[14:11:43] <Bytram> great!
[14:12:01] <janrinok> Ubuntu MATE 14.04 is supported until 2019 and is systemd free too
[14:12:28] <janrinok> by 2019, systemd will have either become ubiquitous or removed completely
[14:12:31] <Bytram> I'm a CLI guy at heart; it's a lot easier to script things that way; but I do appreciate a GUI for discoverability. OTOH, I don't need or want all the 'shiny' aero-type stuff, for example.
[14:13:01] <Bytram> simple, solid colors suffice for me; no need for animations, either, well except maybe for cursor animations
[14:13:05] <janrinok> but, for me, trying to manage 500+ stories is impossible from the command line
[14:13:12] <Bytram> hourglass, etc.
[14:13:21] <Bytram> good point
[14:13:29] <Bytram> pun intended!
[14:13:38] <janrinok> noted :)
[14:13:54] <Bytram> but story management is a constant one-off type thing and would not lend itself to scripting.
[14:13:57] <Bytram> right tool for the job.
[14:14:17] <Bytram> configuring software, otoh, give me a CLI any day.
[14:14:35] * Bytram waits for the obvious counterexample =)
[14:14:51] <janrinok> even canonical have made the Unity desktop more controllable by the user - you can disable the search data submissions and, unlike MS, they stay disabled
[14:15:26] * Bytram dons tinfoil hat
[14:15:37] <janrinok> I use the CLI a lot too, but I'm trying to write a program that will enable anyone to collect, edit and submit good stories to SN
[14:15:58] <Bytram> has that been verified with, say, wireshark/ Or is it just that their toggles all stay consistent while it still mines for user info?
[14:16:05] <Bytram> nice
[14:16:16] <janrinok> verified - linux users are a mistrustful lot, like that
[14:16:43] <Bytram> my dream would be to have a FF/PM addon that one could invoke when looking at a story and think to yourself, Hmmm, I should submit this.
[14:16:45] <Bytram> OR....
[14:17:11] <janrinok> MS are collecting info for various nefarious groups, Canonical were trying to make money. They risked losing too many of their community and saw commonsense
[14:17:16] <Bytram> load a 'meta' web page which reads from the log of the #rss-bot feed and allows selection and maniputlation/submission from there.
[14:17:26] <Bytram> so good to hear!
[14:18:12] <janrinok> the only searching that MATE does is whatever you do in your browser - and that is the same for any other OS too
[14:18:13] <Bytram> otoh, their stopping was not for altruistic reasons, so I'd very well suspect that they might try it again in the future under some different guise.
[14:18:18] <Bytram> k
[14:18:39] <Bytram> have you any experience with freebsd?
[14:19:26] <Bytram> for this particular use case, I'm looking for a small/lightweight VM that I can run git from.
[14:19:36] <Bytram> nature calls; biab
[14:19:40] <janrinok> Unity has 'Lenses' and various other automated tools, and it was they that were doing the submissions. That is part of the Desktop, and not part of the underlying OS. You can build MATE from the server version (which is minimal) and add only the bits that you want
[14:21:16] <janrinok> I use PC-BSD on one machine, and it works fine. There are several gotchas, inasmuch that I have masses of encrypted data backup. PC-BSD and Linux have 2 very good, but incompatible, full disk encryption tools.
[14:21:44] <janrinok> It made working between the two impossible.
[14:22:25] <janrinok> I could send stuff over the network no problem, but I couldn't plug in one of my (many) 1TB encrypted drives
[14:23:29] <janrinok> there are also several other relatively minor differences. Several CLI commands work slightly differently, making easy sharing of scripts harder than I would have liked.
[14:24:08] <janrinok> I have 8 machines, only 1 of which is PC-BSD. I'm not going to reconfigure the other 7 just to suit PC-BSD - which is built on FreeBSD
[14:25:22] <Bytram> back front and center!
[14:25:23] <Bytram> nod nod
[14:25:35] <janrinok> I don't know if that would have any affect on SN/Git code - I doubt it, but you really would want to be using the same, or at least compatible, OS as the one you are supporting
[14:25:45] <Bytram> 8 machines? /me boggles at the thought
[14:26:07] <janrinok> you might find that it passes the test on your machine but not on the SN servers or vice-versa
[14:26:18] <Bytram> ISTR we are running (some flavor of) ubuntu on the servers though there may still be a stray centos box, IIRC
[14:26:28] <Bytram> so, excellent point.
[14:26:33] <janrinok> Most of them are thrown away by others. I still have 2 x 32bit machines
[14:27:11] <janrinok> we update to latest ubuntu every 6 months or so, but not immediately that each update is released, - or I think that is what we do
[14:27:25] * Bytram looks around his room and see that he, too has 8 machines, but only 3 of which have been used in the past three months -- the others are all mothballed
[14:27:57] * Bytram looks at his 3 eMachines e400i boxes.
[14:28:13] <janrinok> I have a server which runs 24/7, S has her own machine, I have 2 main machines which I am on now.
[14:28:27] <Bytram> *e400i3 celerons at 400MHz, IIRC
[14:28:32] <Bytram> nod nod
[14:29:02] <Bytram> some are not good enough to use atm, but they are still too good to throw away!
[14:29:03] <Bytram> =)
[14:29:22] <janrinok> I have the PC-BSD for my own learning purposes, a machine in the guest's accommodation, and a couple that I use for experimenation so that I don't kill something important if I screw up!
[14:29:37] <Bytram> I *so* understand!
[14:30:00] <janrinok> I've done that a few times and decided I can risk an old machine but not my everyday boxes
[14:30:06] <Bytram> here's an idea for a story: how, if you have ONLY ONE MACHINE, do you test your backups?
[14:30:16] <Bytram> if the backup fails, you're SOL
[14:30:50] <janrinok> true. I've also got 2 x Raspberry Pi's, I am very impressed with them.
[14:30:56] <Bytram> but if you don't try it, and it fails, then you're even *more* SOL!
[14:31:19] <janrinok> First World Problems - heheh
[14:31:48] <Bytram> thanks to consistent practices that I employed when building up my old lappy, it was relatively easy to get things running on my new box, but I'd rather not have to go through all THAT again!
[14:32:24] <Bytram> and I lost out on things such as words I had added to Pale Moon's spell checker.
[14:32:46] <Bytram> basically, per-program customizations
[14:32:47] <janrinok> each machine (well most of them) are full disk encryption, and each has a drive copy as backup. If I have a problem, I actually switch disks
[14:32:59] <Bytram> desktops?
[14:33:30] <janrinok> yep, I have a very old lappy but even your old machine would make it look s l o w
[14:34:10] <Bytram> I've got a Dell Latitude, now, which are the Business-flavored version of their machines and known for serviceability, but I've not looked into what it would take to do a disk swap.
[14:34:17] <janrinok> never use a laptop, I tend to travel by vehicle and I have a desktop and major toolkit with me whenever I travel
[14:34:19] <Bytram> s/version/line/
[14:34:19] <sedctl> <Bytram> I've got a Dell Latitude, now, which are the Business-flavored line of their machines and known for serviceability, but I've not looked into what it would take to do a disk swap.
[14:34:57] <janrinok> Yes, I've been following your conversations on here :) They have a good reputation
[14:35:28] <Bytram> that's what I had heard... thanks for the confirmation!
[14:35:33] <Bytram> http://www.itworld.com
[14:35:35] <systemd> ^ 03Quarter of firms can't tell how hackers get in | ITworld ( http://www.itworld.com )
[14:35:55] <janrinok> it should last you a while but, like any technology, could go 'pfft' at any time
[14:36:00] * Bytram wonders how much of that is dependent on the *size* of the firms?
[14:36:06] <Bytram> yuppers
[14:36:07] <janrinok> and if the magic smoke escapes ....
[14:36:20] * Bytram has seen it -- bad news all around.
[14:36:55] <janrinok> I think I caught some magic smoke in a plastic bag, but when I looked several days later it couldn't be seen :)
[14:37:13] <Bytram> lol
[14:37:37] <Bytram> induced smoke emanations can be fun.
[14:38:12] * Bytram once hooked up a 3-fahrad 'can' to 120V mains power -- boom!
[14:38:18] <janrinok> Got news this morning that S has to go into hospital early Nov for a few weeks. Not sure whether that will give me more free time or less. She sends you a {{}}
[14:38:38] <Bytram> was from an OLD burroughs mainframe power supply
[14:38:48] <Bytram> and give her a BIG one for me, too!
[14:39:00] <Bytram> best wishes to her and to you!
[14:39:17] <janrinok> Yep, I've done that sort of thing. Lots of fun until 10 minutes afterwards when you realise what _could_ have happened...
[14:39:34] <Bytram> yup.
[14:40:03] <janrinok> brb
[14:40:09] * Bytram should really fire up the system rescue CD again and make a current image of his system.
[14:40:19] <Bytram> but, for now, I should get cleaned up and out about my day.
[14:40:34] <Bytram> thanks for the chat and sharing from your wealth of knowledge!
[14:40:37] <Bytram> laters.
[14:40:40] <Bytram> afk
[14:42:47] <janrinok> by Bytram, have a good one
[14:42:52] <janrinok> bye*
[15:11:36] Bytram is now known as Bytram|away
[15:28:38] -!- nick [nick!~nick@Soylent/Staff/Editor/n1] has joined #editorial
[15:28:38] -!- mode/#editorial [+v nick] by SkyNet
[16:38:30] <janrinok> nick: hi
[16:43:57] <nick> hey janrinok
[16:44:00] <nick> how goes?
[16:44:12] <janrinok> not bad, yourself?
[16:46:55] <nick> blah, not feeling super fantastic today
[16:47:00] <nick> but ok i guess
[17:01:36] <nick> slightly frustrated by the various 'stop using windows' comments on my ask soylent
[17:37:51] <janrinok> not terribly helpful comments
[17:38:30] <janrinok> although some I thought were very good advice
[17:46:07] <janrinok> nick: Regarding your Answers, what load do you place on your in-house Windows Server? Is it struggling to keep up with the demand or sat twiddling its figurative thumbs for most of the time?
[17:58:14] <nick> its twiddling its thumbs mostly, but its the unreliable internet connections, among other things means its no really reliable off-site
[17:58:56] <nick> there were good comments, ones that might be useful to someone in the future doing some research
[18:00:28] <janrinok> it occurs to me that you might be better off investing in a good connection, and buying a stand-by power supply (one-off cost) and, if necessary, some tech help to set it up (also a 1-off cost)
[18:00:31] <nick> another element is my business partner does not like the idea of the office LAN being connectable from outside the network
[18:00:39] <nick> nearly all of that is bullshit that ive tried to explain
[18:00:40] <janrinok> ah. there is the problem
[18:00:48] <nick> but it's his default paranoia
[18:01:02] <nick> but in the end, we do need an off-site windows server
[18:01:15] <nick> not for much, but we need the flexibility with it
[18:01:29] <janrinok> which will be connectable from the network :)
[18:01:33] <nick> yeah
[18:01:39] <nick> but i wont go there
[18:01:44] <nick> i tried to explain how it's no different
[18:01:50] <janrinok> but I understand your position better now
[18:01:54] <nick> but he feels better about it
[18:02:50] <janrinok> is the db that you need to access remotely just for read-only, or do you need to update it from outside connections too?
[18:02:51] <nick> he's a non-techie techie
[18:03:40] <janrinok> I'm sure he has his strengths, otherwise you wouldn't be working together
[18:03:51] <nick> read-only 99% of the time but it's mostly about flexibility
[18:04:47] <janrinok> because you could have a stand-alone for remote access, that you update say once a day manually, and that would protect your network
[18:04:58] <nick> as i explained to cmn32480 yesterday, it's more a general infrastructure shift to deal with new projects and parts of the business
[18:05:15] <janrinok> understood. I'm just trying to think of alternatives
[18:06:32] <nick> i'm pretty sure there's no other route that will really work, currently in the big picture, we have 2 linux VPS and the in-house widows server
[18:06:42] <janrinok> I run my own server here, and access it using dyndns when I am away from home. The normal household router provides the first level of protection and a linux machine running windows in a VMS the second. Touch wood - so far had no successful attacks
[18:06:54] <nick> by the end of this, we will have 4 or 5 linux vps, the in house server, an off-site remote backup and a windows vps
[18:07:12] <janrinok> they bounce of the household router in all but 1 case and the linux box stopped that one dead
[18:07:33] <janrinok> not much I can offer in the way of helpful advice then
[18:07:39] <nick> currently i access the in-house through a VPN
[18:08:27] <nick> essentially not much is going to change, except the in-house server will be a client server rather than a hub, if you know what i mean
[18:09:08] <nick> nothing about the situation is perfect, i'm trying to keep the business partner happy whilst also making it worthwhile generally
[18:09:22] <janrinok> understood
[18:10:13] <nick> i appreciate your thoughts on it, my hope was more for first-hand experience of providers, rather than new solutions.
[18:10:27] <nick> but i appreciate that was asking a lot from a community with people who like to come up with new solutions :D#
[18:10:29] <nick> -#
[18:11:06] <janrinok> I can't think of any other alternatives at the moment
[18:11:35] <nick> it gave me a few things to think about, and pointed me in the direction of some other providers
[18:11:45] <nick> so overall, it worked
[18:12:14] <janrinok> but I still get the feeling you were rather hoping for something more?
[18:13:26] <nick> i was hoping for more "i had a vps with x, they sucked because z" "i had a vps with y, they are great because z"
[18:13:42] <nick> 'stay away from x' at all costs
[18:13:53] <janrinok> understood
[18:16:03] <nick> but im guessing also, most people dont have direct experience in that way
[18:16:22] <nick> deal with whatever the employer gives them, dont know specifics on the providers often
[18:16:42] <janrinok> which is not too surprising I suppose
[18:17:03] <nick> and those who do it all, are the 'stop using windows' crowd
[18:17:59] <janrinok> well, I can see their point too, but if you have to run Windows then you are stuck with it.
[18:18:43] <janrinok> incidentally, roughly how much do you pay for your VPN?
[18:19:36] <nick> cmn did a good reply to a comment explaining that for certain industries not being on windows just isnt an option
[18:19:48] <janrinok> yes, I read that
[18:19:49] <nick> the linux ones are £10+VAT/month
[18:20:59] <nick> if youre looking for a linux vps, as i say in my question, i'm looking at migrating to linode or gandi
[18:21:03] <nick> probably linode
[18:21:13] <nick> i think it will be slightly cheaper
[18:21:48] <janrinok> no, I don't need a vps - my server is quite happy running on a P4!
[18:22:15] <nick> lol
[18:22:30] <nick> i didnt expect you to, but you never know :p
[18:23:05] <janrinok> it's mainly got reference material and specific software packages - some of which I have written myself - so that I can fix problems in other people's computers
[18:23:40] <janrinok> if their computer is dead, as long as they have a working ISP connection, I can get started
[18:23:58] <janrinok> I carry my own desktop and spares etc
[18:28:16] -!- nick has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
[18:57:16] <janrinok> gtg - see you guys tomorrow
[18:57:51] janrinok is now known as zz_janrinok
[19:02:24] -!- nick [nick!~nick@Soylent/Staff/Editor/n1] has joined #editorial
[19:02:24] -!- mode/#editorial [+v nick] by SkyNet
[19:03:15] <nick> it would be nice if the AC who submitted the evernote story decides contributes more
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