#editorial | Logs for 2014-04-10

« return
[00:09:09] -!- Tachyon has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[02:12:16] -!- Tachyon [Tachyon!Tachyon@hollhb.kolej.mff.cuni.cz] has joined #editorial
[02:13:07] MrBluze|afk is now known as MrBluze
[02:42:15] -!- Bytram|away [Bytram|away!~pc@Soylent/Staff/Developer/martyb] has joined #editorial
[02:55:20] Bytram|away is now known as Bytram
[03:23:32] MrBluze is now known as MrBluze|afk
[03:49:45] <Bytram> If there's an editor here, there's an extra "that" in "on supermarket shelves as adult cereals, and that that" in the story: "Cereal Box Psychology": http://soylentnews.org
[03:50:16] <n1> thanks Bytram
[03:50:18] <n1> will fix
[03:51:03] <Bytram> n1: thanks! I sent an e-mail to LaminatorX to ask if i could have editorial privs so that I could do this myself instead of pesterin you guys.
[03:52:07] <n1> its fixed now, whenever the database catches up
[03:52:29] <n1> the more eyes the better really
[03:53:54] <n1> read things too many times and my mind at least likes to skip over things like that
[03:54:21] <Bytram> Agreed. I worked in QA for a couple decades, so I can't not see these things -- on my first read through. then it starts to turn to mush. =)
[03:56:03] <n1> just having a second set of eyes often helps with errors like that, sometimes it hurts though when it comes to changing wordings though
[03:57:04] <n1> spent way too long on advertising material where i had someone far more qualified than me doing the proof reading, you'd think getting about one page worth of text wouldn't be that difficult
[03:57:05] <Bytram> lol, I think I know what you mean. individual's "styles" and preferences can clash. Much like coding styles and where to put the matching curly braces!
[03:57:32] <n1> when you have someone who knows english 'properly' and has done qualifications in proof reading, you just cant win
[03:57:52] <n1> any one change then requires another 6 to keep the flow and style.
[03:58:02] <Bytram> ROFL!!!
[03:58:14] <n1> and i doubt it would have made any difference
[03:58:23] <n1> being that the people targeted by it probably looked at it for about 10 seconds
[03:58:30] <n1> and just skimmed it
[03:59:16] <n1> i dont code, but i can only imagine it being worse.. the style of how people code varies a lot from what i have seen
[03:59:42] <Bytram> au contraire! If there was *something* wrong with it, they'd notice *that*
[03:59:51] <Bytram> well, I can dream, can't I?
[03:59:55] <n1> lol
[04:00:11] <Bytram> *** I *** would notice, but it's amazing how many others do NOT.
[04:00:44] <n1> it's all a case of if it works or not, if it does the function or gets the message across without causing any actual errors
[04:01:01] <n1> then it should be 'ok' in my book
[04:01:10] <n1> but like the person i had proof reading, and probably like yourself
[04:01:22] <n1> errors in grammar actually make it hard for you to read
[04:01:35] <n1> whereas most people just skim over it
[04:01:54] <Bytram> yup. feels like they pull me in and then start poking me with a pointy stick.
[04:02:08] <n1> lol
[04:02:21] <Bytram> wrenches me right out of whatever message and "aura" they'd communicated so far.
[04:03:07] <n1> i blame the internet, communicating online was the first real inclination i had to actually care about language
[04:03:27] <n1> online discourse is rarely correct in any form lol
[04:09:30] <Bytram> ewe our knot yolking!
[04:12:50] Bytram is now known as Abby
[04:12:57] Abby is now known as Abby_Normal
[04:13:48] Abby_Normal is now known as Bytram
[04:35:59] <Bytram> n1 are you still here?
[04:36:31] <Bytram> there's a typo, "Rasberry" should be "Raspberry" in http://soylentnews.org
[04:37:16] <Bytram> thanks go to stderr for catching that one!
[04:39:52] <n1> fixed
[04:41:06] <Bytram> umm, thanks, but I don't see the change in the title? could it be a caching issue?
[04:41:52] <Bytram> "Rasberry Pi gets a SODIMM Form Factor and Printout" should be: "Raspberry Pi gets a SODIMM Form Factor and Printout"
[04:42:48] <Bytram> ah! NOW I see it!
[04:42:52] <Bytram> thanks!
[04:44:15] <n1> it takes a while to catch up
[04:45:09] <Bytram> got it. thanks again!!!!!
[05:19:56] Bytram is now known as Bytram|away
[05:21:48] -!- mrcoolbp [mrcoolbp!~mrcoolbp@Soylent/Staff/mrcoolbp] has joined #editorial
[05:21:48] -!- mode/#editorial [+v mrcoolbp] by SkyNet
[05:24:08] -!- Bytram|away has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[05:52:29] Gerbilius is now known as aqu44
[05:57:28] aqu44 is now known as deadbeef
[06:06:50] -!- n1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[06:32:06] -!- mrcoolbp has quit []
[06:34:10] -!- mrcoolbp [mrcoolbp!~mrcoolbp@Soylent/Staff/mrcoolbp] has joined #editorial
[06:34:10] -!- mode/#editorial [+v mrcoolbp] by SkyNet
[07:05:01] -!- mrcoolbp has quit []
[10:09:05] crutchy|work is now known as crutchy
[11:45:49] MrBluze|afk is now known as MrBluze
[13:41:36] MrBluze is now known as MrBluze|afk
[14:14:51] MrBluze|afk is now known as MrBluze
[14:22:55] MrBluze is now known as MrBluze|afk
[15:13:56] -!- Bytram|away [Bytram|away!~pc@Soylent/Staff/Developer/martyb] has joined #editorial
[15:15:02] Bytram|away is now known as Bytram
[15:44:55] -!- n1 [n1!~nick@Soylent/Staff/Editor/n1] has joined #editorial
[15:44:55] -!- mode/#editorial [+v n1] by SkyNet
[16:18:16] crutchy is now known as crutchy|zzz
[19:06:45] Bytram is now known as bobby_tables
[19:07:11] bobby_tables is now known as Bytram
[20:19:00] -!- janrinok [janrinok!~janrinok@Soylent/Staff/Editor/janrinok] has joined #editorial
[20:19:00] -!- mode/#editorial [+v janrinok] by SkyNet
[20:19:05] <janrinok> he guys
[20:19:10] <janrinok> hi*
[20:19:30] <n1> hey janrinok
[20:19:32] <Bytram> janrinok: Hi!
[20:19:52] <janrinok> wow - people are on channel tonight! hi n1 Bytram
[20:19:58] <Bytram> I sent an email to Lamx last night as you suggested, but have not seen anything back from him. I'm sure he's busy.
[20:20:34] <janrinok> He's posted a few stories so he appears to be well, but, not seen on IRC for about 10 days or so.
[20:20:57] <Bytram> or it could be my mail client. I'm still trying to get used to thunderbird.
[20:21:30] <n1> yeah, he's been off IRC for 2 weeks i think, janrinok
[20:21:39] <janrinok> I've settled with irssi - in the end it does what I want and then gets out of the way
[20:21:58] <n1> xlefay wasn't sure if he was still with us but i confirmed he was as he's been posting stories
[20:22:01] <janrinok> n1 You're in a bit of a posting frenzy.... Good work
[20:22:38] <n1> thought i was the only one today, when i checked on there was nothing in the queue to come :p
[20:22:53] <n1> so apologies if i didnt check over the stories enough trying to get the queue back up
[20:23:18] <janrinok> I had to leave early-ish last night, and had another busy day today, but I'll try to get ahead of the game on the stories.
[20:23:30] <n1> not complaining, just trying to keep things rolling
[20:24:21] <janrinok> LamX might just be winding down - we had over 2 weeks of just the 2 of us and I don't think that he had had a break since the go-live date.
[20:25:18] <n1> yeah, i understand
[20:25:35] <janrinok> I'm good this weekend but next weekend 19/20 we've got Sophie's parents with us so I will have to do the civilised thing and spend some time with them.
[20:26:04] <n1> that's cool, i'm more likely to be available on weekends, so i can certainly pick up the slack then
[20:27:04] <janrinok> n1: we both merged 2 separate groups of stories before and that made my system throw a bit of a fit - got it sorted in the end though!
[20:27:37] <n1> it doesnt like having more than one group merged at a time?
[20:27:42] <janrinok> Bytram: what have you been up to today
[20:28:07] <Bytram> busy atm.... brb
[20:28:49] <janrinok> n1: I wasn't aware of there being a problem before but there is no way of knowing what another editor might do, so we'll have to live with it. I had to refresh my sub list page a few times before it could work out what to show me!
[20:29:19] <n1> was lucky really, merging those stories was next on my agenda lol
[20:30:03] <janrinok> there's 2 in the sub list now at the bottom which look identical - I'll try and sort them out.
[20:30:50] <n1> i see one merge
[20:30:55] <n1> which is mine
[20:31:07] <n1> but then it looks like someone submitted the same story twice above that
[20:31:39] <janrinok> three times - its also up the page but exactly the same submission.
[20:31:58] <Bytram> janrinok: that's me and me again.
[20:32:23] <janrinok> trying to make a name as an AC are we, Bytram ?
[20:32:29] <n1> oh wait yeah i see it
[20:32:34] <n1> Bytram, not your submissions
[20:32:44] <Bytram> oh! nvm!
[20:32:52] <n1> "Condaleeza Rice joins Dropbox"
[20:33:25] <janrinok> Right - who is going to do this story, I'm happy to do it but only one of us can....
[20:33:26] <Bytram> afk - back in 5 minutes or so
[20:33:33] <n1> btw Bytram, i'm leaving your title as it is, so it's your fault when people complain about it ;)
[20:33:49] <janrinok> too late he's afk
[20:34:06] <janrinok> and I'm going afk to get a cup of tea. brb 5
[20:34:08] <n1> you can do it if you want, i'm finishing up Bytram's and then i'll do another
[20:34:10] <n1> kk
[20:37:20] <Bytram> I'm back.
[20:37:36] <Bytram> that will start a discussion, I suppose!
[20:39:48] <n1> i hope you're getting paid well by AMD ;)
[20:40:27] <n1> it's due up at 22:53 UTC
[20:42:13] <Bytram> I wonder if there is there a bot command to tell me the current time in URTC?
[20:42:14] <Bytram> s/urtc/utc/
[20:42:18] <Bytram> !now
[20:42:24] <Bytram> !utc
[20:42:25] <n1> 18:42 i believe
[20:43:02] <Bytram> so, in about 4 hours. I'll be out at that time. :/
[20:44:13] <n1> i'll move it
[20:45:17] <Bytram> I'm here for another couple hours, and then I won't be back until about 7 hours from now.
[20:45:33] <n1> i changed it over with xlefays sub
[20:46:06] <n1> so it will be up in an hour
[20:49:07] <n1> so now you should have time to see the complaints, and then there might be discussion by the time you get back :p
[20:49:45] <janrinok> good idea n1
[20:50:29] <n1> i had a good idea, where?!
[20:50:49] <Bytram> n1: Nice! Thank you so much!!!!
[20:51:20] <n1> :)
[20:57:04] <janrinok> n1: you know, you're not such a bad guy, despite what all the others say about you behind your back.....
[20:57:14] <n1> rofl
[20:57:31] <janrinok> lol
[20:58:10] <n1> things all good, janrinok?
[20:59:32] <janrinok> yeah, I think so, my wife is in bed watching TV, and I'm in the next room with my computers. Had a busy day but now feel pleasantly tired. Life could be better, but it sure could also be a lot worse.
[21:00:39] <n1> pleasantly tired seems like an improvment, from what i recall youve been quite stretched the last couple days or so
[21:01:07] <janrinok> yep, I think I need a break but I'm OK for a day or 2.
[21:02:02] <janrinok> Sophie's parents arrive on Monday and they help considerably. It increases my workload a little bit but they do a lot more to help in return.
[21:02:45] <n1> having company is its own reward often, having good people around
[21:03:33] <janrinok> true - bit in a perverse way, it's also nice to get back to a routine once they leave.
[21:04:26] <janrinok> But we are both looking forward to them getting here. They are in their 80s but can do lots of the small support tasks that Soph needs throughout the day.
[21:05:08] <n1> i do understand that... for me it sounds similar to my feelings.. it's always great to go on the road, for pleasure (and even work)... but it's just as great to come home too.
[21:05:30] <janrinok> exactly the same.
[21:06:18] <n1> my grandparents are a couple of years away from their 80's and it often surprises me how much energy they have
[21:06:58] <janrinok> The longest they have stayed is about a month and by the end of that I was beginning to feel the strain. But they are here for 10 days and that should be about right.
[21:08:07] <janrinok> Harder still was, in the days when we could travel, going to visit them because they have the 1 computer using the slowest adsl I have ever experienced. Even taking my own computer was a problem because there was nowhere to put it!
[21:08:45] <janrinok> If I have as much life and energy in my 80s as they have I will be very pleased indeed!
[21:09:19] <n1> i'd be pleased if i shared their general disposition at that age
[21:10:01] <n1> i stayed with my parents for a month (they live overseas) recently, to do some work on their house with a friend
[21:10:10] <n1> and that was very tiring towards the end of it
[21:11:02] <n1> was great to go and be there and all that, but halfway through it stopped being enjoyable really
[21:12:33] <janrinok> ditto - but this time for me shouldn't be too bad - in fact it should be quite good
[21:13:05] <n1> yeah, 10 days sounds about right
[21:13:51] <n1> i hope you get the break you need
[21:14:48] <janrinok> I'm sure I'll be OK.
[21:16:01] <n1> if you're not going to be around for a day or so next week, let me know and i'll make sure i'm here to post stories.
[21:18:42] <janrinok> thx - at the moment we have no fixed plans, it's difficult to make any because it all depends on Soph's condition which changes almost daily, and we are not planning on going anywhere because travel is not pleasant for her. Any movement faster than a slow walking pace makes her go dizzy and nauseous.
[21:19:11] <janrinok> brb 3
[21:19:16] <n1> ok
[21:26:17] -!- weeds has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[21:31:56] <janrinok> n1 In your latest story what is the word subitizing. It's the word from the article and they use it quite a few time so it is not a typo - but I've never heard of it before, have you?
[21:35:13] <n1> cant say i have
[21:35:20] <n1> which story?
[21:35:34] <n1> preschoolers?
[21:35:36] <janrinok> Preschoolers Dot Enumeration
[21:35:47] <Bytram> "subitizing" I've never heard of that before, either.... looking
[21:36:04] <n1> http://en.wikipedia.org
[21:36:13] <Bytram> "Subitizing is the ability to immediately recognize the quantity of a small number of objects without counting. Research has shown subitizing to be foundational to basic arithmetic and other math skills."
[21:36:25] <n1> "Subitizing, coined in 1949 by E.L. Kaufman et al.[1] refers to the rapid, accurate, and confident judgments of number performed for small numbers of items."
[21:36:42] <janrinok> It's a new one for me!
[21:36:46] <janrinok> thx
[21:37:06] <n1> i dont quite how you can recognize a quantity without counting...
[21:37:08] <n1> +know
[21:37:24] <Bytram> me too! Learn something new every day!
[21:37:53] <n1> you might not count all objects, but enough to do a pattern and extrapolate from that
[21:38:36] <Bytram> at my day job, I do it all the time. I count groups of 4 or 5 things at a glance without having to count each indvidual item.
[21:39:25] <n1> i would still say you're counting though, but subconsciously
[21:39:55] <janrinok> Another minor aside. Slashcode inserts lots of pairs into the text. At the moment they do not cause us a problem but they will when we come to rewrite some of the formatting. If you have the time, can you change to in stories? When we change (at some unknown point in the future) the old stories will not display correctly if they contain . We should have an editor that does this but unfortunately it
[21:40:22] <n1> i generally do
[21:40:25] <n1> but i do miss some i know
[21:40:53] <janrinok> np - I can't remember which dev told me that but it seems like a long time ago now.....
[21:41:43] <n1> yeah i remember it being mentioned before, and when i see it i do, but as always... that second set of eyes helps
[21:43:11] <Bytram> n1: actually, no, it's not counting. Cf: the picture in the wiki article. I saw/thought "1, oh 3, no uh 6" as I came to recognize the "triangle" pattern, then went to count the green stars, immediately saw it was a group of 4, and *then* added the four to the 6 and got 10...
[21:43:27] <janrinok> yep - I think my stories get corrected more than most
[21:43:45] <Bytram> if the brown and red stars were all blue like the middle 3 stars, I'm pretty sure I'd have seen that all as one thing containing 6 items.
[21:43:53] <n1> janrinok, when you spend too long looking at something you miss the obvious
[21:43:58] <n1> as Bytram and myself discussed last night
[21:44:17] <n1> i'll have to read that wiki article
[21:44:20] <Bytram> janrinok: good point on the stuff; I'll try and kep that in mind.
[21:44:24] <janrinok> Bytram: did you recognise the word for it though? - I don't recall ever having heard that word before.
[21:44:51] <Bytram> never saw "subitizing" before in my life. And am not sure how to pronounce it, either!
[21:45:05] <janrinok> I'm with you then....
[21:45:09] <Bytram> sub-it-eye-zing?
[21:45:22] <janrinok> sub-i-tiz-ing
[21:45:25] <Bytram> sue-bit-eye-zing?
[21:45:43] <janrinok> subi-tizing
[21:46:06] <janrinok> counting but different!
[21:47:03] <n1> looking at those stars, im not good at subitizing
[21:47:33] <n1> i'm going with your first guess at the pronounciation, Bytram
[21:48:15] <Bytram> my 1300-page websters did not have the word in it. it was published in 1981, so that's after the word was coined.
[21:49:04] * n1 goes to get his dictionary
[21:49:18] <janrinok> Another thing that I thought about today which arose yesterday is profanities. I know that we often use them in speech and even on IRC, but as eds I don't think we should let them stay on the front page. I want to ask LamX his views on this but, as we have said, he is busy elsewhere. It doesn't help present a 'professional' site, IMHO.
[21:49:41] <janrinok> s/is/are/
[21:50:05] <Bytram> janrinok: ^^^ I whole-heartedly agree!
[21:50:34] <n1> i agree too
[21:50:54] <janrinok> I think if we adopt the rule informally and then run it by LamX for his official blessing I think we should be OK.
[21:51:27] <n1> i generally edit out inflammatory/subjective things if they're not being insightful with it, so im certainly going to edit out profanity
[21:51:40] <n1> even if i in normal speech cant help myself from swearing lol
[21:51:47] <Bytram> I've heard this said many times "The absence of profanity offends noone."
[21:52:03] <janrinok> I know some Americans claim 'free speech' but that also gives one the right to 'appear to be a dickhead' in the same breath.
[21:52:15] <n1> my logic generally follows that you can be far more offensive and abusive without uttering a 'swear'
[21:52:35] <n1> so making a big deal about empty but emotive words is pointless really
[21:52:58] <janrinok> Sometimes I just give in to it though! Try hitting your thumb with a hammer and saying 'Oh dear, that hurts quite a lot!'
[21:53:15] <n1> hah, indeed
[21:53:19] <Bytram> LOL!
[21:54:11] <n1> i doubt we would use swear words then, if they had lots of syllables
[21:54:35] <n1> but because f/s/c are all nice short sharp words, they're mentally quite easy to process when you hurt yourself
[21:54:53] <janrinok> I must hurt myself quite a lot then....
[21:55:29] <n1> the rest of the time, swearing is just punctuation for me
[21:55:45] <janrinok> Hey good effort - we've made quite a dint in the story list and it's almost time for me to go!
[21:55:52] <Bytram> update: http://wordsmith.org says its "SOO-bi-tyz"
[21:56:30] <janrinok> ah, I bet that's American - so we Brits will have something completely different!
[21:56:42] <Bytram> and it's "[soo-bi-tahyz]" at http://dictionary.reference.com
[21:57:16] <janrinok> OK I'll adopt the French stance and surrender now
[21:57:25] <n1> lol
[21:59:55] <n1> janrinok, are you doing anything with the merged story?
[21:59:56] <janrinok> Bytram: I thought that you were going out/away/to work or something?
[22:00:44] <janrinok> I've finished it once! Did it not go in the queue?
[22:00:57] <janrinok> Yeah 0248
[22:01:26] <n1> oh yeah i see it
[22:01:28] <Bytram> janrinok: I've got another hour or so.
[22:01:29] <janrinok> the merged story should have disappeared by now!
[22:01:37] <n1> it hasnt yet
[22:01:53] <janrinok> I'll delete it as it is from an AC so there is no Karma to claim.
[22:02:41] <Bytram> I see it on the main page now. thanks!
[22:03:12] <janrinok> n1 are you still editing the NASA story - I don't want to give it the second look if we are both editing at the same story.
[22:09:03] <janrinok> Right, I've got to be going soon, I'll be back in 5-10 mins to 2nd check the Nasa story then I'm off. Have a good one guys. CU tomorrow.
[22:09:28] <n1> no i'm not
[22:09:33] <n1> ok janrinok
[22:09:40] <n1> take it easy, good night :)
[22:14:07] <janrinok> OK Nasa story checked - I'm gone. bye
[22:14:09] -!- janrinok has quit [Quit: leaving]
[22:15:51] paulej72 is now known as paulej72_away
[22:42:31] Bytram is now known as Bytram|afk
[23:08:08] -!- Bytram|afk has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
[23:31:41] crutchy|zzz is now known as crutchy|work